Holmgren eyeballing D.C.?

[hogs86]

I got this from PFT. Maybe we can fire Vinny. And bring in Holmgren as the GM.


Posted by Mike Florio on September 29, 2009 8:36 PM ET
Former Packers and Seahawks coach Mike Holmgren has been making no bones about his desire to return to the NFL in 2010.

An we've been hearing for months rumors that Holmgren would be very interested in becoming the next coach of the Washington Redskins.

Earlier today, Peter King of SI.com providing some meat for that bone, in an appearance with Chris Russo of Mag Dog Unleashed on Sirius XM Radio.

"I've heard a lot of people say in the last few days, 'Oh, Holmgren wouldn't want to go to Washington,'" King said. "Keep one thing in mind in December when all this stuff starts to go down. Remember where you heard this. Mike Holmgren last year, Thanksgiving weekend, I'm sitting in his office in Seattle and he says, 'You know, I'm going to take this next year off but after that I'll give you a cool little theory for what I might do.' I said, 'What?' And he says, 'I've coached in the Midwest with Green Bay and I grew up playing and coaching out west -- Brigham Young, the 49ers, Seattle.' And he said, 'I'd really love to try the East Coast. That brand of football where you wake up on Sunday morning and it's the most important thing. There aren't 800 things to do. Where you're in East Rutherford or Philly or Washington and it's so important.'

"He said, 'I'd really love to try football on the East Coast.' So do not eliminate Mike Holmgren when you start talking about coaching candidates for [Redskins owner] Dan Snyder."

So we think it'll be Holmgren and Shanahan jockeying for position in D.C., and the Redskins and Cowboys in a possible tug of war to get their preferred candidate.

That's why we don't rule out the 'Skins launching the process before the end of the season, in order to get a crack at Holmgren or Shanahan, before Jerry Jones does


Link http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/09/29/holmgren-eyeballing-dc/

[tuckahoeskin]

Wow. Holmgren would be a good pick-up, but in all honesty, I'd rather go with a Mike Tomlin type of guy. Young, strong leader, dynamic, tough. Holmgren has a ring -- one ring -- and maybe should have gotten another in Seattle. It would certainly be a step up. Not too much of a change in the offense either. We'll see...

[Taylor21TheUndertaker]

So is he coach, gm, or both?

[Redskinmayhem]

Interesting. I don't care who Dannyboy brings in but they better have GM powers or have a real GM on staff. Anything is better than Zorneratto.

[tbfoster1]

At this point I don't care who they bring in...Holmgren, Shanny, Cower, Akhorus...I just want to win ballgames. Hell, they could bring in Jimmy Johnson as coach, Michael Irvin as the recievers coach, Emmit Smith, Troy Aikman, Deion Sanders for the secondary....I wouldn't care as long as they help win ballgames and we are a contender every year. I'm tired of being bums.

[akhhorus]

At this point I don't care who they bring in...Holmgren, Shanny, Cower, Akhorus...I just want to win ballgames. Hell, they could bring in Jimmy Johnson as coach, Michael Irvin as the recievers coach, Emmit Smith, Troy Aikman, Deion Sanders for the secondary....I wouldn't care as long as they help win ballgames and we are a contender every year. I'm tired of being bums.

*thumbs up*

I, for one, don't buy Holmgren until I see it. I don't see him stabbing Zorn in the back like that.

[Fathead]

*thumbs up*

I, for one, don't buy Holmgren until I see it. I don't see him stabbing Zorn in the back like that.




I could see a golden parachute offer to Zorn where he "steps down" as HC.

[tuckahoeskin]

*thumbs up*

I, for one, don't buy Holmgren until I see it. I don't see him stabbing Zorn in the back like that.

I could absolutely see him doing that. I don't think he would blink to take the job if he wanted it. Considering the amount of money he would get, Zorn would be the furthest thing from his mind.

[Canuck]

*thumbs up*

I, for one, don't buy Holmgren until I see it. I don't see him stabbing Zorn in the back like that.

I don't see Holmgren stabbing Zorn in the back either. What I do see is both Holmgren and Zorn pushing Snyder at the end of the season to replace Ceratto with Holmgren.

[HAWGZHEAD]

I may be wrong but he seems to ho-hum to me. We need to get a HC that is just pissed all the time lol

[tbfoster1]

*thumbs up*

I, for one, don't buy Holmgren until I see it. I don't see him stabbing Zorn in the back like that.

I don't see him doing that either. That would be one hell of a dagger to the back

I may be wrong but he seems to ho-hum to me. We need to get a HC that is just pissed all the time lol

Of all the coaches names thrown around, I think the would be cowher.
His chin alone scares me :)

[HAWGZHEAD]

I don't see him doing that either. That would be one hell of a dagger to the back



Of all the coaches names thrown around, I think the would be cowher.
His chin alone scares me :)

Capt. Spit take does fit the bill

[shally]

So is he coach, gm, or both?

he failed badly in Seattle as the dual Coach/GM.. give him input into personnel and i think he would be fine as Caoch.. kind of like Joe Gibbs was

and by the time Holmgren gets the job, Zorn would be out of work for a couple of months anyway...

[Taylor21TheUndertaker]

he failed badly in Seattle as the dual Coach/GM.. give him input into personnel and i think he would be fine as Caoch.. kind of like Joe Gibbs was

and by the time Holmgren gets the job, Zorn would be out of work for a couple of months anyway...

The D coordinator interests me just as much as the coach

[akhhorus]

he failed badly in Seattle as the dual Coach/GM.. give him input into personnel and i think he would be fine as Caoch.. kind of like Joe Gibbs was

and by the time Holmgren gets the job, Zorn would be out of work for a couple of months anyway...

I could possibly see that, but I think Holmgren would only take it if Zorn "quit." Zorn couldn't be on Holmgren's staff though.

[smoak]

I feel like Holmgren is a boring choice... I still prefer Grimm or at least someone who is nasty to everyone else.

[Death_Venom]

Holgrem would be a step up from our current situatio. I think Holgrem would give Zorn the QB Coach position-any more responsibility than that would be too much for him.

[LATrueRedskin]

I feel like Holmgren is a boring choice... I still prefer Grimm or at least someone who is nasty to everyone else.

I really like Grimm and thinks he deserves a shot, but I only want him with a new GM. Heck, I only want a new coach in general with a new GM. Anything else is the same ol' same ol'.

[SkinsKY]

I'm looking for a coach who's going to bust some chops when he steps into the lockerroom, who gets players riled up, who's not afraid to pull his pants down (or something equally ridiculous) to motivate the team. I'm tired of soft, puffy players without heart or testicular fortitude.

Long story short, I don't think Holmgren brings that. I think he was overrated in Seattle (carried by Twinkle-toes's MVP seasons).

[jaylen]

blah just another guy for Snyder to overpay and underproduce. I just have a hard time seeing us making the right choice which ever way we go.

If Gibbs couldn't get this thing going I don't see anyone being able to as long as Danny's running the show.

I'll always be hopeful but just not looking forward to this whole process playing out once again. its become a ritual now.

[Skins-fo-life]

It don't matter who is the head coach until Snyder becomes a real owner, fires vinny, and hires a GM. Until this happens every coach here will fail. The changes need to be made at the top then to the bottom.

[cactusjack]

I know I say this about every 3 posts but.......Marty won 8 games with Tony Freakin Banks as the starting QB. Oh and he slashed the salary cap too. Only to get let go at then end of the season. Someone tell Danny to kiss Marty's kiester make him GM and have Shanny,Grimm,Cower or Homlgren be the HC.
END THREAD!

I can't believe after all this time Danny hasnt figured it out the last time this team was actually moving forward was when Marty was calling the shots! No Vinny!

[JoeJacksonTaylor28]

I know I say this about every 3 posts but.......Marty won 8 games with Tony Freakin Banks as the starting QB. Oh and he slashed the salary cap too. Only to get let go at then end of the season. Someone tell Danny to kiss Marty's kiester make him GM and have Shanny,Grimm,Cower or Homlgren be the HC.
END THREAD!

I can't believe after all this time Danny hasnt figured it out the last time this team was actually moving forward was when Marty was calling the shots! No Vinny!
Marty for Gm? No thanks... He was responsible for the Gardner fiasco

[cactusjack]

Marty for Gm? No thanks... He was responsible for the Gardner fiasco

I do believe Gardner is not nearly as bad looking back as you might think...
NFC player of the week as a rookie 208 yrds and a touch vs the Panthers.

What have the 3 chumps that we drafted last year done?......Nothing, Zilch, Nada.

Gardner carreer stats 6 years 242 receptions 23 TDs and 3165 yards.

I will bet anything the 3 we drafted last season will not have those numbers combined after this season or next.

I am not saying Gardner was the greatest by any means but compared to these 3 and total number of games played he OWNS them!

[Fathead]

You are seriously talking up 50/50?

[cactusjack]

You are seriously talking up 50/50?

Of course not I am not a fan of 50/50 by any means. I am saying the 3 drafted last season have done nothing. Two could be considered immature headcases and the other may always be a injury risk.

[joethefan]

I feel like Holmgren is a boring choice... I still prefer Grimm or at least someone who is nasty to everyone else.

I tell you what, would you rather have Holmgren or Vinnie....
Grimm still has no playcalling skills or sideline management skills as well... also fo those of you who want to keep Zorn, this could be the way to do it...Zorn could be the OC/QB coach....and let Mike be the HC...

[sinskin]

I tell you what, would you rather have Holmgren or Vinnie....
Grimm still has no playcalling skills or sideline management skills as well... also fo those of you who want to keep Zorn, this could be the way to do it...Zorn could be the OC/QB coach....and let Mike be the HC...

ABSOLUTELY NOT!

[sinskin]

*thumbs up*

I, for one, don't buy Holmgren until I see it. I don't see him stabbing Zorn in the back like that.


He didn't endorse Zorn in Seattle for the heir apparent ... don't think he gives a crap quite frankly.

Hmmmm Zorn's friendship cross country or, 12 mill........uhhh

[joethefan]

ABSOLUTELY NOT!

I understand what you mean, but the reality is that Zorn helped Holgren a great deal. I'm not endorsing Zorn, I just stating that could be a reality.

[Redskin4Life]

Only way I see Holmgren coming is if Zorn is the OC and QB coach.... actually, I can really see that as a possibility. With Holmgren teaching the nuances of calling plays but giving Zorn the relief of not having to make the big calls or in game duties, I think Zorn could be an excellent OC. And Holmgren wouldn't be stabbing him in the back, per se, since Zorn would still be on the team.... now bringing in a new coach would definitely be stabbing Blanche in the back. And I have NO PROBLEMS with that.

[BIGREDSKINSFAN1963]

holmgren as a gm?he has'nt done a damn thing as gm!maybe if he brings in shanny as head coach and holmgren as gm,that MAY work,but my feeling is anybody but a disciplined oriented coach like dungy or cowher while snyder owns the team,is just prolonging the agony for us redskins fans!

[smoak]

I really like Grimm and thinks he deserves a shot, but I only want him with a new GM. Heck, I only want a new coach in general with a new GM. Anything else is the same ol' same ol'.

Totally agree. Zorn was vinnie's hire so I'm assuming thy are joined at the hip.

the only plus for golmgren is that I gues terminology and playbook would be similar only he would know how to use it!

[Patrick]

PFT stirring the pot again ............. :rolleyes:

[akhhorus]

PFT stirring the pot again ............. :rolleyes:

Although I don't think that Holmgren will end up here, its a solid story by PFT. He's quoting Holmgren second hand through Peter King that Holmgren would like to coach in a big city on the east coast. The Skins appear to be the only big city east coast team that could have a coaching vacancy soon.

[akhhorus]

I do believe Gardner is not nearly as bad looking back as you might think...
NFC player of the week as a rookie 208 yrds and a touch vs the Panthers.

What have the 3 chumps that we drafted last year done?......Nothing, Zilch, Nada.

Gardner carreer stats 6 years 242 receptions 23 TDs and 3165 yards.

I will bet anything the 3 we drafted last season will not have those numbers combined after this season or next.

I am not saying Gardner was the greatest by any means but compared to these 3 and total number of games played he OWNS them!

2001 was a great year for WRs, and the skins got one of the biggest busts of the bunch. Here's the quality WRs taken after 50/50 in that draft:
Reggie Wayne
Chad Johnson
Chris Chambers
Steve Smith
Santana Moss(who was taken with the pick after 50/50)
T.J. Houshmandzadeh

[smoak]

Although I don't think that Holmgren will end up here, its a solid story by PFT. He's quoting Holmgren second hand through Peter King that Holmgren would like to coach in a big city on the east coast. The Skins appear to be the only big city east coast team that could have a coaching vacancy soon.

LMAO! He should have added "coach in a big city on the east coast whose stadium does not sit in our nation's capital"

That is pretty darn specific right dere.

[smoak]

2001 was a great year for WRs, and the skins got one of the biggest busts of the bunch. Here's the quality WRs taken after 50/50 in that draft:
Reggie Wayne
Chad Johnson
Chris Chambers
Steve Smith
Santana Moss(who was taken with the pick after 50/50)
T.J. Houshmandzadeh

I'm not a fan of "hindsight" arguments in a draft. I'll go to my grave saying that Gardner seemed to be a decent prospect who looked at times to be a promising rookie. Exit Spurrier and enter the Ol' Ball Coach. Exit Spurrier. Enter Gibbs... How many QBs were there?

I just think the success/failure of a rookie can sometimes correlate to the quality of the coaching staff and stability of an organization.

[Redskinmayhem]

I'm not a fan of "hindsight" arguments in a draft. I'll go to my grave saying that Gardner seemed to be a decent prospect who looked at times to be a promising rookie. Exit Spurrier and enter the Ol' Ball Coach. Exit Spurrier. Enter Gibbs... How many QBs were there?

I just think the success/failure of a rookie can sometimes correlate to the quality of the coaching staff and stability of an organization.

without a doubt, the coaching carousel has a big effect on players. How many players would still be here if we hadn't fired Marty? How many would've prospered?

You're right about hindsight arguments though.

[Patrick]

Although I don't think that Holmgren will end up here, its a solid story by PFT. He's quoting Holmgren second hand through Peter King that Holmgren would like to coach in a big city on the east coast. The Skins appear to be the only big city east coast team that could have a coaching vacancy soon.
Solid maybe BUT it's from an interview done Thanksgiving 2008 .............. man if thats not stirring the pot I don't know what is. ...... How come it wasn't made memtion back then or in Dec, Jan, Feb. ???

[Patrick]

I'm not a fan of "hindsight" arguments in a draft. I'll go to my grave saying that Gardner seemed to be a decent prospect who looked at times to be a promising rookie. Exit Spurrier and enter the Ol' Ball Coach. Exit Spurrier. Enter Gibbs... How many QBs were there?

I just think the success/failure of a rookie can sometimes correlate to the quality of the coaching staff and stability of an organization.
As well as the ability of a knowledgeable GM with a good scoutings to evalute talent.

[akhhorus]

Solid maybe BUT it's from an interview done Thanksgiving 2008 .............. man if thats not stirring the pot I don't know what is. ...... How come it wasn't made memtion back then or in Dec, Jan, Feb. ???

Hasn't there been speculation about Zorn being replaced by a big name basically as soon as he was hired? Its still a relevant post to discuss a big name coach(which Danny likes) wanting to get back into the game and wanting to coach on the east coast. Holmgren, back when he left for Seattle, reportedly wanted to coach in DC. Stirring the pot would be reporting that Parcells might leave for DC based on some vague comment he made 2 years ago. This Holmgren story seems like solid speculation.

I'm not a fan of "hindsight" arguments in a draft. I'll go to my grave saying that Gardner seemed to be a decent prospect who looked at times to be a promising rookie. Exit Spurrier and enter the Ol' Ball Coach. Exit Spurrier. Enter Gibbs... How many QBs were there?

I just think the success/failure of a rookie can sometimes correlate to the quality of the coaching staff and stability of an organization.

I would agree, if we were talking about one player versus Rod, but the amazing level of talent--even just at WR--in that draft and especially in the first two rounds..and how badly Marty missed that talent shows how bad a GM he was.

[Redskinmayhem]

Hasn't there been speculation about Zorn being replaced by a big name basically as soon as he was hired? Its still a relevant post to discuss a big name coach(which Danny likes) wanting to get back into the game and wanting to coach on the east coast. Holmgren, back when he left for Seattle, reportedly wanted to coach in DC. Stirring the pot would be reporting that Parcells might leave for DC based on some vague comment he made 2 years ago. This Holmgren story seems like solid speculation.



I would agree, if we were talking about one player versus Rod, but the amazing level of talent--even just at WR--in that draft and especially in the first two rounds..and how badly Marty missed that talent shows how bad a GM he was.

In Marty's defense Rod 50/50 looked like a damn good WR. He looked ready to go from day 1. 6'2", 215, wingspan of wilt chamberlain, sub 4.45 40. He was actually pretty damn good for us his rookie year, even w/ Tony banks at the helm lol. If Rod Gardner had gone to the Colts instead of Reggie Wayne, he would've been a perennial pro-bowler. Reggie Wayne in DC, could just as easily have been a bust.

[SkinsfaninNJ]

Although I don't think that Holmgren will end up here, its a solid story by PFT. He's quoting Holmgren second hand through Peter King that Holmgren would like to coach in a big city on the east coast. The Skins appear to be the only big city east coast team that could have a coaching vacancy soon.

I'm like 99% sure on this, but that conversation between Holmgren and King happened a long time ago during last season after he had already announced he was leaving Seattle at the end of the year. I'm pretty sure King wrote about it. Things could have changed for Holmgren based on what is going on with Zorn, or not.

[Hr fan]

Holmgren, Shanahan, Cower - name your poison. Without a GM, or with a GM so powerless that he must take Snyderatto's HC pick, is more of the same at best. But it is danny's mo - get a name, spend $, fail because it is part of a marketing plan rather than an organizational plan.

[Redskinmayhem]

Holmgren, Shanahan, Cower - name your poison. Without a GM, or with a GM so powerless that he must take Snyderatto's HC pick, is more of the same at best. But it is danny's mo - get a name, spend $, fail because it is part of a marketing plan rather than an organizational plan.

I agree. If we don't whack Vinny in the process, it doesn't matter. I would, however, prefer a serious disciplinarian. Dungy, Cowher, Even, Chucky.

[BraveHeartFan]

Holmgren would be a very interesting pick up for sure. I could see that being a nice fit for the Skins.

I agree with a few others though that I don't believe he'd stab Zorn in the back like that so I don't know if that would be the ideal situation or not.

The other thing is this about him as GM. That is a bad move and a disaster waiting to happen. They gave him that in Seattle and eventually had to take it away from him (Ironically, or maybe not so much, after they did is when he got the Hawks to the Superbowl) because he's not very good at the whole GM thing. So if he's looking for GM control then he's one guy I wouldn't even look at. He's had his shot at that and he's really just not good as a GM. HC is all you'd want him to be and all you'd want him focusing on.

[akhhorus]

In Marty's defense Rod 50/50 looked like a damn good WR. He looked ready to go from day 1. 6'2", 215, wingspan of wilt chamberlain, sub 4.45 40. He was actually pretty damn good for us his rookie year, even w/ Tony banks at the helm lol. If Rod Gardner had gone to the Colts instead of Reggie Wayne, he would've been a perennial pro-bowler. Reggie Wayne in DC, could just as easily have been a bust.

The problem is that its not just Marty passing on other WRs for Rod, but other players who could have filled other major needs for that Skins team. Steve Hutchinson is going to Canton as an OG, and he was taken two spots after Rod(and OG was a major need for the 01 Skins). CB was a major need, and they passed on Nate Clements. And thats not even mentioning Drew Brees, Todd Heap, Alge Crumpler, Kyle Vanden Bosch, etc etc etc. Its jaw dropping how many great players Marty passed on in the first 3 rounds.

[BIGREDSKINSFAN1963]

I agree. If we don't whack Vinny in the process, it doesn't matter. I would, however, prefer a serious disciplinarian. Dungy, Cowher, Even, Chucky.

not gruden!he inherited dungy's team and after the super bowl,did nothing!
as bad as zorn has been,i'd take him over gruden,and that's pretty pathetic!

[BraveHeartFan]

The problem is that its not just Marty passing on other WRs for Rod, but other players who could have filled other major needs for that Skins team. Steve Hutchinson is going to Canton as an OG, and he was taken two spots after Rod(and OG was a major need for the 01 Skins). CB was a major need, and they passed on Nate Clements. And thats not even mentioning Drew Brees, Todd Heap, Alge Crumpler, Kyle Vanden Bosch, etc etc etc. Its jaw dropping how many great players Marty passed on in the first 3 rounds.

And of those names how many did you honestly have pegged as being for sure great players on the day of the draft? Hindsight is a wonderful thing cause it's 20/20.

31 teams probably still kick themselves to this day for passing on Tom Brady more than once. If only they'd had a crystal ball and 20/20 future vision.

[Canuck]

not gruden!he inherited dungy's team and after the super bowl,did nothing!
as bad as zorn has been,i'd take him over gruden,and that's pretty pathetic!

Why do people hate Gruden so much? I think people forget what a good job he did with the Raiders. As for Tamba Bay, he took over a team with a great D but couldn't move the ball to save it's life. All he did was lead them to a super bowl.

Yes he had some pretty crap years after that but I think that was more due to the draft picks the Bucs gave up to get Gruden and their horrible salary cap position. Parcells turned down the job before the Bucs went after Gruden because he didn't like their upcoming cap situation.

Considering how well Gruden was able to work with Al Davis - he may not be a bad fit with Snyder.

[dogfight6]

Untill we get a GM. who does not shake and shutter every time Danny walks in the room and hires a Head Coach who takes charge. Holds the players accountable for their play, who's not afraid to throw a 1st round pick off the field for half @#$ play and brings in 21 tons of dirt to make a hill and work these million dollar babies back into the Redskins we are proud to call our team, this discussion will last until either Danny or us are pushing daisys. GM. I admit I have no clue. Head Coach either clone Singletary or Russ Grim.

[hogskins]

I feel like Holmgren is a boring choice... I still prefer Grimm or at least someone who is nasty to everyone else.

Holmgren as GM, with Grimm as coach might be interesting--maybe two walruses are better than one.

[Moe]

I'm looking for a coach who's going to bust some chops when he steps into the lockerroom, who gets players riled up, who's not afraid to pull his pants down (or something equally ridiculous) to motivate the team. I'm tired of soft, puffy players without heart or testicular fortitude.

Long story short, I don't think Holmgren brings that. I think he was overrated in Seattle (carried by Twinkle-toes's MVP seasons).

I don't have a really strong opinion either way on Holmgren, but he did take two different teams to the Super Bowl, which is something none of the other usual suspects can say.

[Redskinmayhem]

I don't have a really strong opinion either way on Holmgren, but he did take two different teams to the Super Bowl, which is something none of the other usual suspects can say.

right but he had 2 awesome QB's. Favre on one side and Hass on the other, plus a monster running game behind Hutch and Twinkle Toes.

[BIGREDSKINSFAN1963]

Why do people hate Gruden so much? I think people forget what a good job he did with the Raiders. As for Tamba Bay, he took over a team with a great D but couldn't move the ball to save it's life. All he did was lead them to a super bowl.

Yes he had some pretty crap years after that but I think that was more due to the draft picks the Bucs gave up to get Gruden and their horrible salary cap position. Parcells turned down the job before the Bucs went after Gruden because he didn't like their upcoming cap situation.

Considering how well Gruden was able to work with Al Davis - he may not be a bad fit with Snyder.

just never really impressed me much!he can coach better than most,he's just too moody and irritatting!i think he has found his nitch in life now on MNF,he's the best coach commentator they have had since they moved to espn.

[BIGREDSKINSFAN1963]

i think we ought to throw the panthers into this mix too.john fox will more than likely be canned at the end of the year if not before.whoever goes in there is gonna basically gut the team.i think that will appeal more to him than any other gig out there!

[akhhorus]

And of those names how many did you honestly have pegged as being for sure great players on the day of the draft? Hindsight is a wonderful thing cause it's 20/20.

31 teams probably still kick themselves to this day for passing on Tom Brady more than once. If only they'd had a crystal ball and 20/20 future vision.

It was pretty clear with a lot of those players(hutchinson, Brees, Clements, Hampton) that they would be quality players. The brady analogy doesn't fit since he was a late round flyer pick, and its harder to nitpick late rounder like that(they're a crapshoot). In the first 3 rounds, you should be able to spot talent(you have to be able to spot talent in those rounds). Its stunning how badly the skins whiffed in that draft.

[skin4ever]

*thumbs up*

I, for one, don't buy Holmgren until I see it. I don't see him stabbing Zorn in the back like that.

I dont see it either, but I could definitely see Zorn accepting the step down and being allowed to focus as OC or something like that, to learn from Holmgren and then taking the reigns. That would be an ideal situation and Zorn doesnt appear to be that selfish or arrogant not to understand hes in over his head(regardless of what he says to the media) and accept a bigger role than QB coach and learn how to be a HC from someone he respects and with whom hes had a very good relationship.

[nicefellow31]

I got this from PFT. Maybe we can fire Vinny. And bring in Holmgren as the GM.


Posted by Mike Florio on September 29, 2009 8:36 PM ET
Former Packers and Seahawks coach Mike Holmgren has been making no bones about his desire to return to the NFL in 2010.

An we've been hearing for months rumors that Holmgren would be very interested in becoming the next coach of the Washington Redskins.

Earlier today, Peter King of SI.com providing some meat for that bone, in an appearance with Chris Russo of Mag Dog Unleashed on Sirius XM Radio.

"I've heard a lot of people say in the last few days, 'Oh, Holmgren wouldn't want to go to Washington,'" King said. "Keep one thing in mind in December when all this stuff starts to go down. Remember where you heard this. Mike Holmgren last year, Thanksgiving weekend, I'm sitting in his office in Seattle and he says, 'You know, I'm going to take this next year off but after that I'll give you a cool little theory for what I might do.' I said, 'What?' And he says, 'I've coached in the Midwest with Green Bay and I grew up playing and coaching out west -- Brigham Young, the 49ers, Seattle.' And he said, 'I'd really love to try the East Coast. That brand of football where you wake up on Sunday morning and it's the most important thing. There aren't 800 things to do. Where you're in East Rutherford or Philly or Washington and it's so important.'

"He said, 'I'd really love to try football on the East Coast.' So do not eliminate Mike Holmgren when you start talking about coaching candidates for [Redskins owner] Dan Snyder."

So we think it'll be Holmgren and Shanahan jockeying for position in D.C., and the Redskins and Cowboys in a possible tug of war to get their preferred candidate.

That's why we don't rule out the 'Skins launching the process before the end of the season, in order to get a crack at Holmgren or Shanahan, before Jerry Jones does


Link http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/09/29/holmgren-eyeballing-dc/

I'd take Holmgren here as a coach in a minute. Over Shanahan, over Gruden, over Cowher. Not as a GM though.

[Emmanouel8]

I think we'd be putting ourselves in trouble if we start to evaluate who we'd like our coach to be without a REAL GM in place.

You should have a GM in place to think of the big picture and a head coach focusing on the week to week. Successful teams are able to balance both. There's a conflict of interest when the coach is both b/c they have to win now, and thus suffer in the GM role b/c they may not be around to reap the awards later.

The search for a coach should be done via a GM.

[BIGREDSKINSFAN1963]

I dont see it either, but I could definitely see Zorn accepting the step down and being allowed to focus as OC or something like that, to learn from Holmgren and then taking the reigns. That would be an ideal situation and Zorn doesnt appear to be that selfish or arrogant not to understand hes in over his head(regardless of what he says to the media) and accept a bigger role than QB coach and learn how to be a HC from someone he respects and with whom hes had a very good relationship.

but the questions are,1,does zorn's ego let him do that?and 2,would'nt that kind of be difficult with team chemistry?demoting a guy from hc to a lower position in which he still coachest he players in a new capacity?and zorn stinks as an OC now,why would he be any better in the future?

[skin4ever]

but the questions are,1,does zorn's ego let him do that?and 2,would'nt that kind of be difficult with team chemistry?demoting a guy from hc to a lower position in which he still coachest he players in a new capacity?and zorn stinks as an OC now,why would he be any better in the future?

1) yes, I think Zorn knows he is out of his league and has a lot to learn. Especially, if he had the chance to learn from Holgren under a new hat of OC and not that of QB coach.

2) Right now there is NO team chemistry and we r talking about changing the HC mid season, so the guys will be responding to a new lead dog, who has respect for Zorn and the players should fall in line. He's not our OC now, hes alot more than that, and i think all of those hats are taking away from producing one good product. Plus, i would hope(dont know if he did it previously, but i believe he did) Holmgren would be calling the plays and scheming each week and put his foot up Blaches ass to get pressure and put our d in a position to get turnovers.

As for the future, I dont think anyone who really jumps a lot of steps in their professional growth succeeds, very often. More times than not, its a learned process. Zorn has shown enthusiasm and it may do wonders for him as a OC first to learn how to be a HC.

[Patrick]

I think we'd be putting ourselves in trouble if we start to evaluate who we'd like our coach to be without a REAL GM in place.

You should have a GM in place to think of the big picture and a head coach focusing on the week to week. Successful teams are able to balance both. There's a conflict of interest when the coach is both b/c they have to win now, and thus suffer in the GM role b/c they may not be around to reap the awards later.

The search for a coach should be done via a GM. That's the normal way (there have been sucessful exceptions) and if JKC were still alive I'm sure he would have done it this way. ....... Danny hasn't learned how to be a good owner yet and that's not to say he won't but right now he's just not getting it.

[smave]

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f391/jsmavisd/wanlu.jpg

[Moe]

right but he had 2 awesome QB's. Favre on one side and Hass on the other, plus a monster running game behind Hutch and Twinkle Toes.

Both QB's that he coached up to their potential and at least in Seattle he had a hand in assembling that running game. I'm not a big fan of him as a GM, but he was a major player in turning a forgotten franchise into a pretty solid team.

[Moe]

Why do people hate Gruden so much? I think people forget what a good job he did with the Raiders. As for Tamba Bay, he took over a team with a great D but couldn't move the ball to save it's life. All he did was lead them to a super bowl.

Yes he had some pretty crap years after that but I think that was more due to the draft picks the Bucs gave up to get Gruden and their horrible salary cap position. Parcells turned down the job before the Bucs went after Gruden because he didn't like their upcoming cap situation.

Considering how well Gruden was able to work with Al Davis - he may not be a bad fit with Snyder.

The fallout after Gruden was canned soured me on him. Lots of talk of him being two faced, protecting himself at the expense of others, things of that nature that just don't sit right with me.

[bigcmr]

I think we'd be putting ourselves in trouble if we start to evaluate who we'd like our coach to be without a REAL GM in place.

You should have a GM in place to think of the big picture and a head coach focusing on the week to week. Successful teams are able to balance both. There's a conflict of interest when the coach is both b/c they have to win now, and thus suffer in the GM role b/c they may not be around to reap the awards later.

The search for a coach should be done via a GM.

Yes so Vinny must go first.

[BIGREDSKINSFAN1963]

still don't think he'd stab and undercut zorn like that!:sun:

[NamVet4]

Holmgren coming to the Redskins is just a sports rumors.. no matter the source or the date.
As a rumor I can't get excited. I want to hear some real hard indications that Daniel Snyder has swallowed his pride and realized that the Team needs a real Pro Football GM, FIRST!

This entire message board is rife with threads and posts that are begging for the immediate dismissal of Vincent Cerrato !
Let me know when it happens and I might get excited about the prospects for the Redskins.

[BIGREDSKINSFAN1963]

Holmgren coming to the Redskins is just a sports rumors.. no matter the source or the date.
As a rumor I can't get excited. I want to hear some real hard indications that Daniel Snyder has swallowed his pride and realized that the Team needs a real Pro Football GM, FIRST!

This entire message board is rife with threads and posts that are begging for the immediate dismissal of Vincent Cerrato !
Let me know when it happens and I might get excited about the prospects for the Redskins.

i'm like you,i'll believe it when it happens!

[Canuck]

The fallout after Gruden was canned soured me on him. Lots of talk of him being two faced, protecting himself at the expense of others, things of that nature that just don't sit right with me.

Would you rather have a rat that wins or a saint who loses? Belichick and Parcells are both more rat than saint but I'd take either of them over Jim "stay medium" Zorn in a heartbeat.

Also keep in mind that the same owners who fired Gruden also fired Dungy because they felt he couldn't get them over the top. Gruden has his faults but I would take those rumors about him being two faced with a grain of salt.

[cactusjack]

2001 was a great year for WRs, and the skins got one of the biggest busts of the bunch. Here's the quality WRs taken after 50/50 in that draft:
Reggie Wayne
Chad Johnson
Chris Chambers
Steve Smith
Santana Moss(who was taken with the pick after 50/50)
T.J. Houshmandzadeh

I agree 2001 was a good year for WRs. My point was the 3 guys drafted last year have not produced or appear to be ready to produce any time soon. Further more the whole response was triggered by the comment of "will never forgive Marty for the Gardner debacle". Marty did a hell of a better job in one season than Danny and Vinnie have done in 11 years.

[akhhorus]

I agree 2001 was a good year for WRs. My point was the 3 guys drafted last year have not produced or appear to be ready to produce any time soon. Further more the whole response was triggered by the comment of "will never forgive Marty for the Gardner debacle". Marty did a hell of a better job in one season than Danny and Vinnie have done in 11 years.

Thats a low bar which I don't really agree with. Marty got C+ talent from arguably the best draft in the last decade. At least Vinny/Danny sometimes hit on a guy like Horton or Marko Mitchell.

[cactusjack]

Thats a low bar which I don't really agree with. Marty got C+ talent from arguably the best draft in the last decade. At least Vinny/Danny sometimes hit on a guy like Horton or Marko Mitchell.

Ok so Danny and Vinnie get lucky on a couple of late round picks and fail on picks in rounds 2-6 with the exception of Cooley. 3 2nd rounders and not one is producing and lets not forget Rhinhart who appears a bust as well. Just my opinion but outside of Cooley,LL,and Taylor they have next to nothing to show for 11 years.

[akhhorus]

Ok so Danny and Vinnie get lucky on a couple of late round picks and fail on picks in rounds 2-6 with the exception of Cooley.

Cooley, Taylor and Landry all were Joe Gibbs picks, not Danny/Vinny.

3 2nd rounders and not one is producing and lets not forget Rhinhart who appears a bust as well. Just my opinion but outside of Cooley,LL,and Taylor they have next to nothing to show for 11 years.

And Marty doesn't have a lot to show for his 2001 draft. Smoot and Sage are the only players still in the NFL, and only Smoot's really done anything in the NFL(Marty did pass on a ton of good players for him also: Aaron Schobel, Chris Chambers, Matt Light, Shaun Rogers, Derrick Burgess, Adrian Wilson and Steve Smith taken in the 30 picks after Smoot was taken).

[skinsfan36]

id prefer shanny but i would take holmgrem.would he even come here since zorn is his boy?

[Moe]

Would you rather have a rat that wins or a saint who loses? Belichick and Parcells are both more rat than saint but I'd take either of them over Jim "stay medium" Zorn in a heartbeat.

I think both have inherent problems and would prefer they find someone who can win without being a rat.

Also keep in mind that the same owners who fired Gruden also fired Dungy because they felt he couldn't get them over the top. Gruden has his faults but I would take those rumors about him being two faced with a grain of salt.

Credit to Gruden for winning, but let's not forget the incredible luck afforded him in facing his ex-team in the super bowl. His guys were open after the game that because of Gruden they knew everything that the Raiders were going to do before they hiked the ball, which is a once in a lifetime advantage.

FWIW, many of those who made mention of his two-faced antics were players and not management.

[BucsFaninBrownsLand]

I think both have inherent problems and would prefer they find someone who can win without being a rat.


Credit to Gruden for winning, but let's not forget the incredible luck afforded him in facing his ex-team in the super bowl. His guys were open after the game that because of Gruden they knew everything that the Raiders were going to do before they hiked the ball, which is a once in a lifetime advantage.

FWIW, many of those who made mention of his two-faced antics were players and not management.

If by luck you mean "Buccaneers became the first team to lead the league in total defense, points allowed, and interceptions since the 1985 Bears."

The Raiders inability to change their playbook was a huge advantage but they were severely outmatched across the board before any gamesmanship was employed.

That said, you don't want Gruden. He is basically Jim Zorn 1.0. Offensive wunderkind that never produced the offense. Gruden is just as bad as Zorn when it comes to being inflexible with his schemes and refusing to play to his players' strengths. He's been called a fraud by a few players (most bitter) and by 1 former positions coach. He plays major favorites and refuses to lose in the name of rebuilding, hence the crazy amount of over-the-hill stopgaps.


The Redskins need to find the right coach. Only sign one of the *names* like Cowher, Holmgren or Shanahan if they are sure. They can't fall in love with the very young defensive coach like Tampa and Pittsburgh (who is collapsing and the only reason Tomlin won a SB was because he inherited a championship team). They can't fall in love with the very young offensive wunderkind a la McDaniels.

I'm confident that a *name* will only sign if Vinny is fired.

[smave]

I agree 2001 was a good year for WRs. My point was the 3 guys drafted last year have not produced or appear to be ready to produce any time soon. Further more the whole response was triggered by the comment of "will never forgive Marty for the Gardner debacle". Marty did a hell of a better job in one season than Danny and Vinnie have done in 11 years.

I feel that with Campbell at QB, we could have a Steve Smith or a Housh at WR and not even they would produce.

He doesnt see the field or bare to look at all the receivers to give them a chance to produce. From what ive seen this season so far, every ball Kelly has had a chance to grab, he has. Likewise with Thomas, and Davis.

But you have to have balls thrown your way to produce...

[SkinsWins]

At this point, I don't think that it matters. Blache and Zorn need to go. We need someone to light a fire under these players because right now I am embarrassed to even wear anything burgondy.

[Redskin4Life]

What's wrong with Gruden as an OC??? He's a WCO disciple... HC experience. Can call plays. Was trying to run an offense similar to ours -- WCO with tough running game. Sounds like a good fit...

[BucsFaninBrownsLand]

Gruden will never accept an OC job. He is Zorn. HC-OC. Only Gruden demands personnel control (something Snyder wouldn't give him). Shanahan would want personnel control too.

Gruden's system is ridiculously good but it requires too many correct pieces to run correctly. The RB needs to have WR hands and be a downhill runner. The WRs need to run superb routes and be able to break off their routes if they see favorable coverage. The QB needs to be able to make reads during a 7-step drop and deliver on the 7th step. The QB also needs all-world accuracy and above average mobility. The players all need to be able to remember plays with insane verbiage "Solo Left Snug Past 94 Punch Laser Z Corner 600 Jet Arizona" yes, that is a typical play.

You can see why it took 2 hall of famers and an MVP to run the offense (Tim Brown, Jerry Rice, Rich Gannon).

[ChiefPowhatan17]

If Holmgren comes here, maybe he will hire Zorn as his QB coach....LOL.

[smoak]

I agree 2001 was a good year for WRs. My point was the 3 guys drafted last year have not produced or appear to be ready to produce any time soon. Further more the whole response was triggered by the comment of "will never forgive Marty for the Gardner debacle". Marty did a hell of a better job in one season than Danny and Vinnie have done in 11 years.

Totally agree... Even if it isn't saying much

[Gunnar]

I got this from PFT. Maybe we can fire Vinny. And bring in Holmgren as the GM.


Posted by Mike Florio on September 29, 2009 8:36 PM ET
Former Packers and Seahawks coach Mike Holmgren has been making no bones about his desire to return to the NFL in 2010.

An we've been hearing for months rumors that Holmgren would be very interested in becoming the next coach of the Washington Redskins.

Earlier today, Peter King of SI.com providing some meat for that bone, in an appearance with Chris Russo of Mag Dog Unleashed on Sirius XM Radio.

"I've heard a lot of people say in the last few days, 'Oh, Holmgren wouldn't want to go to Washington,'" King said. "Keep one thing in mind in December when all this stuff starts to go down. Remember where you heard this. Mike Holmgren last year, Thanksgiving weekend, I'm sitting in his office in Seattle and he says, 'You know, I'm going to take this next year off but after that I'll give you a cool little theory for what I might do.' I said, 'What?' And he says, 'I've coached in the Midwest with Green Bay and I grew up playing and coaching out west -- Brigham Young, the 49ers, Seattle.' And he said, 'I'd really love to try the East Coast. That brand of football where you wake up on Sunday morning and it's the most important thing. There aren't 800 things to do. Where you're in East Rutherford or Philly or Washington and it's so important.'

"He said, 'I'd really love to try football on the East Coast.' So do not eliminate Mike Holmgren when you start talking about coaching candidates for [Redskins owner] Dan Snyder."

So we think it'll be Holmgren and Shanahan jockeying for position in D.C., and the Redskins and Cowboys in a possible tug of war to get their preferred candidate.

That's why we don't rule out the 'Skins launching the process before the end of the season, in order to get a crack at Holmgren or Shanahan, before Jerry Jones does


Link http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/09/29/holmgren-eyeballing-dc/

Now if Holmgreg shows up does Zorn stay around? i prefer someone else more defensive minded i want to see a push for Dick Lebeau of the Steelers .

[akhhorus]

Now if Holmgreg shows up does Zorn stay around? i prefer someone else more defensive minded i want to see a push for Dick Lebeau of the Steelers .

Great coordinator, god awful head coach.

[Gunnar]

Great coordinator, god awful head coach.


When was his last head coaching job?

[akhhorus]

When was his last head coaching job?

He was 12-33 with the Bengals. It was a disaster, he went straight back to Pittsburgh after getting fired, and no one has called him since for a head coach's gig. I don't know if anyone has even interviewed him for a HC job since then.

[Gunnar]

He was 12-33 with the Bengals. It was a disaster, he went straight back to Pittsburgh after getting fired, and no one has called him since for a head coach's gig. I don't know if anyone has even interviewed him for a HC job since then.

Thanks.... I just looked up his carrer 3 seasons with Bengals am surprised he did not go after a college HC job... other DF coordinators have been good has head coaches.. 3 seasons at Bengals unlikely he will get a Redskins head coaching job....


I wonder who the fans want has a Head Coach?

[Farmer Ted]

Great coordinator, god awful head coach.

Although he doesn't look it, he's also in his 70's. No one's gonna hire a 70+ year old head coach.

[shally]

Now if Holmgreg shows up does Zorn stay around? i prefer someone else more defensive minded i want to see a push for Dick Lebeau of the Steelers .

not a chance in hell that Zorn stays because he is going to be canned long before Holmgren, or anyone permanent, comes on board

i find it fascinating that Holmgren would like to coach in the NFC east... if it is not just lip service, it bodes really well for whatever team gets him.. considering that the coaches in philly and ny are under no real pressure, i think it will come down to Dallas and Wa..

[skinsfan36]

Although he doesn't look it, he's also in his 70's. No one's gonna hire a 70+ year old head coach.

lol even our front office isnt that dumb. i hope

[cactusjack]

I feel that with Campbell at QB, we could have a Steve Smith or a Housh at WR and not even they would produce.

He doesnt see the field or bare to look at all the receivers to give them a chance to produce. From what ive seen this season so far, every ball Kelly has had a chance to grab, he has. Likewise with Thomas, and Davis.

But you have to have balls thrown your way to produce...

And Tony Freakin Banks was a good qb when? Tony was a journeyman at best and went 500 in one season with the redskins. Furthermore the team put up more than 14 pts a game with as several folks say inferior 2001 talent. I am done arguing this over and over.....It took Marty 8 games to get going with inferior talent, then they won 7 of the last 8 and cut cost and removed over-priced FA's and had a team first concept. Vinny/Danny before and since Marty was running the show went with spend spend spend and have next to nothing to show for it. But for the sake of arguing lets pin Rod 50/50 Gardner as a product of satan, with Marty being the devil and give Danny/Vinny a free pass because they drafted Horton and Mitchell. Oh yeah Campbell(who was drafted after Marty got canned) was Marty's fault too.

This team stinks to high heaven because the owner is crap and he has not hired true football people because he thinks he knows better than proven professionals. Hello McFly the NFL is not a ESPN fantasy league!

[MadDog97]

he failed badly in Seattle as the dual Coach/GM.. give him input into personnel and i think he would be fine as Caoch.. kind of like Joe Gibbs was

and by the time Holmgren gets the job, Zorn would be out of work for a couple of months anyway...

I would prefer him as a GM with GM powers. I don't think it will happen because Danny wants too much power.

[SkinsKY]

He was 12-33 with the Bengals. It was a disaster, he went straight back to Pittsburgh after getting fired, and no one has called him since for a head coach's gig. I don't know if anyone has even interviewed him for a HC job since then.

One of my favorite DLB stories involves him opening training camp by running through a banner that read: "Super Bowl Bengals". They proceeded to go 2-14 in his last season.

[Irish Redskin]

One of my favorite DLB stories involves him opening training camp by running through a banner that read: "Super Bowl Bengals". They proceeded to go 2-14 in his last season.

Hahaha brilliant av!!

[Moe]

If by luck you mean "Buccaneers became the first team to lead the league in total defense, points allowed, and interceptions since the 1985 Bears."

Right, luck in that he inherited an amzing D assembled by Dungy and coached by one of the best D minds in the game in Kiffin. I don't see how Gruden gets credit for that side of the ball.

The Raiders inability to change their playbook was a huge advantage but they were severely outmatched across the board before any gamesmanship was employed.

Indeed the Raiders were facing a tough challenge, but giving an already imposing D a literal open book on that offense was a once in a lifetime occurance and had they lost then that'd be pretty pathetic.

That said, you don't want Gruden. He is basically Jim Zorn 1.0. Offensive wunderkind that never produced the offense. Gruden is just as bad as Zorn when it comes to being inflexible with his schemes and refusing to play to his players' strengths. He's been called a fraud by a few players (most bitter) and by 1 former positions coach. He plays major favorites and refuses to lose in the name of rebuilding, hence the crazy amount of over-the-hill stopgaps.


The Redskins need to find the right coach. Only sign one of the *names* like Cowher, Holmgren or Shanahan if they are sure. They can't fall in love with the very young defensive coach like Tampa and Pittsburgh (who is collapsing and the only reason Tomlin won a SB was because he inherited a championship team). They can't fall in love with the very young offensive wunderkind a la McDaniels.

I'm confident that a *name* will only sign if Vinny is fired.

Agree in totality.

[SkinsKY]

Hahaha brilliant av!!

Thanks a buddy of mine found it somewhere.