Meet our next opponent: The Detroit Lions

[CarMike]

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h191/CarMike24/detcoach.jpg

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h191/CarMike24/detroit.jpg

Before the season started, i'm sure most, if not all, Redskin fans had this game marked as a sure win. Detroit, in my own opinion, has been the surprise team of this young season. Yes, Green Bay is there as well. But who would have counted on the Lions being 3-1 after the first quarter of the season?

John Kitna head into week 5 as the leading QB in yards thrown with 1,227 yards. He also has 8 TDs against 4 INTs. His QB rating so far this year is 105.6. The best of all QBs with at least 90 attempts. The Lions, as a team, average 312.8 passing yards per game.

Their rushing attack is led by Tatum Bell. So far this year Bell has 167 yards on 40 attempts. That's an average of 4.2 YPC. He only has 1 TD so far this year though. His running mate, Kevin Jones, has 43 yards on 13 carries for an average of 3.8 YPC. Their running attack has been hampered by fumbles, where they have fumbled 11 times and lost 6 of them to their opponents. As a team, they are averaging only 74.5 yards per game.

Needless to say, their success comes from throwing the ball. Roy Williams is their leading receiver with 26 catches for 388 yards and 3 TDs. To my surprise, their second leading receiver is Shaun McDonald. He has 21 catches for 268 yards and 3 TDs as well. Rookie WR Calvin Johnson has put good numbers even though he missed last weeks game. CJ has 10 catches for 189 yards and 2 TDs. His long for the year is 39 yards.

As for their defense, Ernie Simms is their leading tackler. He has a total 26 solo tackles and 10 assists. He has 1 INT and 1 FF.

Detroits overall defense is ranked 29th in the NFL. Through 4 games their opponents are averaging 30 points per game. They are giving up a total 381.8 yards per game. An astounding 5.4 yards per play. Their passing defense is ranked #t30 in the NFL while their rushing rank is #20. Interesting points about their defense:

Giving up 267.5 passing yards per game
They have 14 sacks
They have 9 INTs
They are giving up 114.2 yards a game on the ground
Given up 6 TD on the ground
Longest run given up this year is 25 yards
Only forced 2 fumbles
They have given up 457 rushing yards in total
They have given up 1,070 passing yards in total

Continued

[CarMike]

Tale of the tape

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h191/CarMike24/lionsredskins.jpg

My final prediction:

I'm not sure if our defense will be able to contain the Lions WR's and Kitna. Eli and Burress completely destroyed our secondary in our last outing. And IMO, Kitna and Williams are way better than Manning and Burress. If we can't get pressure on Kitna it could be a long day.

Normally i'd think our offense could hang with the Lions. However, we seem to have a patern on offense. Get a lead and then sit on it. Even after we have given the lead away, we still sit back and try to play an '80s type of offense.

Final Score:

Lions 31

Redskins 21

[Patrick]

This is a very interesting game for us - Detroit has been our doormat for years BUT the Skins better not take them for granted. Detroit's passing game is flat out dangerous and the secondary could be VERY vulnerable to those BIG receivers - concerns me very much. Also every one saying that the Lions have no running game - well how many times have we seen a team come in here with a "No Running Game" and put up great numbers - MORE than I want to remember. ................Our offense has to put POINTS on the board and I would think it's a combination of run/pass. We can't think we're going to pound the ball - we never do. Got to have a middle passing game and use it a lot. ..............Most important - our players have to have gotten over that NYG game. That's the thing that has concerned me the most with this bye week - too much time to "Think" about it.
Bottomline - We need a statement game and one that's in OUR FAVOR!

[shally]

Tale of the tape

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h191/CarMike24/lionsredskins.jpg

My final prediction:

I'm not sure if our defense will be able to contain the Lions WR's and Kitna. Eli and Burress completely destroyed our secondary in our last outing. And IMO, Kitna and Williams are way better than Manning and Burress. If we can't get pressure on Kitna it could be a long day.

Normally i'd think our offense could hang with the Lions. However, we seem to have a patern on offense. Get a lead and then sit on it. Even after we have given the lead away, we still sit back and try to play an '80s type of offense.

Final Score:

Lions 31

Redskins 21

major reason to worry about detroit

on the other hand, if we lose to them at home, even this early in the season, i think we can forget about the playoffs this year..
too many teams in the nfc will have better conference records and the wild card teams could well be coming from the central division

in short, we better prepare for them the way the giants prepared for us.. with a sense of total desperation and committment to this game

[shally]

We should send our all-pro DE's at him all day.

All kidding aside, this will be a good test to see if Williams can get back some of his guts and imagination. The Eagles beat Kitna up all day two weeks ago, so it can obviously be done.

we need to run the ball down their collective throats all day.. 40 carries for portis and betts.. that is the key

[nicefellow31]

I'm a little concerned about Shawn Rogers. He was pretty disruptive in the Bears game yesterday. He had five tackles, 1 sack, three hurries, tipped a pass, caused an intentional grounding penalty, and blocked a FG. Interior of the line has got to control him.

[wewantdallas]

If we lose this game, any hopes for a special season will be gone. Plain and simple. I hope your prediction does not come to pass, Carmike....

[CarMike]

If we lose this game, any hopes for a special season will be gone. Plain and simple. I hope your prediction does not come to pass, Carmike....

As do I wwd. It kills me to pick the Lions over the Redskins. But till Gibbs/Saunders/Byner/Snyder shows that we're willing to open this offense up, we're going to struggle against everyone. Detroits offense is amazing to watch. Instead of hiring Saunders the Redskins should have tried to get Mike Martz.

[firehawk157]

I'm a little concerned about Shawn Rogers. He was pretty disruptive in the Bears game yesterday. He had five tackles, 1 sack, three hurries, tipped a pass, caused an intentional grounding penalty, and blocked a FG. Interior of the line has got to control him.
True, with all the FAs brought in, any word on Demulling and how he's doing? Fabini just sucks...

[dj_stouty]

Very nice job, Mike.

I could see this game going either way, and it will all depend on which defense GW decides will show up. If its the defense from the 2nd half of the Giants game, then Roy Williams will make toast all day.

[Meatsnack]

Hmm...well, I admit that the Lions can win next week's game. OTOH, Philly, whom we beat the previous week, hung 50+ on them. The Lions made Kevin Curtis look like the second coming of Jerry Rice. Basically, for me this game boils down to the right side of our O-line against the left side of their D-line. If the Lions get penetration from their front four consistently, we will lose. If we can move or at least stalemate Shaun Rogers with Fabini and Rabach, then we will likely win.

The Lion's DBs are nothing special (see Eagles, Philadelphia)and if we can run at all to keep the defense honest, we will likely win. Kitna is playing well but 3 of his 4 Ints have been in the endzone - that is, he is prone to choking in the redzone. Kitna runs well but does not throw well on the run. If we can move him off his spot, the Lion's passing game will not get in a rhythm. And, the Lion's running game is mediocre. Jones is soft and Bell is impatient waiting for blocks. Last, the Lion's receivers do not like contact and I think we have ways to arraneg that they get plenty of that. The Lions are there to be had if we want them.

[firehawk157]

By far the most dangerous passing attack we've seen and probably will see until NE. Get to Kitna, win the game. That simple. We'll see about just how aggressive we will be if Moss can't play on sunday.

[firehawk157]

Too bad our defense doesn't like to press receivers. Akh said WAY before this season that when you play bump 'n run against Johnson, he struggles. Play off him and he'll eat you alive. We have shown the tendency to not do anything to adjust our gameplan to the opponent we're playing, so we'll see.

[shally]

Too bad our defense doesn't like to press receivers. Akh said WAY before this season that when you play bump 'n run against Johnson, he struggles. Play off him and he'll eat you alive. We have shown the tendency to not do anything to adjust our gameplan to the opponent we're playing, so we'll see.

roy williams is even better than burress.. that thought gives me nightmares..

even losing to the eagles they scored over 20 points...and were close enough at the half

[firehawk157]

That's what really confuses me, we've got playmakers all over our offense, there is no reason we should struggle to get outta the teens. Portis can break open any play, at any time... Moss is another homerun threat... Cooley can take any route he runs 20 yards, no matter who is covering him... JC can run 20+ yards on his own. Teams that have considerably less do considerably better than we do (green bay comes to mind immediately).

Conservative playcalling or not, it's ineffective playcalling. You can be conservative but also effective.

[shally]

I'm a little concerned about Shawn Rogers. He was pretty disruptive in the Bears game yesterday. He had five tackles, 1 sack, three hurries, tipped a pass, caused an intentional grounding penalty, and blocked a FG. Interior of the line has got to control him.

no kidding.. he is the detroit version of griffin.. he can
disrupt the interior of the line all by himself

[shally]

True, with all the FAs brought in, any word on Demulling and how he's doing? Fabini just sucks...

demulling should be active for this game.. how much he plays is another matter. i guess it comes down to how well he practices and understands the line calls

fabini has been in camp from the start and that is a big advantage

[shally]

That's what really confuses me, we've got playmakers all over our offense, there is no reason we should struggle to get outta the teens. Portis can break open any play, at any time... Moss is another homerun threat... Cooley can take any route he runs 20 yards, no matter who is covering him... JC can run 20+ yards on his own. Teams that have considerably less do considerably better than we do (green bay comes to mind immediately).

Conservative playcalling or not, it's ineffective playcalling. You can be conservative but also effective.

3/5 of our o line is new.. that has to make a difference.. look at what losing just 1 player did to the philly o line last night

[RedskinRyan]

well, we were red-hot against the down and out giants, and they came back and won. we are now the down skins, going up against the red-hot lions. they didnt fare well in their last NFC East matchup. i hope we give them one hell of a game.

[firehawk157]

True, but I don't think we took a downgrade in getting Kendall over Dockery. So that really shouldn't matter. Wade isn't new either... And he's filled in just fine for Jansen. The Fabini/Thomas switch is the only real, undisputable downgrade and even so, it's not like we were putting up 30+ points before Thomas went out.

[shally]

well, we were red-hot against the down and out giants, and they came back and won. we are now the down skins, going up against the red-hot lions. they didnt fare well in their last NFC East matchup. i hope we give them one hell of a game.

we squandered some first half chances to put the game away against the giants.. we still could have done better than we did.

the second half was atrocious. hopefully that team does not show up against detroit

[akhhorus]

The biggest advantages we'll have are:
1-The Lions don't run the ball much(or effectively), so the skins can basically stay in a Nickel defense all day.
2-The Lions secondary is shoddy.

But make no mistake: Kitna and their WRs will test this secondary all game long. A good rainy game day would be nice to see.

[shally]

The biggest advantages we'll have are:
1-The Lions don't run the ball much(or effectively), so the skins can basically stay in a Nickel defense all day.
2-The Lions secondary is shoddy.

But make no mistake: Kitna and their WRs will test this secondary all game long. A good rainy game day would be nice to see.

i don t know that the lion secondary is any worse than the giants overall

and i remember bell running around end for the broncos against us for good yardage... at least holdman is not here to torment, but carter better be able to hold the point

[firehawk157]

Good, but sadly I don't really know how good demulling is or how bad fabini is, so does anyone know (assuming they are on the same level from a knowlege standpoint) if Demulling is better than fabini???

[firehawk157]

i don t know that the lion secondary is any worse than the giants overall

and i remember bell running around end for the broncos against us for good yardage... at least holdman is not here to torment, but carter better be able to hold the point
Yeah, the 2005 Broncos has absolutely nothing to do with this game. Totally different circumstances.

[shally]

Yeah, the 2005 Broncos has absolutely nothing to do with this game. Totally different circumstances.

yeah, well travis henry kills us no matter what uniform he is wearing...

[akhhorus]

i don t know that the lion secondary is any worse than the giants overall

and i remember bell running around end for the broncos against us for good yardage... at least holdman is not here to torment, but carter better be able to hold the point

Meh. The Giants secondary is Wilson(a decent player), a couple crappy youngsters and a couple washed up vets. The Lions' best CB is fernando bryant lol.

[nicefellow31]

The biggest advantages we'll have are:
1-The Lions don't run the ball much(or effectively), so the skins can basically stay in a Nickel defense all day.
2-The Lions secondary is shoddy.

But make no mistake: Kitna and their WRs will test this secondary all game long. A good rainy game day would be nice to see.

Early forecast for Sunday. High of 81 degrees, with 10% chance of precipitation. Partly cloudy. Sooo, maybe they don't cut the grass at Fedex this week, or we can leave the sprinklers on too long on Saturday.

[Keino]

Im worried about the next 3 games. I watched a lot of the Arizona Pittsburgh game and they shut down Willie Parker. Im worried about the Pack at Lambeau, who are essentially a passing team, but have one of the greatest QBs in history leading them and of course I am worried about the Lions. That was an impressive win they had yesterday.

[firehawk157]

Im worried about the next 3 games. I watched a lot of the Arizona Pittsburgh game and they shut down Willie Parker. Im worried about the Pack at Lambeau, who are essentially a passing team, but have one of the greatest QBs in history leading them and of course I am worried about the Lions. That was an impressive win they had yesterday.
AZ can be had on defense, the Steelers just didn't do it. They stacked 8 in the box all day long, the Steelers just couldn't get the downfield passing game going.

[Keino]

AZ can be had on defense, the Steelers just didn't do it. They stacked 8 in the box all day long, the Steelers just couldn't get the downfield passing game going.

And what makes you think we will be able to get it going?

[firehawk157]

I didn't say we would or won't do it. But if we can get it done, AZ's defense won't look anything like they did against the Steelers.

[smoak]

This is a "must win" for the Redskins and I will lose all faith or hope that we are playoff bound if they lose. I don't want to hear about how good the Lions are (and they are which I predicted)... We've had two weeks to prepare and these players need to remind teams of what it is like to play the Washington Redskins at home. There can be more giving away games when we have a two score lead, and it is either now or never for this **expletive** defense.

While I am not in agreement with the degree to which the coaching staff has come under fire, I think at some point you either get these chumps to play or you don't. There is no tomorrow if we lose a second home game in the conference and I tabbed both this and AZ as statement games that will be necessary come time for wild card tie breakers...

Get it done Sunday or I might as well give up my season tickets next year, b/c I spend too much time and money (that could be invested with my kid) to keep going through the same garbage.

**Expletive** the Lions. We are the team that should be feared and hopefully everyone in this organization remembers that on game day.

[redskin_rich]

The Lions O-Line is bad. To win, we need to get to Kitna early and often and knock him silly or we need to score 30+ points.

[firehawk157]

This is a "must win" for the Redskins and I will lose all faith or hope that we are playoff bound if they lose. I don't want to hear about how good the Lions are (and they are which I predicted)... We've had two weeks to prepare and these players need to remind teams of what it is like to play the Washington Redskins at home. There can be more giving away games when we have a two score lead, and it is either now or never for this **expletive** defense.

While I am not in agreement with the degree to which the coaching staff has come under fire, I think at some point you either get these chumps to play or you don't. There is no tomorrow if we lose a second home game in the conference and I tabbed both this and AZ as statement games that will be necessary come time for wild card tie breakers...

Get it done Sunday or I might as well give up my season tickets next year, b/c I spend too much time and money (that could be invested with my kid) to keep going through the same garbage.

**Expletive** the Lions. We are the team that should be feared and hopefully everyone in this organization remembers that on game day.
I don't think it's necessarily a must-win game so much as it's (as already mentioned) a statement game. We need to show that we went into the bye week and fixed what was wrong and come out attacking. If we lose 40-35 because after Kitna's 14th sack, he got the ball out as he's getting hit (before sinking into a horrible paranoid state in which there is little hope of recovery) and Roy Williams caught it one handed while tapping his feet inbounds for the final TD, I'll feel a lot better than if we go into the half 14-13 and end up losing 16-14 because we sat on the lead and let them have the underneath stuff. At least we're trying in one scenario, and not playing scared.

Not all losses are the same, just like not all wins are the same.

[CarMike]

The Lions O-Line is bad. To win, we need to get to Kitna early and often and knock him silly or we need to score 30+ points.
Who is worse? The Lions OL, or our DL?

[akhhorus]

Who is worse? The Lions OL, or our DL?

Their Oline is so-so, but might be missing their entire left side. THey're big, but slow.

[shally]

This is a "must win" for the Redskins and I will lose all faith or hope that we are playoff bound if they lose. I don't want to hear about how good the Lions are (and they are which I predicted)... We've had two weeks to prepare and these players need to remind teams of what it is like to play the Washington Redskins at home. There can be more giving away games when we have a two score lead, and it is either now or never for this **expletive** defense.

While I am not in agreement with the degree to which the coaching staff has come under fire, I think at some point you either get these chumps to play or you don't. There is no tomorrow if we lose a second home game in the conference and I tabbed both this and AZ as statement games that will be necessary come time for wild card tie breakers...

Get it done Sunday or I might as well give up my season tickets next year, b/c I spend too much time and money (that could be invested with my kid) to keep going through the same garbage.

**Expletive** the Lions. We are the team that should be feared and hopefully everyone in this organization remembers that on game day.

i could not agree more.. this is the type of opponent we need to put away without any hesistation or wasted motion..

[Meatsnack]

Who is worse? The Lions OL, or our DL?

Well, if Griffin's hip and Daniel's foot are healthy, their O-line is worse. If Griffin and Daniela are both marginal, then our D-line is worse. We'll just have to wait that out, I think.

The sad thing for me is that once upon a time I knew that giving Gibbs 2 weeks to prepare for anyone pretty much meant we were going to win. Now, it doesn't make a bit of difference.

[SkinsfaninNJ]

This is a "must win" for the Redskins and I will lose all faith or hope that we are playoff bound if they lose. I don't want to hear about how good the Lions are (and they are which I predicted)... We've had two weeks to prepare and these players need to remind teams of what it is like to play the Washington Redskins at home. There can be more giving away games when we have a two score lead, and it is either now or never for this **expletive** defense.

While I am not in agreement with the degree to which the coaching staff has come under fire, I think at some point you either get these chumps to play or you don't. There is no tomorrow if we lose a second home game in the conference and I tabbed both this and AZ as statement games that will be necessary come time for wild card tie breakers...

Get it done Sunday or I might as well give up my season tickets next year, b/c I spend too much time and money (that could be invested with my kid) to keep going through the same garbage.

**Expletive** the Lions. We are the team that should be feared and hopefully everyone in this organization remembers that on game day.

Here is the thing that scares me about this game and the early part of the season. It will be our fourth game and three have been at home. Plus, we have already had the bye. I haven't looked at the rest of the schedule, but my quick math tells me after this week, we will play 12 more games and only 5 will be at home. We have to get this home win.

[redskin_rich]

Here is the thing that scares me about this game and the early part of the season. It will be our fourth game and three have been at home. Plus, we have already had the bye. I haven't looked at the rest of the schedule, but my quick math tells me after this week, we will play 12 more games and only 5 will be at home. We have to get this home win.After Detroit, 3 of the next 4 are on the road, so it evens up by the halfway point. However it's scheduled, you always have to get your home wins, especially within the division and conference. In '05 we went 6-2 at home but the 2 losses were to AFC teams. We are already 0-1 at home against the division and conference, so basically we have already used a costly mulligan. We have to string together some wins now, we don't have the luxury of a midseason slump like in '05. The bye week is history, more than half of our best players are hurt and we have 13 consecutive weeks of football to play.

It would be nice to see the Skins take Detroit to the woodshed, just to ease our minds for a week but the Skins rarely make it easy on us. We win by 3.

Skins-24

Lions-21

[Skaggsrules]

I just hope we are tied or behind no more than a touchdown going into half, it'll force Gibbs & Co to open the playbook

[Slobberknocker]

I just hope we are tied or behind no more than a touchdown going into half, it'll force Gibbs & Co to open the playbook

Open the playbook? Better take the temperature of Hell and check the flight-worthiness of bovines.

[GibbsFan]

The Lions offense can be stopped with pressure on Kitna. This is a game where Carter needs to come up big, because their WR's are gonna have big opportunities against our corners. Bell made Daniels look like an old fool the last time he saw him so one of the linebackers needs to smack him early. He's dangerous on the edge of the field.

I hope we pound them 35-40 times because we need to keep there offense off the field. If Moss can't go, a successful running game becomes even more important. Their secondary might be the worst in the league, but if we are minus Moss they match up well against us.

Scary game, and definitely a must win but I think we can win by a close margin in the 30's. I don't know what the over/under is, but this is a good bet on the over if its 47 or less.

[bosshog001]

With my normal D on a bye, its down to the Seahawks D, Packers or the Lions D to pick up this week. If not for being a Skins fan, this would be a no brainer.

Are they that good on D and are we really that bad on O? They did get torched by the Eagles of all teams?

Otherwise, need to have the seahawks ground the Steelers or Pack beat up on the Bears.

Heart or Head? It always hurts

[LadyNRedskinsfan]

i think in the end, the team with the better defense will win, which is us.

skins 30 detroit 27

[LadyNRedskinsfan]

With my normal D on a bye, its down to the Seahawks D, Packers or the Lions D to pick up this week. If not for being a Skins fan, this would be a no brainer.

Are they that good on D and are we really that bad on O? They did get torched by the Eagles of all teams?

Otherwise, need to have the seahawks ground the Steelers or Pack beat up on the Bears.

Heart or Head? It always hurts

are you asking for FF advice, or asking about the lion's defense vs. washington's offense? either way, did you really need to make a seperate thread for this? lol. im merging this with the other 3 redskins vs. lions threads, you can find all of your answers there. btw, detroit's defense isnt very good at all, they gave up almost 30 to chicago and 56 to philly.....

[bosshog001]

are you asking for FF advice, or asking about the lion's defense vs. washington's offense? either way, did you really need to make a seperate thread for this? lol. im merging this with the other 3 redskins vs. lions threads, you can find all of your answers there. btw, detroit's defense isnt very good at all, they gave up almost 30 to chicago and 56 to philly.....

True, but they have had 13 takeaways and scored a touchdown. Thats not bad for 4 weeks, but good enough for me to go with the Pack or Seahawks

Thanks

[LadyNRedskinsfan]

True, but they have had 13 takeaways and scored a touchdown. Thats not bad for 4 weeks, but good enough for me to go with the Pack or Seahawks

Thanks
thats true. i wish we could get turnovers like that. :( don't most FF defenses get negative points for yards and points given up as well?

[WarEagle]

Open the playbook? Better take the temperature of Hell and check the flight-worthiness of bovines.

lol. After I wrongly predicted a breakout game vs. the Giants, I'm hesitant to predict anything. I guess these aren't the typical Turkey Day loser Lions like we've always known. I'll just predict that if there's a critical clock management problem on our sidelines Sunday, we'll read about it here. ;)

[shally]

lol. After I wrongly predicted a breakout game vs. the Giants, I'm hesitant to predict anything. I guess these aren't the typical Turkey Day loser Lions like we've always known. I'll just predict that if there's a critical clock management problem on our sidelines Sunday, we'll read about it here. ;)

the skins are not ready to be favored against almost anyone.. we need to settle down and define ourselves as a team

[joethefan]

i think in the end, the team with the better defense will win, which is us.

skins 30 detroit 27


Lady I'm sorry... their is no way we score 30

[smoak]

i could not agree more.. this is the type of opponent we need to put away without any hesistation or wasted motion..

But I don't want my post to indicate that I think this is an easy game or that we should blow out the Lions. IMO you just can NOT afford to lose b/c the mentality in the lockerroom will just die.

Lady I'm sorry... their is no way we score 30

People said the same story before the Niners. In reality I doubt we score 30, but speaking absolutes is always foolish.

I don't think it's necessarily a must-win game so much as it's (as already mentioned) a statement game. We need to show that we went into the bye week and fixed what was wrong and come out attacking. If we lose 40-35 because after Kitna's 14th sack, he got the ball out as he's getting hit (before sinking into a horrible paranoid state in which there is little hope of recovery) and Roy Williams caught it one handed while tapping his feet inbounds for the final TD, I'll feel a lot better than if we go into the half 14-13 and end up losing 16-14 because we sat on the lead and let them have the underneath stuff. At least we're trying in one scenario, and not playing scared.

Not all losses are the same, just like not all wins are the same.

I understand and really respect your POV. Its foolish to say that we'd be out of it at 2-2, but I really believe we will. We need to win. I'm not saying score a lot of points. I'm not saying blow anyone out. I'm not even saying it has to be pretty.

But at the end of the day, these players need to understand that they must win this football game.

[Patrick]

Lady I'm sorry... their is no way we score 30
Totally disagree with you here jtf .......... we haven't and that is a fact but we are very capable of scoring in the 30's - it's just a matter of time, adjusting the play calling, and having the right players in position.
As much as you say "No Way" - I say "They Will".

[redwolf1218]

Lady I'm sorry... their is no way we score 30

i agree. if we get up by 3, we'll sit on it. if we get down by 3, we'll panic and abandon the run. Portis and Moss are both hurt. we cant cover anyone. sorry to be all gloom and doom, but this is like running into a buzz saw. we might score 30 but i wont be surprised if they drop 400 yards passing and 40 points on us.

[Hr fan]

the skins are not ready to be favored against almost anyone.. we need to settle down and define ourselves as a team

Coming off a bye week where past stats say the rested team wins, with game tape of blowouts (including CHI who were north of 25 pts), and comparing D collapses (NYG 21 2nd half points, CHI an NFL record 34 4th qtr points) I like the 'Skins chances. Agree about needing all the players to buy into a team identity, but a win against an over .500team will help this enormously.

[shally]

Totally disagree with you here jtf .......... we haven't and that is a fact but we are very capable of scoring in the 30's - it's just a matter of time, adjusting the play calling, and having the right player in position.
As much as you say "No Way" - I say "They Will".

for us to score 30, the defense is going to have to account for a couple of td's-- either by scoring themselves or giving the offense redzone opportunities..
the offense is simply to conservative and tends to settle for FG's.. hard to get to 30 with mostly FG's

[shally]

i agree. if we get up by 3, we'll sit on it. if we get down by 3, we'll panic and abandon the run. Portis and Moss are both hurt. we cant cover anyone. sorry to be all gloom and doom, but this is like running into a buzz saw. we might score 30 but i wont be surprised if they drop 400 yards passing and 40 points on us.

you thoughts have been mine in this regard as well..i sure hope they can break out of that mold.

[firehawk157]

I understand and really respect your POV. Its foolish to say that we'd be out of it at 2-2, but I really believe we will. We need to win. I'm not saying score a lot of points. I'm not saying blow anyone out. I'm not even saying it has to be pretty.

But at the end of the day, these players need to understand that they must win this football game.

My POV comes from how we always say it's a must win every week. It was a must-win against the giants because we'd be 2-0 in the div, 3-0 overall and smash the Giants to 0-3. Momentum and all that.

It was a must-win against the Eagles because it was our statement game. We had to go into hostile territory and crush the reigning East champs.

It was a must-win against the Phins to start off on a good foot and not get sucked into the 06 dreg.

Now we are saying it's a must-win against detriot, which I disagree with. It's a very important win, we need to beat a team that has a winning record and we need to establish momentum coming outta the bye week. We need to establish homefield advantage. Those are all very important. BUT just like any other game, it's important because there's only 16 games, so there isn't much time to swing momentum from one way to the other like they can in basketball or baseball.

If we lose this game, the next game becomes a must-win. If we win, the next game doesn't diminish in importance, but it won't be a must-win.

[shally]

My POV comes from how we always say it's a must win every week. It was a must-win against the giants because we'd be 2-0 in the div, 3-0 overall and smash the Giants to 0-3. Momentum and all that.

It was a must-win against the Eagles because it was our statement game. We had to go into hostile territory and crush the reigning East champs.

It was a must-win against the Phins to start off on a good foot and not get sucked into the 06 dreg.

Now we are saying it's a must-win against detriot, which I disagree with. It's a very important win, we need to beat a team that has a winning record and we need to establish momentum coming outta the bye week. We need to establish homefield advantage. Those are all very important. BUT just like any other game, it's important because there's only 16 games, so there isn't much time to swing momentum from one way to the other like they can in basketball or baseball.

If we lose this game, the next game becomes a must-win. If we win, the next game doesn't diminish in importance, but it won't be a must-win.

i agree that we are not statistically in must win territory yet, but this game is eminently winnable and if you look at the schedule, there are not that many
over the next 1/3 of the season that appear that way. suddenly green bay looks more than formidable and the pats look simply unreal..

this team needs to distinguish itself from the flop that was last years team and one major way to do that is to win at home against teams we should be able to beat..detroit is no bunch of chumps and beating them will erase a large portion of the bad taste left from the giant loss.. losing to them is likely to inspire too many thoughts of "here we go again." and dropping conference games at home is no way to get into the playoffs

we simply dont want to get ourselves into a box

[Judge Smails]

Hello from Detroit.

I run http://www.lions-fans.com and just wanted to wish you guys good luck for next week.

If any of you guys want to stop by, you are more than welcome. We had a bit of a tussle with another forum (your "official" one), but trust us, we come in peace. :wazzup:

Can I steal your pickle by the way?:Pickle:

[Patrick]

Hello from Detroit.

I run http://www.lions-fans.com and just wanted to wish you guys good luck for next week.

If any of you guys want to stop by, you are more than welcome. We had a bit of a tussle with another forum (your "official" one), but trust us, we come in peace. :wazzup:

Can I steal your pickle by the way?:Pickle:

Welcome to our board.
We are and always will be a civil group and long as "Visitor" are respectful, follow our board guidelines, and can contribute quality discussion.

[BlueNSilver]

Hmm...well, I admit that the Lions can win next week's game. OTOH, Philly, whom we beat the previous week, hung 50+ on them. The Lions made Kevin Curtis look like the second coming of Jerry Rice. Basically, for me this game boils down to the right side of our O-line against the left side of their D-line. If the Lions get penetration from their front four consistently, we will lose. If we can move or at least stalemate Shaun Rogers with Fabini and Rabach, then we will likely win.

The Lion's DBs are nothing special (see Eagles, Philadelphia)and if we can run at all to keep the defense honest, we will likely win. Kitna is playing well but 3 of his 4 Ints have been in the endzone - that is, he is prone to choking in the redzone. Kitna runs well but does not throw well on the run. If we can move him off his spot, the Lion's passing game will not get in a rhythm. And, the Lion's running game is mediocre. Jones is soft and Bell is impatient waiting for blocks. Last, the Lion's receivers do not like contact and I think we have ways to arraneg that they get plenty of that. The Lions are there to be had if we want them.

Jones is soft?? You obviously have never watched KJ play. He runs behind his pads more then any young back in the game. Watch some video of him from last year or 05, and you'll see how he is nowhere near soft. Ask Jermaine Phillips or Ray Lewis if he runs soft...lol

[firehawk157]

Jones is soft?? You obviously have never watched KJ play. He runs behind his pads more then any young back in the game. Watch some video of him from last year or 05, and you'll see how he is nowhere near soft. Ask Jermaine Phillips or Ray Lewis if he runs soft...lol
Maybe just a smidgeon of hyberbole??? There are a lot of guys that run behind their pads a good deal, and I don't think Kevin Jones is that much more damaging of a back.

[shally]

Hello from Detroit.

I run http://www.lions-fans.com and just wanted to wish you guys good luck for next week.

If any of you guys want to stop by, you are more than welcome. We had a bit of a tussle with another forum (your "official" one), but trust us, we come in peace. :wazzup:

Can I steal your pickle by the way?:Pickle:

welcome.. you can have the pickle

good luck to you guys also. hope it is a clean, non injury game for both teams..

[Judge Smails]

For stealing the pickle, I give you this...


And Kevin Jones soft!? Get a load of THIS!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzGaqkkZ6Eo

[nicefellow31]

Hello from Detroit.

I run http://www.lions-fans.com and just wanted to wish you guys good luck for next week.

If any of you guys want to stop by, you are more than welcome. We had a bit of a tussle with another forum (your "official" one), but trust us, we come in peace. :wazzup:

Can I steal your pickle by the way?:Pickle:

Welcome and good luck to you. Will stop by your site. I had a bit of a tussle with the "official" site as well. We are nothing like that here.

Nice user name. Here is one of my favorite Judge Smails quotes:

"YOU'LL GET NOTHING AND LIKE IT!"

[shally]

Welcome and good luck to you. Will stop by your site. I had a bit of a tussle with the "official" site as well. We are nothing like that here.

Nice user name. Here is one of my favorite Judge Smails quotes:

"YOU'LL GET NOTHING AND LIKE IT!"

easy to register and get on...

[CNYSkinFan]

For stealing the pickle, I give you this...


And Kevin Jones soft!? Get a load of THIS!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzGaqkkZ6Eo
ok first one to use Nazi in a political debate or Madden in an NFl Debate loses.

[Judge Smails]

:Partybig:

[CarMike]

Welcome Judge Smails/BlueNSilver. I'll be sure to stop and check your site out.

Thanks for taking the time to register here. As Patrick said earlier on. We love to have visitors stop by and talk it up with us. As long as they show respect on our board, it's all good. Just like we expect our members to behave on your board as well.

And if anyone thinks KJ runs "soft". I'll have to politely disagree. :)

[Judge Smails]

I invited a couple guys over as well.

We did talk a little smack about your 'Skins, so don't take it personally when you check out the site (that's the reason the ES guys were mad at us).

We know our team sucks, we know we don't win on the road, especially outdoors, we know Millen is an embarassment, we know our offensive line sucks, as does our secondary, as does our linebackers minus Ernie Sims.

Anyway, that's about it on that.

I stole these guys too, :smash:

[shally]

I invited a couple guys over as well.

We did talk a little smack about your 'Skins, so don't take it personally when you check out the site (that's the reason the ES guys were mad at us).

We know our team sucks, we know we don't win on the road, especially outdoors, we know Millen is an embarassment, we know our offensive line sucks, as does our secondary, as does our linebackers minus Ernie Sims.

Anyway, that's about it on that.

I stole these guys too, :smash:

yeah, but when i last checked you had donte curry still on your roster.. stole him from us....

[firehawk157]

I wouldn't say your team sucks. Your defense is pretty bad, but your offense is downright scary. We'd start Furrey in half a second (I have him in my top 5 list of underrated receivers). PLEASE don't resign him, your fine with RW and CJ!!!

I think we match-up well against Kevin Jones though, we seem to do a lot better with power backs. We are all nervous here in Skins land about the passing attack though. We think if we get to Kitna enough and keep the pressure on, the Lions can be had. But that's the rub, we like to get after a QB for a half and then back off inexplicably.

[nicefellow31]

I wouldn't say your team sucks. Your defense is pretty bad, but your offense is downright scary. We'd start Furrey in half a second (I have him in my top 5 list of underrated receivers). PLEASE don't resign him, your fine with RW and CJ!!!

I think we match-up well against Kevin Jones though, we seem to do a lot better with power backs. We are all nervous here in Skins land about the passing attack though. We think if we get to Kitna enough and keep the pressure on, the Lions can be had. But that's the rub, we like to get after a QB for a half and then back off inexplicably.

That's a good point. The Tiki Baber/Bryant Westbrook type of RB have traditionally done well against us. Wasn't Jones fighting thru an injury?

[Judge Smails]

yeah, but when i last checked you had donte curry still on your roster.. stole him from us....

Donte Curry? He played for us for the past 5-6 years. We cut him this pre-season, but re-signed him.

Did he play for you before?

[akhhorus]

I invited a couple guys over as well.

We did talk a little smack about your 'Skins, so don't take it personally when you check out the site (that's the reason the ES guys were mad at us).

We know our team sucks, we know we don't win on the road, especially outdoors, we know Millen is an embarassment, we know our offensive line sucks, as does our secondary, as does our linebackers minus Ernie Sims.

Anyway, that's about it on that.

I stole these guys too, :smash:

You have two great areas: your Dline and passing game. Thats enough to win 8-10 in the NFL these days. The problem is that if a team can hold back your Dline, the back 7 will give up a ton of yards.

[shally]

That's a good point. The Tiki Baber/Bryant Westbrook type of RB have traditionally done well against us. Wasn't Jones fighting thru an injury?

jones is ALWAYS fighting through an injury...

[firehawk157]

Yeah, he was. Lisfrac (sp?) and he actually came back much sooner than expected. I watched a bit of the Lions/Bears game and it didn't seem like he was favoring anything, so I doubt we will be able to "target" that.

[shally]

Donte Curry? He played for us for the past 5-6 years. We cut him this pre-season, but re-signed him.

Did he play for you before?

yep.. curry was originally a college free agent who looked really good and got caught in a numbers crunch.. they kept some older broken down backer and you guys snapped him up
i have noted that he was on your roster for 5 or 6 years.. not bad for an undrafted guy

[shally]

You have two great areas: your Dline and passing game. Thats enough to win 8-10 in the NFL these days. The problem is that if a team can hold back your Dline, the back 7 will give up a ton of yards.

sounds like the giants also....of course philly didnt do so good with the front 4

[akhhorus]

sounds like the giants also....of course philly didnt do so good with the front 4

The Giants at least have a vaguely competent back 7. I don't know if I would call the Lions' back 7 that. Their secondary might be the worst in the NFL.

[SkinsfaninNJ]

That's a good point. The Tiki Baber/Bryant Westbrook type of RB have traditionally done well against us. Wasn't Jones fighting thru an injury?

Very true, which is why when we play the Giants I am hoping for Brandon Jacobs rather than Ward who played well against us.

The bigger and stronger the back, the less chance the back has against us, historically speaking.

[SkinsfaninNJ]

The Giants at least have a vaguely competent back 7. I don't know if I would call the Lions' back 7 that. Their secondary might be the worst in the NFL.

It only matters if we can take advantage of it. If we don't have Moss, I'm not sure we can take advantage of it.

[shally]

The Giants at least have a vaguely competent back 7. I don't know if I would call the Lions' back 7 that. Their secondary might be the worst in the NFL.

when bryant is your number 1 corner that does say a lot...

[akhhorus]

It only matters if we can take advantage of it. If we don't have Moss, I'm not sure we can take advantage of it.

Maybe, Maybe not. They'll put Simms on Cooley, and we do have a size advantage on our Oline to their Dline. I think this could be a Portis goes off game.

[firehawk157]

We really need to get off of the 60/40 split between Portis and Betts. 4.7 YPC for Portis, 2 something for Betts. 3 TDs to 0 TDs. Exact same OL against the exact same defenses. There is no difference in the way we use them either. Betts can't break past the LOS to save his life, let's stop using him.

[SkinsfaninNJ]

Maybe, Maybe not. They'll put Simms on Cooley, and we do have a size advantage on our Oline to their Dline. I think this could be a Portis goes off game.

That would be great to see. You know what offensive showing I liked, the 2005 Rams game. Remember that game, on the road, 24 points. We ran the ball about 40 times and threw about 20. Portis had well over 100 yards and 2 TD's as I recall and I think Cooley caught one too. That was a nice efficient offense.

[firehawk157]

That would be great to see. You know what offensive showing I liked, the 2005 Rams game. Remember that game, on the road, 24 points. We ran the ball about 40 times and threw about 20. Portis had well over 100 yards and 2 TD's as I recall and I think Cooley caught one too. That was a nice efficient offense.
I think we're due to a game of complete domination by Portis. One where it seems like the other team has absolutely no idea how to stop him.

[shally]

Maybe, Maybe not. They'll put Simms on Cooley, and we do have a size advantage on our Oline to their Dline. I think this could be a Portis goes off game.

except inthe middle.. rogers is about 340 and is a load to move. it is going to take both rabach and kendall or rabach and fabini to get him moving.
how well they control him will go a long way to how much running room portis and betts have

[akhhorus]

except inthe middle.. rogers is about 340 and is a load to move. it is going to take both rabach and kendall or rabach and fabini to get him moving.
how well they control him will go a long way to how much running room portis and betts have

Yeah, but Cody is less than 300, and Edwards/White are smaller DEs.

[BlueNSilver]

except inthe middle.. rogers is about 340 and is a load to move. it is going to take both rabach and kendall or rabach and fabini to get him moving.
how well they control him will go a long way to how much running room portis and betts have

Should be a fun matchup to watch. Skins want to pound the rock, and the Lions front 7 has been up to the task but 1 week (which is not a surprise we lost that week) Portis is one of my favorite backs to watch so it should be interesting trying to stop him.

Lamont Jordan 15 carries 70yards
Adrian Peterson 20 carries 66yards (only time he hasn't hit 100)
B.Westbrook 14 carries 110yards
Cedric Benson 15 carries 50yards

As much as people seem to think we're not stopping the run, we have been doing a real well job against it. It all depends on if our front 7 comes to play or not.

[BlueNSilver]

Yeah, but Cody is less than 300, and Edwards/White are smaller DEs.

Actually every one of our DT's is 300 or better except Corey Redding who is 295. He plays our 3 technique and is the penetrator (although Rogers plays that position quite often as well)

[SkinsfaninNJ]

Should be a fun matchup to watch. Skins want to pound the rock, and the Lions front 7 has been up to the task but 1 week (which is not a surprise we lost that week) Portis is one of my favorite backs to watch so it should be interesting trying to stop him.

Lamont Jordan 15 carries 70yards
Adrian Peterson 20 carries 66yards (only time he hasn't hit 100)
B.Westbrook 14 carries 110yards
Cedric Benson 15 carries 50yards

As much as people seem to think we're not stopping the run, we have been doing a real well job against it. It all depends on if our front 7 comes to play or not.

Your post points out something else also, if Westbrook ever stayed healthy, he would be in the same sentence with Tomlinson.

[BlueNSilver]

Your post points out something else also, if Westbrook ever stayed healthy, he would be in the same sentence with Tomlinson.

I agree Westbrook is an amazing player when he's on the field

[firehawk157]

I see Westbrook as more of a Faulk type guy myself. Tomlinson really is in a league of his own, he is the Chargers offense. After all, Westbrook was healthy all of 2006.

[shally]

Should be a fun matchup to watch. Skins want to pound the rock, and the Lions front 7 has been up to the task but 1 week (which is not a surprise we lost that week) Portis is one of my favorite backs to watch so it should be interesting trying to stop him.

Lamont Jordan 15 carries 70yards
Adrian Peterson 20 carries 66yards (only time he hasn't hit 100)
B.Westbrook 14 carries 110yards
Cedric Benson 15 carries 50yards

As much as people seem to think we're not stopping the run, we have been doing a real well job against it. It all depends on if our front 7 comes to play or not.

i love sims

westbrook is going for 100 against anyone if he is healthy. no shame there. that isnt what beat you. not being able to cover anyone or protect kitna killed you
lamont ? meh..
benson is a chump, he is not going to have very many 100 yard games against anyone this year
the vikes dont have qb's that threaten anything and you need to load up to prevent peterson

but i think that portis runs to the edge well and if samuels can control the end, there are going to be a lot of yards running left.. that is where the yardage will be..

[shally]

Your post points out something else also, if Westbrook ever stayed healthy, he would be in the same sentence with Tomlinson.

not even close.. westbrook is a great back, but he is not designed for 30 carries a game.. he has had time missed from every season because of injuries and if reid uses him like LT he will be on IR

when LT beat us the last time we played he got stronger as the game went on and killed us in OT.. he is an amazing back.. another reason why norv should be relieved of command ASAP.. anyone who can ruin an offense with LT is not fit to be a head coach

[firehawk157]

Running to the outside and making Rogers chase will go a long way to wearing him down. If we can keep it up, by the midpoint of the 3rd quarter, he could be a non-factor and that will open more options. I think the perimeter run defense is very suspect. Brian Westbrook aside, which one of these guys are true speed backs??? Peterson is just a rookie so you've got to give him a pass as he's got to adjust to not being far and away the most physically gifted player on the field.

[LadyNRedskinsfan]

Lady I'm sorry... their is no way we score 30
i dont see why not. we definitely have the potential to. this is arguably the worst defense we've played in 3 games and the best offense we've seen so far. im HOPING the coaches will be more aggressive and won't sit on a lead against a team that can score pretty darn quickly one they have the ball.

Totally disagree with you here jtf .......... we haven't and that is a fact but we are very capable of scoring in the 30's - it's just a matter of time, adjusting the play calling, and having the right players in position.
As much as you say "No Way" - I say "They Will".
i agree with ya patrick. we definitely have the potential to score 30+ and i think/hope we'll do it this weekend.


Hello from Detroit.

I run http://www.lions-fans.com and just wanted to wish you guys good luck for next week.

If any of you guys want to stop by, you are more than welcome. We had a bit of a tussle with another forum (your "official" one), but trust us, we come in peace.

Can I steal your pickle by the way?
Jones is soft?? You obviously have never watched KJ play. He runs behind his pads more then any young back in the game. Watch some video of him from last year or 05, and you'll see how he is nowhere near soft. Ask Jermaine Phillips or Ray Lewis if he runs soft...lol
:welcome: to hR! looking forward to a good(good meaning, we win. lol) game with no injuries this weekend. :beer:

[SkinFan in BigD]

Welcome to the board Lions fans.
we are very polite and you will enjoy your stay, we arent Cowboy fans:doh:

oh and speaking of, thank you for embarassing them the last game of last year :wacky:

[akhhorus]

Should be a fun matchup to watch. Skins want to pound the rock, and the Lions front 7 has been up to the task but 1 week (which is not a surprise we lost that week) Portis is one of my favorite backs to watch so it should be interesting trying to stop him.

Lamont Jordan 15 carries 70yards
Adrian Peterson 20 carries 66yards (only time he hasn't hit 100)
B.Westbrook 14 carries 110yards
Cedric Benson 15 carries 50yards

As much as people seem to think we're not stopping the run, we have been doing a real well job against it. It all depends on if our front 7 comes to play or not.

17th in rush defense, but 31st in pass defense. That might be a function of teams passing more, more than the Lions shutting down the run.

[firehawk157]

17th in rush defense, but 31st in pass defense. That might be a function of teams passing more, more than the Lions shutting down the run.
I don't know Akh, they are 19th in YPC with 4.1 and 17th in opposing carries/game with 28/game. So that sounds about right, not good, but not horrible either. About run of the mill average.

[akhhorus]

I don't know Akh, they are 19th in YPC with 4.1 and 17th in opposing carries/game with 28/game. So that sounds about right, not good, but not horrible either. About run of the mill average.

And nearly 40 pass attempts against them a game(2nd worst in the NFL). Their defense can't get off the field period(2nd most plays, 7th worst in defensive TOP), but it looks like teams have their 1st and 2nd priorities as passing against this defense.

[shally]

And nearly 40 pass attempts against them a game(2nd worst in the NFL). Their defense can't get off the field period(2nd most plays, 7th worst in defensive TOP), but it looks like teams have their 1st and 2nd priorities as passing against this defense.

if you can pass and score, why waste time with the run (unless you are the skins- the skins need to control the clock and possessions)
they were very lucky to win the OT game against minny.. if jackson doesnt get his groin injured he has the vikes poised at midfield to go in for the kill.
nobody is going to be able to win with bollinger running an OT offense..
so that is not exactly a game to prove how far you have come..

[BlueNSilver]

if you can pass and score, why waste time with the run (unless you are the skins- the skins need to control the clock and possessions)
they were very lucky to win the OT game against minny.. if jackson doesnt get his groin injured he has the vikes poised at midfield to go in for the kill.
nobody is going to be able to win with bollinger running an OT offense..
so that is not exactly a game to prove how far you have come..


Did you watch the Minn game? Jackson was horrible, and running for his life, and when he did he turned the ball over 4x, he had them poised to do nothing...lol

[GibbsFan]

Did you watch the Minn game? Jackson was horrible, and running for his life, and when he did he turned the ball over 4x, he had them poised to do nothing...lol

Yup, I watched some of that game, and fully agree. I thought Vikes were stupid because their team is fairly solid all the way around except for someone to run the offense. They would have been my favorite for your division if they had just been smart enough to get a QB. As it is, they will flounder around through the season while y'all have a legit shot at winning the division.

[BlueNSilver]

Yup, I watched some of that game, and fully agree. I thought Vikes were stupid because their team is fairly solid all the way around except for someone to run the offense. They would have been my favorite for your division if they had just been smart enough to get a QB. As it is, they will flounder around through the season while y'all have a legit shot at winning the division.


Yeah he was horrible. We put 8 men in the box and shutdown AD, and forced him to beat us and he turned the ball over 4x. We were in his face all game, and forced him to make poor decisions.

If they would have gotten a VET at QB i agree they could have been right there.

[Judge Smails]

Looks like Calvin Johnson is going to play this Sunday since he started practicing again yesterday in full pads, added to that a 100% healthy Kevin Jones and Tatum Bell in the backfield.

Might be a more interesting game than I thought.

Seriously though, if your offensive line is 1/2 as good as Philly's, we don't stand a chance. Bottom line.

[akhhorus]

Looks like Calvin Johnson is going to play this Sunday since he started practicing again yesterday in full pads, added to that a 100% healthy Kevin Jones and Tatum Bell in the backfield.

Might be a more interesting game than I thought.

Seriously though, if your offensive line is 1/2 as good as Philly's, we don't stand a chance. Bottom line.

After last sunday night, thats not much lol.

[dj_stouty]

This game better not turn into a shootout, because the Skins simply can't win those types of games; especially against the Detroit passing attack. You just simply dont' know which Greg Williams' defense will show up...

Detoit's passing game is really good. They are the only team in the league to have 3 different players with 20 or more catches. (and that doesn't even include CJ, who already has 3 TDs in the season) Meaning: Kitna can spread around the ball. If the Skins' front 4 can't get any pressure on the guy, then 350 and 2TDs will be the result.

I'm not scared of their running game. Similar to the Eagles, they tend to put all of their offensive eggs in one basket; passing. (Detroit passes 68% of the time compared to running the ball 32% of the time) THey are playing against NFC East football...and they are going to have to at least pretend to get a running game going early.

What could potentially scare me is defending the screen pass, since our LBs and DBs have been prone to use the "whiffed killshot" technique during these plays instead of making a solid tackle; and that usually results in a major gain by the receiver. Can any of our Lions visitors chime in and let me know if HB screens are part of the Detroit playbook this year?

I said it last week and I'll say it again. We need to rush the ball 35 times to win this game. 22 for Portis...13 for Betts sound good to me. (they combined for only 21 carries last week) Control the clock and keep Kitna/Roy off the field. (And hope our Defense can record some sacks/turnovers for good measure)

[Judge Smails]

Can any of our Lions visitors chime in and let me know if HB screens are part of the Detroit playbook this year?

Not at all this year so far.
Tatum Bell has always had a problem catching the ball out of the backfield.
Kevin Jones is excellent in that area.
Since he is healthy again, they might start doing that again.

Detroit can't run between the tackles well, but it seems like the draw play to Bell works well and KJ runs extremely strong.

The key for you guys is to pick on Backus and get quick pressure on Kitna. It amazes me sometimes why there isn't a guy running a quick slant on blitz plays...

[dj_stouty]

Not at all this year so far.

Good. :)


Tatum Bell has always had a problem catching the ball out of the backfield.
Kevin Jones is excellent in that area.
Since he is healthy again, they might start doing that again.

To be honest, I haven't watched KJ play football too much since he left VT. I do know that he rarely caught the ball in college, so I'm guessing he got better at it over the course of his NFL career.

Detroit can't run between the tackles well, but it seems like the draw play to Bell works well and KJ runs extremely strong.

Again, it depends on which Redskins defense shows up. Our d-backs are pretty good at getting to the Runner when he goes outside the tackles. Of course, this is a big reason why they get burned in pass coverage so often, because they tend to bite on PA so much. And BTW - Redskins fans are very familiar with Tatum Bell. He torched us for 127 yards on 12 carries for 2 TDs the last time we faced him.:banghead:

[Keino]

DJ, KJ, when healthy has been pretty terrific for them. I owned him inn fantasy last year, and he would have 60 yards on the ground and then give you 80 and a Touch in passing game. His problem, as it was at VT, is staying healthy.

I watched most of their win against the Bears last week. They definitely tried to involve both backs in the passing game.

[dj_stouty]

DJ, KJ, when healthy has been pretty terrific for them. I owned him inn fantasy last year, and he would have 60 yards on the ground and then give you 80 and a Touch in passing game. His problem, as it was at VT, is staying healthy.

I watched most of their win against the Bears last week. They definitely tried to involve both backs in the passing game.

Yeah...I have always stayed away from KJ in FF due to his shaddy health.

I forgot that he caught 60 passes last year; which is pretty darn good considering he missed a handful of games. Anytime our opponent completes a pass to their RB, I cringe, because I've seen us burned one too many times to forget...

[shally]

Did you watch the Minn game? Jackson was horrible, and running for his life, and when he did he turned the ball over 4x, he had them poised to do nothing...lol


honestly, i saw the last qtr and the overtime, and that is what i based my opinion on.
i will say, i thought he looked like he had the team moving well in overtime.
if you looked at campbell through most of the second half up until the final drive, he looked pretty bad as well. but he got it in position to force overtime
with a terrific performance on the last drive. at least 3 drive saving passes.

i had the feeling that jackson was playing the same way. he only needed 1 or 2 more first downs to get them in position for a winning FG.. sure, maybe it doesnt happen, but bollinger had ZERO chance of anything good happening

so, i would change some of what i said, but not all...

[jedema]

Smails, I think you are wrong with your not at all comment. We do run the Screen passes to the RB's unfortunately for us, they don't always catch the ball, nor do the WR's block for beans. Usually it is a fairly ineffective play for us so Martz usually dumps it to the bottom of the playbook. If I were you I would worry about the x-ing routs in the middle of the field with McDonald and Furey.

Does your D like to man up or play zone?

I should probably do the intro thing

Hi my name is jedema and I am a lions fan....
I like to call the lions-fans.com home because well... I think I kinda sorta like the company... maybe....

[BlueNSilver]

honestly, i saw the last qtr and the overtime, and that is what i based my opinion on.
i will say, i thought he looked like he had the team moving well in overtime.
if you looked at campbell through most of the second half up until the final drive, he looked pretty bad as well. but he got it in position to force overtime
with a terrific performance on the last drive. at least 3 drive saving passes.

i had the feeling that jackson was playing the same way. he only needed 1 or 2 more first downs to get them in position for a winning FG.. sure, maybe it doesnt happen, but bollinger had ZERO chance of anything good happening

so, i would change some of what i said, but not all...


Jackson was horrible like i mentioned.

MINNESOTA'S scoring drives..

7 plays 43 yards Jackson 1yd TD run
8 plays 27yards Longwell FG
Defensive TD on fumble by JT O'Sullivan

Last drive before Jackson got hurt, Missed 48yd FG by Hanson. Jackson completed a screen to Moore for 20yards (obviously nothing to do with Jackson) Hit Wade for 7 yards. 52 yd FG missed.

OT- Jackson did ONE play before he got hurt and Bollinger came in and turned the ball over at the 50yd line.

[dj_stouty]

If I were you I would worry about the x-ing routs in the middle of the field with McDonald and Furey.

And McDonald & Furrey should be worried about getting hit in the middle of the field by Sean Taylor and LaRon Landry. ;)

[shally]

Jackson was horrible like i mentioned.

MINNESOTA'S scoring drives..

7 plays 43 yards Jackson 1yd TD run
8 plays 27yards Longwell FG
Defensive TD on fumble by JT O'Sullivan

Last drive before Jackson got hurt, Missed 48yd FG by Hanson. Jackson completed a screen to Moore for 20yards (obviously nothing to do with Jackson) Hit Wade for 7 yards. 52 yd FG missed.

OT- Jackson did ONE play before he got hurt and Bollinger came in and turned the ball over at the 50yd line.

i stand corrected, then... i remembered it differently..

[redskin_rich]

Smails, I think you are wrong with your not at all comment. We do run the Screen passes to the RB's unfortunately for us, they don't always catch the ball, nor do the WR's block for beans. Usually it is a fairly ineffective play for us so Martz usually dumps it to the bottom of the playbook. If I were you I would worry about the x-ing routs in the middle of the field with McDonald and Furey.

Does your D like to man up or play zone?

I should probably do the intro thing

Hi my name is jedema and I am a lions fan....
I like to call the lions-fans.com home because well... I think I kinda sorta like the company... maybe....

Welcome to hR, jedema and all the Lions fans that are here this week! It's nice to get a take from the other side and I look forward to your insight.

To answer your question, we play mostly zone but occasionally (not enough for most of our preference) we bring a disguised blitz and man up.

[jedema]

And McDonald & Furrey should be worried about getting hit in the middle of the field by Sean Taylor and LaRon Landry. ;)

shrug

every skins fan I talk to is saying the same thing, however if those 2 are running a x route then they are left up to the backers who should be playing the middle of the field, not the safetys. Your safeties had better be covering the deep halves otherwise you will see how fast CJ really is. Even if they come in contact like that, I am not worried. Those 2 know how to handle the punishment.

[CarMike]

shrug

every skins fan I talk to is saying the same thing, however if those 2 are running a x route then they are left up to the backers who should be playing the middle of the field, not the safetys. Your safeties had better be covering the deep halves otherwise you will see how fast CJ really is. Even if they come in contact like that, I am not worried. Those 2 know how to handle the punishment.

Glad you made it over jedema! :)

CALVIN JOHNSON worries the crap out of me. Roy Williams is bad enough. Throw CALVIN JOHNSON into the mix....:eek:

[Keino]

Yeah...I have always stayed away from KJ in FF due to his shaddy health.

I forgot that he caught 60 passes last year; which is pretty darn good considering he missed a handful of games. Anytime our opponent completes a pass to their RB, I cringe, because I've seen us burned one too many times to forget...

Yep, 61 receptions in 11.5 games. He was getting me 10 points per game with just his yardage (60 on the ground 40 receiving) and that doesn't include the 8TDs he scored, but got injured 2 weeks before the fantasy playoffs. I had that paired up with LT. Lost in the Semis 109-108 with a team that ran off 11 straight wins (KJ was a major contributor). Probably the best team I ever put together that didn't win the whole thing.

[dj_stouty]

shrug

every skins fan I talk to is saying the same thing, however if those 2 are running a x route then they are left up to the backers who should be playing the middle of the field, not the safetys. Your safeties had better be covering the deep halves otherwise you will see how fast CJ really is. Even if they come in contact like that, I am not worried. Those 2 know how to handle the punishment.

shrug?

I'm not sure if you have seen any Redskins games this year, but Taylor and Landry are the hardest hitting safety duo in the league. They have the speed to cover deep as well as close in for the hit on any WR over the middle of the field. They may not be close enough to make the hit during the reception, but you can count on them laying the wood sometime soon after the reception.

As I've as admitted before in this thread, I think the Lions will be able to pass the ball pretty effectively on the Redskins, however that doens't take away from the fact that Taylor and Landry will get their shots. A big hit early on may make McDonald or Furrey think twice about crossing the middle of the field. I guess we will have to wait and see just how much punishment they can take.

[jedema]

Glad you made it over jedema! :)

CALVIN JOHNSON worries the crap out of me. Roy Williams is bad enough. Throw CALVIN JOHNSON into the mix....:eek:
If I was Gibbs, I would want my 2 safeties playing deep halves during obvious passing situations. That way they can provide over the top help on the Big 2 WR's. Without that you are man to man and are gonna be in a world of hurt trying to stop them. Kitna has become good at throwing the ball to the recievers which supprises us as lions fans. We are not used to that...

[jedema]

shrug?

I'm not sure if you have seen any Redskins games this year, but Taylor and Landry are the hardest hitting safety duo in the league. They have the speed to cover deep as well as close in for the hit on any WR over the middle of the field. They may not be close enough to make the hit during the reception, but you can count on them laying the wood sometime soon after the reception.

As I've as admitted before in this thread, I think the Lions will be able to pass the ball pretty effectively on the Redskins, however that doens't take away from the fact that Taylor and Landry will get their shots. A big hit early on may make McDonald or Furrey think twice about crossing the middle of the field. I guess we will have to wait and see just how much punishment they can take.
I have never seen either McDonald or Furrey get alligator arms after taking a shot from somebody. They fit the defination of a Profesional. they take there lunch box to the game each and every game. They don't get intimidated.

Now don't go and think that I am not worried about your 2 safties, I just don't think that they are gonna bring the wood as much as you would like to think

[dj_stouty]

Now don't go and think that I am not worried about your 2 safties, I just don't think that they are gonna bring the wood as much as you would like to think

Look. There are very few aspects of this defense that I can talk about in a positive light with 100% certainty; and one of those aspects is the fact that our safetys can hit with the very best of them. I have no problem if you won't take my word for it. Watch the game on Sunday and see for yourself.

[firehawk157]

I have never seen either McDonald or Furrey get alligator arms after taking a shot from somebody. They fit the defination of a Profesional. they take there lunch box to the game each and every game. They don't get intimidated.

Now don't go and think that I am not worried about your 2 safties, I just don't think that they are gonna bring the wood as much as you would like to think
I don't disagree, or discount, that those guys can take the shots, but Taylor and Landry will bring the pain. I'm not saying they'll give anybody alligator arms (though it's happened to better receivers), but they'll think twice about crossing the middle after a shot or two.

[akhhorus]

I have never seen either McDonald or Furrey get alligator arms after taking a shot from somebody. They fit the defination of a Profesional. they take there lunch box to the game each and every game. They don't get intimidated.

Now don't go and think that I am not worried about your 2 safties, I just don't think that they are gonna bring the wood as much as you would like to think

I don't think Alligator arms or intimidation is the biggest threat from Landry/Taylor, they're doing an amazing job timing out hits to knock the ball out of the receiver's hands to make a 15 yard(for example) gain into an incomplete pass. Landry alone is responsible for almost 8-10 of those this year himself I believe.

[SkinsfaninNJ]

i think in the end, the team with the better defense will win, which is us.

skins 30 detroit 27

Lady's alter ego is revealed.


Detroit Lions (3-1) at Washington Redskins (2-1)
Game of the week. Jason Campbell and Jon Kitna stand 10 paces apart and have a good old-fashioned shootout. So why, with the Redskins averaging 198 passing yards and the Lions 313, do I choose Campbell to win? Simple. Better secondary on his team. Roy Williams, have your head on a swivel Sunday. Those two safeties are looking to add a few tattoos to you.

Redskins 30, Lions 27
http://www.fannation.com/peter_king_challenge/pickoff

[Keino]

If I was Gibbs, I would want my 2 safeties playing deep halves during obvious passing situations. That way they can provide over the top help on the Big 2 WR's. Without that you are man to man and are gonna be in a world of hurt trying to stop them. Kitna has become good at throwing the ball to the recievers which supprises us as lions fans. We are not used to that...


Eh, I think I'd rather see Cover 1 with Taylor playing CF in the Middle 1/3 of the field and Landry close to the line taking the dump-off away and punishing your backs out of the backfield. This strategy mixed in with some Man-up and bringing the heat offers us the best chance to disrupt the Lions Passing game.

[shally]

Eh, I think I'd rather see Cover 1 with Taylor playing CF in the Middle 1/3 of the field and Landry close to the line taking the dump-off away and punishing your backs out of the backfield. This strategy mixed in with some Man-up and bringing the heat offers us the best chance to disrupt the Lions Passing game.

one problem with that is if the lions send 2 receivers deep down the sidelines it means that taylor only is in position to cover 1 and a corner is left alone. whereas if landry is also back that gives deep help to both

[Judge Smails]

And McDonald & Furrey should be worried about getting hit in the middle of the field by Sean Taylor and LaRon Landry. ;)

Have you watched either of those play?

Mike Furrey hasn't been tackled in 2 years, he simply falls down.
McDonald is the same, he either ducks out of bounds or falls down.

[SkinsfaninNJ]

Not to clog up this thread, but I have to take advantage of having fans from another team here.

Anyone know if Martz has direct communication via headset with Kitna on the field?

[dj_stouty]

Have you watched either of those play?

Mike Furrey hasn't been tackled in 2 years, he simply falls down.
McDonald is the same, he either ducks out of bounds or falls down.

:funpost:

Furrey and McDonald have never been tackled?

Just when I thought I've heard it all...

[Keino]

one problem with that is if the lions send 2 receivers deep down the sidelines it means that taylor only is in position to cover 1 and a corner is left alone. whereas if landry is also back that gives deep help to both

1. Landry's strength is not deep coverage.

2. Sending 2 WRs down the sidelines deep gives Taylor time to get over the top to help in coverage. Kitna would need to have time to look him off, and in Cover 1, we actually generate pressure because of our LBs.

3. Cover one is a Zone in which each CB and the FS are responsible for 1/3 of the field. It's inexcusable to get beat deep in Cover 1, when your only responsibilty as a CB is not let anyone get behind you.

[firehawk157]

Have you watched either of those play?

Mike Furrey hasn't been tackled in 2 years, he simply falls down.
McDonald is the same, he either ducks out of bounds or falls down.
I can't say I'd exactly blame them if they do that this sunday. I would be finding that ground awful quick if I saw Taylor heading at me.

[dj_stouty]

Hello from Detroit.

I run http://www.lions-fans.com and just wanted to wish you guys good luck for next week.



Hey Judge...I tried clicking your link but I got an error message. Is the site down?

[bergiemoore]

one problem with that is if the lions send 2 receivers deep down the sidelines it means that taylor only is in position to cover 1 and a corner is left alone. whereas if landry is also back that gives deep help to both

They played the 3-3-5 Nickel a lot in the Eagles game. Perhaps that'd be the way to go here. That way, they can contain the deep threat with either the nickel or Landry.

[Keino]

Im saying Cover 1, but I mean Cover 3.

Cover 1 is Man. With the FS playing CF and the SS covering the TE. WLB or MLB has the 2nd TE in a 2 TE set.

[jedema]

1. Landry's strength is not deep coverage.

2. Sending 2 WRs down the sidelines deep gives Taylor time to get over the top to help in coverage. Kitna would need to have time to look him off, and in Cover 1, we actually generate pressure because of our LBs.

The only problem with this is unless Taylor is Superman fast, he isn't going to be able to keep up, and if he does when is he going to apply that Huge hit? Thats right we will be so far down the field it will not happen


3. Cover one is a Zone in which each CB and the FS are responsible for 1/3 of the field. It's inexcusable to get beat deep in Cover 1, when your only responsibilty as a CB is not let anyone get behind you.

Then we pick you apart with the short X's
shrug... i just don't see that as being a good matchup either. Not only are we throwing to our recievers Under the coverage, It also take the pressure game away from you because the ball is coming out quickly.

Hey Judge...I tried clicking your link but I got an error message. Is the site down?

I think it might have been, but I am logged in now...

[shally]

They played the 3-3-5 Nickel a lot in the Eagles game. Perhaps that'd be the way to go here. That way, they can contain the deep threat with either the nickel or Landry.

the problem with that is, where the pass rush would come from then ?

more than anything, we need to get heat on kitna. rushing 3 will get us torched. you can rush 5 if you send both LB's, but it means that unless marcus has his hand down it lengthens the path to the qb and gives kitna more time.
i would send 4 or 5 after kitna on every pass play. we need to get to him, there is no other way to put it..

[shally]

[QUOTE=jedema;1016958]The only problem with this is unless Taylor is Superman fast, he isn't going to be able to keep up, and if he does when is he going to apply that Huge hit? Thats right we will be so far down the field it will not happen


my thoughts as well. as good as taylor is, in the past he has been vulnerable to look offs by quality qb's.. i would prefer a second safety to help out deep

but in the end, none of the deeper formations will make any difference unless we can get heat on kitna. if he has time, he will kill us deep.. if he doesnt, we are going to pick off several passes and beat him down..i think the game will revolve around how well your o line performs. if they can keep kitna clean, i believe we will have a very hard time winning

[jedema]

i think the game will revolve around how well your o line performs. if they can keep kitna clean, i believe we will have a very hard time winning
Well then if it comes down to that, were gonna get spanked......

Has anybody mentioned that we have glossed our OL as the Matadors? Lead by our "Franchised" LT Jeff "matador sr." Backus. I have never seen somebody wiff on blockes since I played HS ball. Then at least we had the courtesy to let the QB know by screaming

"LOOK OUT!!!"

[shally]

Well then if it comes down to that, were gonna get spanked......

Has anybody mentioned that we have glossed our OL as the Matadors? Lead by our "Franchised" LT Jeff "matador sr." Backus. I have never seen somebody wiff on blockes since I played HS ball. Then at least we had the courtesy to let the QB know by screaming

"LOOK OUT!!!"

Ole' !!!!! we have had some players like that in the past

how has mulitalo worked out for you guys ? at one time it was thought he would sign with the redskins before you snapped him up..

[CarMike]

Well then if it comes down to that, were gonna get spanked......

Has anybody mentioned that we have glossed our OL as the Matadors? Lead by our "Franchised" LT Jeff "matador sr." Backus. I have never seen somebody wiff on blockes since I played HS ball. Then at least we had the courtesy to let the QB know by screaming

"LOOK OUT!!!"
Our problem is that the DL couldn't fight its way through a wet paper bag.

[jedema]

and our OL couldn't block the broad side of a barn if you stood them right in front of it, and started a fire around them so they couldn't move anywere but forward...:cry:

[shally]

Our problem is that the DL couldn't fight its way through a wet paper bag.

there's nothing wrong with our D line... keep repeating that until you believe...

[CarMike]

and our OL couldn't block the broad side of a barn if you stood them right in front of it, and started a fire around them so they couldn't move anywere but forward...:cry:

This is shaping up to be a great battle, huh? :)

[shally]

Our problem is that the DL couldn't fight its way through a wet paper bag.

and our OL couldn't block the broad side of a barn if you stood them right in front of it, and started a fire around them so they couldn't move anywere but forward...:cry:

sort of a resistable force meets the moveable object...:D

[akhhorus]

sort of a resistable force meets the moveable object...:D

I'm betting that Kitna trips over his own ankles and sacks himself lol

[shally]

I'm betting that Kitna trips over his own ankles and sacks himself lol

aaron brooks... i have seen him fumble numerous times without being hit
and at least once he went down the same way...

[Keino]

The only problem with this is unless Taylor is Superman fast, he isn't going to be able to keep up, and if he does when is he going to apply that Huge hit? Thats right we will be so far down the field it will not happen

From the Middle of the Field he would have the angle, and he has shown that ability from CF. Granted that was on a Trent Green to Chris Chambers over the top type pass, who I acknowledge is not as fast as Roy or CJ, but the point holds, but as I said above, in Cover 3, the CB has deep 1/3 and his only job in that coverage is to not let a WR get behind him.



Then we pick you apart with the short X's
shrug... i just don't see that as being a good matchup either. Not only are we throwing to our recievers Under the coverage, It also take the pressure game away from you because the ball is coming out quickly.



If Im picking my poison, I am going to make your X Receivers beat me rather than your studs while trying to maximize pressure on Kitna. We get no pressure with soft zones and Landry away from the L.O.S.

[jedema]

If Im picking my poison, I am going to make your X Receivers beat me rather than your studs while trying to maximize pressure on Kitna. We get no pressure with soft zones and Landry away from the L.O.S.
I completly agree with you on this. you have to get pressure but if you can't get it from your front 4, then I think it is gonna be a rough go of it. As soon as you start blitzing, you are gonna leave one of them with M2M

[akhhorus]

I completly agree with you on this. you have to get pressure but if you can't get it from your front 4, then I think it is gonna be a rough go of it. As soon as you start blitzing, you are gonna leave one of them with M2M

Thats why the Skins should play their big nickel formation with 3 safeties, so they can blitz without leaving a CB on Roy, CJ or Furrey one on one.

[jaylen]

Thats why the Skins should play their big nickel formation with 3 safeties, so they can blitz without leaving a CB on Roy, CJ or Furrey one on one.

This makes sense. Only corner I'm worried about being man up is Smoot if he's matched up on Furrey. I think Springs can cover Williams and Rogers can cover CJ who hasn't proven thus far he can be a stud yet. With pressure and an additional safety hovering we could get a pick or 2 and some tip balls.

I look for Andre Carter to have a nice game.

[dj_stouty]

This makes sense. Only corner I'm worried about being man up is Smoot if he's matched up on Furrey. I think Springs can cover Williams and Rogers can cover CJ who hasn't proven thus far he can be a stud yet. With pressure and an additional safety hovering we could get a pick or 2 and some tip balls. .

I think 3 TDs for CJ in 3 games is mighty impressive. CJ has 5 inches on Rogers so he better start turning his head and looking for the ball.

[BlueNSilver]

I think 3 TDs for CJ in 3 games is mighty impressive. CJ has 5 inches on Rogers so he better start turning his head and looking for the ball.

CJ is definitely a Stud. Look at some film of his first 3 games, and if you think Rogers and Springs can man up against Roy and CJ all day long you're in for a long game.

[redskin_rich]

CJ is definitely a Stud. Look at some film of his first 3 games, and if you think Rogers and Springs can man up against Roy and CJ all day long you're in for a long game.
I don't know where you got the impression anyone here thinks our CB's can man-up your WR's all day. We know that ain't happening, they'll have help most of the day, except when we blitz.

[NFCEAST]

This team better come out and play with a chip on there shoulders, and take this game for what it is. A chance to get right back in the race.

And, did anyone else hear Adam Sheffner on NFL network. kinda in a quick preveiw ,that the winner of this game will get a wild card spot in the NFC ? Did i hear him right ? It seems way early for that sort of prediction.

[bergiemoore]

the problem with that is, where the pass rush would come from then ?

more than anything, we need to get heat on kitna. rushing 3 will get us torched. you can rush 5 if you send both LB's, but it means that unless marcus has his hand down it lengthens the path to the qb and gives kitna more time.
i would send 4 or 5 after kitna on every pass play. we need to get to him, there is no other way to put it..

Generally, Marcus had his hand down. This allowed them to drop him back in coverage, or rush him. Likewise, Landry was available to blitz or man-up against the TE. He was even able to drop back and nearly pick a deep ball, if I'm remembering my games correctly.

[shally]

This team better come out and play with a chip on there shoulders, and take this game for what it is. A chance to get right back in the race.

And, did anyone else hear Adam Sheffner on NFL network. kinda in a quick preveiw ,that the winner of this game will get a wild card spot in the NFC ? Did i hear him right ? It seems way early for that sort of prediction.

both these teams have a long way to go before they prove they are for real.. look who they have beaten thus far..

[shally]

CJ is definitely a Stud. Look at some film of his first 3 games, and if you think Rogers and Springs can man up against Roy and CJ all day long you're in for a long game.

i think that CJ has to prove he can beat a corner who is bumping him from the line..
williams is a finished product and he is going to get his catches, no matter what.. like steve smith you have to try and limit the damage he does
furrey might be the key. if smoot can stay with him we might be in good shape..
and then there is mcdonald-- i think we have torrence who has fine speed and who might be a solid matchup against him

but to keep coming back to the real key, kitna is not going to be able to find anyone if he is looking up from the turf or running for his life.. we simply have to bump the receivers at the line to cut off the quick pass and get to kitna first.

[BlueNSilver]

i think that CJ has to prove he can beat a corner who is bumping him from the line..
williams is a finished product and he is going to get his catches, no matter what.. like steve smith you have to try and limit the damage he does
furrey might be the key. if smoot can stay with him we might be in good shape..
and then there is mcdonald-- i think we have torrence who has fine speed and who might be a solid matchup against him

but to keep coming back to the real key, kitna is not going to be able to find anyone if he is looking up from the turf or running for his life.. we simply have to bump the receivers at the line to cut off the quick pass and get to kitna first.


He did a pretty good job of it vs the Raiders and Vikings. Eagles were playing off most of the time, and then he got hurt in the 2nd qt.

[shally]

He did a pretty good job of it vs the Raiders and Vikings. Eagles were playing off most of the time, and then he got hurt in the 2nd qt.

that was a topic of much discussion here before the draft... that he had difficulty against press coverage in college..

still, it is the way i would go after him now-- especially if rogers is on him..rogers is physical and tackles well but to play him 10 yards off the receiver all game simply doesnt work..

i would get rogers face up on CJ and then get him some help deep.
besides if he is right up on CJ it will take away the quick throw to him..

[BlueNSilver]

that was a topic of much discussion here before the draft... that he had difficulty against press coverage in college..

still, it is the way i would go after him now-- especially if rogers is on him..rogers is physical and tackles well but to play him 10 yards off the receiver all game simply doesnt work..

i would get rogers face up on CJ and then get him some help deep.
besides if he is right up on CJ it will take away the quick throw to him..

If you have a physical CB who can run it should be the way you attack any top flight WR, if anything to throw off the timing of the route at best. As long as you have some help over the top you should attack that way. If it's M2M i would be leary, you miss the jam, or they beat it, it could be a big play (which has happen quite a bit in our first 4 games)

[shally]

He did a pretty good job of it vs the Raiders and Vikings. Eagles were playing off most of the time, and then he got hurt in the 2nd qt.


by the way.. what happened to bill swancutt ? he was one of my favorite sleeper players coming out of oregon state... great situational pass rusher there.

he was a lion and then got cut.. what was the deal with him ??

[BlueNSilver]

by the way.. what happened to bill swancutt ? he was one of my favorite sleeper players coming out of oregon state... great situational pass rusher there.

he was a lion and then got cut.. what was the deal with him ??

He really didnt see the field to much. When Marinelli took over last year he didnt make the team. Either he wasnt a Marinelli type player, or they just didnt see him fitting in at DE

[shally]

If you have a physical CB who can run it should be the way you attack any top flight WR, if anything to throw off the timing of the route at best. As long as you have some help over the top you should attack that way. If it's M2M i would be leary, you miss the jam, or they beat it, it could be a big play (which has happen quite a bit in our first 4 games)

that's why torrence goes on McD.. he is said to be the fastest def player that gregg williams ever timed.. he is physical and can burn. look for him on ST coverage because he can fly..

[shally]

He really didnt see the field to much. When Marinelli took over last year he didnt make the team. Either he wasnt a Marinelli type player, or they just didnt see him fitting in at DE

he has bounced around since then to oakland and baltimore, i think.. maybe just too light ? but he was a terror inthe pac 10 and i thought the lions really had someone in him... too bad

[BlueNSilver]

that's why torrence goes on McD.. he is said to be the fastest def player that gregg williams ever timed.. he is physical and can burn. look for him on ST coverage because he can fly..

How do you think the Skins would try to matchup with our 4 WR set? We play it quite often, i'd say at least 10% of our snaps are out of this set. Teams have had A LOT of problems with this set so far this season. Skins have the players to matchup?

Even without CJ last week with Troy Walters in there instead of CJ the Bears had problems with it (hence Walters scoring on a 20yd TD)

[BlueNSilver]

he has bounced around since then to oakland and baltimore, i think.. maybe just too light ? but he was a terror inthe pac 10 and i thought the lions really had someone in him... too bad


Not sure what happen with him, i thought he would have a decent shot in the rotation esp with the Tampa2, but i guess the staff thought other wise. He really didn't see the field even before Rod took over

[shally]

How do you think the Skins would try to matchup with our 4 WR set? We play it quite often, i'd say at least 10% of our snaps are out of this set. Teams have had A LOT of problems with this set so far this season. Skins have the players to matchup?

Even without CJ last week with Troy Walters in there instead of CJ the Bears had problems with it (hence Walters scoring on a 20yd TD)

before the season the skins loaded up on corners.. we have springs, rogers and smoot (who were supposed to be all 3 rotational starters).. smoot got dinged and is just getting back after a tough first game inwhich he was locked up on chris chambers of miami all game.. they threw at him 15 times.
depending upon whom you read, he either did okay or sucked.. i, personally was one of the ones who thought he did well considering who he was playing and considering how many times they went after him.. he dropped a 4th qtr interception that would have sealed the deal (we won in OT).. but i am in the minority in that opinion here

after that we signed macklin and jeremetrius butler to be the number 4 corner.
butler was terrible and was cut, but macklin looks half decent for a number 4 corner. one of the surprises out of camp was a db named torrence, who GW took an immediate liking to because of his speed and his willingness to hit people on coverage teams.. the last game came down to a choice between him and eubanks-- another practice squad corner. eubanks pulled something and so torrence made the team.. he has worked his way up the depth squad and is probably no worse than #4 corner now.. he is definitely an improving player

to add to versatility we also have prioleau who is a hybrid corner/ #3 safety who is listed as a safety but started his career as a corner with the niners/buffalo.
he has good coverage skills and is employed that way when he plays safety

taylor has good coverage skills but should be playing deep this year.. landry has been used inthe box because he blitzes well and tackles like a linebacker.. he also is developing the uncanny ability to arrive at the exact moment the ball arrives in coverage... ask curtis, the eagle wideout about that. he will pound a receiver in the short zone

finally we have a fromer lion, v fox as a reserve safety.. he is useless tackling anyone, but is a very good special teamer as you should remember. he wont see the field except on special teams..

if we had a solid pass rush, we would be recognized as having fine DB's, but without a pass rush even better ones get exposed..

[jedema]

Chris chambers is no RW or even CJ in his young Career.

Alright I am tired of the Lions O vs the Skins D. All I keep hearing is how your safties are gonna KO our Recievers. The down side to this is its 10-20 Yards down the field at that point. When you are relying on your safties in you defense, you are gonna be in trouble.

Lets get to what just may be the deciding factor in this game

Skins O vs Lions D

Hows your o-line?
Is CP gonna play (fantasy implications)
Does Campbell get rattled?
What about your recievers?

[hail2skins]

Chris chambers is no RW or even CJ in his young Career.

Alright I am tired of the Lions O vs the Skins D. All I keep hearing is how your safties are gonna KO our Recievers. The down side to this is its 10-20 Yards down the field at that point. When you are relying on your safties in you defense, you are gonna be in trouble.

Lets get to what just may be the deciding factor in this game

Skins O vs Lions D

Hows your o-line?
Is CP gonna play (fantasy implications)
Does Campbell get rattled?
What about your recievers?You would have to understand how we play defense to appreciate why we talk about our safeties.

As for our offense vs your defense, if we get our running game going early, you're going to be in trouble because that will open up our playaction. Also, you have to deal with Cooley too.

Our offensive line is banged up on the right side and we have Fabini and Wade in there instead of Randy Thomas and Jon Jansen. The left side is ok and that's where you'll probably see us running the most.

[jedema]

You would have to understand how we play defense to appreciate why we talk about our safeties.

Agreed. I will know much more sunday.... wait.... going golfing and enjoying this 80 degree October Weather!!! hopefully I will catch the last half of the game.


As for our offense vs your defense, if we get our running game going early, you're going to be in trouble because that will open up our playaction. Also, you have to deal with Cooley too.

Our offensive line is banged up on the right side and we have Fabini and Wade in there instead of Randy Thomas and Jon Jansen. The left side is ok and that's where you'll probably see us running the most.

That is what scares me with our D. Our Secondary is garbage. Our 2 starting safties are both on IR (I hate preseason) The only good thing about our DL is if S.Rogers shows up Huge. Some games he does, others he seems content to just take up space. Last game against the bears, he was an animal. Redding on the other side of him is a monster as well. They are complimented by D.White who can make a mess of things as well. Our Backers are average if not below average. Ernie Simms is playing amazing, but we are waiting for him to KO somebody (our money is on himself). Boss Baily will never live up to his potential I don't think, and our MLB is paris Lennon.... yuck....

[hail2skins]

Agreed. I will know much more sunday.... wait.... going golfing and enjoying this 80 degree October Weather!!! hopefully I will catch the last half of the game.



That is what scares me with our D. Our Secondary is garbage. Our 2 starting safties are both on IR (I hate preseason) The only good thing about our DL is if S.Rogers shows up Huge. Some games he does, others he seems content to just take up space. Last game against the bears, he was an animal. Redding on the other side of him is a monster as well. They are complimented by D.White who can make a mess of things as well. Our Backers are average if not below average. Ernie Simms is playing amazing, but we are waiting for him to KO somebody (our money is on himself). Boss Baily will never live up to his potential I don't think, and our MLB is paris Lennon.... yuck....
Our oline has been a staple of this team for awhile but right now it is questionable because of the right side. Because of this, Cooley isn't getting the catches he should be getting because he's being kept in to assist in blocking.

Another thing for your defense that they'll have to be cautious with is Campbell is mobile and that's not something we're used to having in our QB. He can hurt teams with his feet as well as his arm. There aren't any designed plays to take advantage of that or none that we have seen yet but it's something your defense will have to think about.

Clinton Portis will be playing but it is looking like Moss won't play or will be limited. That means our "Z" will be James Thrash. He'll lull your CB's to sleep with the short stuff and then they'll send him long.

[nicefellow31]

This is a good thread. You Lion fans have shown a lot of class, nothing at all like our Eagle/Giant/Cowboy friends. Just wanted to let you guys know that I appreciate that. :honor:

[SkinFan in BigD]

our MLB is paris Lennon.... yuck....
what happened to Teddy Lehman?

[SkinsfaninNJ]

Here is some of my thoughts on our O:
1. Our line is doing a good job protecting JC, but not as good at getting the push on the run - due primarily to injuries on the right side.

2. Because of the injuries, we spent a lot of time running left, but the coaches tried to correct that some in the Giants game. I expect them to not favor one side so much against the Lions unless we can dominate one side (or maybe I'm giving our coaches too much credit).

3. JC gets better as the game goes on. He seems over anxious early forcing bad throws or having balls sail on him. He has forced one bad throw on the opening or second drive of each game so far (two were picked and one pick was dropped). After that he seems to settle down.

4. We are a better offense if JC has the ability to be mobile. Not run like Vick mind you, but just to keep the D honest with his legs or to make a play when nothings there.

5. Most of all, it starts with our running game. If we are effective, play action is nearly impossible to stop. Before the injuries, I would have said we can run on anybody. After the injuries, they are going to have to show me first.

[shally]

Here is some of my thoughts on our O:
1. Our line is doing a good job protecting JC, but not as good at getting the push on the run - due primarily to injuries on the right side.

2. Because of the injuries, we spent a lot of time running left, but the coaches tried to correct that some in the Giants game. I expect them to not favor one side so much against the Lions unless we can dominate one side (or maybe I'm giving our coaches too much credit).

3. JC gets better as the game goes on. He seems over anxious early forcing bad throws or having balls sail on him. He has forced one bad throw on the opening or second drive of each game so far (two were picked and one pick was dropped). After that he seems to settle down.

4. We are a better offense if JC has the ability to be mobile. Not run like Vick mind you, but just to keep the D honest with his legs or to make a play when nothings there.

5. Most of all, it starts with our running game. If we are effective, play action is nearly impossible to stop. Before the injuries, I would have said we can run on anybody. After the injuries, they are going to have to show me first.

i think we will be running left constantly, and away from shaun rogers...

[firehawk157]

i think we will be running left constantly, and away from shaun rogers...
We can pull Kendall and/or Samuels and run right. Both guys seem really good at getting blocking on the second level. Also, watch out for Sellers. When he runs the ball, he almost always gets plenty of yards after contact and can truck ANYBODY (I mean that, ask Brian Dawkins). Also, a very good lead blocker.

[SkinsfaninNJ]

I will throw this out there about our front 4. One time in this game, Andre Carter will channel the spirit of Jason Taylor and will sack the QB. It will only happen once, but it will happen. After it happens, the Lions offense is free to go about its business.

[BlueNSilver]

Agreed. I will know much more sunday.... wait.... going golfing and enjoying this 80 degree October Weather!!! hopefully I will catch the last half of the game.



That is what scares me with our D. Our Secondary is garbage. Our 2 starting safties are both on IR (I hate preseason) The only good thing about our DL is if S.Rogers shows up Huge. Some games he does, others he seems content to just take up space. Last game against the bears, he was an animal. Redding on the other side of him is a monster as well. They are complimented by D.White who can make a mess of things as well. Our Backers are average if not below average. Ernie Simms is playing amazing, but we are waiting for him to KO somebody (our money is on himself). Boss Baily will never live up to his potential I don't think, and our MLB is paris Lennon.... yuck....

Which 2 starting safeties would that be? Bullocks is the only S on IR, Kennedy is our starting SS and always has been.

Bailey has been very good, to many people build up hype on players and when they're not that type of player your avg fan will make a statement like that. Boss has been everything this coaching staff thought he would be and more (if you read up on Marninellis comments on him)

Lennon i agree with is trash. He will show up on a few series and be good, the rest he seems to disappear as if he wasn't there.

Lehman has never recovered 100% from his foot injury, or should i say he never improved on his rookie season to now. He had a productive rookie season, but has been no where near that since.

Lewis is a player i wish could stay healthy

[jedema]

I think Very good is a strech for baily. He has played well enough to not embarrass himself.

My bad on Kennedy though. I should probably pay better attention to the defensive side of the ball, They seem to get off the field quickly weather it is 3 and outs, or big play td's by the Offense that they are supposed to be stopping.

[dj_stouty]

Where are our Lions' friends? Sleeping in?

BTW - I personally saw McDonald "get tackled"...so you may want to call Guiness Book of World Records and let them know someone actually managed to tackle the guy over the last two seasons. Furrey? He only had one catch and he immediately fell to the ground like a wounded duck, so his "streak" is still going...;)

[LadyNRedskinsfan]

Lady's alter ego is revealed.


Detroit Lions (3-1) at Washington Redskins (2-1)
Game of the week. Jason Campbell and Jon Kitna stand 10 paces apart and have a good old-fashioned shootout. So why, with the Redskins averaging 198 passing yards and the Lions 313, do I choose Campbell to win? Simple. Better secondary on his team. Roy Williams, have your head on a swivel Sunday. Those two safeties are looking to add a few tattoos to you.

Redskins 30, Lions 27
http://www.fannation.com/peter_king_challenge/pickoff
oh HAIL no! LOL. he stole that score from me....and who says the redskins cant score 30 points. :)

Where are our Lions' friends? Sleeping in?

BTW - I personally saw McDonald "get tackled"...so you may want to call Guiness Book of World Records and let them know someone actually managed to tackle the guy over the last two seasons. Furrey? He only had one catch and he immediately fell to the ground like a wounded duck, so his "streak" is still going...;)
lol. lets hope they come back for at least a few words...

[Keino]

I will throw this out there about our front 4. One time in this game, Andre Carter will channel the spirit of Jason Taylor and will sack the QB. It will only happen once, but it will happen. After it happens, the Lions offense is free to go about its business.

Good Call....Almost. He had 2 sacks, and one was a complete domination of his opponent. Man that was good to see.