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IHATEDALLAS'82'87'91
01-26-2007, 08:34 AM
OK, there is this guy that I'm in an argument with, and he thinks that Bill Parcels is a better coach than Joe Gibbs. Now i think this is completely crazy, and I brought up the fact that Gibbs won more Super Bowls, had a higher win percentage, and he went on to say those are "pointless stats". Also, he said that every year we won the Super Bowl, we had great players and Joe Gibbs had nothing to do with any of our Super Bowl wins. Then i brought up the 1982 strike season, when we had all replacements and were playing against Tony Dorsett, etc. and we still finished 8-1 that regular season.

OK, but anyway, i need help with some information that i can use to help the Joe Gibbs case.


If you can help, that would be great.

CNYSkinFan
01-26-2007, 08:40 AM
What does this tool base his premise of Parcells being better then Gibbs on if not regular season record or Superbowls?

PyroGenic
01-26-2007, 08:48 AM
What does this tool base his premise of Parcells being better then Gibbs on if not regular season record or Superbowls?

yeah... I don't know how else you'd gauge a coach's success besides regular season winning percentage and the # of super bowls won. I know people like that guy you're talking about, don't waste your time.

SkinsKY
01-26-2007, 08:50 AM
yeah... I don't know how else you'd gauge a coach's success besides regular season winning percentage and the # of super bowls won. I know people like that guy you're talking about, don't waste your time.

The only thing he really has is Parcells's record vs. Gibbs, but really, he's not going to listen, so just tell him Parcells is worse because he has man-boobs.

CNYSkinFan
01-26-2007, 08:51 AM
I guess you could make an argument for head to head record, which Parcells does have the edge there.

But the better players argument is just hogwash. Joe Gibbs won three different Superbowlks with 3 different QBs and 3 different RBs. So at best his argument could be turned into Gibbs is better at finding and developing talent then Parcells, htus a better coach.

SpicyMcHaggis
01-26-2007, 08:59 AM
OK, there is this guy that I'm in an argument with, and he thinks that Bill Parcels is a better coach than Joe Gibbs. Now i think this is completely crazy, and I brought up the fact that Gibbs won more Super Bowls, had a higher win percentage, and he went on to say those are "pointless stats". Also, he said that every year we won the Super Bowl, we had great players and Joe Gibbs had nothing to do with any of our Super Bowl wins. Then i brought up the 1982 strike season, when we had all replacements and were playing against Tony Dorsett, etc. and we still finished 8-1 that regular season.

OK, but anyway, i need help with some information that i can use to help the Joe Gibbs case.


If you can help, that would be great.
The best advice I can give you is to stop wasting your time with this guy. Anybody that says that a HC (that brought in all the players himself) has nothing to do with the success of a team has no idea what he is talking about, or is so completely biased that anything you say won't matter.

IHATEDALLAS'82'87'91
01-26-2007, 09:05 AM
Here are some things he said:

again with the pointless stats. again, Gibbs had great players and great teams. Parcells had way less to work with and he still made championship teams. he turned a 3-13 team into a SB team. Gibbs doesn't have that on his resame. Bill Parcells is a to better. Gibbs is out of his league


you have to look at the players that they had. that 1982 players were thought of as bad at the time, but then everyone relized they had good players, it wasn't only Gibbs. also Dorsett was the only player that they played that was tough. that was a strike season, every team that they played was missing their best players, you're acting like it was only the Skins. Dorsett's one good player big deal name another one that they played


he turned a team that had 1 winning season in 10 years into a SB winner in just 3 years. 1st year they went 3-12-1 so he took that team into a SB team in 2 years. Then he went to the patriots and in 2 years went 10-6 and took them to the playoffs for the 1st time in 8 years. the very next year, he took hem to the SB but lost it to the Packers, who had an unbelievible team with Farve. Then he goes to the Jets who were 4-28 with their previous coach. in his 1st year he went 9-7, more wins than the last 2 seasons combined. then in 1998, the Jets went 12-4 and went to the conference championship game, where they had a 13-0 lead, but Curtis Martin had 2 fumbles in the 2nd half (had 1 previous to that in his whole career) and only had 12 rushing years which lead them to a 17-13 loss. The Broncos and John Elway then killed the Falcons in the SB which the Jets would've won. He's also made great coaches under him. bill belichick, Sean Payton, Tom Coughland, Eric Mangini, Romeo Crennel, and Al Groh. who has Gibbs taught to be coaches

PyroGenic
01-26-2007, 09:09 AM
good god. Who are you arguing with, a parcells-loving version of the game? I still say its not worth your time. I think he's just blindly hating on the 'skins and refuses to pay attention to the stats that matter.

IHATEDALLAS'82'87'91
01-26-2007, 09:10 AM
He always uses the same argument:

Here are some of his posts:


ok sure he;s a great coach, but he's overrated. he had some of the greatest teams ever that he had only a little impact on. A lot of those things you put are yust repeats of different people giving the same award. he had 2 good years, a great coach can do it longer. he is definatley not a top 3 coach of all time i don't know why media people around here say that all of the time.

Gibbs had a lot more talent than Parcells evere's a much better coach than had. he's a much better coach. he tured 4-12 teams into SB contenders. Gibbs only did that once and it was a better than 4-12 team. i'm laughing how you think Gibbs is better than Parcells, that's the most homerish statement of the day. i'm not saying Gibbs is bad, i'm saying he's a top 10 coach of all time, but Parcells is a top 3 coach easily. His teams have been better for a longer period of time. plus his press conferences are better laughing.gif Gibbs never had a TO to work with either


All the same thing!

IHATEDALLAS'82'87'91
01-26-2007, 09:11 AM
good god. Who are you arguing with, a parcells-loving version of the game? I still say its not worth your time. I think he's just blindly hating on the 'skins and refuses to pay attention to the stats that matter.
I'm just gonna leave him alone.


The funny part about this is: HE LIKES THE JETS! :jetsuk:

redskin_rich
01-26-2007, 09:16 AM
For comparison's sake, look at the records-

Joe Gibbs (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/GibbJo0.htm)

Bill Parcells (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/ParcBi0.htm)

Case closed.

CNYSkinFan
01-26-2007, 09:22 AM
good god. Who are you arguing with, a parcells-loving version of the game? I still say its not worth your time. I think he's just blindly hating on the 'skins and refuses to pay attention to the stats that matter.
Yeah I have to agree. You would be more productive finding a crack addict and arguing philosophy.

It ain't worth it, he is using the most subjective criteria to back up his statements.

For example one of the best Redskin teams I have ever seen play is the 1991 Redskins. The only HOF caliber players on that team was Monk, Green, & Grimm. Rypien was an average quarterback. BYner a good running back. Yet they playedwith incredible chemistry and smashed their opponents, including the Giants who had won the supoerbowl the year before.

The coaching job Gibbs did that year wa=s better then any of his previous years because of the ioncredible results he got with above average players.

Skaggsrules
01-26-2007, 09:34 AM
If Joe Gibbs record as a coach and SB wins is a "meaningless stat" then the records of Parcells' teams before he gets them is a meaningless stat.

Also, create an All Star team, and give the reigns to Norv Turner.........6-10 at best, great coaching is needed no matter what the talent level

IHATEDALLAS'82'87'91
01-26-2007, 09:35 AM
Thanks A lot guys, you've been a big help.

C-7
01-26-2007, 09:55 AM
He always uses the same argument:

Here are some of his posts:



Parcells is a top 3 coach lol!!!!!!

WarEagle
01-26-2007, 11:56 AM
The Redskins were 3-0 during the replacement period in the 87 season. The Giants went 0-3. The teams actually played each other during this weird time, and the Skins beat them. If Gibbs and Parcells coached these odd teams, you can easily decide who was the better coach. Blank slate, even playing field, etc..
It was really weird watching NFL games where you had no clue who these guys were, in most cases. Fun times! Surreal.