Snyder the tie breaker?

[PennSkinsFan]

Vote please

[ShaggySkins]

I voted no. But I don't think Spurrier is all that much better then Snyder.

[Keino]

I voted yes. This seemed to work for the Squire when Beathard and Gibbs disagreed

[dj_stouty]

YES. He owns the team. Period.

[Seebs]

who's the owner? Danny!

[NCskinsfanatic]

Ok,the way it worked is'nt bad.i mean that's they way it worked in the past with old man Cooke right?Here's whay i said no though.Johnson is known to get injured,Ramsey until he can audible into the right play at the right time against a full on Philly/Tampa blitz he may be succeptable to injury as well.I personally think Daniel should've trusted SS to be able to stick with Ramsey and not quickly revert to using Danny.And if we did need a 3rd Qb,i'd rather have Woeful than Gardener,Bowen,or whoever else ever took a snap from center in pee-wee league IMO.

[hail2skins]

I think the question should be worded differently. The question assumes there is no disagreement between coaches and personnel and that's when Snyder decides. If you mean if he should be involved in the decisions on a day to day basis, then I vote no.

[PennSkinsFan]

Originally posted by dj_stouty
YES. He owns the team. Period.

Agrred, but then again, with this philosophy, head coaches should not be accountable.

[rskinsfan10]

Yes

[CarMike]

Yes.

[nyjunc]

I'd be very uncomfortable if Woody Johnson was making decisions like that. Woody doesn't know football and neither does Snyder. Should he have some input? yes but to kae the final decision sounds crazy to me. Ask Jerry Jones how that worked out?

[AGibbsGirl]

I dunno, I think Snyder knows a great deal about football and the players that are in this league. He's a smart man and this team is his passion.
I mean just look at how much you guys know!...
I say this is OK

[rskinsfan10]

Jerry has 3 Lombardis so I would say all in all it has worked just fine for him.

[NCskinsfanatic]

Originally posted by rskinsfan10
Jerry has 3 Lombardis so I would say all in all it has worked just fine for him. Jimmy Johnson had A LOT to do with those 3 trophies.Since then what's Jerry's track record.How much did his genius have to do with Swizer packing it up and dave Campo being his next Yes man.Now he's reverted to a big time coach with a big time ego and we'll see how they get along.A lot like Snyder and Marty i bet.Fine so long as they dont
disagree on personell decisions.Tuna didnt stay with the teams that had less "hands-on"owners.I wish it werent true but they are far to much alike.Thats why we have battled for last place with Jerry's dynasty there the last few years.

[Skinzaholic]

The answer is totally depending on the individuals. An owner has invested millions into a dream... and therefore should have every right to interject whenever and whereever he feels. Ont he other hand, the owner needs to be smart enough to pull out and allow the men he is paying do their job.

A quote read... "A good leader knows enough to find good men to help him... and has enough sense to not meddle with them while they do it."

As far as our situation... I dont see Snyder as "unknowledgable"... just a bit over-zealous. So with him... he should have every right to have a say on HIS team... but remember that you are paying SS $25 million to make those decisions for you (otherwise why not just coach the team yourself).


I voted YES.

[Shabba]

The owner should not be involved in the actual setting of the team. He should have the money ready to pay and yes it is his team and he should have some imput but not like what just happened the other day.
This type of stuff will cause coaches not to want to come here in the future if the owner is gonna be meddeling in areas he should'nt be.

[dj_stouty]

Owners get involved with their teams. Thats just plain old life in the NFL.

I'd much rather have my owner making a few personell decisions rather than him calling the plays into the huddle.

[Green-Is-Good]

Neither. I wish Ray Rhodes were still here:(

[rskinsfan10]

Originally posted by NCskinsfanatic
Jimmy Johnson had A LOT to do with those 3 trophies.Since then what's Jerry's track record.How much did his genius have to do with Swizer packing it up and dave Campo being his next Yes man.Now he's reverted to a big time coach with a big time ego and we'll see how they get along.A lot like Snyder and Marty i bet.Fine so long as they dont
disagree on personell decisions.Tuna didnt stay with the teams that had less "hands-on"owners.I wish it werent true but they are far to much alike.Thats why we have battled for last place with Jerry's dynasty there the last few years.

The question wasn't about the coach, but about the owner having the tie breaker. Regardless of who the coach was, we are talking about the owner having the final say. 3 Lombardis during his tenure as coach is to be considered a success in my eyes.

For the record, Jimmy only won two of those three. Switzer won the other.

[hail2skins]

Originally posted by Shabba
The owner should not be involved in the actual setting of the team. He should have the money ready to pay and yes it is his team and he should have some imput but not like what just happened the other day.
This type of stuff will cause coaches not to want to come here in the future if the owner is gonna be meddeling in areas he should'nt be.

So who would you have make the decision if the GM and coach disagreed?

[Shabba]

How often does that really happen, I mean for real. I guess maybe I have had my eyes closed or something.
I guess I should have stayed on topic because the topic said 'breaking the tie and not interfearing with coaches duties'.

My badd.

[nyjunc]

Originally posted by rskinsfan10
The question wasn't about the coach, but about the owner having the tie breaker. Regardless of who the coach was, we are talking about the owner having the final say. 3 Lombardis during his tenure as coach is to be considered a success in my eyes.

For the record, Jimmy only won two of those three. Switzer won the other.

He won it w/ all the players Jimmy brought in.

[rskinsfan10]

Originally posted by nyjunc
He won it w/ all the players Jimmy brought in.

If it were that simple to say that he won it with the players that Jimmy brought in then why couldn't Campo do it with the same players? The core group was the same.

And again, not to get off topic, but I thought that we were talking about the owner having the final say. Do you disagree that 3 Lombardis should be considered a successful tenure in the time frame that Jones has owned the team?

[Keino]

Originally posted by nyjunc
He won it w/ all the players Jimmy brought in.

Ummmm Jimmy was hired by Jerry........If you recall Jerry was the one who ousted Tom Landry. Jerry was a big part of All 3 of the Superbowl rings that Dallas got in the 90's.

[LadyNRedskinsfan]

i say yes and only because he owns the team. he has full control over what happens, thats why he bought the team. sometimes im not too comfortable with it because i feel he needs to go back to football 101, but in the case of a disagreement of two sides within the organization, he should be the deciding factor.

[nyjunc]

If it were that simple to say that he won it with the players that Jimmy brought in then why couldn't Campo do it with the same players? The core group was the same.

Are you serious? By the time Campo came in most of those guys were gone or just hanging on.

And again, not to get off topic, but I thought that we were talking about the owner having the final say. Do you disagree that 3 Lombardis should be considered a successful tenure in the time frame that Jones has owned the team?

I'm not saying Jerry wasn't a good owner, he was but that wass when he let Jimmy do his thing and he stayed out of the day to day on field issues. After Jimmy left and he became more involved the team started to go downhill, they did win 1 w/ Jimmy's guys in '95 but that team SHOULD have won at least 2 more SBs.

Ummmm Jimmy was hired by Jerry........If you recall Jerry was the one who ousted Tom Landry. Jerry was a big part of All 3 of the Superbowl rings that Dallas got in the 90's

I didn't say Jerry wasn't a big part but they were successful whn Jimmy was running the show and Jerry wasn't as involved. Once he became involved in the on field decisions the team started to spiral downwards until they were so deep that jerry had to hire Bill Parcells.

[rskinsfan10]

Originally posted by nyjunc
Are you serious? By the time Campo came in most of those guys were gone or just hanging on.

I'm very serious. Name someone from their core group of guys that wasn't still playing up to a high level when Campo took over.


I'm not saying Jerry wasn't a good owner, he was but that wass when he let Jimmy do his thing and he stayed out of the day to day on field issues. After Jimmy left and he became more involved the team started to go downhill, they did win 1 w/ Jimmy's guys in '95 but that team SHOULD have won at least 2 more SBs.

Jerry has always been hands on. Maybe it became more visible after the split, but he isn't doing anymore now then he did before. I don't recall Jimmy having total control in Dallas. As a matter of fact, because of his previous relationship with Jerry, him getting total control was a sticking point with him taking over the Dolphins job.

Also, it's easy to say what a team should have won, but that doesn't mean it has to happen. Many think that the Packers shouldn't have loss to Denver, and that the Rams should have repeated.


I didn't say Jerry wasn't a big part but they were successful whn Jimmy was running the show and Jerry wasn't as involved. Once he became involved in the on field decisions the team started to spiral downwards until they were so deep that jerry had to hire Bill Parcells.

Again I say that they won 3 SB with him being the same meddling owner that he has always been.

[nyjunc]

Campo took over in 1999:

-Emmitt was still a pro bowl caliber player
-Aikman was nowhere near ther player he was
-They lost Irvin to a neck injury that ended his career
-Deion wasn't Deion(you guys learned that a year later)
-After Irvin the starting WRs were Raghib Ismail & Ernie Mills
-Everett McIver started at RG
-Stepnoski had seen his better days
-Their starting DL was Rookie Greg Ellis, Alonzo Spellman, Kavika Pittman & Chad Hennings(wasn't Hennings a reserve on the great teams)
-They still had good LBs and a good secondary.



Yeah I'd say the talent wasn't near the level of the SB years.

[nyjunc]

Again I say that they won 3 SB with him being the same meddling owner that he has always been.

I never said he was a bad owner but he made mistakes after Jummy by meddling too much and I think he knows that and that's why Parcells is there.

[rskinsfan10]

Originally posted by nyjunc
Campo took over in 1999:

-Emmitt was still a pro bowl caliber player
-Aikman was nowhere near ther player he was
-They lost Irvin to a neck injury that ended his career
-Deion wasn't Deion(you guys learned that a year later)
-After Irvin the starting WRs were Raghib Ismail & Ernie Mills
-Everett McIver started at RG
-Stepnoski had seen his better days
-Their starting DL was Rookie Greg Ellis, Alonzo Spellman, Kavika Pittman & Chad Hennings(wasn't Hennings a reserve on the great teams)
-They still had good LBs and a good secondary.



Yeah I'd say the talent wasn't near the level of the SB years.

-We agree with Emmitt
-The concussions don't diminish Aikman's skill level. He was still on the most accurate passers in the league and would probably still be playing right now if it wasn't for #56 on the Skins, which occurred in 2000 in case 1999 is the focus here.
-Yes he was injured that year, but he doesn't define the core group by himself
-Deion wasn't the great Deion, but he still was a top 5 corner
-2 decent complimentary receivers. You cannot have #1 WR lining up on both sides. BTW, Ismail had 80 catches for almost 1100yds. More then decent #s IMO
-Regardless of your opinion of Stepnoski and McIver, Emmit was still a pro-bowler as you yourself mentioned so the O-line in general must have still been getting the job done
-That D-line group you named had 20.5 sacks, which isn't great but ain't bad either. A more accurate assessment is how do they rate in all aspects of play, as far as run stuffing and allowing their LB's to make plays.
-We agree with the LB and Secondary play

I'll add this. 1999 was their last playoff appearance, so they must have had enough talent to make a run. I also remember alot of acromony as far as Campo's decision making from some of their stars. Maybe the coach making better calls, or the lack there of, is the reason why they didn't go farther.

[rskinsfan10]

Originally posted by nyjunc
I never said he was a bad owner but he made mistakes after Jummy by meddling too much and I think he knows that and that's why Parcells is there.

I don't recall him saying that he was changing his approach after hiring Parcells. He still doesn't have a GM (seperate from himself), so what is going to be different?

[skinswin'emALL]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by dj_stouty
YES. He owns the team. Period.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Originally posted by PennSkinsFan
Agrred, but then again, with this philosophy, head coaches should not be accountable.

If I'm paying someone 5 mil a year to coach, I WOULD HOLD THEM ACCOUNTABLE. I spent 800 million to buy and run it how I want. If you don't want to coach and be accountable because of some dicissions I make, THEN TELL ME TO TAKE MY MONEY ELSEWHERE, BEFORE YOU TAKE THE JOB.

SS is a football coach who payed to coach and have INPUT (his say) on player personel and then its up to GM (OR OWNER) to make the ultimate decissions.

Sorry, I only make 80K and I'm held VERY accountable for my job, eventhough I don't have the final say about everthing. My goal is to one day own Cocaa-Cola so I can:D

[nyjunc]

Originally posted by rskinsfan10
-We agree with Emmitt
-The concussions don't diminish Aikman's skill level. He was still on the most accurate passers in the league and would probably still be playing right now if it wasn't for #56 on the Skins, which occurred in 2000 in case 1999 is the focus here.
-Yes he was injured that year, but he doesn't define the core group by himself
-Deion wasn't the great Deion, but he still was a top 5 corner
-2 decent complimentary receivers. You cannot have #1 WR lining up on both sides. BTW, Ismail had 80 catches for almost 1100yds. More then decent #s IMO
-Regardless of your opinion of Stepnoski and McIver, Emmit was still a pro-bowler as you yourself mentioned so the O-line in general must have still been getting the job done
-That D-line group you named had 20.5 sacks, which isn't great but ain't bad either. A more accurate assessment is how do they rate in all aspects of play, as far as run stuffing and allowing their LB's to make plays.
-We agree with the LB and Secondary play

I'll add this. 1999 was their last playoff appearance, so they must have had enough talent to make a run. I also remember alot of acromony as far as Campo's decision making from some of their stars. Maybe the coach making better calls, or the lack there of, is the reason why they didn't go farther.


Actually I made a mistake, Gailey was the coach in '99 and Campo took over in '00. In '00 Irvin was gone and Aikman was knocked out. I believe Clint Stoerner was their QB for a good portion of the year

Originally posted by rskinsfan10
I don't recall him saying that he was changing his approach after hiring Parcells. He still doesn't have a GM (seperate from himself), so what is going to be different?

I think he'll change, he's still involved but not nearly as involved as before. He knows Parcells will drag them out of the gutter and he's not stupid enough to anger BP and make him want to leave.

[TexSkin]

Think of it this way guys..if we would have kept Woeful or Hadman on it still would have been like we only had 2 QB :D

[Skinzaholic]

How would you feel if you bught a car and someone tried to tell you where and how to drive it? Truth is... that would make most people mad (and then they end up on COPS!).

The owner paid the bucks... he makes the final decisions... simple.

[rskinsfan10]

Damn nyjunc, I totally forgot that Chan Gailey coached the Cowboys. I must have been doing some of that crack that they are known to smoke down there.