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lorimike
10-28-2007, 05:47 PM
How can players who make millions of dollars per year play with less passion!. I am sick of the owner, the coach and the players!. I am sick of watching our defenders help a Patriots player up after the play. I so miss the era of George Allen where pure hatred of other teams players was a motivator. And as for the patriots they just scored again. 45 to nothing! They are still throwing the ball. going for it on 4 th down. If I were Gibbs I would not shake Belicheks hands after the game. And for cryin out loud if this team wastes one more 1st round pick on another 200 lb defensive back I'm going to puke! Draft some guys who can get pressure on the QB! And cut portis. I'm flat out done with Clinton Portis! I AM SICK OF IT!

akhhorus
10-28-2007, 05:51 PM
How can players who make millions of dollars per year play with less passion!. I am sick of the owner, the coach and the players!. I am sick of watching our defenders help a Patriots player up after the play. I so miss the era of George Allen where pure hatred of other teams players was a motivator. And as for the patriots they just scored again. 45 to nothing! They are still throwing the ball. going for it on 4 th down. If I were Gibbs I would not shake Belicheks hands after the game. And for cryin out loud if this team wastes one more 1st round pick on another 200 lb defensive back I'm going to puke! Draft some guys who can get pressure on the QB! And cut portis. I'm flat out done with Clinton Portis! I AM SICK OF IT!

:rolleyes: Right, because it was Portis' fault today. Your campaign is getting tired.

LuvSkins17
10-28-2007, 05:55 PM
Wow. Do you have anything soft and cuddley that you can hold during the game?

Im sick too but I don't know if im "that" sick....

I hope you feel better.

SpicyMcHaggis
10-28-2007, 05:58 PM
I think the solution to all our problems is to actually kill Portis. He is pure evil.

RedskinRyan
10-28-2007, 05:58 PM
:rolleyes: Right, because it was Portis' fault today. Your campaign is getting tired.

i dont recally seeing anywhere that she pointed out it being portis' fault

but im sick of this too

nicefellow31
10-28-2007, 06:12 PM
How can players who make millions of dollars per year play with less passion!. I am sick of the owner, the coach and the players!. I am sick of watching our defenders help a Patriots player up after the play. I so miss the era of George Allen where pure hatred of other teams players was a motivator. And as for the patriots they just scored again. 45 to nothing! They are still throwing the ball. going for it on 4 th down. If I were Gibbs I would not shake Belicheks hands after the game. And for cryin out loud if this team wastes one more 1st round pick on another 200 lb defensive back I'm going to puke! Draft some guys who can get pressure on the QB! And cut portis. I'm flat out done with Clinton Portis! I AM SICK OF IT!

Wha did Portis do today that warrants him being cut?

give_portis_the_rock
10-28-2007, 06:19 PM
Patriots?
Seriously...
I feel like we're watching somebody's franchise mode right now.
How classless can you be? Going for it on fourth down when you're up 45-0?

firehawk157
10-28-2007, 06:21 PM
Wha did Portis do today that warrants him being cut?

I have no idea... He looked like the rest of the team.

firehawk157
10-28-2007, 06:21 PM
Patriots?
Seriously...
I feel like we're watching somebody's franchise mode right now.
How classless can you be? Going for it on fourth down when you're up 45-0?
That was classless, but you know what? We don't want them to convert, we stop them!

Patrick
10-28-2007, 06:27 PM
I won't consider the Pat's anything but on the road to being the greatest single season team in the history of the NFL.

give_portis_the_rock
10-28-2007, 06:29 PM
I won't consider the Pat's anything but on the road to being the greatest single season team in the history of the NFL.

Yeah but if they go all the way no single fan will consider it the least bit legitimate. First the cheating thing, then the 'eff you' running up the score every game.

CarMike
10-28-2007, 06:32 PM
I'll say it. Portis isn't the same runner that we traded for. He runs soft and looks to go down before contact. Betts hits the hole and keeps driving. When he needs to, he looks for the cut back. What does Portis do? Dance around and then falls down on the slightest bit of contact.

I'm sick of it to.

SpicyMcHaggis
10-28-2007, 06:33 PM
Yeah but if they go all the way no single fan will consider it the least bit legitimate. First the cheating thing, then the 'eff you' running up the score every game.
You gotta be kidding me.

Dept_of_Defense
10-28-2007, 06:33 PM
Portis didn't put the ball on the ground 3 times today. Campbell is starting to become known as a fumbler. He needs to take better care of the ball. Not to take anything from the Pats, but Vrabel had 3 sacks and 3 fumbles. That's unacceptable. Also, Clinton needs to stop dancing so much. He definently does not have the burst that he's had in previous years. It's hard for him to get around the edge which does not bode well with the plays we're calling. Does anyone else agree with this? I'm not saying we should cut CP, but he needs to start looking at tape of past seasons when he used to hit the hole 100mph. I really thought Betts looked much better on the field today and we probably should've stuck with him when CP went down.

James F. Quinn
10-28-2007, 06:33 PM
Yeah but if they go all the way no single fan will consider it the least bit legitimate. First the cheating thing, then the 'eff you' running up the score every game.

As If! It will go down in the books sans asterisk. This team doesn't even permit moral victories.

It's what modern sports is all about.

I still think that The redskins can coax out three more wins this season and go 7-9. But I'm not sure that Gibbs will be back.

colkurtz
10-28-2007, 06:34 PM
The Pats may be classless and cheats BUT they still play and are coached with a FIRE this Redskin's team does not have.

SkinsfaninNJ
10-28-2007, 06:35 PM
You gotta be kidding me.

I think he is just mad at them right now (rightfully so).

firehawk157
10-28-2007, 06:35 PM
I'll say it. Portis isn't the same runner that we traded for. He runs soft and looks to go down before contact. Betts hits the hole and keeps driving. When he needs to, he looks for the cut back. What does Portis do? Dance around and then falls down on the slightest bit of contact.

I'm sick of it to.
Portis may not be the guy we traded for, but Betts isn't the guy we resigned either. It's stupid to call anybody out in particular after this loss, there's plenty of blame to go around.

Let's trade Portis, Moss, Samuels, Sellers, Campbell, Carter, Griffin, Springs, Taylor, Landry, Fletcher, Washington and Rocky... They didn't play up to their contracts/draft slot.

akhhorus
10-28-2007, 06:36 PM
I think the solution to all our problems is to actually kill Portis. He is pure evil.

Give us the proudest RB of the Redskins,
That we may hew his limbs, and on a pile
Ad manes fratrum sacrifice his flesh,
Before this earthy prison of their bones;
That so the shadows be not unappeased,
Nor we disturb'd with prodigies on earth.

I'll say it. Portis isn't the same runner that we traded for. He runs soft and looks to go down before contact. Betts hits the hole and keeps driving. When he needs to, he looks for the cut back. What does Portis do? Dance around and then falls down on the slightest bit of contact.

I'm sick of it to.

I disagree. Betts is the RB on this team who doesn't hit the hole and keeps driving. Portis is fighting with a wreck of an oline and still tries to make yardage. Betts has shown that he's the soft Rb who goes down quickly. Is Portis' production down? Absolutely, but he still fights and is plays hurt despite having an awful Oline.

SkinsfaninNJ
10-28-2007, 06:38 PM
We are playing a very poor rush D next week. So these guys will have a chance to show what they have.

firehawk157
10-28-2007, 06:38 PM
The Pats may be classless and cheats BUT they still play and are coached with a FIRE this Redskin's team does not have.
They are. There is no maybe. I don't think we scratched the surface here, the Skins had radio issues that magically went away when we told the refs and Brady got back on the field. Where else does it go?

Patrick
10-28-2007, 06:38 PM
Yeah but if they go all the way no single fan will consider it the least bit legitimate. First the cheating thing, then the 'eff you' running up the score every game.

LMAO ................... sad thing - YOU actually believe that ........... but you ARE WRONG!!!!!

11-5
10-28-2007, 06:38 PM
:rolleyes: Right, because it was Portis' fault today. Your campaign is getting tired.

The only thing getting tired is your rude remarks. Not to mention your lame avatar. You are the most bitter member of this entire board and it shows.

James F. Quinn
10-28-2007, 06:39 PM
Portis didn't put the ball on the ground 3 times today. Campbell is starting to become known as a fumbler. He needs to take better care of the ball. Not to take anything from the Pats, but Vrabel had 3 sacks and 3 fumbles. That's unacceptable. Also, Clinton needs to stop dancing so much. He definently does not have the burst that he's had in previous years. It's hard for him to get around the edge which does not bode well with the plays we're calling. Does anyone else agree with this? I'm not saying we should cut CP, but he needs to start looking at tape of past seasons when he used to hit the hole 100mph. I really thought Betts looked much better on the field today and we probably should've stuck with him when CP went down.

I think that Portis is the same runner that he was in thos 1500 plus yard years.

We do not have an NFL caliber OL. Everything that you mention follows from that.

I think that if they had started Betts recently you would see the same hesitation, dancing, and inability to get to the edge.

Right now we are looking for whipping boys.

The man who is responsible for the product out on the field will be holding a press conference shortly.

SkinsfaninNJ
10-28-2007, 06:41 PM
I think that Portis is the same runner that he was in thos 1500 plus yard years.

We do not have an NFL caliber OL. Everything that you mention follows from that.

I think that if they had started Betts recently you would see the same hesitation, dancing, and inability to get to the edge.

Right now we are looking for whipping boys.

The man who is responsible for the product out on the field will be holding a press conference shortly.

I don't know why we don't try DeMullin (or whatever his name is) at guard. He has experience and is supposed to be good. Fabini may be worn down so he could use the break.

colkurtz
10-28-2007, 06:42 PM
I disagree. Betts is the RB on this team who doesn't hit the hole and keeps driving. Portis is fighting with a wreck of an oline and still tries to make yardage. Betts has shown that he's the soft Rb who goes down quickly. Is Portis' production down? Absolutely, but he still fights and is plays hurt despite having an awful Oline.[/QUOTE]

There are few holes for either RB to run to. Also neither guys is hitting what little daylight is there, but Portis is certainly doing better. The OL was a "little" better at pass protection today but JC wasn't protecting the ball well enough. We have no running game to speak of.

akhhorus
10-28-2007, 06:42 PM
The only thing getting tired is your rude remarks. Not to mention your lame avatar. You are the most bitter member of this entire board and it shows.

So, Im guessing you're actually Lorimike or a buddy of his he asked to come on here. This is ridiculous. Attacking my avatar? And being bitter is blaming a player for all the problems with a team, even before the season starts, kinda of like Lorimike and his Portis campaign.

CarMike
10-28-2007, 06:43 PM
I disagree. Betts is the RB on this team who doesn't hit the hole and keeps driving. Portis is fighting with a wreck of an oline and still tries to make yardage. Betts has shown that he's the soft Rb who goes down quickly. Is Portis' production down? Absolutely, but he still fights and is plays hurt despite having an awful Oline.

Isn't Betts running behind the same OL? Portis is just as soft.

God i'm sick of this team.

lorimike
10-28-2007, 06:45 PM
:rolleyes: Right, because it was Portis' fault today. Your campaign is getting tired.<<<
No , it is not all Clinton Portis' fault! But we traded Champ Bailey and a 2nd rounder for Clinton and also paid him a lot of money. We have not gotten our return on the investment. And quite frankly I'm not the only one saying this. Aikman who has commented on the Green Bay game and today's game has often commented on how Clinton doesn't look the same. I am quite tired of seeing him with an ailment after every play. We all age differently and sadly at age 26 Clinton Portis is cooked

CarMike
10-28-2007, 06:45 PM
The only thing getting tired is your rude remarks. Not to mention your lame avatar. You are the most bitter member of this entire board and it shows.
Listen up guys. Do not attack members. You can attack opinions. That goes out to everyone.

I'll lock this thread up in a heartbeat if it doesn't stop right now.

SpicyMcHaggis
10-28-2007, 06:45 PM
So, Im guessing you're actually Lorimike or a buddy of his he asked to come on here. This is ridiculous. Attacking my avatar?

I think we should cut your avatar. It clearly isn't what we traded for, and nowhere near in 2005 shape. Plus, it skipped training camp and practices.

akhhorus
10-28-2007, 06:46 PM
Isn't Betts running behind the same OL? Portis is just as soft.

God i'm sick of this team.

And Betts had 40ish carries for 110 yards. The oline problems might be hurting him, but he's doing far less than what Portis is.

CarMike
10-28-2007, 06:46 PM
<<<
No , it is not all Clinton Portis' fault! But we traded Champ Bailey and a 2nd rounder for Clinton and also paid him a lot of money. We have not gotten our return on the investment. And quite frankly I'm not the only one saying this. Aikman who has commented on the Green Bay game and today's game has often commented on how Clinton doesn't look the same. I am quite tired of seeing him with an ailment after every play. We all age differently and sadly at age 26 Clinton Portis is cooked

Baily didn't want to be here. And I can't say I blame him right now.

CarMike
10-28-2007, 06:47 PM
Portis hasn't done much better.

remaxjon
10-28-2007, 06:47 PM
Isn't Betts running behind the same OL? Portis is just as soft.

God i'm sick of this team.

I like the team and think they play hard the problem I have with them is that they think they are better then what they are.

suppitty
10-28-2007, 06:47 PM
I will say that Portis better get his ypc above 4 before I support him in any argument. There are probably 60 rbs in the nfl that are capable of getting 4 ypc as the primary rb. Just look at what Betts did last year as the primary back.

CarMike
10-28-2007, 06:48 PM
I like the team and think they play hard the problem I have with them is that they think they are better then what they are.

yeah, well, a lot of the fans think the same thing since we're 4-3.

lorimike
10-28-2007, 06:48 PM
The Patriots never stopped playing in this game. They brought out the daggers and drove them into our heart. They still passed late in the game and went for it on several 4TH downs. The patriots and their coach played like they hated us. And what did our players do? Well we patted them on the butt and helped them up after each play! If I'm coach Gibbs that practice would officially end as of Monday October 29th! For good! No more helping opposing players up after plays. I AM SICK OF IT!

akhhorus
10-28-2007, 06:49 PM
<<<
No , it is not all Clinton Portis' fault! But we traded Champ Bailey and a 2nd rounder for Clinton and also paid him a lot of money. We have not gotten our return on the investment. And quite frankly I'm not the only one saying this. Aikman who has commented on the Green Bay game and today's game has often commented on how Clinton doesn't look the same. I am quite tired of seeing him with an ailment after every play. We all age differently and sadly at age 26 Clinton Portis is cooked

On the investment, I guess the 4000 total yards from Portis counts for nothing? And I don't think its a different Portis, what the difference with this team, maybe the terrible Oline?

Btw, Portis did have 81 total yards today, the only offensive player to really do anything. Why let that stand in the way of your rant.

I think we should cut your avatar. It clearly isn't what we traded for, and nowhere near in 2005 shape. Plus, it skipped training camp and practices.

I can't believe I traded a 2nd for it....

lorimike
10-28-2007, 06:51 PM
I'll say it. Portis isn't the same runner that we traded for. He runs soft and looks to go down before contact. Betts hits the hole and keeps driving. When he needs to, he looks for the cut back. What does Portis do? Dance around and then falls down on the slightest bit of contact.

I'm sick of it to.<<<

thanks.... This is exactly how I see you too. Once NFL pundit did remark that Betts is the better runner for this offense

SpicyMcHaggis
10-28-2007, 06:51 PM
I can't believe I traded a 2nd for it....

Plus an all-star signature (that didn't want to be here anymore though....)....terrible trade.

akhhorus
10-28-2007, 06:52 PM
Portis hasn't done much better.

Portis: 115 carries, 433 yards, 5 Tds+156 yards receiving
Betts: 44 carries, 126 yards 0 Tds+86 yards recieving.

I disagree with that.

CarMike
10-28-2007, 06:55 PM
Thats fine. But when we need Portis he isn't getting the job done. Betts is also the type of runner the more he gets the ball the better he is.

wewantdallas
10-28-2007, 06:55 PM
Isn't Betts running behind the same OL? Portis is just as soft.

God i'm sick of this team.

I agree. Betts is commonly blasted, yet Portis is magically awarded the "beat up line" excuse. They are both non-factors. And to me, it's worse that Portis is a non-factor. To whom much is given, much is expected. He's failed miserably so far, just like almost every other so-called "leader" on this offense.

But I don't blame the line or the backs solely. To me, the main problem is the way BOTH backs are being used. When Betts is allowed to run straight ahead, as he did last year, he is effective more often than not. Neither he nor Portis is effective on these sweeping, wide plays that they consistently and inexplicably run.

I would love to see Saunders let go. There, I said it. It's not working. There is no improvement, and as long as Gibbs is there, the two philosophies just appear destined to always clash. The only time this offense woke up last year was when Gibbs, behind the scenes, re-stamped his identity on this offense.

akhhorus
10-28-2007, 06:55 PM
<<<

thanks.... This is exactly how I see you too. Once NFL pundit did remark that Betts is the better runner for this offense

Was this pundit before or after Betts' stellar 2007 campaign? This is what I don't get. You rail against Portis for doing nothing, but Betts has a healthy contract and is looking terrible. But you won't hold Betts to the same standard you hold Portis.

akhhorus
10-28-2007, 06:57 PM
Thats fine. But when we need Portis he isn't getting the job done.

So, we turn it over to the RB who can't get anything done?

Betts is also the type of runner the more he gets the ball the better he is.

And they tried giving him the ball more early in the season with poor results. His carries have dropped off almost entirely because he's reverted back to the old Ladell Betts that doesn't run hard at all.

CarMike
10-28-2007, 06:58 PM
BTW, Portis has 106 carries for 406 yards.

CarMike
10-28-2007, 06:59 PM
I agree. Betts is commonly blasted, yet Portis is magically awarded the "beat up line" excuse.

Yeah, I don't get it either.

CarMike
10-28-2007, 07:00 PM
So, we turn it over to the RB who can't get anything done?



And they tried giving him the ball more early in the season with poor results. His carries have dropped off almost entirely because he's reverted back to the old Ladell Betts that doesn't run hard at all.

I'll return the I disagree.

akhhorus
10-28-2007, 07:00 PM
BTW, Portis has 106 carries for 406 yards.

Plus today.

LuvSkins17
10-28-2007, 07:00 PM
When Portis ran for 1500 yards we had a healthy, strong, "JELLED" offensive line. We don't have anything close to what we had offensively Gibbs first two years. Im not blaming the system,.... We are not the same team. Better players,.... but not playing better.

I don't think it would matter who was in at RB. Right now we can't block for the run or hold pass rushers.

Clinton is still a fighter... Hard to fight with no good blocking.


Oh yeah!

Clinton didn't sub himself out for Betts during those first two seasons either. He came out for a breather when he was tired. He got into a groove. Oh did I mention that we had a better OLINE?

CarMike
10-28-2007, 07:01 PM
Plus today.

You didn't add in Betts carries or yards then.

http://www.nfl.com/teams/washingtonredskins/profile?team=WAS

Battle Cat
10-28-2007, 07:02 PM
Name one team where Fabini or T Wade starts on the o line. Name one team in the entire NFL.

akhhorus
10-28-2007, 07:03 PM
You didn't add in Betts carries or yards then.

Thats right, my bad:
Portis: 115 carries, 433 yards, 5 Tds+156 yards receiving
Betts: 47 carries, 135 yards 0 Tds+86 yards recieving.


Betts still sucks. If you want to bench Portis, fine. But we have to have something at RB behind him. Betts from last year isn't the real Betts, it was the "I'm earning my big contract so I can be lazy again" Betts.

Dept_of_Defense
10-28-2007, 07:06 PM
Name one team where Fabini or T Wade starts on the o line. Name one team in the entire NFL.

I'm sure St Louis would love Wade with Pace out for the year.

lorimike
10-28-2007, 07:08 PM
Was this pundit before or after Betts' stellar 2007 campaign? This is what I don't get. You rail against Portis for doing nothing, but Betts has a healthy contract and is looking terrible. But you won't hold Betts to the same standard you hold Portis.<<<

The reasons this team was not competitive today are too numerous. Clinton had the one great year here. But I think he is too beat up to be the player he once was. Statistically Portis has outperformed Betts this year but only because Betts has not been given the chance to be the the primary back this season. When you have two offensive outings like the ones we've had in back to back weeks it is time to switch things up a bit. Maybe Portis will thrive as the 3rd down pass catching back. The less offensive plays will give him a chance to heal. Because right now he's seems to come up hurt after a lot of plays.

Battle Cat
10-28-2007, 07:08 PM
I'm sure St Louis would love Wade with Pace out for the year.
Over Alex Barron? I would take Alex Barron.

Skins3
10-28-2007, 07:13 PM
all 3 vrable sacks came from right side lined up over wade stephon heyer has played far better then wade

havent a clue how we gain 8yds on two run plays and we have to throw the ball 1 yd down the field on 3rd and 2

need to run more no huddle like the 2 best offenses in the league do (pats-colts) for numerous different reasons you dont allow defenses to rotate over top of wade and get free runs at the qb second campbell looked half decent when we did it agains the patriots

by far it was not a classless move by the patriots so called running the score up if we stop them on the 4th downs the dont score at all not even 3 points woulda been easier to kick the guaranteed 3 then get 2yds on 4th

if you told me it was classless during the game I woulda told you if you think the game is over then walk off the field

akhhorus
10-28-2007, 07:13 PM
<<<

The reasons this team was not competitive today are too numerous.

So why is Portis the one player you single out?


Clinton had the one great year here. But I think he is too beat up to be the player he once was.

And maybe if Portis wasn't hitting hole or getting caught behind the line constantly, this could be a good point for discussion, but what we're seeing is Portis running left into the stacks of defenders since everyone knows we're running left and Portis running right into a cloud of defenders since Wade/Fabini are struggling badly. There's a correlation between losing THomas and Portis' production dropping off. There's also causality.

Betts has 40% the carries that Portis does, with 30% the production. He's getting the chance, but he's doing nothing.

Statistically Portis has outperformed Betts this year but only because Betts has not been given the chance to be the the primary back this season.

Thats a counterfactual first, but if its true, then Betts' production should be similar with the same amount of carries. Its not.

When you have two offensive outings like the ones we've had in back to back weeks it is time to switch things up a bit. Maybe Portis will thrive as the 3rd down pass catching back. The less offensive plays will give him a chance to heal. Because right now he's seems to come up hurt after a lot of plays.

And if we put in Betts, and he produces less than Portis, what then?

GibbsFan
10-28-2007, 07:15 PM
I would love to see Saunders let go. There, I said it. It's not working. There is no improvement, and as long as Gibbs is there, the two philosophies just appear destined to always clash. The only time this offense woke up last year was when Gibbs, behind the scenes, re-stamped his identity on this offense.
Reply With Quote

I agree, Saunders has brought nothing to the table but confusion.

As for this team, I still think they can recover from this debacle and win 4-6 games and possibly sneak into the playoffs and lose in the wildcard round.

Portis is a warrior, but he is not the player we got from Denver. Anybody who thinks he is soft must be in a parallel universe. He's worn down quite a bit from 04 and he is probably gonna go downhill even more in the next year or 2.

I said way back in the offseason and I'll say again now Betts is overated. He had success last season at the end of the year against teams that were not playing very good run d at the time. He fumbled late in 2 games to cost us any chance of winning. He is the soft one and wish we had traded him for a 2nd rounder like I wanted.

The real problem with this team is we build it from back to front instead of front to back. You don't need the best backs, receivers, or safeties on defense if you have a good line. It all starts up front, except in Washington where we just get bodies to wear a uniform. Like Vince once said "90% of football is blocking and tackling". We would do well to heed those words of our former coach.

MONK_in_HOF
10-28-2007, 07:23 PM
One of the things that bothered me the most is the fact that when Portis and Sellers missed their blocking assignments (quite often) is that they didn't really seem to hustle to correct their initial misdoings.

I have always liked Portis and how hard he plays on the field, regardless of what he is doing off the field, but today I didn't get that feel of 100% from him. I am not placing the blame on him, or any single person, as this team was dominated from top down today. But I don't think Portis is near worth what we are paying him, but once again, he isn't nearly the most overpaid player on this squad, so he is just one of many.

The one thing I am more sick of than anything is passing the ball sideways to our WRs every other passing play.

ph33rtheD
10-28-2007, 07:23 PM
Hmmm
I dont think we have the talent level right now
especially with the injuries on the line to compete in the
playoffs. And if you can't compete in the playoffs whats the
point in going. I say we loose out draft glenn dorsey with our first pick
and Adarius bowmen in the second. Then oline and secondary depth with the rest of our picks and a second day running back wit homerun speed.
this is a half joking/half serious post

Dept_of_Defense
10-28-2007, 07:25 PM
Over Alex Barron? I would take Alex Barron.

Is he really doing that much better than Wade is? St. Louis hasn't won a game yet. At this point we have to deal with what we have. Are you telling me that you'd rather have Heyer out there than Wade? Because Jansen isn't coming back this year. Wade is only starting because Jansen went down. It's not like he was crowned the starter in training camp. I think that Wade is a pretty decent #2 tackle.

akhhorus
10-28-2007, 07:26 PM
Is he really doing that much better than Wade is? St. Louis hasn't won a game yet. At this point we have to deal with what we have. Are you telling me that you'd rather have Heyer out there than Wade? Because Jansen isn't coming back this year. Wade is only starting because Jansen went down. It's not like he was crowned the starter in training camp. I think that Wade is a pretty decent #2 tackle.

Barron has more talent than most LTs in the NFL, but he just doesn't seem to care about playing. What a waste.

Dolla Bill
10-28-2007, 07:33 PM
The only thing that I get from this game, is the way each team evaluates talent. Patriots have it in excess, the Skins barely have any. The team is talented, but only at certain positions. The Patriots seem to have no holes. This is where someone needs to take Cerrato out back and beat him with a rubber hose.

guinness4health
10-28-2007, 07:33 PM
The real problem with this team is we build it from back to front instead of front to back. You don't need the best backs, receivers, or safeties on defense if you have a good line. It all starts up front, except in Washington where we just get bodies to wear a uniform.

This is not completely fair....few if any teams are equipped to lose the number of quality starters that we have lose on the offensive line and remain competitive

akhhorus
10-28-2007, 07:35 PM
This is not completely fair....few if any teams are equipped to lose the number of quality starters that we have lose on the offensive line and remain competitive

Its not just that we're losing quality starters, we're losing them in the same area. Olinemen and Cbs. We had two areas of our team struggling to perform because of injuries.

smave
10-28-2007, 07:36 PM
Al Saunders needs to go..bottom line

WarEagle
10-28-2007, 07:36 PM
Say what you want about Portis, but when he jammed his fingers against that Patriots helmet, it must've hurt like (Spensored). I would've been done for the day right there.

Dolla Bill
10-28-2007, 07:39 PM
Its not just that we're losing quality starters, we're losing them in the same area. Olinemen and Cbs. We had two areas of our team struggling to perform because of injuries.

This is where the Skins differ from someone like the Patriots though. I have a feeling if they lost 2 OL, then they really wouldn't miss that much of a beat.

Lavar703
10-28-2007, 07:43 PM
This is where the Skins differ from someone like the Patriots though. I have a feeling if they lost 2 OL, then they really wouldn't miss that much of a beat.

Were not the Patriots, they built there team and then used there draft picks for depth, we on the other hand traded away all our draft picks, and what have we got in return?

colkurtz
10-28-2007, 07:44 PM
The only thing that I get from this game, is the way each team evaluates talent. Patriots have it in excess, the Skins barely have any. The team is talented, but only at certain positions. The Patriots seem to have no holes. This is where someone needs to take Cerrato out back and beat him with a rubber hose.

Having one of the best QBs the game has ever seen is a big factor. he makes everyone look very, very good around him.

Bellicheck is a tough and extremely prepared coach. His players play hard, with a real passion and the team never lets up.
If we had just those two people these Redskins would be a completely different and vastly better team.

dcumdfan
10-28-2007, 07:45 PM
This is where the Skins differ from someone like the Patriots though. I have a feeling if they lost 2 OL, then they really wouldn't miss that much of a beat.

I have the same feeling. Today was a real eye opener for me as far as some of the front office moves we have made. This team is a long ways away, and we still have to eat the B Llyod deal next year. We are still eating the Arch deal, the Duckett deal...the list goes on. These mistakes have taken much more of a toll on the team then I originally thought. When your down to having a guy like Fabini start, it speaks volumes about are player personal decisions.

Dolla Bill
10-28-2007, 07:46 PM
Having one of the best QBs the game has ever seen is a big factor. he makes everyone look very, very good around him.

Bellicheck is a tough and extremely prepared coach. His players play hard, with a real passion and the team never lets up.
If we had just those two people these Redskins would be a completely different and vastly better team.

I think that Bellicheck also instills a type of fear in his players, but they love and respect him for it. Gibbs just doesn't seem like he has the fire he once had. I don't know if its old age, or what, but our players don't play with that much fire and passion. Only on the Defensive side of the ball do I see emotion. On O, we're a bunch of robots, but sucky robots ;)

akhhorus
10-28-2007, 07:47 PM
Were not the Patriots, they built there team and then used there draft picks for depth, we on the other hand traded away all our draft picks, and what have we got in return?

They actually gave up 3 picks(including a 2nd) for Welker and Randy Moss lol.

Dolla Bill
10-28-2007, 07:49 PM
They actually gave up 3 picks(including a 2nd) for Welker and Randy Moss lol.

Kind of nice to have a GM that can take advantage of other GMs....

Unlike with Cerrato, which people can't wait to answer the phone, and must have their mute button working as they are laughing too much.

GibbsFan
10-28-2007, 08:11 PM
This is not completely fair....few if any teams are equipped to lose the number of quality starters that we have lose on the offensive line and remain competitive

Yes, we have had a high number of injuries, but I was speaking to the philosophy of building a team. We don't draft OL above the 5th or 6th round, and we don't draft DL at all. Instead we hand out 3rd and 4th round picks like Halloween candy and then repeat the procedure over again next year.

When you have a guy like Fabini starting every week you just have a big hole in your line. Yet we spent big dollars on wideouts, etc. Fair my butt, this FO has been among the worst in the league. Everyone knows it

redskin_rich
10-28-2007, 08:33 PM
To the original post and poster, if you are sick of it, then go root for another team. The Patriots are incredible and they have a fanbase full of bandwagoneers, so it should be easy to jump aboard.

Problem solved. Happy trails.

smave
10-28-2007, 08:40 PM
To the original post and poster, if you are sick of it, then go root for another team. The Patriots are incredible and they have a fanbase full of bandwagoneers, so it should be easy to jump aboard.

Problem solved. Happy trails.

very true, thank you

culpeper
10-28-2007, 08:54 PM
To the original post and poster, if you are sick of it, then go root for another team. The Patriots are incredible and they have a fanbase full of bandwagoneers, so it should be easy to jump aboard.

Problem solved. Happy trails.

LMAO! life would be so easy.

Dept_of_Defense
10-28-2007, 09:10 PM
How the hell did Brady not get drafted until the 6th Round? The guy is in control of everything. If you look @ his eyes on the field you can tell that he is always calm. The most emotion I saw him show all day was when one of his lineman jumped early near the goalline.
Belichek's credibility is ridiculously high and players, even Randy Moss, would never think to question his playcalling, gameplan, etc. They just buy into it and understand that if they do this and that, they will win championships. As of right now, our coaches don't have that kind of credibility because nobody has won anything recently. I know that players are questioning this and that because anyone can watch our games this year and see so many questionable calls. Our halftime adjustments have been horrible @ best and I don't think anyone has been afraid of our offense since Rypien was under center. We need to win and win consistently for us to have any kind of respect from anybody.

WarEagle
10-28-2007, 09:43 PM
How the hell did Brady not get drafted until the 6th Round? The guy is in control of everything. If you look @ his eyes on the field you can tell that he is always calm. The most emotion I saw him show all day was when one of his lineman jumped early near the goalline.
Belichek's credibility is ridiculously high and players, even Randy Moss, would never think to question his playcalling, gameplan, etc.

-I lived outside of Boston and I'd never heard of Tom Brady until he was called in to that game in 2001 when Bledsoe got hurt. He was completely off the radar until that day. Coach Charlie Weis had quietly molded him.

-BB has an obsessive personality disorder. Did you see him on the sidelines today kneeling down at the bench in conference with his D line? Head coaches rarely do that anymore.

give_portis_the_rock
10-29-2007, 12:21 AM
I think he is just mad at them right now (rightfully so).

I was serious.
Yeah they're a talented team but class winners are as bad as losers in my book. Our only hope is Dungy and Peyton right now -- this is like a movie, really. The good guys are the Colts, the bad guys are the Pats. Easterbrook was right. :devil2:

shally
10-29-2007, 12:36 AM
How the hell did Brady not get drafted until the 6th Round? The guy is in control of everything. If you look @ his eyes on the field you can tell that he is always calm. The most emotion I saw him show all day was when one of his lineman jumped early near the goalline.
Belichek's credibility is ridiculously high and players, even Randy Moss, would never think to question his playcalling, gameplan, etc. They just buy into it and understand that if they do this and that, they will win championships. As of right now, our coaches don't have that kind of credibility because nobody has won anything recently. I know that players are questioning this and that because anyone can watch our games this year and see so many questionable calls. Our halftime adjustments have been horrible @ best and I don't think anyone has been afraid of our offense since Rypien was under center. We need to win and win consistently for us to have any kind of respect from anybody.

yeh and unitas wasnt until very late and was not anything with pittsburgh, his first team
favre looked like a bust for atlanta
steve young looked terrible in tampa
montana was a third rounder

it happens.. with marino, 30 teams passed on him, i believe

lorimike
10-29-2007, 07:01 AM
To the original post and poster, if you are sick of it, then go root for another team. The Patriots are incredible and they have a fanbase full of bandwagoneers, so it should be easy to jump aboard.

Problem solved. Happy trails.<<<<

We lost 52-7! Doesn't that bother you? It's not like we don't pay our players as much as the Patriots players. I can't root for another team- it just doesn't work. What bothers me more than anything is the lackluster spirit of the team. All that I ask is that when you are getting the snot kicked out of you the last thing I need to see is helping the players up after the play.

lorimike
10-29-2007, 07:11 AM
They actually gave up 3 picks(including a 2nd) for Welker and Randy Moss lol.<<<

Then the Patriots got return on their investment. Those are good front office moves. Our return on our investment has been Brandon LLoyd and Duckett. I don't which game you were watching but Welker had about 8 catches. Duckett, well, he plays or sits on the bench I believe for Detroit. And lloyd caught a nice 6 yard out pattern and promptly fell down. Moss caught a TD. who do you think is making the better front office moves??? Maybe for you this would be a real head scratcher.

redskin_rich
10-29-2007, 07:42 AM
<<<<

We lost 52-7! Doesn't that bother you? It's not like we don't pay our players as much as the Patriots players. I can't root for another team- it just doesn't work. What bothers me more than anything is the lackluster spirit of the team. All that I ask is that when you are getting the snot kicked out of you the last thing I need to see is helping the players up after the play.
Well, I can't say I enjoyed any part of that game but at the end of the day, it's just a loss like any other.
So far, no one else in the league can play at the Patriots level either and last I checked, they are all highly paid professionals as well. We are a battered team right now, yet we have a winning record. Go talk to a Rams fan and remember that they were a better team than us last year.

akhhorus
10-29-2007, 09:26 AM
<<<<

We lost 52-7! Doesn't that bother you? It's not like we don't pay our players as much as the Patriots players. I can't root for another team- it just doesn't work. What bothers me more than anything is the lackluster spirit of the team. All that I ask is that when you are getting the snot kicked out of you the last thing I need to see is helping the players up after the play.

Then why are you calling out 1 player for this loss? Why is POrtis the Great Satan to you for this embarrassment?

dj_stouty
10-29-2007, 09:52 AM
Jump!

Hr fan
10-29-2007, 12:38 PM
The players are reflectin the leadership of the coaching staff as far as passion goes. Enthusiastic yes, passionate no. Only Snyder shows passion, and this is an area of the organization the this is a liability, not an asset.

lorimike
10-29-2007, 04:36 PM
Then why are you calling out 1 player for this loss? Why is POrtis the Great Satan to you for this embarrassment?<<<

You are taking what I wrote out of context. As for Clinton I have become frustrated by watching him play. No disrespect to Clinton Portis the person but perhaps father time has caught up with him. In my original post I singled out the coach, the owner and the players. This game of football is a game where you need a lot of good players at all positions. We just don;t have the horses to run with the better teams in the league. Why do the Pats give up a 2nd for Welker and he turns out to be good but when we try the same thing we end up with Brandon Lloyd???? It's frustrating and I'm sick of it. This team better shape up real quick or we'll lose to the friggin Jets!

akhhorus
10-29-2007, 04:38 PM
<<<

You are taking what I wrote out of context. As for Clinton I have become frustrated by watching him play. No disrespect to Clinton Portis the person but perhaps father time has caught up with him. In my original post I singled out the coach, the owner and the players. This game of football is a game where you need a lot of good players at all positions. We just don;t have the horses to run with the better teams in the league. Why do the Pats give up a 2nd for Welker and he turns out to be good but when we try the same thing we end up with Brandon Lloyd???? It's frustrating and I'm sick of it. This team better shape up real quick or we'll lose to the friggin Jets!

I'm sorry, but you've been saying this since before the season, so its hard to take you seriously when you bitch about the loss and single out the one player you've been dumping on all year. Portis clearly isn't done because when they got him the ball in a screen, he got 54 yards quickly. The problem is that the Oline is pathetic this year.

guinness4health
10-29-2007, 06:23 PM
This is where the Skins differ from someone like the Patriots though. I have a feeling if they lost 2 OL, then they really wouldn't miss that much of a beat.

i think that is a little naive....

virtually no teams don't carry more than 3 extra linemen with one of those guys being the equivalent of a utility player, backing up multiple positions...

most teams when they loss an offensive lineman they are able to deal with his loss because of the other starters next to him, but in our case we lost an entire side of our line basically at one time....

and the reality is that were have lost our best offensive linemen [Randy], our biggest leader in the offensive huddle [Jansen] and our replacement right Tackle is playing with a dislocated shoulder and a strained groin....and every other single starter on the offensive line has been hobbled at one point or another....this is a situation that is nearly unheard of

I seriously doubt the pats (or any other team for that matter) would be able to easily handle losing the right or left side of their line...

GibbsFan
10-30-2007, 01:04 AM
I like and respect Joe Gibbs. Failing to get the job done in version 2.0 will not change that. He meant too much for my Redskins of old. In truth, it took a lot of guts for him to take the job again. So it is with deep regret that I preface my comments below with the above statements.

This team has no fight and no guts. Yes, the time has finally arrived where a Gibbs coached team plays with a lack of fire, heart, guts, or whatever adjective you want to put on it.

Sure, it was just one game. But can anyone tell me that we played hard throughout it? I don't think so. The defense played soft, and never adjusted. They whined like babies about the Pats running up the score and going for it on 4th down. But did anybody think about getting one shot on Tom Brady? No! Why not unload Sean Taylor on him just one time? Landry? Maybe even Torrence, reported to be the fastest man on the team from just one corner blitz.

Don't even get me started with the offense, which is truly offensive in every sense of the word. Too bad it is not with the football. But they sure can stink a joint up. The coaching and overall play was simply abysmal. I can take an old fashioned butt whupping if we left it out on the field with our efforts. But I saw very few who took the field who played hard, coached hard, and acted like they gave a crap. The whole dang crew should donate their paychecks to charity because they sure as heck didn't earn it.

Yes, the Patriots are a very good football team. Best of all-time? I don't think so but some might differ on that. Next Sunday will tell the tale for our team. I hope we grow some new gonads because ours were :guillo: off and stomped into Gillette field.

Does anybody out there think we played our guts out? I just don't see it myself. Every player, coach, owner, and fan should be disgusted and ashamed of that sorry effort. There is only one way to fix it, and thats to get to the SB and b-slap them like they just did to us. Unfortunately, our guys don't have the heart and guts to get it done. Like the tin man, they have no heart.

joethefan
10-30-2007, 01:45 AM
IMO it's almost like they just wanted to go to Foxboro to get the game overwith.....

Question....If you saw that they were running up your gut after the third running play of the game, which was about 30+ yards, Why didn't Gregg walk a saftey up?.....why didn't he bring the Linebackers up......Troy told everyone what they were doing....They were running Randy downfield pulling Felther with him and Bringing the 3rd reciever out and gained 12 yards everytime....and Gregg didn't adjust to it.

It's almost like he's using Landry like he used Archuletta last year....not walking him to the line...no blitzes at ALL!!! didn't try anything new....he just played read and react ball in a cover 2......So IMO they didn't plan on even trying to do anything different from offense to defense IMO.......

Mike Sellars looked horrible for the second week in a row.....Unbeleivable.
then next week they'll try thier best to Kill the Jets....cause of their inferiority but couldn't play up to that talent.....

lorimike
10-30-2007, 07:08 AM
I'm sorry, but you've been saying this since before the season, so its hard to take you seriously when you bitch about the loss and single out the one player you've been dumping on all year. Portis clearly isn't done because when they got him the ball in a screen, he got 54 yards quickly. The problem is that the Oline is pathetic this year.<<

I would not hang you hat on that stat. About 25 of those yards came when Campbell threw a screen pass with 1 second left in the 1st half. For a minute try and have some levity and compare how Portis ran vs Lawrence Maroney. We need that type of runner. And for the last two games Betts has the higher yard per carry with much fewer carries. If what we are doing in the running game is not working then its time to try something different wouldn't you think?? Against the Jets I would start Betts and see what happens.

lorimike
10-30-2007, 07:15 AM
I'm sorry, but you've been saying this since before the season, so its hard to take you seriously when you bitch about the loss and single out the one player you've been dumping on all year. Portis clearly isn't done because when they got him the ball in a screen, he got 54 yards quickly. The problem is that the Oline is pathetic this year.<<<

Them quite honestly I was right about Clinton Portis. When I saw the reports of Knee tendinitis from early in training camp I recognized that there was a long term problem with this running back. 7 games into the season I think we can all see that. The receiving stat is so misleading because they threw a screen pass with 1 second left in the first half. Most of Portis' yards in the receiving game came on that play. I mean come on Ank! This is Clinton Portis with the 4.3 speed from the U of Miami. I don't know what game you are watching but that player went "bye bye "about 24 months ago.

akhhorus
10-30-2007, 08:56 AM
<<<

Them quite honestly I was right about Clinton Portis.

LOL, keep dreaming there.

When I saw the reports of Knee tendinitis from early in training camp I recognized that there was a long term problem with this running back. 7 games into the season I think we can all see that. The receiving stat is so misleading because they threw a screen pass with 1 second left in the first half. Most of Portis' yards in the receiving game came on that play. I mean come on Ank! This is Clinton Portis with the 4.3 speed from the U of Miami. I don't know what game you are watching but that player went "bye bye "about 24 months ago.

See what? That Portis' stats have dropped since Randy Thomas went down? This knee tendinitis didn't stop him from rushing for 98 yards in 17 carries to open the season. So no, you're wrong. Again. Your obsessive hatred with Portis is getting obscene.

<<

I would not hang you hat on that stat. About 25 of those yards came when Campbell threw a screen pass with 1 second left in the 1st half. For a minute try and have some levity and compare how Portis ran vs Lawrence Maroney. We need that type of runner. And for the last two games Betts has the higher yard per carry with much fewer carries.

Wow, talk about selective stat use. Betts has 6 carries for 21 yards(3.5 ypc) and half that that yardage came on 1 carry, Portis has 29 carries in that time. I wouldn't hang your hat on that stat as evidence.

If what we are doing in the running game is not working then its time to try something different wouldn't you think?? Against the Jets I would start Betts and see what happens.

On what grounds? What has Betts done this year to show that he's worthy of a starting shot? And not being named Portis isn't evidence that he's ready to start. I understand that you're a Betts stalker, but deal with reality.

Moe
10-30-2007, 10:38 AM
...and compare how Portis ran vs Lawrence Maroney. We need that type of runner.

Nah, we need that type of blocking.

lorimike
10-30-2007, 05:19 PM
LOL, keep dreaming there.



See what? That Portis' stats have dropped since Randy Thomas went down? This knee tendinitis didn't stop him from rushing for 98 yards in 17 carries to open the season. So no, you're wrong. Again. Your obsessive hatred with Portis is getting obscene.



Wow, talk about selective stat use. Betts has 6 carries for 21 yards(3.5 ypc) and half that that yardage came on 1 carry, Portis has 29 carries in that time. I wouldn't hang your hat on that stat as evidence.



On what grounds? What has Betts done this year to show that he's worthy of a starting shot? And not being named Portis isn't evidence that he's ready to start. I understand that you're a Betts stalker, but deal with reality.<<<

You sir have drunk the Koolaid. Are you perhaps Clinton Portis himself??

akhhorus
10-30-2007, 05:22 PM
<<<

You sir have drunk the Koolaid. Are you perhaps Clinton Portis himself??

*yawn* Thanks for giving up. Btw, the Skins did give Betts the same number of carries as Portis behind the full Oline against Miami. They both had 17 carries, Portis had 98 yards, Betts 59. I'm sorry that you're in love with a Rb who's terrible.

I think its time for you to make a non-sequitur comment again since the facts are against you..again.

lorimike
10-30-2007, 06:31 PM
*yawn* Thanks for giving up. Btw, the Skins did give Betts the same number of carries as Portis behind the full Oline against Miami. They both had 17 carries, Portis had 98 yards, Betts 59. I'm sorry that you're in love with a Rb who's terrible.

I think its time for you to make a non-sequitur comment again since the facts are against you..again.<<<
Thanks for that Ank! Have you checked to see where Portis ranks in the NFL in yards rushing? It is not very good. Bottom line is this team is not very good in any one aspect at this point. We are at a crossroads right now.

akhhorus
10-30-2007, 06:34 PM
<<<
Thanks for that Ank! Have you checked to see where Portis ranks in the NFL in yards rushing? It is not very good. Bottom line is this team is not very good in any one aspect at this point. We are at a crossroads right now.

This isn't an answer to what I wrote about Portis/Betts. If you can't discuss the issues you bring up yourself, then maybe this medium isn't for you? What does where Portis ranks in the NFL in rushing have to do with the fact that Betts isn't the player you so badly want him to be?

And is your vision still so poor that you keep calling me Ank, do we have to have an HR fund raiser for a new pair of glasses for you?

hail2skins
10-30-2007, 06:41 PM
<<<
Thanks for that Ank! Have you checked to see where Portis ranks in the NFL in yards rushing? It is not very good. Bottom line is this team is not very good in any one aspect at this point. We are at a crossroads right now.I'm sorry but this is a cop out post right here. You two have been engaged in this discussion and all of a sudden you just quit on it. That's pretty weak IMO. Don't you have more evidence?

lorimike
10-30-2007, 07:22 PM
This isn't an answer to what I wrote about Portis/Betts. If you can't discuss the issues you bring up yourself, then maybe this medium isn't for you? What does where Portis ranks in the NFL in rushing have to do with the fact that Betts isn't the player you so badly want him to be?

And is your vision still so poor that you keep calling me Ank, do we have to have an HR fund raiser for a new pair of glasses for you?<<

Ank, Ank, Ank,
What do you want me to say my man? Betts ran like a man possessed the last 9 games of last year. I think if given his carries he could replicate that. If the one game this season that Betts got his carries makes the player in your opinion then continuing this is useless. I am not the only one who thinks Portis is a shell of his former self. Knowledgeable football people like Troy Aikman are saying the same thing. A greater likeliehood could be that Portis is released following this season and we draft another running back. I don't know...... What I do know is that we lost 52-7 last week. A small resistance would have been nice but lose the way we did was disgusting. It was one of the worst defeats in Redskin history. In my opinion the entire team stunk. Every single player stunk! Portis' play is just one of the many sypmtoms we have. We gave Clinton one of the richest contracts ever- I expect him to be a 1500 yard a year back. Right now he is below average. You go drink some more Koolaid now........ run along now- Koolaid stand is over there>

akhhorus
10-30-2007, 07:30 PM
<<

Ank, Ank, Ank,

Again with your vision problems.

What do you want me to say my man? Betts ran like a man possessed the last 9 games of last year.

Too bad he's not playing for a contract this year then. Because he's not running like he did, either in production or in quality of his actual running.

I think if given his carries he could replicate that. If the one game this season that Betts got his carries makes the player in your opinion then continuing this is useless.

Thats your opinion. Doesn't mean it will happen. The fact that Betts hasn't run well when in means you're bordering on blind faith. We've seen how Betts can run with a healthy Oline this year, and its not good, whether you like it or not.

I am not the only one who thinks Portis is a shell of his former self. Knowledgeable football people like Troy Aikman are saying the same thing.

Really? He said last week that he thought Portis was battling injuries, not that he was done.

A greater likeliehood could be that Portis is released following this season and we draft another running back. I don't know...... What I do know is that we lost 52-7 last week. A small resistance would have been nice but lose the way we did was disgusting. It was one of the worst defeats in Redskin history. In my opinion the entire team stunk. Every single player stunk! Portis' play is just one of the many sypmtoms we have.

Wouldn't the 52 points(45 to be fair) mean that you should be calling out the defense and not the Rb you've had a ***CENSORED BY SPENCE***-on for since before the season began? The only reason you singled out Portis is because you hate Portis no matter what he actually does and even if the defense gave up 100 points, you'll still find a way to convince yourself that its Portis' fault.

We gave Clinton one of the richest contracts ever- I expect him to be a 1500 yard a year back. Right now he is below average.

He's on pace still for 1000 yards rushing and about 1400 total yards, thats hardly below average. Btw, Betts is on pace(with 1/3 the touches of Portis) for maybe 470 total yards. Oh wait, thats not his fault :rolleyes:

You go drink some more Koolaid now........ run along now- Koolaid stand is over there>

What's truly hilarious is that you're as blindly in love with Betts as you claim I am about Portis. The fact that you constantly change the subject or ignore certain questioning about him show that you're drowning in kool aid. And i'm not going to throw you a life vest.

Skinsguy1
10-30-2007, 07:39 PM
not at all trying to jump into an argument...just had a comment

I like to believe Betts' declining productivity this season isn't due to his contract signing over the offseason, largely because Betts spurned free agency, and consequently, more lucrative deals to stay in Washington. I don't believe the guy is on cruise control and just picking up a pay check. If he is, then we made a mistake.

I feel that our running game's ineffectiveness is simply because there isn't a whole lot of running room for either of the two backs.

Looking back to the last few games of last season, I feel like I noticed the running game featured more quick-hitting runs instead of some of the long, looping stretch plays that are getting no where right now.

akhhorus
10-30-2007, 07:43 PM
not at all trying to jump into an argument...just had a comment

I like to believe Betts' declining productivity this season isn't due to his contract signing over the offseason, largely because Betts spurned free agency, and consequently, more lucrative deals to stay in Washington. I don't believe the guy is on cruise control and just picking up a pay check. If he is, then we made a mistake.

I honestly think this is the problem with him. Betts was a lazy runner who hesitated before he was playing for a contract, he looked great last year, and now has gone back to his old ways. I'm just glad we didn't give up a ton of money for him.

I feel that our running game's ineffectiveness is simply because there isn't a whole lot of running room for either of the two backs.

Looking back to the last few games of last season, I feel like I noticed the running game featured more quick-hitting runs instead of some of the long, looping stretch plays that are getting no where right now.

This is why I go back to the one game where we had our starting Oline(essentially) this season, Miami. They both got 17 carries, only Portis produced dramatically better and Betts looked slow.

lorimike
10-30-2007, 08:20 PM
Again with your vision problems.<<

Ank , Ank, Ank, get used to it



Too bad he's not playing for a contract this year then. Because he's not running like he did, either in production or in quality of his actual running.<<

Oh I'm sorry. Lets just keep running Clinton. maybe we just expect a better result.



Thats your opinion. Doesn't mean it will happen. The fact that Betts hasn't run well when in means you're bordering on blind faith. We've seen how Betts can run with a healthy Oline this year, and its not good, whether you like it or not. <<
I would like to see Betts get 20 carries and be the primary back. If that doesn't work then so be it but at least we tried something different.



Really? He said last week that he thought Portis was battling injuries, not that he was done. <<< This is splitting hairs with you. He's been battling injuries for two seasons now. This is the NFL- Stand for not for long when your always battling injuries.



Wouldn't the 52 points(45 to be fair) mean that you should be calling out the defense and not the Rb you've had a ***CENSORED BY SPENCE***-on for since before the season began? The only reason you singled out Portis is because you hate Portis no matter what he actually does and even if the defense gave up 100 points, you'll still find a way to convince yourself that its Portis' fault. <<
When I saw Portis in Denver is seemed like he ran for 10 yards every play. Since he got hear I believe his yards per carry dropped quite a bit. If it is all O-line play then that is where the money should be invested.



He's on pace still for 1000 yards rushing and about 1400 total yards, thats hardly below average. Btw, Betts is on pace(with 1/3 the touches of Portis) for maybe 470 total yards. Oh wait, thats not his fault :rolleyes:
1000 yards in a 16 game schedule is like 65 yards a game. You keep drinking the Koolaid


What's truly hilarious is that you're as blindly in love with Betts as you claim I am about Portis. The fact that you constantly change the subject or ignore certain questioning about him show that you're drowning in kool aid. And i'm not going to throw you a life vest.
Betts is the only other viable option unless you want to try Rock or Sellars. Before we go there I would try Betts as the primary and Portis as the third down back

akhhorus
10-30-2007, 08:31 PM
Betts is the only other viable option unless you want to try Rock or Sellars. Before we go there I would try Betts as the primary and Portis as the third down back

And with the Skins in the thick of the NFC playoff picture, now is not the time to try experimental lineups or benching our best offensive player on whims. Maybe if Betts produced when he was on the field this year, there would be a basis for the Skins to try this.

And thanks for proving what I said about you avoiding the issue and changing the subject.

lorimike
10-30-2007, 08:41 PM
And with the Skins in the thick of the NFC playoff picture, now is not the time to try experimental lineups or benching our best offensive player on whims. Maybe if Betts produced when he was on the field this year, there would be a basis for the Skins to try this.

And thanks for proving what I said about you avoiding the issue and changing the subject.<<<

I have not avoided any issue. But after a while the points are belabored. I just think maybe we should give Betts a start and get him 20 carries. It is an opinion you do not agree with. So What! In my opininon Clinton appears beat up and his having difficulting getting some good yards per carry. In a limited role Betts has not set the world on fire either but he's more of a runner who gets better when he gets in the groove. You keep referring back to this Miami game as the gospel of who is right and wrong on this point. Give it a rest why don't you and have some respect for another opinion

hail2skins
10-30-2007, 09:14 PM
<<<

I have not avoided any issue. But after a while the points are belabored. I just think maybe we should give Betts a start and get him 20 carries. It is an opinion you do not agree with. So What! In my opininon Clinton appears beat up and his having difficulting getting some good yards per carry. In a limited role Betts has not set the world on fire either but he's more of a runner who gets better when he gets in the groove. You keep referring back to this Miami game as the gospel of who is right and wrong on this point. Give it a rest why don't you and have some respect for another opinionand you are telling folks to be respectful of others opinions. Get a grip. If you can't defend your opinion, then don't post it. If you can't take someone questioning your opinion, then you don't belong here.

akhhorus
10-30-2007, 09:23 PM
Ironically, you change the subject and avoid the issue again.

<<<

I have not avoided any issue. But after a while the points are belabored.

Yeah, thats why you've copped out God knows how many times in this thread. :rolleyes:

I just think maybe we should give Betts a start and get him 20 carries.

And Portis has gone over 20 carries 1 time this year, so shouldn't he get that kind of opportunity first also?

It is an opinion you do not agree with. So What! In my opininon Clinton appears beat up and his having difficulting getting some good yards per carry.

And what would you describe Betts as doing?

In a limited role Betts has not set the world on fire either but he's more of a runner who gets better when he gets in the groove. You keep referring back to this Miami game as the gospel of who is right and wrong on this point. Give it a rest why don't you and have some respect for another opinion

LOL, speaking about yourself here? I'm sorry if someone "dared" to point out that you're using a bad loss to beat the drum for the "Why I blame Clinton Portis for everything" bandwagon without making any "sense", but tough.

lorimike
10-31-2007, 06:55 AM
Ironically, you change the subject and avoid the issue again. <<<
My original post points out my frustration with the team as a whole. I did single out Clinton Portis and for some reason that really "frosts your beanie". We lost 52-7. Your a stat guy what is 11 carries for 27 yards??I'll give you a hint, it friggin sucks



Yeah, thats why you've copped out God knows how many times in this thread. :rolleyes:<<< You belabor your points and it prevents the conversation from moving along. It is quite tiresome to keep rolling in the mud with you. You are like a local building inspector " if you they were any good they would be a private contactor" If you were any good you would be writing for a real publication.



And Portis has gone over 20 carries 1 time this year, so shouldn't he get that kind of opportunity first also? When he's not moving the chains it's hard to commit to the run.



And what would you describe Betts as doing?<<
I said he has not lit the world on fire either but I noticed that when he was given the chance to carry the load and be "the man "he really got into a groove. I think maybe he can replicate that.



LOL, speaking about yourself here? I'm sorry if someone "dared" to point out that you're using a bad loss to beat the drum for the "Why I blame Clinton Portis for everything" bandwagon without making any "sense", but tough.<<<
I enjoy debate but you always get so hung up on criticism of Portis.

lorimike
10-31-2007, 07:00 AM
and you are telling folks to be respectful of others opinions. Get a grip. If you can't defend your opinion, then don't post it. If you can't take someone questioning your opinion, then you don't belong here.
<<<

I have defended my point ad nausium. I think you've got it the other way around

skinsfan45
10-31-2007, 07:39 AM
Were not the Patriots, they built there team and then used there draft picks for depth, we on the other hand traded away all our draft picks, and what have we got in return?
nothing but excuses - the Pats were extremely smart in the way they built this team (with concentration on an o-line) without huge useless contracts that hurt the team

hail2skins
10-31-2007, 07:48 AM
<<<

I have defended my point ad nausium. I think you've got it the other way around
No, you haven't. You have not covered some of his points and totally ignored them.

lorimike
10-31-2007, 08:09 AM
No, you haven't. You have not covered some of his points and totally ignored them.
<<<

I went through it line by line and responded. Nothing has been ignored. I am not even close to being the only one who feels Clinton Portis is not what he used to be. I have only made the point that when Betts got his shot last season he ran very well. Ank keeps referring to the Miami game as the gospel of truth on who is right and who is wrong. My observations are the Clinton has some nagging injuries and perhaps the team would be better. served with Betts carrying the bulk of the running duties and Clinton getting more time as the third down back. If it doesn't work then so what! What we are currently doing is not working. To keep doing what we are currently doing with this offense is pure insanity.

akhhorus
10-31-2007, 09:04 AM
<<<
I enjoy debate but you always get so hung up on criticism of Portis.

Another cop out. You don't like debate, you've gotten ultra defensive when someone criticized your bias/premise of this thread and when questioned further, all you've done is tap dance and ignore any debate.

Hr fan
10-31-2007, 11:37 AM
Just chiming in. When Betts ran well last year the pressure was off - we had already tanked the year and ran the most conservative of systems with a superior O line. IMO this year Portis is making a classic mistake, trying to make a play instead of taking what he can (what the defense "gives" him, which is damn little given the state of our O line and an ineffective passing game that begs a D approach of 8-9 in the box). Maybe injuries are playing a factor, but no gain is better than retreating trying to rescue a floundering O by making a play and losing 5 yards. The whole O is playing as if they are desperate this year from game one, like trying to sit on a half time lead.

This is leadership more than player oriented. IMO run Portis or run Betts. It won't matter as long as the O has no confidence or identity, and the coaching staff fosters this condition by their actions.

Brokenstriker
10-31-2007, 01:07 PM
I think the solution to all our problems is to actually kill Portis. He is pure evil.

That will just double his evil power ... I think you have to behead him and bury the head somewhere in the salt flats ... on a night with a full moon ... and umm ... while swingin a dead cat 6 times over your head ... chanting the long lost 4th verse to Hail to the Redskins ... in the orginial Algonquian ... yup that's what you'll have to do alright

lorimike
10-31-2007, 06:56 PM
Another cop out. You don't like debate, you've gotten ultra defensive when someone criticized your bias/premise of this thread and when questioned further, all you've done is tap dance and ignore any debate.<<<

Come on Akhhrous! I've responded to everthing you have written and defended my point.

akhhorus
11-01-2007, 08:43 AM
<<<

Come on Akhhrous! I've responded to everthing you have written and defended my point.

:lol1: So not only do you have vision problems, but memory issues also?

csquared
11-01-2007, 09:57 AM
<<<<<< No AKH <<<<<<<<<<< Your crazy <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< WTH is up with these in EVERY post?