OFFICIAL GET RID OF BARROW THREAD

[tomlcollins]

I'm sure that getting rid of Barrow would not be beneficial to the Skins' financially, as they would probably still have to pay his salary this year if he was cut (not to mention there are rules against cutting injured players). But I say we cut this guy as soon as we can to avoid any cap ramifications of him being on the roster for next year. I can't remember how much we signed him for but I know it was for a few years.
To the best of my knowledge he has not even played ONE SNAP!! I know tendinitis can be painful but I think that Barrow is milking this. Talk all you want about how painful it can be, how Barrow is supposed to be a stand up guy, good locker room presence, etc. None of that matters if you ask me, he's just another older player we should not have signed in the first place. I don't even know that he has made a valiant effort to play at all! Pierce is doing great, let's stick with him and sweep Barrow out the door as fast as we can (even though it bothers me he's getting paid at all!)

[#1SkInSfAn]

Ummm wait I know the answer to this one..... Um True.

[SkinsKY]

I doubt he is milking it. I will concede that he is old, but if he was milking it, Gibbs would have cut him a while ago.

[Spence]

Mike Barrow is a consummate professional. No way in the world is he jaking or milking. He's hurt.

[smoak]

i agree with spence. barrow played for william on the titans and i think the emergence of pierce is why they're able to let barrow heal rather than run him in there at 80%... barrow will have some important plays for the skins this season.

[BurgundyNGold]

I don't know what kind of cap relief we'd get by dumping Barrow, IMO, we overpaid for an aging player instead of think of the future. Here's the sad part: Since we signed Barrow for $$$, he'll almost certainly be here next year and the younger, more versatile Antonio Pierce won't be because we probably can't afford both. That's what is gonna stream me.

[RedskinsVision]

Lavar might miss the next 4 weeks so if Barrow can come back by next week, we're going to need him and switch Pierce over to Lavar's side.

Barrow signed a $2.5M SB and a 6 year deal.. so if we cut him this year we're going to have just over $2M in dead money next year alone on the cap.

[tomlcollins]

I don't know what kind of cap relief we'd get by dumping Barrow, IMO, we overpaid for an aging player instead of think of the future. Here's the sad part: Since we signed Barrow for $$$, he'll almost certainly be here next year and the younger, more versatile Antonio Pierce won't be because we probably can't afford both. That's what is gonna stream me.

exactly what i was trying to figure out here...I love Danny b/c he wants to win, and for the first couple of years I applauded the way he went out and grabbed up new guys to contribute, HOWEVER, I can no longer applaud when he goes out and signs OLD guys susceptible to injury whose salaries are forcing us to sacrifice our future for immediate gain (34 year old Barrow for 6 YEARS!!). There better be an option to turn the last three (or five in this case) into a player/coach contract!!! Supposedly our cap gurus know what they're doing, but everyone else and their brother is saying that the Skins' are screwed cap wise in about 3 years...
Sorry for the cap rant, but back to my original rant....I think missing every game of the year thus far (preseason DOES count to get a grasp of the defense!) b/c of tendinitis is unacceptable and ridiculous. Is there even a timetable for his return, b/c I haven't seen or heard of one???

And where is this info about Arrington being out 4 weeks coming from ??!!! Is that reliable info or gossip talk?

[ihatedallas]

I hink barrow is the armstead of two years ago. Sign him while hes just finished his prime,and he'll just put up average numbers. Peirce has great potential and will do really well. If perce plays well enough he might get more time then barrow,who knows.

[superskin]

And where is this info about Arrington being out 4 weeks coming from ??!!! Is that reliable info or gossip talk?

It's true, it depends on whether the specialist recommends surgery. Which, of course makes this "Get rid of Barrow" thing a moot issue. He needs to step up though, and earn his paycheck. He just HAS to play at 80%, and in doing so, he will allow Peirce to move into Lavar's spot instead of forcing Lemar Marshall into action.

[redwolf1218]

i dont think Barrow is washed up yet. i'm looking for him (and Brandon Noble) to step in and get stronger in the second half of this season, and then contribute strongly next year.

[LadyNRedskinsfan]

it amazes me how people keep turning on barrow. you cant fault him for being hurt. he is an excellent player on the field, but unfortunately he hasnt had a chance to hit the field. lets give the guy a break until he returns to the field.

[flave1969]

it amazes me how people keep turning on barrow. you cant fault him for being hurt. he is an excellent player on the field, but unfortunately he hasnt had a chance to hit the field. lets give the guy a break until he returns to the field.


Exactly. We all know what this guy can do, lets see if he can do it before we ask for him too be run out of town. At last years rate of tackles, half a season of Mike Barrow would bring around 75-80 tackles. That is not shabby at all.

[techskinsfan]

i highly doubt gibbs and williams would let him milk it, they probalby woulda pushed him back quicker if pierce hadnt been so nice a replacement. barrow hopefully could go this week and pierce could move to replace lavar

[truant]

I'm a big supporter of Barrow... just the type of guy that should go along with the explosive Lavar and Washington.

The guy is hurt... let him heal up and come play. There wasn't a reason to rush back with Pierce playing well. Now with Lavar out, I hope he gets close soon.

[BurgundyNGold]

Exactly. We all know what this guy can do, lets see if he can do it before we ask for him too be run out of town. At last years rate of tackles, half a season of Mike Barrow would bring around 75-80 tackles. That is not shabby at all.
We know that he is old and that we paid him a lot of $$$. We also know that we're committed to him for at least a couple of years, because of that $$$ so the premise of this thread is moot. We also know that the $$$ we paid Barrow will make it very difficult to keep Pierce, who is worth the $$$ we paid Barrow. We further know that Danny has a history of bringing in old guys who aren't worth the $$$. Knowing that there usually isn't much gas left when an aging player gets cut, we can speculate that if there was much gas left in his tank, he wouldn't have been cut by the Giants.

Since he's been out all year, the one thing that we don't know is what he can do.

[redwolf1218]

We know that he is old and that we paid him a lot of $$$. We also know that we're committed to him for at least a couple of years, because of that $$$ so the premise of this thread is moot. We also know that the $$$ we paid Barrow will make it very difficult to keep Pierce, who is worth the $$$ we paid Barrow. We further know that Danny has a history of bringing in old guys who aren't worth the $$$. Knowing that there usually isn't much gas left when an aging player gets cut, we can speculate that if there was much gas left in his tank, he wouldn't have been cut by the Giants.

Since he's been out all year, the one thing that we don't know is what he can do.
i must disagree. the signing of Barrow had nothing to do with Snyder. these players on this team are here because Gibbs and/or Williams wanted them. Barrow's salary from 2004 thru 2009: $760K $1.74M $2.5M $2.5M $2.1M $2M. with a 2.5 M bonus, not outlandish by any stretch of the imagination, for a guy who led the entire NFC in tackles last year.

[BurgundyNGold]

i must disagree. the signing of Barrow had nothing to do with Snyder. these players on this team are here because Gibbs and/or Williams wanted them. Barrow's salary from 2004 thru 2009: $760K $1.74M $2.5M $2.5M $2.1M $2M. with a 2.5 M bonus, not outlandish by any stretch of the imagination, for a guy who led the entire NFC in tackles last year.
I guess we'll see. I consider $2.5M + the base salaries a lot of money if he plays old and it means that we either 1) Cut him and have dead duckets on the cap, or 2) We don't have enough to keep Pierce, who not only a real baller, but is also younger and homegrown.

But... if he plays lights out and we can still keep Pierce long term, then he's a bargain ;).

[redwolf1218]

I guess we'll see. I consider $2.5M + the base salaries a lot of money if he plays old and it means that we either 1) Cut him and have dead duckets on the cap, or 2) We don't have enough to keep Pierce, who not only a real baller, but is also younger and homegrown.

But... if he plays lights out and we can still keep Pierce long term, then he's a bargain ;).
well i agree about Pierce. i am hoping he'll sign a long term deal sooner rather than later. i think Lavar and Samuels contracts will have a much bigger impact on that decision than will Barrow's. Pierce should be a Redskin for life and then retire to become our linebacker's coach.

[LadyNRedskinsfan]

ifone thing is for sure, its that pierce will be resigned this year. when barrow was signed, it was reported that his contract was more of a 2 year rather than a 5 year. im sure snyder thought about the cap ramifications if barrow was to cut after 2 years.

[bgforever]

REDSKINSVISION SAID:

Lavar might miss the next 4 weeks so if Barrow can come back by next week, we're going to need him and switch Pierce over to Lavar's side.


Exactly - Alignnment possibilities:

Washington Barrow Pierce

(this is standard for Monday, if LaVar will be out)


Another is : Bowen Taylor Lott


Washington Pierce
(on passing downs maybe or once and a while, Barrow being replaced by corner at times too - Harris)

See Williams was adjustable anyway.

[BurgundyNGold]

well i agree about Pierce. i am hoping he'll sign a long term deal sooner rather than later. i think Lavar and Samuels contracts will have a much bigger impact on that decision than will Barrow's. Pierce should be a Redskin for life and then retire to become our linebacker's coach.
The LaVar contract for sure. I think the have budgets by position, so Samuels would have more of an imact on the OL.

[redwolf1218]

The LaVar contract for sure. I think the have budgets by position, so Samuels would have more of an imact on the OL.
on the o-line we are paying big money to samuels, jansen and thomas. at linebacker, it's lavar and washington. i posted a thread a few days ago about all the one year deals, and the guys who will be free agents next year, and even without them we are tight against next year's cap, unless it goes up considerably. i hope Pierce's deal will be a point of emphasis, and as far as re-structuring goes, it has to be lavar and samuels. they are head and shoulders above everyone next year.

[colkurtz]

Barrows is an excellent LB, who we signed [regardless of the entire contract] to play probably two years here. He's played consistent, tough football throughout his career. It was Gibb's and (mostly) William's decision to sign him, NOT Daniel Snyder's. At the time of the signing it was considered a good move to strengthen the LB corps.

Barrows hasn't played, because the team has been pleased with Pierce's [unexpected] excellent substitution and because they want Barrows to get back to 100%. Barrow's isn't trying to milking it, just trying to get better. This stuff happens in the NFL and I don't think we should start to dump on a guy until he comes back to play. Hey, the Browns just lost Winslow II and Courtney - two #1 draft picks for them - now that's disappointing (for them).

Let's give Barrows a chance to get better and come back - then see how he does. If he's lost a step or starts to make dumb plays then we can lay into him. From his interviews, he's sounds disappointed he can't get back on the field yet.

[PennSkinsFan]

Given Arrington's surgery, i don't think we can afford to get rid of any LB right now. Gte off his case. Barrow will recover and begin posting 8 to 10 tackles a game.

[hail2skins]

I for one believe we need to give Barrow time. I don't think the coaches would allow him to milk them for money. From what I have read he has been practicing a little more each day and Gibbs even said that it's possible he could make his debut on Monday in a supporting role of course. Give the man a break and let's see how this pans out.

As for the cap issue that was mentioned, it has been mentioned every year since Snyder took over and when have we been in cap hell? There are folks who believe Snyder has found a loophole in the salary cap. A friend at work who is a Charger fan says he doesn't understand how we can do the signings we do every year and not be in cap hell.

[ConradCountry]

Right now we need Barrow I hope he can come back and play, does anyone know if he can play the weakside spot because I would hate to see Pierce moved when he playing so well.

I think with Pierce coming does not mean that Barrow is useless the only thing that Pierce playing well means is we can take it off our draft board for next year.

We have our MLB of the future and a quality veteran for the present.

[Skinz4lyfe]

One thing is for sure about Gregg Williams defenses, you can never have too many linebackers. We're gonna find some way to get Barrow and Pierce on the field. I don't think Barrow's contract will hurt against signing Pierce too much. I'd be worried about us resigning Smoot, and 2 years from now 50/50. Hopefully we'll resign Pierce because he is the future for us at middle linebacker.

[lakeskin]

I agree with bgforever.

Dallas has no running game --unless you would call eddie george and his 3 ypc average a running game-- so why not go to a 4-2-5 with taylor being the fifth DB. Vinny leads the league in passing yardage and with this lineup he can lockup the interception lead as well.

Its a shame tho that lavar wont be able to end another cowboy quarterback's career this week.

[lakeskin]

Barrow hasnt been in one single game out of 6 and i dont think he's practicing. And this is all due to knee tendinitis?

Whether he's cut or not his football days are numbered. When your out this long with knee tendinitis at your advanced age its not a good sign for your longevity.

[truant]

So you're saying Barrow is done? I disagree. Time will tell but why would the trainers want to rush him back if Pierce is playing well?

He is older and i'm sure they are more concerned with not having this issue flair up later in the season. It's a long season and i'm sure we'll need Barrow soon and i'm confident that he'll perform well.

[sdredskinsfan]

it amazes me how people keep turning on barrow. you cant fault him for being hurt. he is an excellent player on the field, but unfortunately he hasnt had a chance to hit the field. lets give the guy a break until he returns to the field.

Exactly. Also, the coaching staff is primarily responsible for the decision to sign Barrow, not Snyder.

[BIGSEF3]

with pierce, i dont think we really need barrow and we could really use the money next year with some contracts coming up that need to be renewed.

[dj_stouty]

Barrow is not used to sitting out due to injury. In his past 11 seasons, he has only missed FIVE games! (and only 2 of the last 8 seasons!)

I wouldn't use the "he is too old" theory with Barrow. In his illustrious 11 year career, LAST YEAR was his best...with 148 tackles.

I hope he gets better and contributes quickly. We need him now...and what we don't need is the dead cap space should he be cut.

[IowaSkinsFan]

Mike Barrow is a consummate professional. No way in the world is he jaking or milking. He's hurt.

Professional? Yes! Unnecessary signing? Yes.

[BurgundyNGold]

One thing is for sure about Gregg Williams defenses, you can never have too many linebackers. We're gonna find some way to get Barrow and Pierce on the field. I don't think Barrow's contract will hurt against signing Pierce too much. I'd be worried about us resigning Smoot, and 2 years from now 50/50. Hopefully we'll resign Pierce because he is the future for us at middle linebacker.
If 50/50 doesn't become more like 90/10, he won't be resigned.

[LATrueRedskin]

Barrow's hurt. He hasn't missed a game all last year, and I heard on radio that he's extremely frustrated right now. He wasn't hurt when we signed him, these things happen.

[redwolf1218]

i would just like to hear an explanation of what exactly it "tendinitis"(?). does he need his knee cleaned out? will he ever be 100 % with that condition? does it heal with time and rest? it just doesnt sound good for someone at his age. i'm hoping he'll be good to go about halfway thru the season and still have another year left in the tank for next year.

[LATrueRedskin]

i would just like to hear an explanation of what exactly it "tendinitis"(?). does he need his knee cleaned out? will he ever be 100 % with that condition? does it heal with time and rest? it just doesnt sound good for someone at his age. i'm hoping he'll be good to go about halfway thru the season and still have another year left in the tank for next year.

There is no "cure" for tendonitis. I don't know if it even goes away completely. I've read somewhere (don't quote me on this) that it's actually his quad but it affects his knee. I agree that being as old as Barrow is can't help his situation. I think he can come back from it, but he shouldn't be rushed. We are definately getting hit by the nagging injury bug.

[redwolf1218]

There is no "cure" for tendonitis. I don't know if it even goes away completely. I've read somewhere (don't quote me on this) that it's actually his quad but it affects his knee. I agree that being as old as Barrow is can't help his situation. I think he can come back from it, but he shouldn't be rushed. We are definately getting hit by the nagging injury bug.
that is true about the injury bug, but the best coached teams, one of which we most definitely are, should be able to plug in the next guy and overcome it. i look at guys like Pierce, Warner, Ramsey, Hasselbeck, Betts, Marshall, Thrash, Dmac, Ray Brown, Kenyatta Jones, Raymer... and i cant help but see quality depth that should service us thru the inevitable injuries that plague most teams. Barrow was projected as a starter, but with the way Pierce has been playing, Barrow is now quality depth in my book, i mean once he gets healthy.

[LATrueRedskin]

that is true about the injury bug, but the best coached teams, one of which we most definitely are, should be able to plug in the next guy and overcome it. i look at guys like Pierce, Warner, Ramsey, Hasselbeck, Betts, Marshall, Thrash, Dmac, Ray Brown, Kenyatta Jones, Raymer... and i cant help but see quality depth that should service us thru the inevitable injuries that plague most teams. Barrow was projected as a starter, but with the way Pierce has been playing, Barrow is now quality depth in my book, i mean once he gets healthy.

I agree. I'm not worried about Barrow, because Pierce is playing a hell of a football game right now. To me, it's just a bonus when Barrow gets back.

[redwolf1218]

I agree. I'm not worried about Barrow, because Pierce is playing a hell of a football game right now. To me, it's just a bonus when Barrow gets back.
heck yeah, Pierce is leading the team in tackles. who woulda thought?