The offensive line

[Ohiofan]

How do you people rate this offensive line? To me it is horrible. In today's game the line got beat again and again.

What say all of you?

[wide_awake]

inconsistency is the problem with the offensive line

[redwolf1218]

they were good last week. maybe they were coming down from too much celebrating and head-swelling over last week's performance, or maybe it's just that they cant play as well away from home.

[Dept_of_Defense]

I think the O-Line was watching the game on tv because they definently weren't out there playing today.

[Axegrinder]

Above average.

[CarMike]

Hey, whats up Ohiofan! Man, where have you been? Haven't seen you around here in a long, long time!

Welcome back!

[ryflan47]

They didn't play as good as they should have today. Our team will win and lose games in the trenches.

[Oregonian]

My assessment of the O Line:

Talented? Maybe/possibly.

Capable of playing well? At times.

The way the played today, and for much of this season, including preseason? Just awful.

I think the O line was at the heart of our problems against the Giants today. Strahan was running past Jansen as if he weren't even there. Today and against Dallas, Minnesota, and throughout the preseason, teams have been getting serious pass rushing heat without even blitzing.

I do not believe that our "bookends" Jansen and Samuels have ever been as good as they have been given credit for, but they are definitely both worse in the past 2 years than they were earlier in their careers.

[70chip-on-1]

My assessment of the O Line:

Talented? Maybe/possibly.

Capable of playing well? At times.

The way the played today, and for much of this season, including preseason? Just awful.

I think the O line was at the heart of our problems against the Giants today. Strahan was running past Jansen as if he weren't even there. Today and against Dallas, Minnesota, and throughout the preseason, teams have been getting serious pass rushing heat without even blitzing.

I do not believe that our "bookends" Jansen and Samuels have ever been as good as they have been given credit for, but they are definitely both worse in the past 2 years than they were earlier in their careers.


Yeah there were breakdowns everywhere on the line, but Jansen needs to step it up.. He's physically getting beat during pass protection snaps. He was matched up against Strahan, but I've observed this slide since preseason.

[PennSkinsFan]

inconsistency is the problem with the offensive line

Bingo. Horrible? No way. Inconsistsent? Absolutely. There is really no need for more discussion, this explains it all.

[chicago_skinz_fan]

Bingo. Horrible? No way. Inconsistsent? Absolutely. There is really no need for more discussion, this explains it all.

Exactly.

[Dolla Bill]

Bingo. Horrible? No way. Inconsistsent? Absolutely. There is really no need for more discussion, this explains it all.


The one key person on the line that I have a problem with, is actually Jansen. He has been horrible dating back to the preseason. Penalties, run blocking, and especially his pass blocking have been problems this year. I have no idea what has happened to him, but he has taken a huge step back this year.

[BandWagon]

I agree. The Jags game now looks like an anomaly. Pass protection is horrid. As much as I like Jansen, he's starting to look like a liability out there. He's getting killed on the edge.

[Skinz4lyfe]

Inconsistent. The productivity on offense is directly attributable to the line. IMO, Brunell and Portis did what they could but unless the line can put together back-to-back good performances, that's what we'll be. Mediocre.

[LATrueRedskin]

inconsistency is the problem with the offensive line

Yep. They are probably the most inconsistent group in the entire league. We show that nobody can beat us by the way we play against the Jags, but then our play level drops visibley the very next week. Their performance pretty much makes or breaks our chances of winning a football game, and they definately haven't lived up to their potential. If this keeps up, changes would have to be made for, if anything, to get a change of pace and some new blood.

[jtovb2005]

They look the same as they have for the 3rd year in a row now. Each year the big buck talent playes like you know what for some games and up to their level in other games.
Geez I am writing this Ryan Clark gets an interception. Sigh the memories.

I see 2 problems: the games they don't they just stink (I don't really think this was one of their worst though) and really makes it tough in a game. Also the way the league and our division is we just can't afford that type of play. That leads to win or your out of the playoffs during December situations.

We have too many 3 and out series because the defense is not getting blocked and they are all over the ball.

[greatest2]

what is there that we can do to fix it

Samuels is a redskin for life with all the money we have resrtuctured in his contract and stuff

Jansen got paid, Thomas and CAsey (was just signed)

Doc is a free agent.

by no means am i saying overhaul the o-line, because continuity there is important, but this is terriable, mark is gettin pressure from the front 4, and then we yell at him for not letting the ball go when the defense drop the other 7 are in coverage.

O-line, do somethin, they are nothin but players who show up when they want to (i.e. Jag game)

[Redskinmayhem]

inconsistency is the problem with the offensive line


exaclty, I don't understand why they're soooo inconsistent.

[Ohiofan]

Glad to see most agree that it is the O-line not Brunell or Portis that are setting the tone for this season. In addition to Jansen being a problem, and he certainly is, it seems that Rabach is also getting beat quite a bit.

[Hr fan]

How do you people rate this offensive line? To me it is horrible. In today's game the line got beat again and again.

What say all of you?

Neal Olkewitz said it best when he pointed out that, on the wrong side of 30 it takes more than a week to recover from sunday. Jansen is 32, Samuels and Thomas nearly so. It means incosistent may be the best we can hope for.

[skins74]

With the way the line is blocking I think Randel El should be the starting QB. Brunell needs a decent amount of time to throw and they weren't really doing that. Brunell wasn't good either, why didn't they get the ball in Santana's hands more often? Even a quick slant or something?

[Dolla Bill]

With the way the line is blocking I think Randel El should be the starting QB. Brunell needs a decent amount of time to throw and they weren't really doing that. Brunell wasn't good either, why didn't they get the ball in Santana's hands more often? Even a quick slant or something?


Problem for the slant, is that you need a clear throwing lane to do so. Not with this line. DL are hitting gaps quicker than the OL can keep them out. Quickness is the key against our line. If you're big and strong (Jax), then the line can hold their own. Against speed and agility, the OL is getting "manhandled".

[Redskinmayhem]

Problem for the slant, is that you need a clear throwing lane to do so. Not with this line. DL are hitting gaps quicker than the OL can keep them out. Quickness is the key against our line. If you're big and strong (Jax), then the line can hold their own. Against speed and agility, the OL is getting "manhandled".

That may be the key right there. Against smallish DE's, we get owned but when we play the bigger, less athletic/fast guys, it plays into our strengths....good point Dolla Bill.

[vbskins]

That may be the key right there. Against smallish DE's, we get owned but when we play the bigger, less athletic/fast guys, it plays into our strengths....good point Dolla Bill.


That means the eagles are going to eat us alive.

[SkinsfaninNJ]

The only thing I know about the line, and specifically Jansen, is we should have expected this. All preseason, members of this board reporting from practice wrote that Jansen was getting owned by our DE's.

I'm not sure if its age or sins in the offseason, but somethings not right with him.

[Meatsnack]

Our o-line just didn't play with the kind of passion to win they did against Jacksonville. In fact with a few notable exceptions (Sellers, MW, ARE) the whole team came out flat and lifeless. Just like last year. I guess some of these guys don't have enough professional pride to want to play better after a 36-0 drubbing. Sad.

[Fathead]

Since I was unable to watch this last game, how did they look? I know there were some holding calls and such, but is there any sign of improvement?


I'm wary of throwing JC to the wolves with how bad the o line has looked at times.

[redskin_rich]

Since I was unable to watch this last game, how did they look? I know there were some holding calls and such, but is there any sign of improvement?


I'm wary of throwing JC to the wolves with how bad the o line has looked at times.
I thought they played well, for the most part. On running plays, they handled the D-Line well but Cato June kept busting plays with his speed. That was more of a schematic problem than physical one. Brunell took less hits than Peyton did but Samuels was left one-on with Freeney for the entire game and Samuels fought hard but couldn't take Freeney's speed rush. Again, I blame that more on the schemes. A player like Freeney should always get extra attention and the Redskins never gave Samuels any help.

[danny's stogie]

I thought they played well, for the most part. On running plays, they handled the D-Line well but Cato June kept busting plays with his speed. That was more of a schematic problem than physical one. Brunell took less hits than Peyton did but Samuels was left one-on with Freeney for the entire game and Samuels fought hard but couldn't take Freeney's speed rush. Again, I blame that more on the schemes. A player like Freeney should always get extra attention and the Redskins never gave Samuels any help.

Somewhat OT, but June gives other teams fits by how quickly he gets into the backfield. He is one player I wouldn't mind seeing on the Skins next season because I doubt the Colts have the cash to resign him.

[Fathead]

I thought they played well, for the most part. On running plays, they handled the D-Line well but Cato June kept busting plays with his speed. That was more of a schematic problem than physical one. Brunell took less hits than Peyton did but Samuels was left one-on with Freeney for the entire game and Samuels fought hard but couldn't take Freeney's speed rush. Again, I blame that more on the schemes. A player like Freeney should always get extra attention and the Redskins never gave Samuels any help.



I hope they're playing better. I'd just hate to see JC get nothing but plastered like Carr.

[redskin_rich]

Somewhat OT, but June gives other teams fits by how quickly he gets into the backfield. He is one player I wouldn't mind seeing on the Skins next season because I doubt the Colts have the cash to resign him.
Who do you replace? We drafted Rocky to play the Will. Would you have Rocky try to unseat Lemar at the Mike?

[danny's stogie]

Who do you replace? We drafted Rocky to play the Will. Would you have Rocky try to unseat Lemar at the Mike?

Yes, Rocky at Mike, but even Rocky isn't a sure bet at this point.

[shally]

Yes, Rocky at Mike, but even Rocky isn't a sure bet at this point.

rocky played mike in college and at his size and ability to hit, it might be a better option...
right now, he just needs to get on the field and play

[Phonte]

They can't pass block.

Never could and they never seem to improve in the area.

[Emmanouel8]

The offensive line is overrated. I'd say Randy Thomas is the best player on the line and everyone else is mediocre at their posirion. I don't see any domination in this unit.

We squandered a chance to upgrade the line this past offseason bypassing a stud like Hutchinsen. :banghead:

[dabro]

I think they need to be allowed to run block straight ahead on a consistent basis. These stretch plays seem to wear them out, whereas if they block straight ahead they can run over people. Clinton seems to like that better as well. By being successful in running the ball, it may give them more confidence in pass protection, too. Speaking of which, maybe they need to keep more people back to help the line pass protect and send fewer out into the pass patterns.

[SpicyMcHaggis]

I think they need to be allowed to run block straight ahead on a consistent basis. These stretch plays seem to wear them out, whereas if they block straight ahead they can run over people. Clinton seems to like that better as well. By being successful in running the ball, it may give them more confidence in pass protection, too. Speaking of which, maybe they need to keep more people back to help the line pass protect and send fewer out into the pass patterns.
Which is exactly what we were doing last year, and was working pretty well when we had at least 2 capable receivers...
But I think if we give Saunders time and the right players (NOT Collins..lol...) he can make hs system work here.

[Patrick]

I hate saying this but our tackles are pass their prime season. Doc is at his full potential. Thomas is starter quality now and for a few more years. Rabach is what he is - a better than average "backup" on a team that does not put much focus on his position - NOT since Bostic anyway.

[PennSkinsFan]

Jansen has not been right since his return from achilles tendon rupture. We need to upgrade Tackle. Samuels is a lock simply because it will cost too much to get rid of him. This is not a pass blocking Line, they personally will tell you that. They excel at run blocking. That begs a versatility issue to me.

[SkinsfaninNJ]

I think we can get by with our guards and center, assuming they bring back Doc. The tackles to me are the biggest problem. Speed rushers kill us, and most of the NFL has turned to fast DE's. If we could upgrade the tackles (I don't see how based on contracts), this line would be good.

[redskin_rich]

Jansen has not been right since his return from achilles tendon rupture. We need to upgrade Tackle. Samuels is a lock simply because it will cost too much to get rid of him. This is not a pass blocking Line, they personally will tell you that. They excel at run blocking. That begs a versatility issue to me.
I have read quite a few people say this here and I strongly disagree. Jansen played good last year, even with casts on both his hands. I'm pretty sure every one of Portis' TD's were on the right side running behind Jansen and most of the 1st downs were run on that side as well.
I will say that Jansen is struggling this year and I don't know why but he was fine last year and this achilles excuse from '04 is simply not the case.

[JsMaViSd]

i think everyone on our line is playing good..you could maybe point out Rabach..but i still think hes a starter for now.

Samuels was getting burned sunday vs Freeney, but that happens to everyone.

[openallnight]

I have read quite a few people say this here and I strongly disagree. Jansen played good last year, even with casts on both his hands. I'm pretty sure every one of Portis' TD's were on the right side running behind Jansen and most of the 1st downs were run on that side as well.
I will say that Jansen is struggling this year and I don't know why but he was fine last year and this achilles excuse from '04 is simply not the case.
While saying Jansen was "good" last year may be a slight stretch. I don't think he was as good as say in '02. I will say that this year's decline has been phenomenal. Jansen has inexplicitly become a huge liability on the oLine this season.

I actually think we are probably a RT and a TE away from being a decent oLine.

[openallnight]

Samuels was getting burned sunday vs Freeney, but that happens to everyone.

Samuels had a real tough time dealing w/ Freeney's speed and athleticism but, he used everything he had in his vet bag of tricks to keep freeney off brunell for the most part. Jansen on the other blocked absolutely no one that was put in front of him.

[SkinsfaninNJ]

i think everyone on our line is playing good..you could maybe point out Rabach..but i still think hes a starter for now.

Samuels was getting burned sunday vs Freeney, but that happens to everyone.
Are you serious? Our tackles are like a revolving door this year.

[openallnight]

Are you serious? Our tackles are like a revolving door this year.
I think "open door" would be a better analogy a revolving door may actually cause you to break stride ;)

[danny's stogie]

I have read quite a few people say this here and I strongly disagree. Jansen played good last year, even with casts on both his hands. I'm pretty sure every one of Portis' TD's were on the right side running behind Jansen and most of the 1st downs were run on that side as well.
I will say that Jansen is struggling this year and I don't know why but he was fine last year and this achilles excuse from '04 is simply not the case.

Agreed. He was pretty good last season, but he's having a tough time this year. Check out the Redskins' rushing splits and they get around a yard more per carry going to Jansens' side. But, I think his legs aren't as good any more. He's below average in pass protection when he needs to move laterally. I think it was you who commented last night about needing to give Samuels help, well, I think Jansen needs it more and Mathis has been better than Freeney so far this season.

[bergiemoore]

Jansen get the "El Matador" award for Sunday's performance, while Samuels gets the award for getting away with more holds than any other lineman.

[shally]

I think "open door" would be a better analogy a revolving door may actually cause you to break stride ;)

samuels needs to change the 60 on his uni to "welcome"

[shally]

Agreed. He was pretty good last season, but he's having a tough time this year. Check out the Redskins' rushing splits and they get around a yard more per carry going to Jansens' side. But, I think his legs aren't as good any more. He's below average in pass protection when he needs to move laterally. I think it was you who commented last night about needing to give Samuels help, well, I think Jansen needs it more and Mathis has been better than Freeney so far this season.

i wonder if they gave any thought to moving jansen inside to guard to spot thomas (since he only plays the right side) and see what wade can do ??

[Dolla Bill]

This is my idea on the OL right now as it stands. The defense are licking its chops at Jansen. He has been getting beat almost regularly, which leads to problems for Brunell since he is on Brunell's blind side. That is a problem. Most premier OL are the LT position, since a majority of the QB's in the league are right handed. Beat Jansen, force Brunell to his left, and the rest of the defense collapses on the left side of the field since they know that Brunell cannot deliever the ball anywhere else. This usually leads to supersmart Brunell throwing the ball away.

Samuels is having a bad year due to speed rushers being thrown at him. He just simply cannot handle them. This is really troublesome. Is he regressing this badly? Is Bugel having problems in protection for the scheme that Saunders is running? I personally have no idea. I do know that with both of our tackles, they are needing more and more help. The only way to help them is two ways, either a TE helping, or running the *spensored* ball.

All this talk of Campbell puts an odd spin on things. Jansen no longer is the blindside OT. It puts pressure on Samuels, who I do trust more than Jansen. If Jansen gets beat, Campbell can see and feel the pressure more. Campbell's scrambling ability will create plays, but it can also lead to rookie mistakes.