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colkurtz
08-03-2008, 10:14 PM
I thought SOMEONE would be faster than me to get this started.

OK - some real comments:

Colt had a very good first game against the third/fourth string.

Collins looked, well.. bad. Same as he has in the TC. Seriously I wonder if we should look for an old guy out there with WCO experience if Collins poor play continues over the next 3-4 PS games.

AustinSkins
08-03-2008, 10:15 PM
A Stud name for a QB, and a stud performance!

Other studs...

#48 Horton - Great Instincts, great performance

Mason - Truly impressed

The Punter (Rookie - I forget his name)

#98 at DE

Fred Davis - Great Hands!

I'm bummed that I won't catch the rest of the preseason games, but I will stay tuned!


I have a few drinks in me right now, BUT I'M PUMPED!!!

colkurtz
08-03-2008, 10:18 PM
More comments:

I wonder if Zorn is going to try to modify Colt's throwing motion or just leave it alone?

If Colt keeps having success this PS he will play against the second string. Then we will see how he does.

This kid is a sixth round pick and a real gamble. Had a very good first game. Let's see what he can do!

akhhorus
08-03-2008, 10:19 PM
Colt showed a lot of poise for a rookie, but floating out there in the middle of the field will get him a lot of INTs. Good safeties salivate over passes like that. If he has to play some real game time, zorn should limit the playbook to plays that maximize hiding this flaw in his game.

colkurtz
08-03-2008, 10:19 PM
Mods merge these threads. Just saw another out there. When I started this I saw none on the list.

FanFromArizona
08-03-2008, 10:21 PM
I'm predicting we might see a swapping of QBs around once Jason gets his reps in.

I would definitely like to see a 2 games/2games scenario with Collins and Colt getting reps with the second teamers.

Maybe JC, then Colt, then Todd in the next game, followed by JC, Todd, Colt in the third game.

colkurtz
08-03-2008, 10:22 PM
Colt showed a lot of poise for a rookie, but floating out there in the middle of the field will get him a lot of INTs. Good safeties salivate over passes like that. If he has to play some real game time, zorn should limit the playbook to plays that maximize hiding this flaw in his game.

Yes, he's going to definetly have to fix that part of his game. I'm not a mechanical engineer but the OVERHEAD pass seems to have more zip in it. Just a hint.

shally
08-03-2008, 10:23 PM
More comments:

I wonder if Zorn is going to try to modify Colt's throwing motion or just leave it alone?

If Colt keeps having success this PS he will play against the second string. Then we will see how he does.

This kid is a sixth round pick and a real gamble. Had a very good first game. Let's see what he can do!

the announcers said zorn was going to re make him from the feet up.. but footwork would come before any arm changes

ChapelHillMatt
08-03-2008, 10:24 PM
I thought SOMEONE would be faster than me to get this started.

OK - some real comments:

Colt had a very good first game against the third/fourth string.

Collins looked, well.. bad. Same as he has in the TC. Seriously I wonder if we should look for an old guy out there with WCO experience if Collins poor play continues over the next 3-4 PS games.

While it's true Colt looked good vs third/fourth stringers, let's remember he was also playing with third/fourth stringers.

SkinsKY
08-03-2008, 10:24 PM
Colt showed a lot of poise for a rookie, but floating out there in the middle of the field will get him a lot of INTs. Good safeties salivate over passes like that. If he has to play some real game time, zorn should limit the playbook to plays that maximize hiding this flaw in his game.

Agreed. He threw some great corner routes, but those ones over the middle are picks waiting to happen.

They did say that they were going to work on Colt's throwing from the feet up, which I think is for the best. Even if your arm is great, poor footwork can undo that in a heartbeat.

Skaggsrules
08-03-2008, 10:26 PM
He did hit a lot of guys in perfect stride and with really good placement

shally
08-03-2008, 10:30 PM
He did hit a lot of guys in perfect stride and with really good placement

accuracy has always been his thing...

akhhorus
08-03-2008, 10:30 PM
He did hit a lot of guys in perfect stride and with really good placement

Yeah, but his two best passes(the first TD pass and the seem to the TE) would be eaten up by a competent Safety. Brett Favre and Peyton can throw it into situations like that because they have the arm strength to pull it off, but you just can't float it like he was tonight against starting level players.

jaylen
08-03-2008, 10:32 PM
pretty good game by Colt good poise and accuracy. Nothing to get carried away with.

shally
08-03-2008, 10:33 PM
Yeah, but his two best passes(the first TD pass and the seem to the TE) would be eaten up by a competent Safety. Brett Favre and Peyton can throw it into situations like that because they have the arm strength to pull it off, but you just can't float it like he was tonight against starting level players.

he throws a very soft catchable ball.. i wouldnt expect to see a lot of tips
when he is in..

if he can compensate for his lack of arm strength by looking off the safety he might be effective even against better talent

one thing for certain, i think we are going to continue to see a lot of him all preseason

jaylen
08-03-2008, 10:33 PM
Please don't get too carried away there's always Wuerfel and Osaka.

akhhorus
08-03-2008, 10:34 PM
Please don't get too carried away there's always Wuerfel and Osaka.

Actually Danny Waffle is the Qb he most reminds me of in college.

shally
08-03-2008, 10:35 PM
Please don't get too carried away there's always Wuerfel and Osaka.

wuerffel might be one of the few with an uglier throwing motion..

shally
08-03-2008, 10:36 PM
Actually Danny Waffle is the Qb he most reminds me of in college.

i think wuerrfel took a lot more hits by standing still than colt ever did (or will).. brennan is far more effective on the move than DW ever was

but both have ugly motions for certain..

smoak
08-03-2008, 10:37 PM
Nice game all aroundd offensively, but I am not yet sold on Colt... If Campbell fails in a year or two, Brennan might be in a position to compete for a job.

Collins definitely looked lost out there. Istill don'uersand brining in a good sytem QB andchaging everything he kows from the ast years of experience???

jaylen
08-03-2008, 10:38 PM
Actually Danny Waffle is the Qb he most reminds me of in college.

Oh no not the gloved one. I agree thats exactly how his ball looked. Which is a nightmare against quality corners and safeties.

The only caveat is having been coached by a competent qb coach in Zorn. He'll need to be more disciplined than his past seems to indicate. If not then he'll be wreck against 1st string guys, He'll need to eliminate bad habits and impulsiveness with that sorta arm.

colkurtz
08-03-2008, 10:38 PM
pretty good game by Colt good poise and accuracy. Nothing to get carried away with.

Yeah, it's a long pre-season. If he does very well he could move up to #2. But IMO he's got a lot of mechanics to work on to get to playing against the big boys. But who better than Zorn to get him there.

BL - any sixth rounder who actually makes the team is a win.

SkinsfaninNJ
08-03-2008, 10:40 PM
Two things I liked about him was his ability to move around in the pocket and his knowledge of the offense. He seemed much more sure of where to go with the ball than Collins.

We really can't complain much about Collins either. If not for the penalty on the first drive, Collins may have had a really nice night also. You guys do realize we only had three incompletions the whole night.

jaylen
08-03-2008, 10:41 PM
i think wuerrfel took a lot more hits by standing still than colt ever did (or will).. brennan is far more effective on the move than DW ever was

but both have ugly motions for certain..

Plus Wuerffel lacked heart, I thought he was scared to death out there. I still have nightmares from that game in Dallas. I have never been more frustarted watching a football game in my life than watching Wuerffel that night.

Dolla Bill
08-03-2008, 10:41 PM
Collins was 5-6 for 32 yards. That won't cut it. Btw, I think that was his deer in headlight to dropback ratio as well.

WarEagle
08-03-2008, 10:48 PM
Please don't get too carried away there's always Wuerfel and Osaka.

As the announcers said, all of the Skins QBs did well, so Zorn must be happy. Coach, BTW, has a pretty serious "warrior look" on the sidelines. I like it.

OT: Congrats to Jaylen on 1,000 posts... :)

GreenspanDan
08-03-2008, 10:48 PM
man, there are far worse things than 5-6 for 32 yards!

colkurtz
08-03-2008, 10:50 PM
Collins has struggled in TC and just didn't look good out there. I loved him last season.

However, it's a new offense and the preseason is a competition for position behind JC. May the best man win.

InsomniaKiller
08-03-2008, 11:18 PM
You guys do realize we only had three incompletions the whole night.

That is insane, thanks for pointing it out. I know we were all hoping to see the offense show some signs of "getting it" but I think it's safe to say they outplayed most of our expectations.

GloryHog
08-03-2008, 11:24 PM
As the announcers said, all of the Skins QBs did well, so Zorn must be happy. Coach, BTW, has a pretty serious "warrior look" on the sidelines. I like it.

For the first preseason game under a new head coach I was delighted. The team in general looked crisp and well coached. I saw several rookies who looked like they might be ballers. I saw the veterans excited and cheering for the 2nd and 3rd string. I saw a head coach who looked like he had his game together and even cracked a smile now and then. I can't wait to see the veterans plus Thomas and Kelly, who sat this one out, on the field. If they continue to improve they will be a serious team.

colkurtz
08-03-2008, 11:40 PM
I think the fun part of the largely useless PS is to root for underdog players.

There are many Brennan and Mason doubters out there but it sure is fun seeing these guys out there playing hard and well for a spot on the team.

Lacquer Head
08-03-2008, 11:43 PM
Just think, this is his first look at a pro defense ever. Give the kid a few years.

And I love JC. Remember, it's better to be plentiful than adequate depth-wise. Can't have too many good QBs.

shally
08-03-2008, 11:45 PM
Just think, this is his first look at a pro defense ever. Give the kid a few years.

And I love JC. Remember, it's better to be plentiful than adequate depth-wise. Can't have too many good QBs.

without question, we will live and die as a team with JC... as his season goes, so will the team's

silverspring
08-03-2008, 11:48 PM
Actually Danny Waffle is the Qb he most reminds me of in college.

you can't associate colt with mr. noodle arm himself. His arm may not be particularly strong but it isn't that weak either, now the side arm motion is a whole different story.

Slobberknocker
08-03-2008, 11:48 PM
Yeah, but his two best passes(the first TD pass and the seem to the TE) would be eaten up by a competent Safety. Brett Favre and Peyton can throw it into situations like that because they have the arm strength to pull it off, but you just can't float it like he was tonight against starting level players.

And when they are, Colt's play will be savaged. Until then, the goal of football is still to complete passes and score touchdowns.

Of course your point is correct. But orthodoxy doesn't mean a darn thing if Colt has a gunslinging "it" factor and gets the job done. Kenny Stabler was like that.

God, this is all so premature... If nothing else, Colt showed me tonight that he has fire. He brings an enthusiasm to the game that's fun to watch.

Lacquer Head
08-03-2008, 11:50 PM
without question, we will live and die as a team with JC... as his season goes, so will the team's

I absolutely agree. JC has finally given us all hope for the future, thank God for that.

I just think that CB has a chance to be a very good QB as well someday, he just needs to fix that disgusting release. I left my straightedge and triangle at home but that's got to be a 90 degree angle. I'll eat my hat if his arm is any further vertically than that.

Not my 2005 sideline though.

Rogers_Redskins
08-04-2008, 12:00 AM
I was totally impressed by the play of the offense whne JC was in, when Todd Collins was in it took a step backward, then Colt came in and we turned on the after burners. The throw to his left right over the head of the reciever was a thing of beauty. I reallt do not care what his release looks like as long as the ball lands in his recievers hands everytime.

swheeler
08-04-2008, 12:13 AM
I think the fun part of the largely useless PS is to root for underdog players.

There are many Brennan and Mason doubters out there but it sure is fun seeing these guys out there playing hard and well for a spot on the team.
Agreed 100%


Also Akh, I know all of the standard caveats about Colt's college career (gimmick offense, low competition, etc) but if you look at his TD/Int ratio it suggests he may be halfway decent at keeping the ball out of the defenders' hands. I know, NFL safeties are a different story, but still I think it counts for something. I think we can all agree that it would be nice to see him against some better players in the next few games and see what he can do.

shally
08-04-2008, 12:14 AM
I absolutely agree. JC has finally given us all hope for the future, thank God for that.

I just think that CB has a chance to be a very good QB as well someday, he just needs to fix that disgusting release. I left my straightedge and triangle at home but that's got to be a 90 degree angle. I'll eat my hat if his arm is any further vertically than that.

Not my 2005 sideline though.

most of us felt that zorn has already had an impact on JC's throwing motion.

he has already said that he will rebuild brennans from the ground up..
but what that tells me is that zorn sees enough of the intangibles that CB has to make a rebuilding project worthwhile

i think we will see a lot of CB this preseason-- and then virtually nothing of him until next preseason. but his development should be fun to watch..

TrueOracle
08-04-2008, 12:23 AM
I must say I was pleasantly surprised by Colt and Mason. That kid Mason runs with heart. He's a little undersized but he's a real football player. Kinda reminds me of... drum roll please........ Clinton Portis. Hard runner but a little undersized. And I would never take anything from CP. I love him.

About Colt: Damn!!! Yes it was his first game, preseason, against 10th stringers, yada-yada, but you've gotta love the kid's first outing. He's going to need a ton of experience at this level and a complete rebuild but he showed promise.

About TC: Damn!!! When will the experiment end?!?!? To beat the dead horse Al Michaels and John Madden are carrying around in that corny horse trailer - This guy was only good last year b/c he was lodged in Saunders' :moon2: for 20 years. Now, I'm thankful for his performance last year but this year will be tough for us if he ever has to come in for a save. Unfortunately, we have no other option for 2nd stringers now. TC has zero athletic ability and his Wonderlic (sp?) scores in this new offense are a joke. What this means for us is our O-line must stay healthy to protect JC. It's not that he only threw for 32 yards tonight (I can live with this), it was his snail-like movement in the pocket and hesitancy before the throws. His arm is weak enough without the pressure. We're going to be drilling holes in each others heads over his contract for years to come if he has to do what he did last year. Clearly I'm no fan of his.

About JC: Damn!!! I love this kid and am glad he's our QB. Considering all of the systems he's been in over the years, he looked like he was in his element. Can't way to see more of him in the preseason (If I can from Chi). I really think this is his year. He finally looked like the leader of the team out there without remorse; a savvy vet. :beer:

All told, this was as good of a first preseason game that I could've hoped for.

Hail!!!

colkurtz
08-04-2008, 01:00 AM
JC's fundamentals have improved under Zorn and he looks good so far for what we've seen.

A sixth round player is a project - if he even makes the team. Colt will be fun to watch and he'll only get better under Zorn's instruction.

I doubt Collins will be on the team next season as they bring in an 'mature' WCO QB.

Death_Venom
08-04-2008, 01:06 AM
First off I was just happy to watch some REDSKINS football on tv. Very pleasing.

Colt Brennan: Looked rather decent for a rookie. Great energy! Of course as many have mentioned he will have to built from the ground up........And just maybe he will be the successor to Campbell-maybe........

Todd Collins: Talk about looking out of place!!! I think CB may usurp TC's place as the numero #2 QB.

Jason Campbell: Looked good, calm, poised and ready for the season. I think all the time Zorn has spent with Campbell is beginning to show.

Fred Davis: Looked pretty good tonite. I am hoping he becomes another solid recieving TE for us.

Honorable Mention: Rhinehart looked pretty good tonite as well.

colkurtz
08-04-2008, 01:11 AM
Picture of Colt in WP makes it look like it's ALMOST an overhand pass. Maybe it's the camera angle. lol

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/04/AR2008080400046.html

SkinsKY
08-04-2008, 06:17 AM
Picture of Colt in WP makes it look like it's ALMOST an overhand pass. Maybe it's the camera angle. lol

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/04/AR2008080400046.html

nah, his hand still needs to be brought up 10 degrees or so. The forearm is usually pretty close to vertical.

Patrick
08-04-2008, 06:52 AM
Very impressed the Zorn's coaching presents last night. Heck of a start - even for pre-season.
JC looked very in-control for his few plays - I hope it's a sign of things to come this season.
TC - didn't have a problem with his play. For all the negitive he's been getting the past couple of weeks - his performance was somewhat of a nice surprise.
CB - Well all I can say - For ALL you Colt haters - looks like you'll have to wait at least another week before you can through all your "TOLD YOU SO" antics. Kid had a very good debut and you've got to admit brings a certain element of excitment to the game.
IF FACT - I was impress with many of our late rounders and FA pickups.
Bottomline though - it's preseason and a extra one to boot. NOT going to make more out of it than necessary.
Best thing about last night's game - 2 minor injuries .... .

lorimike
08-04-2008, 07:00 AM
While it's true Colt looked good vs third/fourth stringers, let's remember he was also playing with third/fourth stringers.<<<<

But he was 9 for 10 for 123 yards and 2 touchdowns. Kinda hard to ignore that despite playing against the scrubs. I don't know if he'll ever be a starter in this league but he's gonna at least be a backup for a long time. Based on his play I would give him a shot at 2nd string.

redskinz#1fan
08-04-2008, 08:28 AM
the announcers said zorn was going to re make him from the feet up.. but footwork would come before any arm changes

They also said right before that, that Zorn said he wasn't going to change his throwing motion.

akhhorus
08-04-2008, 08:37 AM
And when they are, Colt's play will be savaged. Until then, the goal of football is still to complete passes and score touchdowns.

Of course your point is correct. But orthodoxy doesn't mean a darn thing if Colt has a gunslinging "it" factor and gets the job done. Kenny Stabler was like that.

God, this is all so premature... If nothing else, Colt showed me tonight that he has fire. He brings an enthusiasm to the game that's fun to watch.

I wasn't commenting on his unusual delivery, I don't care about that. He(and no QB) can float it like that in the NFL down the middle and expect to be successful in the NFL.

Agreed 100%


Also Akh, I know all of the standard caveats about Colt's college career (gimmick offense, low competition, etc) but if you look at his TD/Int ratio it suggests he may be halfway decent at keeping the ball out of the defenders' hands. I know, NFL safeties are a different story, but still I think it counts for something. I think we can all agree that it would be nice to see him against some better players in the next few games and see what he can do.

His stats in college are really irrelevant imo. He played in a run and shoot system. I'd like to see him against better players, but I think we're making way too much of Brennan, when all the QBs didn't miss much last night.

BraveHeartFan
08-04-2008, 08:47 AM
A few things having watched the game that stuck out for me.

#1 - Jason Campbell certainly looked very impressive and was very sharp. Excellent showing for you guys starter there. I was quite impressed with what I saw.

#2 - Colt Brennan looked better than I expected he would, much better honestly, and I give him props for that much. I'll still reserve judgement for what I ultimately think he's going to do as a back up this year for when he's not playing against the 4th and 5th string people, most of whom won't even make a team, because that was essentially like playing against the WAC conference anyway, which he's used to.

But I do give him credit cause he looked a lot better than I had expected. I agree with the point someone else already made on him though that those throws over the middle, that had some so excited, are absolutely picks in the making when he's playing against the guys who are going to actually play in the NFL this year. Those are terribly dangerous thows. But if he continues to progress, from what I saw last night, then he's got a shot to know how to throw the better, smarter, passes over that middle.

#3 - The little running back you guys played, I believe his name was Mason, was pretty impressive to watch. I did enjoy seeing him.

Pretty nice showing for the Skins on this weekend and even as a Cowboy fan I sort of have to feel good for them in this respect cause of how important a weekend it was with Green and Monk going in. It was just a nice ending for the festivities of the Hall of Fame weekend.

Keino
08-04-2008, 08:48 AM
I was a big a Colt basher as anyone, but he was impressive to me last night. I do agree with Akh that when he plays more competent safeties he some of the balls he threw would be going the other way. I am not so bothered but the Slinging side-arm motion. Rivers has a very similar throwing motion. I was very impressed with the way he seemed poised in the pocket and his accuracy.....the one mitigating factor for a weaker arm is accuracy.

Having said that, I thought Campbell was also VERY impressive. The TD pass to Randel-el while wide open, showed some touch on the ball that Campbell hadn't shown me before. Collins looked lost and horrible.

I am very excited for the offense. I think Zorn stressing the Fast pace is paying immediate dividends and I salivate at the thought of a 2 TE set with Davis and Cooley. Stack the box if you want defenses, we will kill you in the seams.

hogskins
08-04-2008, 09:28 AM
Picture of Colt in WP makes it look like it's ALMOST an overhand pass. Maybe it's the camera angle. lol

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/04/AR2008080400046.html

He's squared to the receiver and throwing a short one there. The 3/4 motion is more pronounced when he's on the move and throwing to the sideline or deep.

When he throws the 3/4-arm thing, it sure looks ugly coming out, but his accuracy makes it more forgivable (to me, anyway). And the fact that he moves to make his own lane may make him less likely get one tipped than an over-the-top pocket statue--this guy is the Anti-Bledsoe.

hogskins
08-04-2008, 09:37 AM
most of us felt that zorn has already had an impact on JC's throwing motion.

he has already said that he will rebuild brennans from the ground up..
but what that tells me is that zorn sees enough of the intangibles that CB has to make a rebuilding project worthwhile

i think we will see a lot of CB this preseason-- and then virtually nothing of him until next preseason. but his development should be fun to watch..

JC's motion looked like a cobra striking, compared to previous years.

RE Brennan: If nothing else, he appears to have the wheels and field sense to overcome crappy blocking (and we saw plenty of that last night), and give receivers/backs/TEs the maximum number of opportunities to prove themselves in the pre-season. I agree that we'll see a lot of him until the games actually count.

Ibleedburgundy
08-04-2008, 09:50 AM
Obviously Brennan had a good game but I am not buying into him as an NFL caliber QB based on this. He beat some scrubs and showed a nice touch which is good but it was a Weurful like performance in a pre-preseason game. Let's see him compete against some second/first stringers and show some zip.

bosshog001
08-04-2008, 10:04 AM
Don't know how good he really is or could be, but I have no issue with him carrying the clipboard this year and practicing with the team as 3rd QB.

Skaggsrules
08-04-2008, 10:05 AM
I'm a big Brennan supporter, but I don't think he should have a legitimate shot to beat out Todd Collins as the #2, I really don't expect Brennan to have a legit shot until 2 years down the road, but I'll still employ my wait and see tactic, but I think his performance last night has more people wanting to wait and see.

Cutter
08-04-2008, 10:07 AM
I couldn't see if JC was throwing it to the best receiver, but from what you could see on TV he looked excellent. That TD pass was pretty much perfect. It should be with that much time, but still, he did it, so props to him. The way he delivered the ball was much improved over the past. He put the ball in much better spots than I'm used to see from him.

Collins looked good on paper. That's all I want to say.

Brennan looked excellent except for two passes. The slant that went behind the WR and that one across the middle. The slant should have been a reception. The one across the middle, did he see that guy and gamble? Or did he just get lucky? I'd prefer to think he saw the guy gambled, but who knows? He was exciting and I hope to see more from him. He had two passes that were as perfect as perfect gets. I had to rewatch them a few times because they were so pretty. His TD to Mason seemed like maybe he threw it late. Anyone else think he took too much time delivering that ball there?

shally
08-04-2008, 10:11 AM
Obviously Brennan had a good game but I am not buying into him as an NFL caliber QB based on this. He beat some scrubs and showed a nice touch which is good but it was a Weurful like performance in a pre-preseason game. Let's see him compete against some second/first stringers and show some zip.

we will get our chance with 4 remaining preseason games..

shally
08-04-2008, 10:13 AM
I couldn't see if JC was throwing it to the best receiver, but from what you could see on TV he looked excellent. That TD pass was pretty much perfect. It should be with that much time, but still, he did it, so props to him. The way he delivered the ball was much improved over the past. He put the ball in much better spots than I'm used to see from him.

Collins looked good on paper. That's all I want to say.

Brennan looked excellent except for two passes. The slant that went behind the WR and that one across the middle. The slant should have been a reception. The one across the middle, did he see that guy and gamble? Or did he just get lucky? I'd prefer to think he saw the guy gambled, but who knows? He was exciting and I hope to see more from him. He had two passes that were as perfect as perfect gets. I had to rewatch them a few times because they were so pretty. His TD to Mason seemed like maybe he threw it late. Anyone else think he took too much time delivering that ball there?

mason was totally open for about 3 or 4 seconds before brennan even saw him.. that should have been a lot easier td than it was.
still, credit him for executing the play

Farmer Ted
08-04-2008, 10:28 AM
Here's what Zorn said about Colt's pass selection on espn's blog (http://myespn.go.com/blogs/afcsouth/0-3-19/Zorn-pleased-with--smooth--debut.html):

"He had some really slick throws, a few of them were really dangerous throws. But he was looking and going to the right guy when we were dropping back. He even took a couple of checkdowns and scrambled and threw a touchdown pass."

Cutter
08-04-2008, 10:33 AM
mason was totally open for about 3 or 4 seconds before brennan even saw him.. that should have been a lot easier td than it was.
still, credit him for executing the play

Good - than it wasn't just me :)

HAWGZHEAD
08-04-2008, 10:33 AM
Colt looked very comfortable out there which is great and he made some very nice throws. He made a couple sketchy ones too lol but it was good to see him come out poised and ready to play.

I can't figure out if it was our plays, matchups, or if the Colts forgot how to play football there during JC's drive but that looked way too simple.

HAWGZHEAD
08-04-2008, 10:35 AM
mason was totally open for about 3 or 4 seconds before brennan even saw him.. that should have been a lot easier td than it was.
still, credit him for executing the play
I think he saw Mason. It looked to me like he may have even pump faked to him if I remember correctly. CB could have been hovering too close to make the throw earlier than he did.

shally
08-04-2008, 10:45 AM
I think he saw Mason. It looked to me like he may have even pump faked to him if I remember correctly. CB could have been hovering too close to make the throw earlier than he did.

the colts were missing defensive starters as well.. take away freeney and bob sanders and it makes a huge difference

swheeler
08-04-2008, 11:08 AM
I can't figure out if it was our plays, matchups, or if the Colts forgot how to play football there during JC's drive but that looked way too simple.

the colts were missing defensive starters as well.. take away freeney and bob sanders and it makes a huge difference

Shally I think you meant to quote that one, not the one about Mason.

Yeah I agree that it seemed way too easy, hopefully it wasn't just because they were missing starters.

RedHokieSkin
08-04-2008, 11:56 AM
His TD to Mason seemed like maybe he threw it late. Anyone else think he took too much time delivering that ball there?

I think it was hard to tell from the angle they showed it on TV. To me Mason looked wide open from the start of the play. However, the screen cut him off as Brennan dropped back and you couldn't see who was behind Mason in the endzone. Maybe the DB was there. If Brennan had thrown the pass at that point, all the way to the far sideline, maybe a DB intercepts and takes it to the house...

As he scrambled, it became easier for Brennan to hit Mason quickly, in front of the DB, which he ended up doing. Mason did get hit immediately too which implies to be the guy was there the whole time, we just couldn't see him because he was off the screen.

Tough to say. I'm just glad he eventually found him.

SkinsKY
08-04-2008, 12:41 PM
They also said right before that, that Zorn said he wasn't going to change his throwing motion.

Actually they said, he wouldn't, but rather would start at the feet and if they got to it, adjust it. It's not the biggest issue for Zorn, but if he's here 3-4 years, they could start tinkering with it.

colkurtz
08-04-2008, 12:44 PM
My question is two-fold:

1) What happens if Collins plays weakly the rest of the pre-season?

2) What happens if Colt continues to have good nights [with rookie issues]?

Could they really switch or would the Redskins bring in another older WCO QB for Collins?

Skaggsrules
08-04-2008, 12:48 PM
My question is two-fold:

1) What happens if Collins plays weakly the rest of the pre-season?

2) What happens if Colt continues to have good nights [with rookie issues]?

Could they really switch or would the Redskins bring in another older WCO QB for Collins?

Hopefully Campbell stays healthy so we can address this in the next off-season

Keino
08-04-2008, 01:00 PM
My question is two-fold:

1) What happens if Collins plays weakly the rest of the pre-season?

2) What happens if Colt continues to have good nights [with rookie issues]?

Could they really switch or would the Redskins bring in another older WCO QB for Collins?

One can only hope!

Seriously, I think this was True Oracle's point on the other thread (where everyone jumped down his throat). TC is a system guy and he is no longer in a system that suits him and it shows, just as it showed last year how comfortable both he and Saunders were with each other (The play calling changed drastically once Saunders had his boy). True argued that maybe instead of re-signing this guy a Trent Dilfer type who has played and had some success under this system and is familiar with our Head Coach would have been smart money for the Vet Back-up.

I am starting to think that maybe True Oracle was 100% spot on. Sure you want to reward TC for what he did last year, but maybe for everyone involved would have been better off had he followed Saunders to St. Louis.

Hopefully he looks better in the coming weeks......

colkurtz
08-04-2008, 01:35 PM
One can only hope!

Seriously, I think this was True Oracle's point on the other thread (where everyone jumped down his throat). TC is a system guy and he is no longer in a system that suits him and it shows, just as it showed last year how comfortable both he and Saunders were with each other (The play calling changed drastically once Saunders had his boy). True argued that maybe instead of re-signing this guy a Trent Dilfer type who has played and had some success under this system and is familiar with our Head Coach would have been smart money for the Vet Back-up.

I am starting to think that maybe True Oracle was 100% spot on. Sure you want to reward TC for what he did last year, but maybe for everyone involved would have been better off had he followed Saunders to St. Louis.

Hopefully he looks better in the coming weeks......

Spot on. JC is our future this season and hopefully for more to come.

Colt is a long-term project only if he continues to play well this pre-season. If he really starts to sting it up huge they'll move on next year.

I also wonder about Collins. We need a credible backup. If he's a one trick pony can we take that chance going into this season?

hail2skins
08-04-2008, 01:52 PM
I'm predicting we might see a swapping of QBs around once Jason gets his reps in.

I would definitely like to see a 2 games/2games scenario with Collins and Colt getting reps with the second teamers.

Maybe JC, then Colt, then Todd in the next game, followed by JC, Todd, Colt in the third game.Zorn spoke on this after the game and said Collins will be #2

WarEagle
08-04-2008, 01:58 PM
[QUOTE=HAWGZHEAD;1121547]Colt looked very comfortable out there which is great and he made some very nice throws. He made a couple sketchy ones too lol but it was good to see him come out poised and ready to play.

I can't figure out if it was our plays, matchups, or if the Colts forgot how to play football there during JC's drive but that looked way too simple. [QUOTE]

Colts D seemed unprepared when the surprise onside kick failed. JC and Zorn simply jammed it down their throats. Beautiful.

BraveHeartFan
08-04-2008, 02:23 PM
I know the Colts were missing a few defensive starters but you've still got to be better prepared than they seemed to be on that first Redskins possession.

None the less plenty of credit has to be given to JC for his quick, accurate, crisp throws on that drive. He looked very sharp.

skinsfan36
08-04-2008, 08:17 PM
colt was solid and looked very comfortable. hes a perfect fit for the wco he may of been playing vs bums but he threw some passes on target perfectly

silverspring
08-04-2008, 11:38 PM
Question- What do you think Zorn's level of influence was on the brennan pick?

I have been thinking about it and I find it curious that a qb coach so intense about technique would draft a guy that has that side arm funkified throwing motion. I wonder if it was more of a highest value for the pick.

colkurtz
08-05-2008, 10:45 AM
Question- What do you think Zorn's level of influence was on the brennan pick?

I have been thinking about it and I find it curious that a qb coach so intense about technique would draft a guy that has that side arm funkified throwing motion. I wonder if it was more of a highest value for the pick.

When you get drafted that low - you're usually a cheap project guy. Historically the success rates are very,very low [yeah, of course someone will bring up Tom Brady].
Just to be on the team after lets say 2-3 years is highly improbable. He young, cheap, fighting for a spot and will maximize out under Zorn.

Hopefully he will ascend to the #2 some day and learn more watching Jason Campbell. So far he's been fun to watch.

Moe
08-05-2008, 11:03 AM
Question- What do you think Zorn's level of influence was on the brennan pick?

I have been thinking about it and I find it curious that a qb coach so intense about technique would draft a guy that has that side arm funkified throwing motion. I wonder if it was more of a highest value for the pick.

There's a lot more to being a QB than just a throwing motion. Phillip Rivers has that same 3/4 sidearm sling and it didn't slow him down too much. I think the more important aspects to Zorn when judging Brennan were likely his mobility, his moxie and his brain. It's exceptionally early to project much on what the future holds for him but it's always better to show up and play well when given the chance than to stink up the joint. If nothing else, he seems cofident and that is something that most successful QB's need. As others have stated, here's hoping JC takes the reigns and runs with it for the forseeable future.

TrueOracle
08-05-2008, 11:38 AM
One can only hope!

Seriously, I think this was True Oracle's point on the other thread (where everyone jumped down his throat). TC is a system guy and he is no longer in a system that suits him and it shows, just as it showed last year how comfortable both he and Saunders were with each other (The play calling changed drastically once Saunders had his boy). True argued that maybe instead of re-signing this guy a Trent Dilfer type who has played and had some success under this system and is familiar with our Head Coach would have been smart money for the Vet Back-up.

I am starting to think that maybe True Oracle was 100% spot on. Sure you want to reward TC for what he did last year, but maybe for everyone involved would have been better off had he followed Saunders to St. Louis.

Hopefully he looks better in the coming weeks......

Sometimes it just reads better when someone else says it, Keino. Glad you saw my point.

For the record, I don't believe we can get rid of TC at this point (unless Trent Dilfer is lurking out there somewhere). We would be asinine to put Colt Brennan in a back-up position when he doesn't even know the pro game, let alone the offense. We're stuck with TC, and yes I do mean "stuck" with him.

Personally I think keeping him was a bad decision. We should've looked at his contract as sunk cost. Due to the regime change he was expendable and we should've punched out when we had the chance. Now we're one injury away from a very questionable season. I believe we should've went after a more cagey, WCO QB in the off-season once Zorn took over as HC; an insurance policy if nothing else. I think this was one of the only bad decisions made by the FO during the break.

Keino
08-05-2008, 11:54 AM
Sometimes it just reads better when someone else says it, Keino. Glad you saw my point.

For the record, I don't believe we can get rid of TC at this point (unless Trent Dilfer is lurking out there somewhere). We would be asinine to put Colt Brennan in a back-up position when he doesn't even know the pro game, let alone the offense. We're stuck with TC, and yes I do mean "stuck" with him.

Personally I think keeping him was a bad decision. We should've looked at his contract as sunk cost. Due to the regime change he was expendable and we should've punched out when we had the chance. Now we're one injury away from a very questionable season. I believe we should've went after a more cagey, WCO QB in the off-season once Zorn took over as HC; an insurance policy if nothing else. I think this was one of the only bad decisions made by the FO during the break.

What concerns me most is once the season gets here. When that happens, all he will get is mental reps, and as you know Muscle memory is a big reason for reps especially when it comes to something "new". Lets hope for a healthy 2008 campaign so that the TC question never comes into play.

smoak
08-05-2008, 11:56 AM
Sometimes it just reads better when someone else says it, Keino. Glad you saw my point.

For the record, I don't believe we can get rid of TC at this point (unless Trent Dilfer is lurking out there somewhere). We would be asinine to put Colt Brennan in a back-up position when he doesn't even know the pro game, let alone the offense. We're stuck with TC, and yes I do mean "stuck" with him.

Personally I think keeping him was a bad decision. We should've looked at his contract as sunk cost. Due to the regime change he was expendable and we should've punched out when we had the chance. Now we're one injury away from a very questionable season. I believe we should've went after a more cagey, WCO QB in the off-season once Zorn took over as HC; an insurance policy if nothing else. I think this was one of the only bad decisions made by the FO during the break.

Exactly how I felt from day one. I don't care about stats... Collins looked terrible against backups and "never will bes" b/c he is uncomfortable in the system. We should have allowed him to roll to STL.

TrueOracle
08-05-2008, 12:01 PM
What concerns me most is once the season gets here. When that happens, all he will get is mental reps, and as you know Muscle memory is a big reason for reps especially when it comes to something "new". Lets hope for a healthy 2008 campaign so that the TC question never comes into play.

It's the most we could hope for at this point. Give me a healthy line and QB for the year and I'll show you tix to the NFC Championship game at FedEx field. I'll take any other injuries all day (just be reasonable with the assertion).

TrueOracle
08-05-2008, 12:03 PM
Exactly how I felt from day one. I don't care about stats... Collins looked terrible against backups and "never will bes" b/c he is uncomfortable in the system. We should have allowed him to roll to STL.

And this is why he'll always be a solid #2 in Saunders' system. It's just too much to ask given his history and runway ahead of him. Just a bad decision -- though I wouldn't mind being proven wrong on this one.

WarEagle
08-05-2008, 01:15 PM
A Hawaii TV station gives props to Colt Brennan's performance on Sunday. He's obviously very popular there. (2 min)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKEG5EFBb2M

colkurtz
08-05-2008, 02:25 PM
We'll have to see how Collins progresses. He obviously is a smart guy but I think it was impossible to predict whether he would or would not get the new WCO. I mean the guy came in late in the season an was having impressive 100+ QB ratings games.

If he really doesn't get it over the next few games then I wonder if Zorn will look for a white knight THIS season. QB position is too important to "wait for next season".

Keino
08-05-2008, 02:31 PM
We'll have to see how Collins progresses. He obviously is a smart guy but I think it was impossible to predict whether he would or would not get the new WCO. I mean the guy came in late in the season an was having impressive 100+ QB ratings games.

I think mkost people realized that his comfort in the system and the confidence Saunders had in him were huge factors for his games. Not to mention the rest of the team flat out playing inspired ball.



If he really doesn't get it over the next few games then I wonder if Zorn will look for a white knight THIS season. QB position is too important to "wait for next season".

Problem is, who could that be at this juncture (or weeks from now)?

Moe
08-05-2008, 02:46 PM
...unless Trent Dilfer is lurking out there somewhere...

Dilfer retired last month. Apparently he injured his Achilles but he was quoted as saying that he was all set to hang 'em up anyway.

BrennanFan
08-06-2008, 09:08 AM
It was awesome to watch from my perspective...Colt tearin up the Colts. I hate the Colts even though I'm smack dab in the middle of Colts' Country. For all this talk about the "lobs" that Colt threw over the middle...what do you want him to do? Everybody knows his arm strength isn't the greatest. He's thrown that route thousands and thousands of times the past four years. He's putting the ball where it needs to, over the LB and in front of the safety. When you don't have the arm to thread the needle, you've got to find ways to get the ball where it needs to be. Also, he might change a little but there will always be the gunslinger mentality in Colt...in the way he throws, his decision making, everything. It's just the way he plays, you either love it or hate it. The slant looked bad though...the footwork didn't look there. I kinda looked like he was halfway between the half-roll and one step. Overall it was a good showing...he's here to stay in the NFL.

akhhorus
08-06-2008, 09:11 AM
It was awesome to watch from my perspective...Colt tearin up the Colts. I hate the Colts even though I'm smack dab in the middle of Colts' Country. For all this talk about the "lobs" that Colt threw over the middle...what do you want him to do? Everybody knows his arm strength isn't the greatest. He's thrown that route thousands and thousands of times the past four years. He's putting the ball where it needs to, over the LB and in front of the safety. When you don't have the arm to thread the needle, you've got to find ways to get the ball where it needs to be. Also, he might change a little but there will always be the gunslinger mentality in Colt...in the way he throws, his decision making, everything. It's just the way he plays, you either love it or hate it. The slant looked bad though...the footwork didn't look there. I kinda looked like he was halfway between the half-roll and one step. Overall it was a good showing...he's here to stay in the NFL.

You can't float a ball like that in the NFL and expect it to be successful. Thats asking for multiple INTs per game. Maybe in the WAC you can, but the NFL has competent defenders who look for opportunities for INTs like that.

Hr fan
08-06-2008, 09:37 AM
Couple of thoughts. First, Beathard regularly used the 6th for a project QB (Green and I believe Rypien), and bu qbs can turn into hidden gems (Schroeder, a 3rd, turned into Jim Lachey). Second, Madden, whatever you may think of him as an announcer, is an HOF coach. Madden complimented 2 of Brennan's throws as "NFL" in that he led the receiver properly and the ball was thrown where only his receiver could catch it. Last, Zorn according to Madden wanted to run the ball extensively in the 2nd half to finish the game as fast as possible, yet Brennan got a real workout. I don't believe that Colt was audibleizing at the LOS, so Zorn must have been looking for tape on the guy.

BrennanFan
08-06-2008, 09:48 AM
I get what you're saying...but as Colt gets reps in practices and games(eventually) he will get used to the speed and the looks that he will see. And those throws will be put exactly where they need to be and not a half second late which is "dangerous" in the NFL. It was good to see him out there just having fun and playing football again. You obviously didn't see that too much against Georgia. But when he's having fun, he starts to get into this zone and you can't get him to have a bad play, which by the way is really fun to watch.

akhhorus
08-06-2008, 10:00 AM
I get what you're saying...but as Colt gets reps in practices and games(eventually) he will get used to the speed and the looks that he will see. And those throws will be put exactly where they need to be and not a half second late which is "dangerous" in the NFL. It was good to see him out there just having fun and playing football again. You obviously didn't see that too much against Georgia. But when he's having fun, he starts to get into this zone and you can't get him to have a bad play, which by the way is really fun to watch.

On his "best throw" of the night, he threw a duck into triple coverage on a seam route. If the safety wasn't thinking about which CFL team he'll be trying for in a month, he had an easy INT. On his deep out, the 3rd string CB had 4-5 seconds to sit and wait on the ball, if Colt had put it in bounds, that's probably another pick. You just can't do that against competent defenders in the NFL, they'll eat you alive.

I understand you're a turbo fan of his, but lets deal with reality please.