Why is L. Landry getting a pass???

[The Iceman]

I have been baffled the last 4 weeks at how invisible Laron Landry has been. With all of the drama surrounding Reed Doughty, why is it that Landry's inability to make big plays thus far has been overlooked??? Landry has only 16 tackles on the season, and I'm not even sure how many of those are solo. Is he playing deep too much to be effective, or is he doing his job so well that the ball is not coming his way?

I'd love to see Landry get involved. Thoughts?

[BurgundyNGold]

That's because they're playing a lot of Cover 1 with Landry 25 yards deep. He's been quiet because he's not near the LOS. Personally, I think that he's better suited to be a SS but, given his 4.3 speed, they've got him over the top of receivers.

So, in short, unless a QB makes a really bad throw, you won't hear much from Landry until we get another S out there with some range. But, as evidenced by the lack of big plays given up, that's actually a good thing. Perhaps, just not the best thing. ;)

[guess88]

As Blache says, he's our "angel" in the back. He's playing deep most of the time, and supposedly qb's aren't trying to test him. In a way it's a good thing he only has 16 tackles... it means people aren't getting into the secondary. Remember when ST lead the team in tackles, we had one of the worst defenses in recent year.

[JasonCampbell]

Not to mention the guy missed all of the preseason. I'm hoping his playmaking ability picks up some shortly.

[The Iceman]

The point is, you don't take a guy with the 6th overall pick to hang out and not make big plays. I just wanna see some Ed Reed type of plays out of him.

[guess88]

Personally, I think that he's better suited to be a SS but, given his 4.3 speed, they've got him over the top of receivers.

See I just don't get that argument. I think he's great as a SS, but fantastic as a FS as well. If you can read a play, are fast, and have hands... what better position than FS? If you can hit even better. Imagine if ST were SS... he'd be unstoppable, but he's even more special as a FS.

[jtovb2005]

I did notice not many if at all mention of him yesterday. As long as the defense keeps the big plays out then I am not sure it is an issue. As other posters say, maybe he is just doing what he is supposed to be doing.

That said I can think of a few times we need him to make plays. Not thinking of a specific play but more like a series we need to get the opposing O off the field. Ahhh what the heck how about creaming some receivers. lol.

[akhhorus]

What you're seeing from Landry is teams used to throwing it deep decided it not to because Landry is effectively closing down the deep middle for the simple reason that they don't want to risk it. If you're expecting Ed Reed, then the Skins should have dealt that pick for Reed. Landry's role is different.

[guess88]

The point is, you don't take a guy with the 6th overall pick to hang out and not make big plays. I just wanna see some Ed Reed type of plays out of him.

Are you gonna whine about drafting Rogers if they stop calling his name cause they don't throw his way anymore? Generally the less you hear the better, and with the 6th pick, we have a guy teams don't want to challenge deep, and instead take the shorter pass. That pays off in several dividends. Also, we drafted him at a time when we thought we could've had the best and scariest safety tandem in the league.

He's not slacking at all, and he's almost had about 2 picks slip through his hands so far. I got no worries about them sticking soon... just need to replace Doughty with Horton.

[InsomniaKiller]

We've played 4 of the top 5 offenses and they've all had their worst game against us.

Landry has an awful lot to do w/ that.

An awful, awful lot.

[ihatedallas]

He's playing deep. If he had 30 tackles that means the corners need help or somebody has figured out how to abuse the middle.

The longest passing play forDallas was 26 yards.

They had plays of 63, and 71 the last two weeks.

Stats, particularly on Defense, don't mean near as much as an individual on the defensive side of the ball.

Unlike offense, defensive team totals mean leaps and bounds more than the fact that one player has 3/4 picks. Landry, right now, is contributing a HUGE chunk to our team D. He allows for springs and Rogers to step up and press with him being the safety belt.

[Biggie]

Landry's been having a great year. You don't hear his name because people don't want to test him, as has been said.

[hail2skins]

I think this question has been answered by everyone. Not hearing his name doesn't mean he's not doing his job. I believe teams learned last year not to test him.

[shally]

What you're seeing from Landry is teams used to throwing it deep decided it not to because Landry is effectively closing down the deep middle for the simple reason that they don't want to risk it. If you're expecting Ed Reed, then the Skins should have dealt that pick for Reed. Landry's role is different.

totally agree.. no complaints with his play

[Fathead]

Teams are terrified of throwing the ball where Landry is. They are afraid he'll:

A. Make the INT

B. Kill their reciever after he gets the ball

C. Both



If teams don't ever put the ball near him, he won't have anything to do. Which is fine by me.

[akhhorus]

Teams are terrified of throwing the ball where Landry is. They are afraid he'll:

A. Make the INT

B. Kill their reciever after he gets the ball

C. Both

If teams don't ever put the ball near him, he won't have anything to do. Which is fine by me.

Yeah, I would use as one of my definitions of a great player is one that makes opposing teams adjust their entire game plan around. Landry might not make that many big plays, but opposing offenses are clearly scared of him.

[Fathead]

Exactly. Landry is doing everything that is asked of him. But if teams never throw the ball near you then you aren't going to be on the highlight reel.

[BurgundyNGold]

See I just don't get that argument. I think he's great as a SS, but fantastic as a FS as well. If you can read a play, are fast, and have hands... what better position than FS? If you can hit even better. Imagine if ST were SS... he'd be unstoppable, but he's even more special as a FS.
ST was special as a FS. He had range, a nose for the ball and a mean streak. He was an enforcer that dared you to come into the middle of the field.

LL was drafted as a SS and is more suited to playing that position, IMO. His instincts are best utilized at or aroung the LOS where he can blitz and disrupt plays. Most of his college highlights are of him at the LOS or in short coverage.

LL is playing FS because we lost one of the most special players in the game at FS. If they intend to keep him there, they should try to use him like Philly uses Brian Dawkins. LL can make those plays at the LOS just as well as Dawkins.

[whitskins]

All four teams we've played are among the best deep passing teams in the league and we've given up one major play through the air to all four of them.

Landry is playing way too far back to make many tackles or sudden INTs, but he has broken up several long balls this year and generally shut down our opponents' deep passing game. He doesn't need a "pass" from anything, he's doing his job and doing it very, very well.

Once we play some scrubbier teams with less explosive offenses then we'll probably sink him back down a little bit and let him blitz more too.

[The Iceman]

Everyone is willing to make all the excuses in the world for the lack of production, as far as the stat line that is, but everyone is willing to crucify Reed Doughty. FYI, as far as Doughty being a liability in coverage, the Jason Whitten TD catch should have never happened... Why did it? Not Marcus Washington's fault, Chris Horton blew the coverage. He was supposed to be helping with Whitten over the top. Go back and look at the play and it is painfully obvious. Horton got pulled from the base package for a like 2 quarters after that as well. So, let's be fair here when we assess our safety play instead of just going mainstream and unjustly trying to string guys up. Point is... We need to get more big plays out of Landry, and Horton is too raw to be in the starting lineup week in, week out.

[akhhorus]

Everyone is willing to make all the excuses in the world for the lack of production, as far as the stat line that is, but everyone is willing to crucify Reed Doughty. FYI, as far as Doughty being a liability in coverage, the Jason Whitten TD catch should have never happened... Why did it? Not Marcus Washington's fault, Chris Horton blew the coverage. He was supposed to be helping with Whitten over the top. Go back and look at the play and it is painfully obvious. Horton got pulled from the base package for a like 2 quarters after that as well. So, let's be fair here when we assess our safety play instead of just going mainstream and unjustly trying to string guys up. Point is... We need to get more big plays out of Landry, and Horton is too raw to be in the starting lineup week in, week out.

The difference being that Laron Landry is doing his job, Chris Horton is creating plays, Reed Doughty is taking up space. Its odd that you want to use number of turnovers/big plays as your criteria, but are ripping Horton for blowing a coverage. Landry does his job in coverage, and is great at it. If you want Ed Reed, then root for Ed Reed. Landry is a different kind of player.

[whitskins]

Everyone is willing to make all the excuses in the world for the lack of production, as far as the stat line that is, but everyone is willing to crucify Reed Doughty. FYI, as far as Doughty being a liability in coverage, the Jason Whitten TD catch should have never happened... Why did it? Not Marcus Washington's fault, Chris Horton blew the coverage. He was supposed to be helping with Whitten over the top. Go back and look at the play and it is painfully obvious. Horton got pulled from the base package for a like 2 quarters after that as well. So, let's be fair here when we assess our safety play instead of just going mainstream and unjustly trying to string guys up. Point is... We need to get more big plays out of Landry, and Horton is too raw to be in the starting lineup week in, week out.

Maybe you should pay attention to the actual games instead of the statline then. You might see that Landry is taking away a huge component of every offense we have played so far. And those offenses just happen to make up four of the top five units in the league.

NYG, NO, ARI, and Dallas collectively average 402 yards per game. We've held them to an average of 315. Why do you think that is? It's because we've taken the big play away from all of them. Which is Landry's primary job.

That's not making excuses, that's recognizing what is actually happening on the field.

[akhhorus]

Maybe you should pay attention to the actual games instead of the statline then. You might see that Landry is taking away a huge component of every offense we have played so far. And those offenses just happen to make up four of the top five units in the league.

NYG, NO, ARI, and Dallas collectively average 402 yards per game. We've held them to an average of 315. Why do you think that is? It's because we've taken the big play away from all of them. Which is Landry's primary job.

That's not making excuses, that's recognizing what is actually happening on the field.

Seconded. And only 1-3 deep passes that I can recall from against Landry so far(Fitz deep TD, Plax's deep catch and maybe one more) against 4 teams that specialize in exactly that.

[The Iceman]

The difference being that Laron Landry is doing his job, Chris Horton is creating plays, Reed Doughty is taking up space. Its odd that you want to use number of turnovers/big plays as your criteria, but are ripping Horton for blowing a coverage. Landry does his job in coverage, and is great at it. If you want Ed Reed, then root for Ed Reed. Landry is a different kind of player.

First of all, I didn't rip Horton. Secondly I just hate it that everyone is so high on Horton to replace Doughty when clearly he is not ready to be an every down safety. The big plays and the turnovers were nice. It was nice that he actually made the turnover last night all by himself. The turnovers in the Saints game were clearly right place at the right time deals. Which is still a tribute to him for making the plays that he lucked into. He has blown coverage on many occasions and hasn't been burned until Whitten beat him last night (which everyone wanted to burn MW alive about, clearly it wasn't his fault). BTW ahk, Landry and Reed are very similar players. The ravens just use Reed differently. Oh, and why so hard on Doughty? Because he has blown coverage? Just like Horton who you want to replace him? Hmmmm.

[Farmer Ted]

Landry absolutely saved us in the 4th quarter of the New Orleans game. He knocked down one deep pass that would've been a td, and as I recall, knocked down a 3d down pass two plays that enabled us to get the ball and take the lead. If those weren't big plays, then I don't know what are.

[akhhorus]

First of all, I didn't rip Horton.

Fine. Replace "rip" with "criticize." Either way, you're being inconsistent.

Secondly I just hate it that everyone is so high on Horton to replace Doughty when clearly he is not ready to be an every down safety.

He's better at coverage than Doughty(which isn't difficult) and makes plays.

The big plays and the turnovers were nice. It was nice that he actually made the turnover last night all by himself.

Do you want to go over how many INTs Smoot, Rogers and Springs have dropped in the last 3 years? Your conditional clause is absurd.

The turnovers in the Saints game were clearly right place at the right time deals. Which is still a tribute to him for making the plays that he lucked into.

See above.

He has blown coverage on many occasions and hasn't been burned until Whitten beat him last night (which everyone wanted to burn MW alive about, clearly it wasn't his fault).

Even if Horton blew the coverage, its still somewhat MW's fault.

BTW ahk, Landry and Reed are very similar players.

Umm..no. They were totally different players in college and likewise in the pros. Different scheme, different responsibilities.

The ravens just use Reed differently.

Wrong.

Oh, and why so hard on Doughty? Because he has blown coverage? Just like Horton who you want to replace him? Hmmmm.

Reed Doughty has blown coverages for his entire time in DC. Horton hasn't. If he blew the coverage on Witten, he needs to tighten up, but this is his 3rd game with the Skins. Reed hasn't shown anything or any improvement in 2.25 seasons with the skins. And Horton creates turnovers-which your complaining about is the point of this thread you started.

[guess88]

Everyone is willing to make all the excuses in the world for the lack of production, as far as the stat line that is, but everyone is willing to crucify Reed Doughty. FYI, as far as Doughty being a liability in coverage, the Jason Whitten TD catch should have never happened... Why did it? Not Marcus Washington's fault, Chris Horton blew the coverage. He was supposed to be helping with Whitten over the top. Go back and look at the play and it is painfully obvious. Horton got pulled from the base package for a like 2 quarters after that as well. So, let's be fair here when we assess our safety play instead of just going mainstream and unjustly trying to string guys up. Point is... We need to get more big plays out of Landry, and Horton is too raw to be in the starting lineup week in, week out.

Are you Doughty's nephew? Horton might've blown that assignment, but Doughty has countless times more. Maybe Doughty does recognized plays better (not sure about that), but he physically isn't blessed with the tools to make the play. Horton is, and has.

But really, this is all about Landry right? Would you rather they sacrifice the risk of a deep pass, so he can get a few more tackles? Asinine

[guess88]

LL is playing FS because we lost one of the most special players in the game at FS. If they intend to keep him there, they should try to use him like Philly uses Brian Dawkins. LL can make those plays at the LOS just as well as Dawkins.

Agreed that he can make those plays, but as of now, if they put him up at the LOS, we'd have to rely on Doughty deep.. not a favorable situation. Until Horton proves himself to be more reliable, Moore comes along, or if Springs plays FS for a few special packages, I doubt we see much of LL up close. Until then that is...

[skinfan43]

This thread is some seriously retarded crap IMO. Can you say Doughty mancrush? Just absurd.

Without Landry policing the secondary we're 0-4...look at the Qb's we've faced

[Red Bear]

lets also not forget what was talked about after the cowboys game, forget where i read it exactly. is that we have landry disguising the defense so much with his movement in the backfield that its confusing for offenses to know what we are going to do on many plays

[lorimike]

I have been baffled the last 4 weeks at how invisible Laron Landry has been. With all of the drama surrounding Reed Doughty, why is it that Landry's inability to make big plays thus far has been overlooked??? Landry has only 16 tackles on the season, and I'm not even sure how many of those are solo. Is he playing deep too much to be effective, or is he doing his job so well that the ball is not coming his way?

I'd love to see Landry get involved. Thoughts?<<<

He made some plays against Arizona. Against Dallas he was in the over top coverage against TO that prevented the long passes to Owens.

[smoak]

My opinion is that we can expect a little better from Landry as he gets his legs, but I care ostly about team defense and not individual stats.

[lorimike]

First of all, I didn't rip Horton. Secondly I just hate it that everyone is so high on Horton to replace Doughty when clearly he is not ready to be an every down safety. The big plays and the turnovers were nice. It was nice that he actually made the turnover last night all by himself. The turnovers in the Saints game were clearly right place at the right time deals. Which is still a tribute to him for making the plays that he lucked into. He has blown coverage on many occasions and hasn't been burned until Whitten beat him last night (which everyone wanted to burn MW alive about, clearly it wasn't his fault). BTW ahk, Landry and Reed are very similar players. The ravens just use Reed differently. Oh, and why so hard on Doughty? Because he has blown coverage? Just like Horton who you want to replace him? Hmmmm.
<<<
Doughty does nothing remarkable. He looks slow and seems to lack instincts required to be an every down safety. I think he'll slowly be fazed out of the lineup. Horton is going to be the starter eventually and Kareem Moore might get more time on the field. While I will agree that he was in the right place against the saints it is worth noting the number of times we've seen tipped balls the last several years fall harmlessly to the ground. Horton has been making plays since the 1st preseason game. After a while it can no longer be regarded as a fluke

[Skinreds]

Honestly Doughty is a pawn in this defense...he does SOME things well but thats it....Horton can still atleast learn and has more potential I mean you cant teach an old dog new tricks.


Back to the original Question. Like every has already said its a good thing we arent hearing anything from Landry because no team wants to test him yet. Just like Namdi on the Raiders and Champ with the Broncos, noone bothers throwing in there direction cause they know something bad is going to happen.

The opposite applies to Horton since he is constantly tested by other teams, he makes plays because he is targeted more.(look at the play where he played the zone and sprinted full speed to pick off romo)

[Nomad]

What games have you been watching?

In Dallas he was BRILLIANT at keeping Romo confused, disguising what he was doing.

Teams are learning he is good and not challenging him as much.

He's had some big stops on deep passes.

You DON'T want to see your FS in on tons of plays.

That is NOT a good sign.

That's like asking why Campbell isn't getting more long runs.

[cal_junior]

Are we really criticizing LaRon Landry, who last time I checked has played like 20 games in his NFL career, for not being more like Ed Reed, who has basically been an All-Pro from the moment he stepped onto an NFL field and might end up being one of the best safeties every to play the sport?

Really?

[Skinz4lyfe]

If you wanna criticize someone, criticize Blache for assigning Landry a different job than you would like for him to do. As I see it Landry is doing exactly what the coaching staff is asking of him. He's done very well in not allowing deep passes and shrinking the field. However, Doughty's criticism seems warranted because he is the most tenured Safety we have. More should be expected of him and he hasn't proven to be as reliable as he should. Horton is expected to make mistakes being a rookie but he has also shown an ability to always be around the ball and has caused turnovers. Doughty hasn't shown that. Therefore, that is why most have wanted to see Horton more. Call it what you want, being in the right place at the right time. If Doughty was in the right place at the right time he might have had turnovers too but I don't know if he's had any turnovers in his career. Right now they'll split time there and let the best man win.

[jaylen]

Landry is playing fine the few times he was tested he batted balls down and almost came up with a pick against the Giants.

Check how our current opponents explode when playing other people, the saints threw over the heads of the Niners heads all day on Sunday, Warner threw over the head of the Jets for big yards. Landry has basically discouraged all of those things.

I suspect when we get in the stretch of suspect qb's he'll begin to make a host of big plays, because of their lack of awareness.

I think its possible when and if Moore develops LL could switch positions and raise hell close to the line in the box. But thats down the road possibly.

[greatest2]

The safety position that landry is playing (seans old spot) is alot like the long snapper for a fg or punt. If you don't hear about them, then they are doing there Job.

The greatest Corners never really get alot of picks cause QB's dont throw there way cause they have there man so well covered.


Landry is doing his job so well that QB's can't even go there. we haven't really seen abig play in the air when landry is back there (the one in arizona was reed). other then that he is confusing QB's, like in dallas when he runs around near the LOS and drops back or fakes a blitz or comes. He does ahave i think .5 a sack. they are being judicious in when they bring landry cause do you really want Doughty back there covering or even Horton. No, you rather have landry deep and those guys at the LOS.


in my opinion, you say landry is getting a pass for not creating big plays, i say he is probably the most consistent and best playing player on our defense (after maybe Fletch who always plays out of his mind. where would we be with out him?)

[greatest2]

Landry is playing fine the few times he was tested he batted balls down and almost came up with a pick against the Giants.

Check how our current opponents explode when playing other people, the saints threw over the heads of the Niners heads all day on Sunday, Warner threw over the head of the Jets for big yards. Landry has basically discouraged all of those things.

I suspect when we get in the stretch of suspect qb's he'll begin to make a host of big plays, because of their lack of awareness.

I think its possible when and if Moore develops LL could switch positions and raise hell close to the line in the box. But thats down the road possibly.

i don't think Moore has the potential to be a sideline to sideline player (you need elite talent plus awarness and toughness. a position few safeties can even do. a ed reed/sean taylor kind of talent.) i think moore lacks the speed of landry (who ran a 4.3, and sean ran a very low 4.4). he does have toughness, and can certainly intimedate back there, but i worry about his angles.

i see moore as a strong safety. he has the size, and explosiveness in his hitting (alot like rocky, who doesnt look like he will hit you hard, and then just explodes into you). I think we are fortunate to have found this guy. if special teams tackles are any proof of his normal tackling, we have a very solid SS in the box kid in the making.

[jaylen]

i don't think Moore has the potential to be a sideline to sideline player (you need elite talent plus awarness and toughness. a position few safeties can even do. a ed reed/sean taylor kind of talent.) i think moore lacks the speed of landry (who ran a 4.3, and sean ran a very low 4.4). he does have toughness, and can certainly intimedate back there, but i worry about his angles.

i see moore as a strong safety. he has the size, and explosiveness in his hitting (alot like rocky, who doesnt look like he will hit you hard, and then just explodes into you). I think we are fortunate to have found this guy. if special teams tackles are any proof of his normal tackling, we have a very solid SS in the box kid in the making.

In the preseason he displayed very good range getting a pick against the jags and the Panthers. I think he could potentially become that sorta player.

LL does it better because of the elite speed but I think Moore is very instinctive he just got nicked which pushed him back down the chart.

I think he could be a solid Free safety.

[greatest2]

In the preseason he displayed very good range getting a pick against the jags and the Panthers. I think he could potentially become that sorta player.

LL does it better because of the elite speed but I think Moore is very instinctive he just got nicked which pushed him back down the chart.

I think he could be a solid Free safety.

i respect you opinion, but i do not share it. he played against some inferior talent in those games, and the NFL premier offenses are in our division. that has to dictate our line-up somewhat (see the texans going after dline in the draft to get after MAnning)

landry can simply stop any big plays. if you can do that, you have alot of oppurtunities on defense to get stops and alot more potential for turnovers.

[InsomniaKiller]

When Horton plays, we get turnovers.

When Doughty plays, he is targeted. And it is embarassing.

How is this even up for discussion at this point?

Horton, the 200-something pick in this draft has created more turnovers in his two stars than Doughty has in his career.

Landry is the reason that we have held the #2, 3, 4, AND 5 offenses in check this year. The fact that we're only 4 weeks into this season, and they all had their worst games against our defense, and they're STILL all in the top 5 is insane.

Landry has no stats and is still a huge part of our defense. He is playing his rule beautifully.

Horton and Doughty, meanwhile, are sharing the same rule. In 2 starts, Horton has 4 turnovers to his credit. In Reed's entire career, he has ZERO. Correct me if I am wrong.

This is not worth this much discussion.

This thread is getting absurd.

[SpicyMcHaggis]

When Horton plays, we get turnovers.

When Doughty plays, he is targeted. And it is embarassing.

How is this even up for discussion at this point?

Horton, the 200-something pick in this draft has created more turnovers in his two stars than Doughty has in his career.

Landry is the reason that we have held the #2, 3, 4, AND 5 offenses in check this year. The fact that we're only 4 weeks into this season, and they all had their worst games against our defense, and they're STILL all in the top 5 is insane.

Landry has no stats and is still a huge part of our defense. He is playing his rule beautifully.

Horton and Doughty, meanwhile, are sharing the same rule. In 2 starts, Horton has 4 turnovers to his credit. In Reed's entire career, he has ZERO. Correct me if I am wrong.

This is not worth this much discussion.

This thread is getting absurd.

For real. I don't really understand what the heck the problem is.

Or actually, maybe I do, and it's rather sad.

[joethefan]

Rather have him in this role of being the angel, than being the only one making the majority of the tackles....the less you hear of your safeties the more you know everyone else is doing thier jobs.....

[Patrick]

First of all, I didn't rip Horton. Secondly I just hate it that everyone is so high on Horton to replace Doughty when clearly he is not ready to be an every down safety. The big plays and the turnovers were nice. It was nice that he actually made the turnover last night all by himself. The turnovers in the Saints game were clearly right place at the right time deals. Which is still a tribute to him for making the plays that he lucked into. He has blown coverage on many occasions and hasn't been burned until Whitten beat him last night (which everyone wanted to burn MW alive about, clearly it wasn't his fault). BTW ahk, Landry and Reed are very similar players. The ravens just use Reed differently. Oh, and why so hard on Doughty? Because he has blown coverage? Just like Horton who you want to replace him? Hmmmm.

At what point is he going to be ready ............ ummmm when he starts ....... WHICH he did for the Dallas game. Honestly - you've picked a very weak argument with little to back you. I'd suggest you bail on this subject.

[SkinsKY]

The point is, you don't take a guy with the 6th overall pick to hang out and not make big plays. I just wanna see some Ed Reed type of plays out of him.

You've (mistakenly) made the assumption that you have to have impact plays to have an impact and that is just false. Until we have another safety who is reliable in coverage, the closer Laron gets to the LOS, the more likely teams are to throw deep. Our offense is not in a position to get into a shootout and the defense is doing it's job in that regard.

I'd love to see Ed Reed/Troy P. type plays, but there's too much risk involved right now.

[rhummer37]

Teams are terrified of throwing the ball where Landry is. They are afraid he'll:

A. Make the INT

B. Kill their reciever after he gets the ball

C. Both



If teams don't ever put the ball near him, he won't have anything to do. Which is fine by me.

Teams were doing the same thing with s. Taylor last year: keeping the ball away from him as possible and the Skins lining him up 20 some yards back

[Sweepea436]

Kinda seems to me that the less you hear a guys name in the secondary - the better off you are. For instance - not some much mention of LL or Rodgers this season so far - quite a bit of Reed Doughty........... just an observation.....

[BurgundyNGold]

Agreed that he can make those plays, but as of now, if they put him up at the LOS, we'd have to rely on Doughty deep.. not a favorable situation. Until Horton proves himself to be more reliable, Moore comes along, or if Springs plays FS for a few special packages, I doubt we see much of LL up close. Until then that is...
Therein lies the rub. That's why LL is playing so deep and why he doesn't have the stat line that one might expect from a #6 pick overall. He's being a team player and is doing a very good job of, really, playing out of position.

[shally]

Kinda seems to me that the less you hear a guys name in the secondary - the better off you are. For instance - not some much mention of LL or Rodgers this season so far - quite a bit of Reed Doughty........... just an observation.....

exactly.. at his best, deion might have 1 or 2 plays total in a game simply because teams avoided even throwing near his area.. it was a testament to how highly he was respected.. teams dont usually throw at your best defender if they have any choice in the matter... it is a matter of matchups and that tells me teams dont want to matchup against landry, rather than blache trying to hide him in any way..

[BigHairedAristocrat]

I can't beleive Landry is being criticized. We're 3-1 for goodness sake. We have been playing a lot of cover1 which means Landry is playing deep. We've played the top passing offenses in the NFL the past 4 weeks and have pretty much shut all the teams receivers down aside from Plexico in week 1. We havent really given up many big plays which means Landry is doing his job.

[BurgundyNGold]

Everyone is willing to make all the excuses in the world for the lack of production, as far as the stat line that is, but everyone is willing to crucify Reed Doughty. FYI, as far as Doughty being a liability in coverage, the Jason Whitten TD catch should have never happened... Why did it? Not Marcus Washington's fault, Chris Horton blew the coverage. He was supposed to be helping with Whitten over the top. Go back and look at the play and it is painfully obvious. Horton got pulled from the base package for a like 2 quarters after that as well. So, let's be fair here when we assess our safety play instead of just going mainstream and unjustly trying to string guys up. Point is... We need to get more big plays out of Landry, and Horton is too raw to be in the starting lineup week in, week out.
If you look at that play, three things should be painfully obvious:

1) Horton was initially lined up at the back edge of the box to give MW help over the top of Whitten, should he need it.
2) Dallass had both Felix Jones and Marcus Washington in the backfield, which effectively overloaded the package that the Redskins were in.
3) Seeing this, Fletcher partially followed Jones in motion and was calling out and motioning to Horton to cover Jones in the flat.

Horton was a little late to respond to Fletcher's call so both ended up covering Jones in the flat. Meanwhile, Barber was uncovered in the right flat. MW still had coverage on Whitten but he did a poor job of sticking with him or defensing the pass.

Horton's mistake was not that he didn't get back to cover the deep zone (they weren't in C2), it was that he did not cover Jones in the left flat, allowing Fletcher to cover Barber in the right flat (which was his primary responsibility as MLB).

This was a well designed play by Dallass. True, Horton was late to see his responsibility, but Fletcher ditched his responsibility to cover Jones and MW had poor coverage on Whitten.

[Moe]

Landry absolutely saved us in the 4th quarter of the New Orleans game. He knocked down one deep pass that would've been a td, and as I recall, knocked down a 3d down pass two plays that enabled us to get the ball and take the lead. If those weren't big plays, then I don't know what are.

Yep. In one series against the Saints he broke up a potential td (to Patten I believe) and then two plays later he broke up another deep pass that would've put NO in scoring position. Against Arizona he broke up a td pass to Fitz that had the commentators almost apopleptic that the all-world Fitz couldn't make the catch.
His two poor plays thus far this season are missing the INT on a high pass to Plaxico against the Giants and not tatooing TO last week on his td.

As for him not being an impact player in relation to his draft position, I guess those two picks in the playoff game at Seattle last year weren't good enough either.

[skinsfan36]

hes doing a great job if you ask me the only beeef i have is a missed Int in the gints game. people are not testing him. someone will when our offense is blowing someone out they will have to go deep

[walton40]

hes doing a great job if you ask me the only beeef i have is a missed Int in the gints game. people are not testing him. someone will when our offense is blowing someone out they will have to go deep

Good point there. When we do eventually get a big lead in a game, the opposition are going to be forced to take shots.........& hopefully test Landry!

The guy is doing a great job. So comforting knowing he's back there & has things covered.

[flave1969]

This thread actually has little to do with Landry, it was really a cover for a defense of Doughty.

As stated Landry has been instrumental in changing the way strong passing teams play us, and first and foremost that is what we need.

[hail2skins]

This thread actually has little to do with Landry, it was really a cover for a defense of Doughty.

As stated Landry has been instrumental in changing the way strong passing teams play us, and first and foremost that is what we need.
Which was going to be my next response to the thread starter. I wanted to see what he had to say first though.

[Meatsnack]

This whole thread reminds me of Kelly asking Greg Blache about the "prevent defense" he played at the end of the halves. Blache got a little heated in his response which was, paraphrased, "You can call it whatever you want but the fact of the matter is we took away what they wanted to do and limited their offense."

I think what Landry does is take away what teams want to do in the deep passing game. Very few teams in the league, other than ours apparently, can dink and dunk down the field for 80 yards. They rely at some point on explosive plays. Landry makes teams hesitate and in hesitation is disaster.

[OCSkinzFan]

ST was special as a FS. He had range, a nose for the ball and a mean streak. He was an enforcer that dared you to come into the middle of the field.

LL was drafted as a SS and is more suited to playing that position, IMO. His instincts are best utilized at or aroung the LOS where he can blitz and disrupt plays. Most of his college highlights are of him at the LOS or in short coverage.

LL is playing FS because we lost one of the most special players in the game at FS. If they intend to keep him there, they should try to use him like Philly uses Brian Dawkins. LL can make those plays at the LOS just as well as Dawkins.
I seem to remember the FO saying that we didn't have F and S safeties when he was drafted. But that's sort of academic, because ST was almost always the deep guy.

I also remember that LL played at the LOS quite a bit against NY. He got seriously trucked too. I think it's possible that he got a little exposed as an "in the box safety" in that game (partly a size thing). I'm thinking that he's just more valuable to us in deep cover- quick reads, great closing speed, doesn't try to guess or take risks.

[OCSkinzFan]

lets also not forget what was talked about after the cowboys game, forget where i read it exactly. is that we have landry disguising the defense so much with his movement in the backfield that its confusing for offenses to know what we are going to do on many plays

LL isn't really "disguising" his coverage. When he's 25 yds deep, the QB is pretty certain that he's not playing man. It's sort of like he's back there saying "Go ahead and throw deep; I'm gonna track the ball and have a better shot at it than your WR."

It's the other DB's and LB's that are doing a good job of disguising and rerouting the WR's.

[BurgundyNGold]

I seem to remember the FO saying that we didn't have F and S safeties when he was drafted. But that's sort of academic, because ST was almost always the deep guy.
Under Williams C2 fetish, that was true, but I haven't seen a whole lot of that this year. I think we're more into the traditional FS, SS sets now.

I also remember that LL played at the LOS quite a bit against NY. He got seriously trucked too. I think it's possible that he got a little exposed as an "in the box safety" in that game (partly a size thing). I'm thinking that he's just more valuable to us in deep cover- quick reads, great closing speed, doesn't try to guess or take risks.
Yeah, he got straight up owned by Jacobs. Still, I think that Landry generally gives better than he gets. In fact, it happens to the best of them... except ST. I recall Brian Dawkins getting similarly trucked by Mike Sellers a few years ago. That was classic, lol.

The FS/SS point is probably moot for now since we don't have anyone who has LL's range in the secondary.

[OCSkinzFan]

Under Williams C2 fetish, that was true, but I haven't seen a whole lot of that this year. I think we're more into the traditional FS, SS sets now.Yep, we ran a lot of cover one too. They were running a lot of complicated combination coverages with man unerneath and a zone deep. And sometimes thirds (cover 3).


Yeah, he got straight up owned by Jacobs. Still, I think that Landry generally gives better than he gets. In fact, it happens to the best of them... except ST. I recall Brian Dawkins getting similarly trucked by Mike Sellers a few years ago. That was classic, lol.Somebody has a loop of that Sellers hit in their sig lol. I love it!

The FS/SS point is probably moot for now since we don't have anyone who has LL's range in the secondary.That was sort of my point. And it may be a long time before we need to replace LL back there too. He's just going to get better and better.

[BostonSkins]

So, in summary:

Landry is The Man and playing a great center field
Horton = Makes mistakes but forces turnovers
Doughty = Makes mistakes but.... *crickets*

I think this thread (about Landry) boils down to, does Doughty bring anything to the table.....anything at all that Horton does not? If so, I'd love to know what it is because I am missing it.

[skinsfan36]

So, in summary:

Landry is The Man and playing a great center field
Horton = Makes mistakes but forces turnovers
Doughty = Makes mistakes but.... *crickets*

I think this thread (about Landry) boils down to, does Doughty bring anything to the table.....anything at all that Horton does not? If so, I'd love to know what it is because I am missing it.

add to that moore is atletic and appears to be close to making plays on teams

[RedskinRyan]

I have been baffled the last 4 weeks at how invisible Laron Landry has been. With all of the drama surrounding Reed Doughty, why is it that Landry's inability to make big plays thus far has been overlooked??? Landry has only 16 tackles on the season, and I'm not even sure how many of those are solo. Is he playing deep too much to be effective, or is he doing his job so well that the ball is not coming his way?

I'd love to see Landry get involved. Thoughts?

Anquan Bolden didn't make much noise when we played Arizona. Larry Fitzgerald burned Reed Doughty, while the bomb to Anquan was blocked deep by Landry, in single coverage. He's making plays, they just don't all show on the stat sheets.

[guess88]

Yeah, he got straight up owned by Jacobs. Still, I think that Landry generally gives better than he gets. In fact, it happens to the best of them... except ST. I recall Brian Dawkins getting similarly trucked by Mike Sellers a few years ago. That was classic, lol.

Can't really blame Landry for that. Jacobs is 6'4", 265 with single digit body fat, he should be able truck most people 1-1, and definitely any secondary player (except the late ST) Jacobs is a big dude flat out... I'd cringe and crap myself if I had to tackle him. Don't think that exposes LL as an in the box safety at all.. he's just more valuable as our angel playing deep.

[Patrick]

So, in summary:

Landry is The Man and playing a great center field
Horton = Makes mistakes but forces turnovers
Doughty = Makes mistakes but.... *crickets*

I think this thread (about Landry) boils down to, does Doughty bring anything to the table.....anything at all that Horton does not? If so, I'd love to know what it is because I am missing it.

brings an intangible element to the defense that the coaches think enough of to keep him in the line-up.

[redskin_rich]

My only complaint of Landry, as noted in another thread, was when he watched TO go into the end zone. I don't think Landry could have stopped TO's momentum but I still expect physical play and its supposed to be part of Landry's game.

As to the rest of the discussion in this thread, I think there has been enough bashing of Doughty and there is no reason to defend him. He has played his way out of the starting position, almost as much as Horton has played his way into it.

[RoanokeSkin]

brings an intangible element to the defense that the coaches think enough of to keep him in the line-up.

I still can't imagine what that is... I don't think that he could cover me 1 on 1.

[Patrick]

I still can't imagine what that is... I don't think that he could cover me 1 on 1.

I don't know what it is either but obviously the coaching staff (who we have ALL been praising for the last three weeks) does. For myself - as long as we are winning - whatever they decide is fine with me. :)

[ChiefPowhatan17]

Landry is fine, he can't be ST on every play. The thing is that we haven't had that many big plays against us, so in that regard he is doing his job. I think our Defense has been pretty solid in the last 3 games. Landry is going to be fine, plus averaging 4 tackles a game is about right for a FS. You don't want your Safeties to lead the team in tackles, then others are not doing their jobs. Like a few years ago when our D was horrible and ST was one of the leaders in tackles. That is not good news for the front 7. So the fact that he doesn't have huge numbers speaks volumes for our front.

[Sean36]

LaRon Landry might see action at strong safety, since sean springs should not be in the box for any reason...then landry can blitz, cover Braylon, and possibly get his first regular season interception. I just want LaRon to be a head hunter again.

Your thoughts.

[Sean36]

LaRon Landry might see action at strong safety, since sean springs should not be in the box for any reason...then landry can blitz, cover Braylon, and possibly get his first regular season interception. I just want LaRon to be a head hunter again.

Your thoughts.

I just have a feeling that LL is gonna go off this week and the rest of the season ending up with 4-6 Ints and more hard hits to QB's...(just a feeling)

[redskin_rich]

LaRon Landry might see action at strong safety, since sean springs should not be in the box for any reason...then landry can blitz, cover Braylon, and possibly get his first regular season interception. I just want LaRon to be a head hunter again.

Your thoughts.

I would rather leave Landry in deep centerfield and have Horton playing up. If Horton can't go, then play Moore at Strong. If Springs can go fully, let him play Corner.

I am not a fan of shuffling a bunch of positions and I don't care who it is that makes the plays, as long as someone does.

[skinsfan36]

we need springs at cb
edwards,cribbs,stallworth,kw2(lines up at wr once in a while)
horton must play

[BigCountry]

This thread is kinda ridiculous. One series without Landry in the lineup and you'd see why he's getting a so called free pass. My only beef is the INT he dropped, but he saved the New Orleans and AZ games for us with coverage on deep plays and besides, we've held 4 top 10 offenses below their average and won those games. What else do you want the secondary to do. It's amazing that they're even in position to drop INT's with the pass rush they have to play with. Our secondary right now is the heart of the defense and the reason they're able to play at a high level.

[shally]

This thread is kinda ridiculous. One series without Landry in the lineup and you'd see why he's getting a so called free pass. My only beef is the INT he dropped, but he saved the New Orleans and AZ games for us with coverage on deep plays and besides, we've held 4 top 10 offenses below their average and won those games. What else do you want the secondary to do. It's amazing that they're even in position to drop INT's with the pass rush they have to play with. Our secondary right now is the heart of the defense and the reason they're able to play at a high level.

agree.. considering we are getting little or no pass rush, it is ALL on the secondary

[redskin_rich]

This thread is kinda ridiculous. One series without Landry in the lineup and you'd see why he's getting a so called free pass. My only beef is the INT he dropped, but he saved the New Orleans and AZ games for us with coverage on deep plays and besides, we've held 4 top 10 offenses below their average and won those games. What else do you want the secondary to do. It's amazing that they're even in position to drop INT's with the pass rush they have to play with. Our secondary right now is the heart of the defense and the reason they're able to play at a high level.
Welcome to over two weeks ago. This thread just got bumped because Sean36 thought there was a chance that LL plays Strong Safety this week.

[shally]

Welcome to over two weeks ago. This thread just got bumped because Sean36 thought there was a chance that LL plays Strong Safety this week.

with who playing FS ?

green ????? i dont see that at all... no way he has the deep speed to play cover 1.. i can see green playing farther back, especially if we use that 3 safety formation with horton in the box (if he is well).

[redskin_rich]

with who playing FS ?

green ????? i dont see that at all... no way he has the deep speed to play cover 1.. i can see green playing farther back, especially if we use that 3 safety formation with horton in the box (if he is well).
Please read up a few posts, so I don't have to repeat myself. You'll find that I agree with you. :)

[shally]

Please read up a few posts, so I don't have to repeat myself. You'll find that I agree with you. :)

my bad.. sorry...