Something to Chew on: Why Don’t NFL Scouts Like Colt Brennan?

[NamVet4]

Ultimately though, every team in the NFL had a scouting consensus that Colt Brennan was not a first day pick. Not even a first 5 round pick. Brennan wasn’t the only Quarterback with stats that indicate NFL success who slipped in the draft. Green Bay and Miami landed prototype franchise QBs in the second round. Andre Woodson, a 3.5 year starter at Kentucky, actually fell further than Brennan. I could do a very long post on why all these guys got overlooked by scouts, but only one of those guys is a Redskin, so I will focus on him.



Read on . . . Source (http://mvn.com/nfl-redskins/2008/05/20/why-dont-nfl-scouts-like-colt-brennan/)

[guess88]

It's cause of his slaughtering in the bowl game (which I blame more on his O line), and that his results are more a product of a system, than his own personal attributes. He also has the jailtime issue, but I think if he was starting at any of the bigger named programs, they'd label that part of his maturation process.

I'm excited to see what he could develop into, but he's years away from doing anything in the NFL, and right now is a project at best. He's very accurate though.

[akhhorus]

There's been very few Qbs who played in a gimmick system like Hawaii ran that turned out to be a decent QB in the NFL.

[ryflan47]

He's a few years too late, Spurrier would have started him from game 1

[Keino]

There's been very few Qbs who played in a gimmick system like Hawaii ran that turned out to be a decent QB in the NFL.

I really cannot think of one of note outside of Shaun King who turned himself into a pretty decent game-manager.

[redskin_rich]

Colt will be a fine QB... in the Arena League.

[dj_stouty]

I really cannot think of one of note outside of Shaun King who turned himself into a pretty decent game-manager.

Eh...King was only good enough for 24 measly starts in the NFL, which ironically is the exact same number that fellow Tulane alum, Patrick Ramsey got. I wouldn't necessarily call either of them a success story.

[Keino]

Eh...King was only good enough for 24 measly starts in the NFL, which ironically is the exact same number that fellow Tulane alum, Patrick Ramsey got. I wouldn't necessarily call either of them a success story.

Leading a team to a NFC Conference Championship game is a pretty good story. But, there is a reason he is no longer in the league.

[CNYSkinFan]

Maybe it is because he sucks?

[shally]

Maybe it is because he sucks?

i will say this much.. he is in the ideal position to learn and develop slowly. he has a great teacher in zorn. who knows what he can do in 3 years?

[Hrabanmaur]

I will say that scouts have been much harsher in their assessment of him than Carson Palmer's younger brother,based on...pedigree? That clearly wasn't a good measuring stick. As far as I'm concerned, any 6th round QB is a crap shoot. I care very little about what he accomplished in college. We're stuck with him now as our 3rd QB, so let's just hope he takes to Zorn's coaching well.

[shally]

I will say that scouts have been much harsher in their assessment of him than Carson Palmer's younger brother,based on...pedigree? That clearly wasn't a good measuring stick. As far as I'm concerned, any 6th round QB is a crap shoot. I care very little about what he accomplished in college. We're stuck with him now as our 3rd QB, so let's just hope he takes to Zorn's coaching well.


we are most certainly NOT stuck with him as #3.. if he shows poor work habits or does not have what it takes he could easily end up being cut.

it isnt as though he was a first day pick

[GreenspanDan]

is tom brady the sole reason there is annually so much offseason chatter about the colt brennans and jordan palmers of the world?

[guess88]

is tom brady the sole reason there is annually so much offseason chatter about the colt brennans and jordan palmers of the world?

That, and a slug slow offseason

[PyroGenic]

is tom brady the sole reason there is annually so much offseason chatter about the colt brennans and jordan palmers of the world?

Yup.

[jaylen]

I tend to think in the late rds big school qb's have a better shot at making it. I'd gamble on those guys. I think Woodson has a shot.

But Brennan looked so bad, so small and frail, arm looked really weak and he didn't seem that tough at all. It wasn't all his fault but he looked so bad. in that bowl game against Georgia.

If he becomes a player it'll be Zorn's qb magic bringing it out.

I just don't see the talent.

[JoeDaSchmoe]

No, Tom Brady has little to do with chatter about a guy who was in contention for the Heisman all season and broke numerous college records. There'd be talk about him no matter where Brady went.

Scouts don't like him because of the bowl game, because of his throwing motion, because of the system he played in. Yet scouts supposedly fell in love with Joe Flacco, he of the Division 1-AA schedule and the shotgun spread offense. Totally logical, huh?

[akhhorus]

No, Tom Brady has little to do with chatter about a guy who was in contention for the Heisman all season and broke numerous college records. There'd be talk about him no matter where Brady went.

Brennan was never a serious contender for the Heisman(and do we want to get into a discussion about the success rate of Heisman Qbs?). Tebow and McFadden had a stranglehold on it.

Scouts don't like him because of the bowl game, because of his throwing motion, because of the system he played in. Yet scouts supposedly fell in love with Joe Flacco, he of the Division 1-AA schedule and the shotgun spread offense. Totally logical, huh?

That doesn't mean that Brennan has any better of a chance. Flacco did well under pressure and at the senior bowl. Brennan looked just dreadful playing with NFL coaches and fellow draft level talent.

[Keino]

No, Tom Brady has little to do with chatter about a guy who was in contention for the Heisman all season and broke numerous college records. There'd be talk about him no matter where Brady went.

Scouts don't like him because of the bowl game, because of his throwing motion, because of the system he played in. Yet scouts supposedly fell in love with Joe Flacco, he of the Division 1-AA schedule and the shotgun spread offense. Totally logical, huh?

Is it that Simple Joe? Or does Flacco also have measurables of a prototypical NFL QB (6'6, 230) {Colt is 6'2, 205}, a compact throwing motion and a strong arm? This is not the "All things being equal, they played in the same system" situtation you are portraying it to be.

Flacco also scored pretty high on the wonderlic test, which is pretty meaningless to everyone but NFL scouts.

But why let facts get in the way of pimping your boy.

[JoeDaSchmoe]

Brennan was never a serious contender for the Heisman(and do we want to get into a discussion about the success rate of Heisman Qbs?). Tebow and McFadden had a stranglehold on it.

Didn't say he was, just that that's why ESPN spent fifteen minutes talking about Brennan after he was picked, yet ignored every other sixth-round QB.

That doesn't mean that Brennan has any better of a chance. Flacco did well under pressure and at the senior bowl. Brennan looked just dreadful playing with NFL coaches and fellow draft level talent.

There are other factors, of course. I just find it entertaining to hear NFL scouts come on TV and say things like, "Brennan was in a gimmicky system! He never faced real competition!" Then five minutes later they'll get asked about Flacco and say, "Look at his arm! God, I'm getting aroused just watching him throw through a swinging tire!"

Is it that Simple Joe? Or does Flacco also have measurables of a prototypical NFL QB (6'6, 230) {Colt is 6'2, 205}, a compact throwing motion and a strong arm? This is not the "All things being equal, they played in the same system" situtation you are portraying it to be.

Flacco also scored pretty high on the wonderlic test, which is pretty meaningless to everyone but NFL scouts.

But why let facts get in the way of pimping your boy.

Lots of people have the measureables of a prototypical NFL QB. Hell, I hang out with a couple guys that do. That doesn't mean they can actually play the position, even if they can throw a ball 70 yards.

You can believe in Flacco if you want. I find him to be Kyle Boller Part Deux, which became all the more ironic when the Ravens happened to draft him. I also find Brennan to be a Garcia/Hasselbeck type.

[akhhorus]

Didn't say he was, just that that's why ESPN spent fifteen minutes talking about Brennan after he was picked, yet ignored every other sixth-round QB.

No offense, but: so what? He set records in college for passing.

There are other factors, of course. I just find it entertaining to hear NFL scouts come on TV and say things like, "Brennan was in a gimmicky system! He never faced real competition!" Then five minutes later they'll get asked about Flacco and say, "Look at his arm! God, I'm getting aroused just watching him throw through a swinging tire!"

Okay, how does this help Brennan's chances exactly? It doesn't change anything that Brennan is at best a poor prospect.

Lots of people have the measureables of a prototypical NFL QB. Hell, I hang out with a couple guys that do. That doesn't mean they can actually play the position, even if they can throw a ball 70 yards.

You can believe in Flacco if you want. I find him to be Kyle Boller Part Deux, which became all the more ironic when the Ravens happened to draft him. I also find Brennan to be a Garcia/Hasselbeck type.

Elizabeth Hasselbeck, I assume you mean. I vaguely agree that Flacco is probably Kyle Boller. Brennan is nowhere near Jeff Garcia of any of the Hasselbacks. He's not some weak armed scrambler who is a leader like Garcia. Matt Hasselbeck is a decent armed, good leader who's a smart player. Brennan's just not a good prospect, and the only reason he got a sniff from the NFL was because of his stats-and he really didn't deserve that.

[Keino]

Lots of people have the measureables of a prototypical NFL QB. Hell, I hang out with a couple guys that do. That doesn't mean they can actually play the position, even if they can throw a ball 70 yards.

You can believe in Flacco if you want. I find him to be Kyle Boller Part Deux, which became all the more ironic when the Ravens happened to draft him. I also find Brennan to be a Garcia/Hasselbeck type.

Don't do that Joe. Your comment implied that there was no logic in the NFL scouts liking Flacco over Brennan as if their circumstances were identical or hell, close. They were not, so when I listed those items that NFL Scouts look for, it was to debate your position that there was no logic in their respective values. The logic was there. You may not agree with the conclusions born out of that logic, but in every way that scouts measure, Flacco was more desirable.

You can believe in Colt all you want, but the bottomline is that if he gets a chance in the next 3 years, then things are not going well for the Redskins.

[shally]

is tom brady the sole reason there is annually so much offseason chatter about the colt brennans and jordan palmers of the world?

that, and the jeff garcias, matt hasselbecks etc.... not all qb's have to be first rounders to make it..

[shally]

I tend to think in the late rds big school qb's have a better shot at making it. I'd gamble on those guys. I think Woodson has a shot.

But Brennan looked so bad, so small and frail, arm looked really weak and he didn't seem that tough at all. It wasn't all his fault but he looked so bad. in that bowl game against Georgia.

If he becomes a player it'll be Zorn's qb magic bringing it out.

I just don't see the talent.

how big was joe montana ? how strong was his arm ?

now before everybody jumps all over shally, i am NOT saying that brennan is the next montana, only that you dont need a cannon for an arm, but if you are not accurate (as in culpepper or ramsey-bird) no amount of arm strength will help you.. and for what it is worth, brennan does appear to be accurate

he may turn out to be a wasted pick.. but it was a 6th rounder. for the record, i would have preferred smith..

[Patrick]

how big was joe montana ? how strong was his arm ?

now before everybody jumps all over shally, i am NOT saying that brennan is the next montana, only that you dont need a cannon for an arm, but if you are not accurate (as in culpepper or ramsey-bird) no amount of arm strength will help you.. and for what it is worth, brennan does appear to be accurate

he may turn out to be a wasted pick.. but it was a 6th rounder. for the record, i would have preferred smith..

Have to agree with you here Sally - we don't know how it will turn out for him and weather or not JZ can do something with him. (my bet is he can)
AND of by the way just a little FYI ...... Brennan is 4" taller and 25 lbs heavier than Doug Flutie coming out of college.

[JoeDaSchmoe]

No offense, but: so what? He set records in college for passing.

*shrug* Doesn't mean anything in the NFL, but someone made the comment that ESPN analysts and the like "only" talk about Brennan because of Tom Brady being drafted in the sixth round. My point was that they didn't spend any time on other sixth-round quarterbacks; the reason they talk about Brennan is because of his high profile in college, not because of the round Brady was picked in.

Okay, how does this help Brennan's chances exactly? It doesn't change anything that Brennan is at best a poor prospect.

It doesn't. I was just mentioning that the irony amuses me.

Elizabeth Hasselbeck, I assume you mean. I vaguely agree that Flacco is probably Kyle Boller. Brennan is nowhere near Jeff Garcia of any of the Hasselbacks. He's not some weak armed scrambler who is a leader like Garcia. Matt Hasselbeck is a decent armed, good leader who's a smart player. Brennan's just not a good prospect, and the only reason he got a sniff from the NFL was because of his stats-and he really didn't deserve that.

Hey, I know more people that agree with you than agree with me. I obviously have a different take, but there's really no way to even begin settling this until, at the very least, we see some preseason action.

Don't do that Joe. Your comment implied that there was no logic in the NFL scouts liking Flacco over Brennan as if their circumstances were identical or hell, close. They were not, so when I listed those items that NFL Scouts look for, it was to debate your position that there was no logic in their respective values. The logic was there. You may not agree with the conclusions born out of that logic, but in every way that scouts measure, Flacco was more desirable.

You can believe in Colt all you want, but the bottomline is that if he gets a chance in the next 3 years, then things are not going well for the Redskins.

No, my comment implied that I laugh at the television when supposed "expets" use flimsy aguments like a "gimmicky system" against Colt, despite the fact that a majority of college quartebacks play in some sort of "gimmicky system." I also laugh when they mention Colt's schedule, yet seem to give Flacco a pass for playing in 1-AA. Are Flacco's measureable's better? Of course they are. But, again, I believe Colt's immeasureable's trounce Flacco's, and the former will eventually be another Garcia-type, while the latter will wind up in the Kyle Bolle Dustbin of quaterbacks who were drafted in the first round because they could throw a ball really, really far.

Quite definitive of you, by the way. I'd say that the bottom line is that if Brennan is starting in three years, it means that Campbell failed and we'll be lucky to have stashed away Mr. Hawaii.

[Counter Trey]

Can't really argue with all the folks that think Brennan was a wasted pick. I would have rather of had a handful of QBs in the draft over him as well, but I'm not going to count him out so quickly though. I saw a report on him a few months ago and one thing is definite...he will not go away easily.
If my memory serves me right, he had to back up Matt Leinart in high school (Brennan eventually won them a state championship). When the major schools didn't come calling, he went to a prep school for a year, then eventually walked on to Colorado. Even after his big brush with the law, he didn't quit but went to Juco and then accepted June Jones walk on opportunity at Hawaii where he broke NCAA records. The guy just will not stop.
Now who knows, I might have wasted 2 minutes writing this up but I'm going to wait till the end of preseason before I stick a fork in him.

[akhhorus]

*shrug* Doesn't mean anything in the NFL, but someone made the comment that ESPN analysts and the like "only" talk about Brennan because of Tom Brady being drafted in the sixth round. My point was that they didn't spend any time on other sixth-round quarterbacks; the reason they talk about Brennan is because of his high profile in college, not because of the round Brady was picked in.

Okay..so what?

It doesn't. I was just mentioning that the irony amuses me.

There's no irony really. Flacco and Brennan are both Qbs, but the similarities end there.

Hey, I know more people that agree with you than agree with me. I obviously have a different take, but there's really no way to even begin settling this until, at the very least, we see some preseason action.

And if Brennan is cut by game 2?

Quite definitive of you, by the way. I'd say that the bottom line is that if Brennan is starting in three years, it means that Campbell failed and we'll be lucky to have stashed away Mr. Hawaii.

No, it could mean that Campbell is hurt or failed, his primary backup is hurt/failed, and the skins have no other perceived choice but to play Brennan.

[sinskin]

Tom Brady said himself his strength out of college was pathetic and in no way was he NFL ready...this playing in a Michigan program. He made the practice squad BARELY. This being said the odds are against Brennen for all reasons said previously but noone will ever know how good he can be until he gets a couple years and a chance. But imo I would rather see Cambell do better and be our QB.

[JoeDaSchmoe]

Okay..so what?

Erm... I don't really know what you're looking for here. I made the comment in response to whoever posted that the only reason anyone on ESPN talks about Brennan is because he was drafted in the same round that Tom Brady was. I disagreed. It has nothing to do with anything beyond that.

There's no irony really. Flacco and Brennan are both Qbs, but the similarities end there.

If you don't want to see it, I have no reason to change your mind.

And if Brennan is cut by game 2?

Then I'm wrong. And if he becomes a Pro Bowler, then you're wrong. I'm sure we'll both be sweating bullets at the outcome.

No, it could mean that Campbell is hurt or failed, his primary backup is hurt/failed, and the skins have no other perceived choice but to play Brennan.

Wait, wait, you're telling me that making a definitive statement about a scenario three years away risks all sorts of inaccuracies?

[akhhorus]

Erm... I don't really know what you're looking for here. I made the comment in response to whoever posted that the only reason anyone on ESPN talks about Brennan is because he was drafted in the same round that Tom Brady was. I disagreed. It has nothing to do with anything beyond that.

I disagree with your assessment. I think you brought that up to show how much pundits thought of him.

If you don't want to see it, I have no reason to change your mind.

Your comparison of Flacco's schedule and offense are accurate, but as pure QB prospects, Flacco and Brennan can't be more different. Flacco is a tall cannon armed gunslinger with some mobility and improvisational ability. Brennan is a system product with good accuracy, but with little else. He has no arm strength to speak of. No sack avoidance ability to speak of. Hasn't read anything close to an NFL caliber defense..or even a good NCAA defense, until Georgia torn him apart. Has terrible technique and the senior bowl coaches thought he was about as useless as it got as a potential pro QB.

I really don't understand why you are so high on him.

Then I'm wrong. And if he becomes a Pro Bowler, then you're wrong. I'm sure we'll both be sweating bullets at the outcome.

I'll bet you a healthy amount of cash that the only way he makes it to a pro bowl is as a spectator or as a coach in the future.

Wait, wait, you're telling me that making a definitive statement about a scenario three years away risks all sorts of inaccuracies?

No. Just saying that your hope-based interpretation is based on a premise that Brennan is worth a damn.

[JoeDaSchmoe]

I disagree with your assessment. I think you brought that up to show how much pundits thought of him.

You're arguing with me about... my own thoughts.

Oooookay. You got me. I'm part of the Vast Colt Brennan Conspiracy.

Your comparison of Flacco's schedule and offense are accurate, but as pure QB prospects, Flacco and Brennan can't be more different. Flacco is a tall cannon armed gunslinger with some mobility and improvisational ability. Brennan is a system product with good accuracy, but with little else. He has no arm strength to speak of. No sack avoidance ability to speak of. Hasn't read anything close to an NFL caliber defense..or even a good NCAA defense, until Georgia torn him apart. Has terrible technique and the senior bowl coaches thought he was about as useless as it got as a potential pro QB.

I really don't understand why you are so high on him.

Hence the reason I... you know... focused my ironic amusement at the schedule and gimmicky offense comments.

I'll bet you a healthy amount of cash that the only way he makes it to a pro bowl is as a spectator or as a coach in the future.

If that bet couldn't potentially take a decade, I'd be down.

No. Just saying that your hope-based interpretation is based on a premise that Brennan is worth a damn.

If you closely, you'll notice that my extremely narrow statement was in response to an equally narrow statement by Keino. That was the point.

[Keino]

Quite definitive of you, by the way. I'd say that the bottom line is that if Brennan is starting in three years, it means that Campbell failed and we'll be lucky to have stashed away Mr. Hawaii.



No, it could mean that Campbell is hurt or failed, his primary backup is hurt/failed, and the skins have no other perceived choice but to play Brennan.

It could mean all of those things, none of which are good. Is that a definitive statement? Sure, but because of our investment in Campbell. That should have been obvious.

Edit: In addition, Joe, what you said initially (and what I responded to) was "Scouts" not pundits, but scouts. Scouts look for tangibles, tangibles which Flacco has over Brennan in every single way.

[JoeDaSchmoe]

It could mean all of those things, none of which are good. Is that a definitive statement? Sure, but because of our investment in Campbell. That should have been obvious.

All that could very well be true, but it still requires that Brennan be terrible. Again, I know that there are a lot more of you than there are of me. But I don't at all think that we'll be in dire straits if Brennan's under center in three years.

[akhhorus]

You're arguing with me about... my own thoughts.

You can say whatever you want, but I interpret based on your posts. There's no reason to bring up how long ESPN talked about unless it was part of an attempt to promote him.

Oooookay. You got me. I'm part of the Vast Colt Brennan Conspiracy.

I don't care enough to get the crickets link for this. It doesn't deserve it lol

Hence the reason I... you know... focused my ironic amusement at the schedule and gimmicky offense comments.

Right, you're just being ironic /sarcasm

If that bet couldn't potentially take a decade, I'd be down.

Well, he'll be out of the league in 3.

If you closely, you'll notice that my extremely narrow statement was in response to an equally narrow statement by Keino. That was the point.

No, Keino's comment wasn't narrow. Yours was.

All that could very well be true, but it still requires that Brennan be terrible. Again, I know that there are a lot more of you than there are of me. But I don't at all think that we'll be in dire straits if Brennan's under center in three years.

Based on what? Please explain why you think so much of a guy who no one else does. The only thing Brennan has is gaudy stats...piled up in a gimmick system which doesn't develop NFL prospects. Yet, you think he'll be quality QB.

[JoeDaSchmoe]

You can say whatever you want, but I interpret based on your posts. There's no reason to bring up how long ESPn talked about unless it was part

I'm sure you understand why I'm just going to punt this part of the conversation if you're actually going to argue with me about my own thoughts.

Based on what? Please explain why you think so much of a guy who no one else does. The only thing Brennan has is gaudy stats...piled up in a gimmick system which doesn't develop NFL prospects. Yet, you think he'll be quality QB.

I'd rather not re-hash an argument that I joyfully avoided a month ago when Brennan was first drafted. Based on my own research, I believe Brennan will be a good quarterback in the league. There is no way to definitively prove whether or not this will be true; thus, I'd much rather simply wait and see.

[akhhorus]

I'm sure you understand why I'm just going to punt this part of the conversation if you're actually going to argue with me about my own thoughts.

Not thoughts JDS, motivations. I don't need to be on the 7 1/2th floor of the Mertin Flemmer Building to glean those.

I'd rather not re-hash an argument that I joyfully avoided a month ago when Brennan was first drafted. Based on my own research, I believe Brennan will be a good quarterback in the league. There is no way to definitively prove whether or not this will be true; thus, I'd much rather simply wait and see.

If you want to take this to PM, thats fine, but I would be more than happy to give your research a fair reading.

[JoeDaSchmoe]

Right, I'm straight-up telling you what my motivations were, and you're trying to argue with me about them. I don't care which word you want to use.

And it's not about the research. You clearly are quite convinced that Brennan is the personification of suck, and I clearly am quite convinced that he will be a good QB. The odds of either of us convincing the other that he has been wrong this whole time are incredibly small; therefore, I'll stick with the "wait and see" approach.

And to be fair, I hope it's never really settled; I'm hoping that Campbell turns into a stud for us and Brennan becomes our version of Jim Sorgi. If Jason's a perennial Pro Bowler and Brennan sees about 20 snaps a year, I'll be thrilled.

[akhhorus]

Right, I'm straight-up telling you what my motivations were, and you're trying to argue with me about them. I don't care which word you want to use.

And it's not about the research. You clearly are quite convinced that Brennan is the personification of suck, and I clearly am quite convinced that he will be a good QB. The odds of either of us convincing the other that he has been wrong this whole time are incredibly small; therefore, I'll stick with the "wait and see" approach.

And to be fair, I hope it's never really settled; I'm hoping that Campbell turns into a stud for us and Brennan becomes our version of Jim Sorgi. If Jason's a perennial Pro Bowler and Brennan sees about 20 snaps a year, I'll be thrilled.

I am convinced of his total lack of ability from watching him play, and watching him at the senior bowl practices, where a corpse would have been more effective than he was. Again: I'm more than happy to hear your reasons for thinking so much of him. I don't quite know why you're avoiding doing this-even in private.

[Keino]

All that could very well be true, but it still requires that Brennan be terrible. Again, I know that there are a lot more of you than there are of me. But I don't at all think that we'll be in dire straits if Brennan's under center in three years.

From my point of view anyone other than Campbell at QB in 3 years means that we spent 2 1st round picks on a guy who did not become the player we expected and that would be on Joe Gibbs.

Again, if Colt Brennan, or anybody else is under center it would be bad for the Skins. It would mean that Campbell failed, was injured and/or was supplanted. I don't see that as anything but bad. That has nothing to do with Brennan's abilities or lack thereof and everything to do with out investment in JC.

[guess88]

Hasn't this whole "start brennan" argument already been done? Should a "start Rob Jackson" thread be made? He was drafter lower. Could be the next coming of Freeney or Merriman.

[JoeDaSchmoe]

I am convinced of his total lack of ability from watching him play, and watching him at the senior bowl practices, where a corpse would have been more effective than he was. Again: I'm more than happy to hear your reasons for thinking so much of him. I don't quite know why you're avoiding doing this-even in private.

Because I don't think anything I say will sway you whatsoever. So why would I want to go through all of that effort?

From my point of view anyone other than Campbell at QB in 3 years means that we spent 2 1st round picks on a guy who did not become the player we expected and that would be on Joe Gibbs.

Again, if Colt Brennan, or anybody else is under center it would be bad for the Skins. It would mean that Campbell failed, was injured and/or was supplanted. I don't see that as anything but bad. That has nothing to do with Brennan's abilities or lack thereof and everything to do with out investment in JC.

I misunderstood you then, and in fact, I agree with that sentiment. The ideal situation here will be that Campbell blossoms and we all wonder what it's like for those pathetic other teams who have to debate about who the answer is at quarterback.

[akhhorus]

Because I don't think anything I say will sway you whatsoever. So why would I want to go through all of that effort?


Swaying my opinions or not, I would just like to hear them.

[JoeDaSchmoe]

To avoid the quote-fest that would inevitably develop if I made this a long post, I'll simply say that I believe accuracy and mental ability (both when it comes to grasping the nuances of an offense and when it comes to reading a defense and making the right throw) to be the two most important features of any quarterback, and the things I see about Brennan tell me he has both of those in spades.

[akhhorus]

To avoid the quote-fest that would inevitably develop if I made this a long post, I'll simply say that I believe accuracy and mental ability (both when it comes to grasping the nuances of an offense and when it comes to reading a defense and making the right throw) to be the two most important features of any quarterback, and the things I see about Brennan tell me he has both of those in spades.

I'll give you accuracy, Brennan is nothing if not extremely accurate. However, the redskins have dealt with a run'n'shoot QB in the recent past, and he struggled badly with reading defenses: Ramsey(and he wasn't stupid). The run'n'shoot is designed to have the Qb do the least amount of defensive reads as possible since you're overwhelming a defense with WRs. And college Qbs who play in these gimmick systems fail to pick up the tools needed to read an NFL style defense. I do not believe for a second that Brennan has NFL potential with the mental aspects of the QB position.

[JoeDaSchmoe]

I didn't say he was smart because he played in the Run'n'Shoot.

[akhhorus]

I didn't say he was smart because he played in the Run'n'Shoot.

I didn't say you said that. I'm saying that a college QB playing in the run'n'shoot is entering the NFL without the abilities to read a defense because he hasn't had to seriously read a college defense for 4 years.

[JoeDaSchmoe]

I'll take June Jones' word on this one.

[akhhorus]

I'll take June Jones' word on this one.

Yeah, because he has such a great track record with QBs going to the NFL.

[shally]

I'll give you accuracy, Brennan is nothing if not extremely accurate. However, the redskins have dealt with a run'n'shoot QB in the recent past, and he struggled badly with reading defenses: Ramsey(and he wasn't stupid). The run'n'shoot is designed to have the Qb do the least amount of defensive reads as possible since you're overwhelming a defense with WRs. And college Qbs who play in these gimmick systems fail to pick up the tools needed to read an NFL style defense. I do not believe for a second that Brennan has NFL potential with the mental aspects of the QB position.

ramsey's worst flaws were inaccuracy and inability to see the whole field. he was smart, but apparently, not football smart

[JoeDaSchmoe]

Yeah, because he has such a great track record with QBs going to the NFL.

Actually, part of the reason I believe Jones on this one has to do with an article I read before the draft in which one scout said that he had found his discussion with Jones interesting, because Jones had never really campaigned for one of his quarterbacks before, but he was pushing everyone he knew in the league about Colt. He's been adamant about Brennan, and been clear in his distinctions between Colt and Timmy Chang.

[akhhorus]

Actually, part of the reason I believe Jones on this one has to do with an article I read before the draft in which one scout said that he had found his discussion with Jones interesting, because Jones had never really campaigned for one of his quarterbacks before, but he was pushing everyone he knew in the league about Colt. He's been adamant about Brennan, and been clear in his distinctions between Colt and Timmy Chang.

Okay, but Jones doesn't exactly have a great track record working with QBs in the NFL. I would be more impressed by a college OC who runs a pro style offense, and has a track record working with good QBs in the NFL pushing a guy. What would you say if Steve Spurrier was pushing one of his QBs as an NFL prospect? Also, Jones might see Brennan as a chance to promote himself, and his style of coaching.

[JoeDaSchmoe]

Okay, but Jones doesn't exactly have a great track record working with QBs in the NFL. I would be more impressed by a college OC who runs a pro style offense, and has a track record working with good QBs in the NFL pushing a guy. What would you say if Steve Spurrier was pushing one of his QBs as an NFL prospect? Also, Jones might see Brennan as a chance to promote himself, and his style of coaching.

That's possible, sure. I'm willing to take the gamble that he actually believes what he's saying. And I trust what Jones is saying because he's been in the NFL, and many of his comments about Brennan essentially came down to, "Look, this kid is really effing smart and will be able to read defenses at the next level. I know because I've been there."

[shally]

Okay, but Jones doesn't exactly have a great track record working with QBs in the NFL. I would be more impressed by a college OC who runs a pro style offense, and has a track record working with good QBs in the NFL pushing a guy. What would you say if Steve Spurrier was pushing one of his QBs as an NFL prospect? Also, Jones might see Brennan as a chance to promote himself, and his style of coaching.

i think jones is perceived as a "failure" in the nfl. he would definitely see brennan success as a vindication of his abilities as a coach

i dont think that jones harbors a desire to return to the nfl, but his move from hawaii says loudly that he wants to prove he can compete on a larger stage in college ball. brennan's success would allow him to recruit better prospects..

[akhhorus]

That's possible, sure. I'm willing to take the gamble that he actually believes what he's saying. And I trust what Jones is saying because he's been in the NFL, and many of his comments about Brennan essentially came down to, "Look, this kid is really effing smart and will be able to read defenses at the next level. I know because I've been there."

His qbs in the NFL weren't known for their abilities to read a defense:
Jeff George
Bobby Herbert
Rodney Peete
Andre Ware
Chris Miller
Billy Joe Tolliver
Ryan Leaf
Craig Whelihan.

And he was the QB coach in Atlanta when they dumped Brett Favre(this alone might be the most damning indictment of his abilities to spot talent). He did have Warren Moon for a couple years, but he was an established star when Jones got him.

[JoeDaSchmoe]

The same could be said of 95% of quarterbacks that ever enter the NFL. Very few QBs ever develop the ability to read defenses as quickly as is necessary to truly be a good NFL quarterback. Jones says that Brennan is the brightest he's ever had when it comes to the mental aspects of the game; he's got that "special" level that's required.

[colkurtz]

Well we will see how he turns out. Folks this is the SIXTH round. Actual starting percentage may be 5-10% or less out those picked that late - over a 3 year period.

Wonder why Zorn liked him if he is from such a gimmick system. There must have been something Zorn liked in his style, read even that late in the draft.

Anyway not good odds fro making it long-term.

[Patrick]

Well we will see how he turns out. Folks this is the SIXTH round. Actual starting percentage may be 5-10% or less out those picked that late - over a 3 year period.

Wonder why Zorn liked him if he is from such a gimmick system. There must have been something Zorn liked in his style, read even that late in the draft.

Anyway not good odds fro making it long-term.

AND we have a winner....................... But then again - would Zorn know anything about tangible qualities in a QB ......... :rolleyes:

[akhhorus]

The same could be said of 95% of quarterbacks that ever enter the NFL.

Right, and how many Qbs in a given draft class do anything in the NFL?

Very few QBs ever develop the ability to read defenses as quickly as is necessary to truly be a good NFL quarterback. Jones says that Brennan is the brightest he's ever had when it comes to the mental aspects of the game; he's got that "special" level that's required.

If June Jones had produced 1 quality NFL qb, I would believe that he has a clue when it comes to evaluating NFL QB talent. And when Steve Spurrier comes out pimping Chris Smelley in a year or two for the draft, I fully expect you to believe him 100%. Spurrier has as better track record than Jones does developing NFL Qbs from college.

[Gravy]

I don't think Colt was our guy, I think it was either Ainge or Johnson but they were gone. I am not so sure Colt will become our backup...I am not so sure he will even be this league in a couple of years...

[Hrabanmaur]

I don't think Colt was our guy, I think it was either Ainge or Johnson but they were gone. I am not so sure Colt will become our backup...I am not so sure he will even be this league in a couple of years...

This is what JLaC was reporting before the draft. It will be interesting to see what happens with Johnson in Tampa when they have to cut their roster to three QBs. I wonder if we'd make a move to pick him up off waivers or sign him off Tampa's practice squad if available. If that happens, Brennan may have a rather short window to prove his ability to adapt to the NFL.

[Meatsnack]

If you look at the measurable predictors of QB success, Colt has two of the the major three: 1) more than three season’s worth of starts and 2) accuracy.

What he lacks is 3) major conference competition. Playing not only in the run and shoot but also in the Time Zone at the End of the Earth skews things when evaluating Hawaii players. Colt beat a #17 ranked Boise State team playing jet-lagged in Aloha Stadium. Then, having to march across 5 hours of time zones to the Sugar Bowl, play in front of a hostile crowd against a team that was playing as well as anyone in the country at the end of the season, Hawaii got killed by #4 Georgia. A lot of pundits were saying that Georgia was a national championship contender by season’s end, and I don't think anyone seriously promoted that idea about 12-0 in the WAC Hawaii. A shellacking was what they were in for going in.

So, what we can't evaluate about Mr. Brennan that you can about someone who has QB-ed vs. Alabama in the Iron Bowl or played Ohio State in front of 105,000 in the Big House, is how he deals with pressure and expectations. If you think that the Sugar Bowl game alone answers that question, then over and out.

I was pretty angry when we drafted Colt. I wanted JD Booty with our compensatory 3rd (pre-trade) and was, in all honesty, wondering why we didn't take Woodson who passes all three tests. But, Colt is ours now and I will support the guy and be patient with his development. Very patient, because I hope he doesn't see the field for a long time. I am also willing to give Zorn the benefit of the doubt that he can identify a guy who can run his offense and develop him appropriately.

[JoeDaSchmoe]

Meatie, I'll agree with you about Woodson - I really liked him myself, and despite my arguments for Brennan here, I probably would have been happier with Andre. I wish I could just call up Zorn and ask specifically why he favored Brennan there.

[chrisbcbu]

http://was.scout.com/a.z?s=71&p=2&c=755588&refid=400&CMP=OTC-K9B140813162&ATT=5
Rookie most likely to be a steal in 5 years.

A lot of pundits think that Brennan will be nothing more than an Arena League quarterback because he doesn’t have the ideal size, throwing motion or overall quickness that translate to the NFL. But the one thing about Brennan is that anytime someone questions his ability, he always bounces back and proves all of his doubters wrong.

In the last ten years, there have been four quarterbacks selected in the sixth round that have gone on to be Pro Bowl players: Matt Hasselbeck, Marc Bulger, Tom Brady and Derek Anderson. I’m not going to compare Brennan with any of the quarterbacks mentioned, but his resiliency is uncanny, and nothing seems to faze him.

Brennan is in the perfect situation with the Redskins to show he’s capable of being an efficient NFL quarterback. New Head Coach Jim Zorn brings his West Coast offense to Washington, and Brennan is the perfect QB to develop in this offense. Although he worked out of the shotgun at Hawaii, Brennan has experience in the West Coast system going back to his high school days. Brennan’s quick release, accuracy and ability to run the offense will be enough to push Jason Campbell for the starting job in two years.

I think Brennan could be a very good backup and do fairly well in spot duty, but i will be worried if he has to play any extensive time.

[BrennanFan]

Brennan is a system product with good accuracy, but with little else. He has no arm strength to speak of. No sack avoidance ability to speak of. Hasn't read anything close to an NFL caliber defense..or even a good NCAA defense, until Georgia torn him apart. Has terrible technique and the senior bowl coaches thought he was about as useless as it got as a potential pro QB.

I wanna know how many Hawai'i games you have actually watched? The Georgia game, some of the Georgia game, any less than that? A couple of years ago, everybody and their brother fell in love with Boise State. Their defense and Ian Johnson was the reason they went undefeated. Granted, they're the only team in Hawaii's conference that comes close to being ranked in the top 15. But their defense was good. Georgia tore Hawaii's offensive line apart, not Colt. Hawai'i hadn't seen that kind of speed but they knew that saying that Washington was the fastest team they had faced all year and they were a mediocre Pac 10 team. Colt was understandably gun-shy taking all those hits and having to face the quickest 7-8 guys in coverage all night.

Patrick Ramsey AND Shaun King were SPREAD QB's. Shaun King's offensive coordinator was Rich Rodriguez. Just because an offense is based on multiple WR's doesn't mean that they're the same. The Run and Shoot was the original, period. The Spread came in the early to mid 1990's. The modern day Run and Shoot was started in the early 1970's by Mouse Davis. And a side note...most of today's Spread Offenses have Run and Shoot principles in their passing games. Someone who would say that he has no ability to make plays after a play breaks down is guilty of two things:1) They haven't watched very many Hawai'i games and 2)They have no clue about the offense that's he's running to be able to know when a play has "broken down".

Oh and include Warren Moon and Jim Kelley to June Jones' quarterbacks. If it wasn't for June those two wouldn't be in the Hall of Fame. And Bobby Hebert had his only Pro Bowl season under June. Ryan Leaf was beyond repair...as to quote an NFL GM "Everybody in the world missed on Ryan Leaf. And if he couldn't get along with June Jones then there's something wrong with him." Also June left Hawai'i because for all that June has done for the football program and the University, they couldn't guarantee him upgrades to football facilities. Hawaii's football facilities are a joke. There was a time when the athletic department didn't even provide soap for showers after practices...until Colt went on local TV to campaign for more soap lol. That's why June left.

[shally]

http://was.scout.com/a.z?s=71&p=2&c=755588&refid=400&CMP=OTC-K9B140813162&ATT=5


I think Brennan could be a very good backup and do fairly well in spot duty, but i will be worried if he has to play any extensive time.

i agree with the general thought of that article.. the 2 things that brennan has going for him above all are accuracy and personal drive.. he will be in a good spot at number 3 on the roster and i dont expect to see very much of him except in preseason for the next several years..

[Keino]

I wanna know how many Hawai'i games you have actually watched? The Georgia game, some of the Georgia game, any less than that? A couple of years ago, everybody and their brother fell in love with Boise State. Their defense and Ian Johnson was the reason they went undefeated. Granted, they're the only team in Hawaii's conference that comes close to being ranked in the top 15. But their defense was good. Georgia tore Hawaii's offensive line apart, not Colt. Hawai'i hadn't seen that kind of speed but they knew that saying that Washington was the fastest team they had faced all year and they were a mediocre Pac 10 team. Colt was understandably gun-shy taking all those hits and having to face the quickest 7-8 guys in coverage all night.

Patrick Ramsey AND Shaun King were SPREAD QB's. Shaun King's offensive coordinator was Rich Rodriguez. Just because an offense is based on multiple WR's doesn't mean that they're the same. The Run and Shoot was the original, period. The Spread came in the early to mid 1990's. The modern day Run and Shoot was started in the early 1970's by Mouse Davis. And a side note...most of today's Spread Offenses have Run and Shoot principles in their passing games. Someone who would say that he has no ability to make plays after a play breaks down is guilty of two things:1) They haven't watched very many Hawai'i games and 2)They have no clue about the offense that's he's running to be able to know when a play has "broken down".

Oh and include Warren Moon and Jim Kelley to June Jones' quarterbacks. If it wasn't for June those two wouldn't be in the Hall of Fame. And Bobby Hebert had his only Pro Bowl season under June. Ryan Leaf was beyond repair...as to quote an NFL GM "Everybody in the world missed on Ryan Leaf. And if he couldn't get along with June Jones then there's something wrong with him." Also June left Hawai'i because for all that June has done for the football program and the University, they couldn't guarantee him upgrades to football facilities. Hawaii's football facilities are a joke. There was a time when the athletic department didn't even provide soap for showers after practices...until Colt went on local TV to campaign for more soap lol. That's why June left.

Warren Moon was the QB in Houston from 1984-1993. June Jones coached him in 87 and 88 (As QB coach) and those are arguably his worst two statistical years in Houston. He Never coached Jim Kelly, so how exactly is he remotely responsible for his Hall of Fame Career? As an NFL Head Coach coach, June Jones has a 41-65 record. I think it a pretty safe bet that June Jones isn't all that highly regarded in NFL circles, and certainly not to the extent you are portraying here.

Did you ever watch Bobby Hebert? LMAO. I would argue that he wasn't deserving of the Probowl that year considering Favre, Aikman, Simms, Young and Beurlein all had better years. I mean really, throwing a lot on a 6-10 team just means you were playing catch-up.

As for Ramsey and King, people were trying to give the Run N SHoot the benefit here (sort of). Because beyond those moderate success stories (in the case of King anyways) a bum like David Klingler actually compares very favorably to Colt Brennan. Let us line them Up side by side shall we?

Klinger 6'2/215 ................... Brennan 6'2/205
NCAA TD record in 1990 .................. NCAA TD Record in 2007
9,430 yrds/91 TDs .................. 14,193 Yrds/131 TDs
(1,262 Attempts) .................. (1,584 Attempts)
RNS System .................. RNS System
Baugh Award (1990) .................. Baugh award (2006)

Sorry, but when I see Colt Brennan, I think David Klingler. Same gimmick system (That was a proven failure in the NFL). Same out of this world Stats. Same Piss poor competition. Brennan's 6TDs against Northern Colorado are as unimpressive as Klingler's 6TDs against Eastern Washington. The biggest difference here is that the Scouts actually weren't enamored by out of the world stats causing the use of a 1st day pick on Klingler. Chances are, had we not reached to grab the guy in round 6, he would not have been drafted at all.

[BrennanFan]

June coached Jim Kelly with the Houston Gamblers of the USFL, actually he was the WR coach. The offensive coordinator was Mouse Davis(Jones' mentor) so he was involved in the passing game. He probably isn't responsible for the HOF career but Jim Kelly got his start in pro football with the Run and Shoot and Mouse Davis/June Jones.

Warren Moon's worst year with the Oilers was 1986 with a 52% completion and 13/26 TD/Int. Also his completion percentage was going down every year before that. When June was hired in 1987, his completion % still went down to 50 but his TD/Int was 21/18. And in 1988 the completion % went back up to 54 and TD/Int was 17/8. Warren on his career and June, "I was disenchanted with playing in Houston. I was contemplating whether or not to be traded. June understands talent, and he knows how to get the most out of a quarterback. I owe a lot to June. When you think about it, if Jerry(Glanville) hadn't hired him, who knows? I talked to Colt quite a bit last year, and I told him that he's going to be a lot better in the NFL because of June. There's no doubt about that."

If you want to go by June's win-loss record then look at the state of the teams that he took over...also there's something about Run and Shoot guys taking over teams that are bad year after year and bringing them to respectability. That somewhat explains mediocre records for coaches. Also who's the only team in NFL HISTORY to have a 3,000 yd. passer, 1,000 yd. rusher, 3 1,000 yd receivers along with 3 other receivers almost combining for another 1,000? Also if it's such a gimmick offense then why do most NFL teams have Run and Shoot principle in their passing game?

I'll try to be quick with this one considering I wrote a book already but Colt has intangibles that Klingler didn't have. One of them being the Redskins are actually a competive team and the Bengals were anything but. Colt doesn't quit...no matter what happens. Also Colt was looking at competing for a starting job at Colorado the upcoming year if he hadn't been kicked off the team. He had D1 talent. Also for all those who are skeptical about Colt, June Jones, and the Run and Shoot. Pick up Hawai'i Warrior Football...A Story of Faith, Hope, and Redemption by J. David Miller. You may still have those opinions about all 3 but at least you will be educated in having those opinions.

[coffdogg]

i will say this much.. he is in the ideal position to learn and develop slowly. he has a great teacher in zorn. who knows what he can do in 3 years?I agree. What harm is it to put some time into him as a backup and see if he pans out. It would be nice to see a young #3 QB that you can look at and say " hey in 2 or 3 years this kid might be pretty good".

[akhhorus]

June coached Jim Kelly with the Houston Gamblers of the USFL, actually he was the WR coach. The offensive coordinator was Mouse Davis(Jones' mentor) so he was involved in the passing game. He probably isn't responsible for the HOF career but Jim Kelly got his start in pro football with the Run and Shoot and Mouse Davis/June Jones.

Mouse Davis is a legend of a coach and QB mentor, he's done it without Jones, Jones hasn't done it without him.

Warren Moon's worst year with the Oilers was 1986 with a 52% completion and 13/26 TD/Int. Also his completion percentage was going down every year before that. When June was hired in 1987, his completion % still went down to 50 but his TD/Int was 21/18. And in 1988 the completion % went back up to 54 and TD/Int was 17/8. Warren on his career and June, "I was disenchanted with playing in Houston. I was contemplating whether or not to be traded. June understands talent, and he knows how to get the most out of a quarterback. I owe a lot to June. When you think about it, if Jerry(Glanville) hadn't hired him, who knows? I talked to Colt quite a bit last year, and I told him that he's going to be a lot better in the NFL because of June. There's no doubt about that."

If you want to go by June's win-loss record then look at the state of the teams that he took over...also there's something about Run and Shoot guys taking over teams that are bad year after year and bringing them to respectability. That somewhat explains mediocre records for coaches. Also who's the only team in NFL HISTORY to have a 3,000 yd. passer, 1,000 yd. rusher, 3 1,000 yd receivers along with 3 other receivers almost combining for another 1,000? Also if it's such a gimmick offense then why do most NFL teams have Run and Shoot principle in their passing game?

Thats because its precisely a gimmick you whip out from time to time. And your stat question irrelevant: June Jones hasn't done it with NFL Qbs(or developing them).

I'll try to be quick with this one considering I wrote a book already but Colt has intangibles that Klingler didn't have. One of them being the Redskins are actually a competive team and the Bengals were anything but.

How many other Run and shoot QBs do you want to go through?

Colt doesn't quit...no matter what happens. Also Colt was looking at competing for a starting job at Colorado the upcoming year if he hadn't been kicked off the team. He had D1 talent. Also for all those who are skeptical about Colt, June Jones, and the Run and Shoot. Pick up Hawai'i Warrior Football...A Story of Faith, Hope, and Redemption by J. David Miller. You may still have those opinions about all 3 but at least you will be educated in having those opinions.

I am extremely educated in my opinions. I understand and appreciate that you love Brennan, thats fine. But stop trying to make him(and Jones/Jones' offense) into something they're not.

[BrennanFan]

Mouse Davis is a legend of a coach and QB mentor, he's done it without Jones, Jones hasn't done it without him. And your stat question irrelevant: June Jones hasn't done it with NFL Qbs(or developing them).


The answer to the stat question is the Atlanta Falcons quarterbacked by Jeff George and coached by June Jones(who called the plays). So that makes it relevant. The fact that a guy like Bobby Hebert was able to go or was even mentioned to go to a Pro Bowl under June Jones says something about June as well. Everywhere June has been offensive numbers have gone up. The Run and Shoot is used to having non-prototypical QB's running it but when it does(George and Colt) extraordinary seasons happen. Colt is not a prototypical NFL QB but he was a D1 talent which most of Hawai'i QB's did not have. How many Hawai'i games have you watched? Do you know enough of the RNS to know what's part of a play and what's imporvised? If you have done the research and film watching then bag on the offense and Colt all you want. I'm not on here saying that the Run and Shoot is the only way to go and that all other offenses are crap. We can agree to disagree which is fine because a lot of people just don't like the Run and Shoot. Also if you think that option routes and the stop fade(which June came up with) are gimmicks then more power to you because I'm not wasting my breath convincing you otherwise.

[akhhorus]

The answer to the stat question is the Atlanta Falcons quarterbacked by Jeff George and coached by June Jones(who called the plays). So that makes it relevant.

Not exactly evidence of a good coaching experience by Jones. George had a gun LOOOONG before June Jones got him, and they weren't that good of a team(and weren't very dominating an offense, they weren't top ten in points in Jones' 3 years and the best they did was 7th in yards).

The fact that a guy like Bobby Hebert was able to go or was even mentioned to go to a Pro Bowl under June Jones says something about June as well.

Not really, no.

Everywhere June has been offensive numbers have gone up.

Too bad that wins don't, or that Jones has shown he can develop an NFL caliber QB.

The Run and Shoot is used to having non-prototypical QB's running it but when it does(George and Colt) extraordinary seasons happen.

And no one runs it today(nor has for years) because its like the Wishbone offense: doesn't work in the NFL.

Colt is not a prototypical NFL QB but he was a D1 talent which most of Hawai'i QB's did not have. How many Hawai'i games have you watched?

I watched 6 Hawaii games last year, probably about the same number the year before.

Do you know enough of the RNS to know what's part of a play and what's imporvised?

Yes.

If you have done the research and film watching then bag on the offense and Colt all you want. I'm not on here saying that the Run and Shoot is the only way to go and that all other offenses are crap. We can agree to disagree which is fine because a lot of people just don't like the Run and Shoot. Also if you think that option routes and the stop fade(which June came up with) are gimmicks then more power to you because I'm not wasting my breath convincing you otherwise.

I cannot confirm that June Jones came up with either concept, but even if he did: so what? This has nothing to do with his ability to develop an NFL-caliber QB(either in college or the pros), which is something he hasn't shown he can do. I realize you love Brennan, but he hasn't shown much that he has a chance in the NFL.

[Lavar703]

is tom brady the sole reason there is annually so much offseason chatter about the colt brennans and jordan palmers of the world?

lets not go comparing Jordan Palmer to a collegiate record breaker

[Dolla Bill]

Does anyone have an update on Brennan's hip injury? Will he get IR'd for the upcoming season to "stash" him if they need be?

[Hrabanmaur]

Does anyone have an update on Brennan's hip injury? Will he get IR'd for the upcoming season to "stash" him if they need be?

I haven't heard anything. I think he was originally projected to be cleared for work by July. My guess is that we won't be hearing any updates until OTAs.

[HanburgerBum]

No, Tom Brady has little to do with chatter about a guy who was in contention for the Heisman all season and broke numerous college records. There'd be talk about him no matter where Brady went.

Scouts don't like him because of the bowl game, because of his throwing motion, because of the system he played in. Yet scouts supposedly fell in love with Joe Flacco, he of the Division 1-AA schedule and the shotgun spread offense. Totally logical, huh?


Like it or not, NFL scouts fall in love with the big arm. Flacco has a bazooka, while Brennan's in comparison is a bee-bee.

My initial reaction of Brennan was it was a wasted pick like Jordan Palmer. There were a bunch of other QBs (O'Connell, Johnson, Dixon, Brink) I preferred over Colt. But, now that CB is a Redskin, I am rooting hard for you to be right about him.

[linzman|skinsfan]

So I am not sure I follow the debate exactly but I will throw in my opinion anyway...

I think there are always going to be arguments on what's God given talent, what's a product of education, and then, what you can do with the both of them in the right situations. I suppose the skins favored accuracy, probably also believing Colt could make the quick reads to get the ball out quick as well. I just find it hard to believe in the argument that system and statistics weigh as heavily as the play of surrounding players does on his performance. Saying the system made him is like suggesting any QB coming after him should be just as good, or better. An example is saying any player in the same system that Brady played In Michigan... (i.e. Drew Henson) should be an amazing player.

To further keep with my scheme of examples, I am not sure what a gimmick system is anyway. I am pretty sure they are all playing within the rules of football, so what is a gimmick system? The system Tom Brady is in isn't exactly known for playing within the rules... that would qualify more to me.

Now I am not really a Hawaii fan or a CB fan... I don't even really care much for the West Coast Offense but you either pick the players that work in your system or the system that works for your players and then you coach. I am guessing they picked the player for their system and now plan to coach him. They must have seen something about him and I really hope it works because he is a Redskin now.

BTW... let's not kid ourselves... he is a 3rd string QB this year at best but he is in a good situation to learn from Zorn and Todd Collins, who is a smart, good character guy with less than amazing arm strength too.

Go Skins!

[GloryHog]

I like the drafting of Brennan. I think his skill set is best suited for running the West Coast offense, as far as any pro scheme is concerned.

I also liked his attitude in this article. He seemed confident, but not cocky or bitter.

http://www.redskins.com/news/newsDetail.jsp?id=36018

[AUviaMD101]

see his ONLY BCS game... See Georgia's defense...