hR Best Ever Series: SECOND ROUND DRAFT CHOICE

[PennSkinsFan]

updated best ever series page (http://www.hailredskins.com/BestEver.htm)

Please vote

[IowaSkinsFan]

I'm going with the "Rock", Jon Jansen.

[frenchskinsfan]

I went to Paul Krause, a real outstanding player out of the 2nd round.

[IowaSkinsFan]

I went to Paul Krause, a real outstanding player out of the 2nd round.

He was a great player, but I didn't vote for him because he did most of his handy work with the Viqueens.

[GolfFreak]

I chose Jansen, he is a stud ... Smoot needs a few more years to prove himself (hopefully this is his year). He also needs to show the fans he's a Redskin.

[Wild Bore]

This one is not even close: Paul Krause, HOFer and best safety to play the game...EVER. The excuse that he played his best days with Minnesota is not necessarily true: Yes, he played longer with them than he did with us, but it was four amazing years with us--just as long as Jansen, Samuels, Chump and some of the others that people vote for all the time in these polls. If you want to, compare his stats with Chump's and your will agree.

The poll is "Best Ever...Second round draft choice", not "Best Ever...Second round draft choice who played their whole career with the Redskins". He was the best. I don't see any other HOFers on the list.

IMHO, Anyone who votes otherwise is just not old enough to remember and is just voting more recent players.

[dj_stouty]

I would have expected that list to be FULL of great players! Goes to show you how much of a crap shoot the draft is.

[Patrick]

Don't know yet, to close to consider.

[Keino]

Krause is by far the best player on the list, however, I voted Jansen. Krause's HOF career was spent largely with the Vikings and I believe he went into the Hall as a Vike. Bore the question could be interrpreted as Best ever Redskins 2nd rounder, in which case the time spent with the team, relative to the rest of their career is a factor. Champ Bailey is a perfect example. When his career is over, he will be one of the greatest CB's to play the game, yet he would never receive my vote on a poll like this, because the bulk of his career will be played elsewhere.

Jansen is one of the most underrated OT's in the league and is long overdue for a PB appearance.

[Wild Bore]

keino, How do we know that Jansen won't spend the majority of his career somewhere else?

Guy's don't get me wrong, I am as big a Redskins fan as they come, but Jansen is ok, maybe above average, but not great. At least not yet.

On the one hand, you say he is underrated, and may, someday be a probowl player, and then you say he is the greatest second round draft pick ever. This seems a stretch. You are assuming FUTURE greatness AND future greatness as a REDSKIN.

(BTW: Champ is a Chump)

[Keino]

Well polls like these ask for assumptions when they include current players. IMO, Jansen has already perfromed at Pro-bowl levels, hence the "underrated" tag. Also, based on his attitude and recent restructuring, Im pretty confident that Jansen will don the B & G for quite a while. So you are right, I am projecting future greatness for Jansen as a Redskin, as the question is basically asking me to do. He's the only player I've seen dominate Michael Strahan...consistantly. IMO Jansen is the best OT on our team, and has been since we drafted him.

[IndianBaller27]

Didn't we already have this poll? Well I voted for Jon Jansen

[redwolf1218]

i dont remember krause. i always liked ken houston and joe lavender. was he better than ken houston? he went to something like 9 straight probowls. anyway, i voted jansen.

[Spence]

If Tre Johnson had been able to stay healthy he could have won this vote, but he couldn't so he won't. Jansen was my choice.

[Wild Bore]

i dont remember krause. i always liked ken houston and joe lavender. was he better than ken houston? he went to something like 9 straight probowls. anyway, i voted jansen.

I am a big Ken Houston fan. I'll never forget his goalline stop of Walt Garrison to preserve a win against the Cowboys. One of the most classic Redskin's plays, right up there with Riggo's SB run.

It's hard to compare these two HOFers. Both were great. I think Houston was in about 12 probowls total. In any event, both were HOFers. No two safetys in Washington history (well maybe Sammy Baugh) were even close to these two.

Best ever has BRAD EDWARDS! PLEASE!

[fubar94]

I would have gon with Jansen, but Chip was amazing when he played here. Have to go with the points.

[davaj]

Gotta go with Jansen. If Ken Houston was a 2nd rounder, why is he not on list?

[Wild Bore]

Gotta go with Jansen. If Ken Houston was a 2nd rounder, why is he not on list?

He wasn't. We traded, like, five guys to get him from Houston in about 1973.

[fent]

Jansen is one of the most underrated OT's in the league and is long overdue for a PB appearance.

i have to go with jansen and agree with you on this one. He's been a rock for us and has been underrated SEVERELY...well, aside from Madden that is. He's a beast in video games. I'm not old enough to remember a lot of the others and Smoot still needs several more pro-bowl level years to show me that he deserves this.

[IowaSkinsFan]

This one is not even close: Paul Krause, HOFer and best safety to play the game...EVER. The excuse that he played his best days with Minnesota is not necessarily true: Yes, he played longer with them than he did with us, but it was four amazing years with us--just as long as Jansen, Samuels, Chump and some of the others that people vote for all the time in these polls. If you want to, compare his stats with Chump's and your will agree.

The poll is "Best Ever...Second round draft choice", not "Best Ever...Second round draft choice who played their whole career with the Redskins". He was the best. I don't see any other HOFers on the list.

IMHO, Anyone who votes otherwise is just not old enough to remember and is just voting more recent players.

It can be argued both way IMO. The poll is best ever Redskins second round pick. Jansen has never missed a game in 5 years, often playing at a pro bowl level. Being a part of some bad teams has probably kept him from getting the recognition he deserves. He is under contract for 5 more years, so unless his cap numbers become untenable, I fully expect him to serve out that deal and be a life long Redskin, making him our best ever second round pick.

[HanburgerBum]

A poll like this is usually bias toward present day players, because most voters are more familiar with the current Redskins. To me, Krause is clearly the top player of this field. Jansen may one day over-take Krause but he isn't there yet.

It broke my heart when Otto Graham traded Krause for a nine-fingered TE by the name of McKeever. Graham panicked into the trade when his "great" experiment of converting all-pro left tackle Jim Snowden into a TE failed badly. Graham was one LOUSY head coach and he was the Steve Spurrier of his time. Came to the Redskins directly from coaching the Coast Guard Academy. I knew we were in trouble when Graham said in his first press conference that he would rather lose 33-30 than win 3-0. The guy had no concept what it took to coach at this level, despite having a HOF career as a player. Graham was all offense and no defense. Needless to say, Krause went on to a great career, while McKeever soon drifted out of the NFL.

There has not been the kind of ball-hawking free safety here of the caliber of Krause since he left (including Mark Murphy and Brad Edwards). Hopefully, Sean Taylor will remedy that.

[Wild Bore]

A poll like this is usually bias toward present day players, because most voters are more familiar with the current Redskins. To me, Krause is clearly the top player of this field. Jansen may one day over-take Krause but he isn't there yet.

It broke my heart when Otto Graham traded Krause for a nine-fingered TE by the name of McKeever. Graham panicked into the trade when his "great" experiment of converting all-pro left tackle Jim Snowden into a TE failed badly. Graham was one LOUSY head coach and he was the Steve Spurrier of his time. Came to the Redskins directly from coaching the Coast Guard Academy. I knew we were in trouble when Graham said in his first press conference that he would rather lose 33-30 than win 3-0. The guy had no concept what it took to coach at this level, despite having a HOF career as a player. Graham was all offense and no defense. Needless to say, Krause went on to a great career, while McKeever soon drifted out of the NFL.

There has not been the kind of ball-hawking free safety here of the caliber of Krause since he left (including Mark Murphy and Brad Edwards). Hopefully, Sean Taylor will remedy that.

Great post. That trade broke my heart too. The only disagreement I would have with your post is that McKeever didn't just drift off. He was not only the player involved in the biggest rip off trade we were ever suckered into, but also was the player involved in one our best rip offs ever (after Jurgensen for Snead). If you remember, the core of over-the-hill gang was built off McKeever: We got Diron Talbert, Jack Pardee, Mo Pottios, Maxie Baughen, Richie Pettibon, Jeff Jordan, John Wilbur, and a 71 5th for Marlin Mckeever, 71 1st and 3rd, 72 3rd,4th, 5th,6th,7th.

[Keino]

Hanburger, I was with you all the way until you called Mark Murphy a ball hawking Safety. The Pearl Harbor Crew earned that title for a reason......

As I said earlier, there is no doubt that Krause is the best player on this list, but my vote was based on interpretting the question as which player is the Best Redskin, as I answer every question of this sort.

Kudos to both of you (bore and Hanburger) for remembering the details of both of those trades. I gotta say, Im happy that we dealt Krause. It ended up getting us Sonny. Who is more iconic in this town than Sonny?(Besides Gibbs of course)

[Wild Bore]

.

I gotta say, Im happy that we dealt Krause. It ended up getting us Sonny. Who is more iconic in this town than Sonny?(Besides Gibbs of course)

Oops. Look closer, it actually got us the over the hill gang. However, point is still valid. Thanks for the compliment.

[Keino]

Oops. Look closer, it actually got us the over the hill gang. However, point is still valid. Thanks for the compliment.

I thought you said McKeever was invloved in the Snead for Sonny deal.....Oh well, everything happens for a reason I guess...LOL

[JoeJacksonTaylor28]

This one is not even close: Paul Krause, HOFer and best safety to play the game...EVER. The excuse that he played his best days with Minnesota is not necessarily true: Yes, he played longer with them than he did with us, but it was four amazing years with us--just as long as Jansen, Samuels, Chump and some of the others that people vote for all the time in these polls. If you want to, compare his stats with Chump's and your will agree.

The poll is "Best Ever...Second round draft choice", not "Best Ever...Second round draft choice who played their whole career with the Redskins". He was the best. I don't see any other HOFers on the list.

IMHO, Anyone who votes otherwise is just not old enough to remember and is just voting more recent players.
I understand your point. The last poll I voted for Krause, but now I have changed my mind because I think Jansen will turn out to be a better player FOR THE REDSKINS than Krause. The question is: "Who is the Redskins Best Ever SECOND ROUND DRAFT CHOICE?", so I'll stick with Jansen. I'm only 23, but I know and respect Krause a lot.

BTW, I have to strongly agree with you in that: CHAMP IS A CHUMP. Hey, that phrase is so good that it could see nice in a T-shirt with something else about Portis.

[ihatedallas]

Jasens good but i think smoot could be even better with Champ gone
SMOOOOOOT!

[Wild Bore]

... I think Jansen will turn out to be a better player FOR THE REDSKINS than Krause. The question is: "Who is the Redskins Best Ever SECOND ROUND DRAFT CHOICE...


Ah, but LaVar: The answer is in the verb tense.

[HanburgerBum]

Great post. That trade broke my heart too. The only disagreement I would have with your post is that McKeever didn't just drift off. He was not only the player involved in the biggest rip off trade we were ever suckered into, but also was the player involved in one our best rip offs ever (after Jurgensen for Snead). If you remember, the core of over-the-hill gang was built off McKeever: We got Diron Talbert, Jack Pardee, Mo Pottios, Maxie Baughen, Richie Pettibon, Jeff Jordan, John Wilbur, and a 71 5th for Marlin Mckeever, 71 1st and 3rd, 72 3rd,4th, 5th,6th,7th.

I had forgotten that McKeever was involved in that first major deal pulled off by George Allen. Thanks for letting me know that we salvaged at least a little bit something out of that Krause/McKeever fiasco. I presume that McKeever did about as much for the Rams as he did for us (which is nothing).

[HanburgerBum]

Hanburger, I was with you all the way until you called Mark Murphy a ball hawking Safety. The Pearl Harbor Crew earned that title for a reason......

As I said earlier, there is no doubt that Krause is the best player on this list, but my vote was based on interpretting the question as which player is the Best Redskin, as I answer every question of this sort.

Kudos to both of you (bore and Hanburger) for remembering the details of both of those trades. I gotta say, Im happy that we dealt Krause. It ended up getting us Sonny. Who is more iconic in this town than Sonny?(Besides Gibbs of course)

Keino, you are right. Mark Murphy was not a ball-hawking free safety. He was an okay player who got the most out of his meager physical talents. He and Brad Edwards were two of the better known free safeties for the Redskins after the Krause period, that's all I was really trying to say. Sean Taylor, on the other hand, has all the physical tools to become a ball-hawking free safety and perhaps surpass Krause eventually.

Even though he was not invovled in the Jurgensen trade, McKeever did play a part in the trade with the Rams, as pointed out by Bore, that brought us the Over-the-Hill Gang who undoubtedly was largely responsible for what was then a first playoff berth in over 20 years.

[IowaSkinsFan]

This thread has made for some excellent conversation and debate. Very pleased in reading all posts.

[garedskin]

I picked Krause.I was not yet old enough to watch him play when he was in D.C. but I sure do remember him playing for the vikings.He ended up with 81 career interceptions and finally made it into the HOF.What where they thinking when they let him go. :Peace: