I Love this Front Office!

[Nomad]

No num-nutted Dansby, Peppers, Rolle signings. We have accepted we won't be winning the SB in the next two years, but may finally have a chance to after that. This is what we should have been doing a decade ago!

We made FAs offers, but didn't get into bidding wars, and let them walk rather than the Vinny/Snyder we-have-to-have-them-and-get-played-and-overpay routine.

Awesome.

Peppers is not worth what Chicago paid. Nor was Rolle for Giants. Let Chicago be the new Washington, offseason champion. There are few great FAs, ones we bring in should be at modest price.

I expect us to try and sign 10 - 15 FAs, all second tier players. I expect us to offer very fair market value contracts, with big time incentives if the player actually produces, to large numbers of players, shrug at the ones that say no, bring in the ones that say yes, let them compete, and pay the ones that produce. Lowball offers with incentives to players like Thomas Jones and LT would not surprise me. Nor would us looting other team's practice squads as year progresses.

Vinny is gone, and I'm loving it.

Finally, finally, finally, finally a real front office!

Finally the long, hard road that could lead to real success, rather than the fool's gold of free agency every year. Finally the main FA's pursued are in the trenches rather than the skill positions.

We need bodies. If Bradford is Shanahan's man, and Rams pass on him, would love to see us draft him, then trade Campbell. We'd have Grossman, Bradford, Brennan. I doubt anyone is coughing up a second for Campbell, especially in this draft. But we need bodies. A 3rd and some lower pick, or a large number of lower picks, is exactly what we need. I could see the FO being very happy getting three 4 - 6th round picks for Campbell, and being able to draft late round RB and zone blocking linemen. It is not absurd to think, given Shanny's history with late round linemen and RBs, that these players could be genuine contributors. I don't have time to look, but which teams interested in Campbell, if any, have 8+ picks, and might part with 3rd and some lower pick?

Most of the dead weight Jurassic overpaid underproducers gone (ARE's remarks about being surprised at being cut made me fall out of my seat laughing, and summarizes everything wrong with old regime), our big name player CP in a system that will finally use his skills, quick cuts uphill running, a potential franchise QB at #4 to start off the new regime properly, with the most important position solidified, and the QB put in a system that emphasizes his strengths.

Thank bajimminy for uncapped year that let us cut the dinosaurs without being $40 million or whatever ghastly sum it would have been over the cap. Snyder the tit should count his blessings for that salvation.

I love where this is heading. This is EXACTLY how you run a team.

I am pumped!!!

[BurgundyNGold]

I have never seen a vacuum evoke so much excitement lol.

Still, given the current FA crop, I can't say that there was much to pick from and they certainly didn't reach. That's refreshing.

Oh, and the Redskins haven't signed Grossman yet. If they do, you might have to hold off on that whole "real front office" proclamation for a little bit lol.

[akhhorus]

We'll revisit this after the offseason ends. I have a feeling that we're lying in the weeds on some players.

[Redskinmayhem]

We'll revisit this after the offseason ends. I have a feeling that we're lying in the weeds on some players.

Care to mention who? I'm wondering what players are out there that fill our needs.

[Fathead]

Just having every pundit in america go "WTF is with the Redskins" at this point in the offseason and not have it be about overspending is so nice.

[skin4ever]

We'll revisit this after the offseason ends. I have a feeling that we're lying in the weeds on some players.

+1. I think as we approach the draft and during the draft teams will start to make moves on RFA's.

Still i think(hoping really) that even after the draft we will be able to agree with the original posters view.

[NCskinsfanatic]

Well...I'd prefer a happy medium between being way to frugal(as I feel we have been thus far) and being way too aggressive(as in past years under Snyderatto). I'm certainly not upset with the front office but I think we've let a few guys we could use leave only to sign reasonable contracts elsewhere. If we allow Foote to leave after visiting today he'll be a Cardinal and another solid option will be lost with starting caliber options dwindling day by day.

[akhhorus]

Care to mention who? I'm wondering what players are out there that fill our needs.

Restricted FAs like Jeremy Trueblood, Bushrod, Strief, Atogwe, etc.

[Nomad]

I have never seen a vacuum evoke so much excitement lol.

Still, given the current FA crop, I can't say that there was much to pick from and they certainly didn't reach. That's refreshing.

Oh, and the Redskins haven't signed Grossman yet. If they do, you might have to hold off on that whole "real front office" proclamation for a little bit lol.

Grossman is a serviceable back-up who knows the Shanny system. As a starter, horrific signing. As a back-up, good signing.

[Nomad]

Well...I'd prefer a happy medium between being way to frugal(as I feel we have been thus far) and being way too aggressive(as in past years under Snyderatto). I'm certainly not upset with the front office but I think we've let a few guys we could use leave only to sign reasonable contracts elsewhere. If we allow Foote to leave after visiting today he'll be a Cardinal and another solid option will be lost with starting caliber options dwindling day by day.

This is a long term proposition. Players have traditionally come here for one reason and one reason only: to get paid. The Cards have been in a SB recently, and have a solid roster already. If you only had a few years left, you'd go to a team known far and wide to be one of the most dysfunctional in the NFL, with no OL, no QB, holes everywhere, and 5 draft picks? Now that we won't drop our pants and let agents aim for penetration, we will lose many FAs. I'm fine with that. Sign lots of second tier guys, let them compete, change the culture, and then free agents will come here for market value. We could "overpay" slightly for second tier FAs and pay $100,000 more. Versus $10 million more for big names. Overpaying a little for 12 second tier FAs is less expensive than overpaying one Haynesworth. And the totality of the effect of having numerous hungry individuals competing for positions, trying to win starting jobs and reach incentives in contracts, will be FAR greater than any Peppers or Dansby or Haynesworth.

The notion that there are tons of quick, "starting caliber" options available is the old Vinny mentality. You DEVELOP starters, you don't just hope to cherry pick them in free agency.

Being frugal was the right choice here. The only reasonably young FA stud who was worth the money was Dansby. He is the ONLY big name, big money FA that may have been worthwhile. Yet again, if you were him, you would come to this goat rodeo--and believe me, insiders know all the dysfunctional Snyder a-hole stories we only get whiffs of--rather than to an improving team in Miami with oodles of draft picks manning the trenches and a promising young QB, run by Parcells who has had success everywhere? If we signed Dansby, it would have cost way more, because of who we are. That is the truth. For what it would have cost us to sign him, it would have been a bad signing.

In summary, the presumption that the players we lost would have signed those same reasonable contracts here is flat out wrong. But why not roll into town and see if Snyder-the-Sucker will offer you a King's Ransom.

The fact that he hasn't is cause for rejoicing.

This view of the Redskins can and may change quickly once Shanny starts winning. But for now, you are what you are, and it is what it is.

[Nomad]

We'll revisit this after the offseason ends. I have a feeling that we're lying in the weeds on some players.

I agree. I think they are making much more sane offers to players. I think some players are going to try and get more than they are worth, and then come back our way. I still think we will be willing to overpay modestly, and offer higher than normal incentives if player produces--but nothing like old days.

Right now I think we have very quietly made very reasonable offers to a number of FAs, or expressed interest at sane numbers. I think players are still holding out, hoping for more.

Traditionally under Snyder, the skins have had NO nuts in negotiations, and get so afraid of losing players they overpay. It is good to see us letting some guys walk, so agents know we can't be juked and jived into overpaying on EVERY free agent deal.

But I agree. The plan can't be to cut 10 guys, have 10 more that shouldn't be on any NFL roster, have 5 draft picks, and somehow fill the roster.

Like or hate my views, this is what I have ALWAYS said we should be doing, and I am pumped. Even Daniel Snyder can learn, it seems, it is just a slow, grueling, glacial process.

[warpaint]

We'll revisit this after the offseason ends. I have a feeling that we're lying in the weeds on some players.

have to agree ,lying in the weeds now vs smoking the weed before, only explaination for some of the previous signings, isnt it something after several drinks and right before closing time how good all the ladies start to look lol ,its the morning after that you realise what a mistake you made, with the redskins its 10 years later.

[NCskinsfanatic]

This is a long term proposition. Players have traditionally come here for one reason and one reason only: to get paid. The Cards have been in a SB recently, and have a solid roster already. If you only had a few years left, you'd go to a team known far and wide to be one of the most dysfunctional in the NFL, with no OL, no QB, holes everywhere, and 5 draft picks? Now that we won't drop our pants and let agents aim for penetration, we will lose many FAs. I'm fine with that. Sign lots of second tier guys, let them compete, change the culture, and then free agents will come here for market value. We could "overpay" slightly for second tier FAs and pay $100,000 more. Versus $10 million more for big names. Overpaying a little for 12 second tier FAs is less expensive than overpaying one Haynesworth. And the totality of the effect of having numerous hungry individuals competing for positions, trying to win starting jobs and reach incentives in contracts, will be FAR greater than any Peppers or Dansby or Haynesworth.

The notion that there are tons of quick, "starting caliber" options available is the old Vinny mentality. You DEVELOP starters, you don't just hope to cherry pick them in free agency.

Being frugal was the right choice here. The only reasonably young FA stud who was worth the money was Dansby. He is the ONLY big name, big money FA that may have been worthwhile. Yet again, if you were him, you would come to this goat rodeo--and believe me, insiders know all the dysfunctional Snyder a-hole stories we only get whiffs of--rather than to an improving team in Miami with oodles of draft picks manning the trenches and a promising young QB, run by Parcells who has had success everywhere? If we signed Dansby, it would have cost way more, because of who we are. That is the truth. For what it would have cost us to sign him, it would have been a bad signing.

In summary, the presumption that the players we lost would have signed those same reasonable contracts here is flat out wrong. But why not roll into town and see if Snyder-the-Sucker will offer you a King's Ransom.

The fact that he hasn't is cause for rejoicing.

This view of the Redskins can and may change quickly once Shanny starts winning. But for now, you are what you are, and it is what it is.

I cant argue with that logic at all Nomad, but after cutting 10 players and increasing the amount of holes we had we better get busy filling them. My complaint is the 2nd tier guys you mentioned arent expensive and in all actuality are the top of this years limited UFA market. The drop off gets considerable especially at OT after the likes of Clifton, Pashos, etc. If we're just gonna replace Heyer and Mike Williams with players of the same ilk(career backups that wouldnt be able to start on any OL except ours) then are we really improving?

Again if the FA market was loaded with guys that would be even minimal upgrades and we had more than 5 draft picks then by all means be frugal, take your time, let a few of the top guys sign elsewhere...no worries. But in an uncapped year, with 2/3rds of the FA's back ups or worse then you cant keep passing on guys that can improve your roster at a reasonable price.

I dont buy that Pashos would only sign here for ridiculous money, if that were the case I dont think we would have landed Hicks. We were likely a mil or so off from what Cleveland offered with some incentive based language. And if Forester wasnt high on Pashos why bother to attend the wine and dine session with Shanny?/

Rumor is we were willing to pay Clifton but he didnt want to leave GB. So I think we just have to be a little more aggressive, just not to the ridiculous extent of the past. Foote is a definate need, is cheaper than Dansby and provides veteran leadership in a system he's familar with... if we lowball him watch him sign a modest deal in AZ and then we're probably left trying to force round pegs like Rocky into square holes.

With 5 picks and lukewarm interest in our disgrunteled, underwhelming RFA's I dont see what other options we really have but to try to nab guys closer to the top in UFA rather than the bottom. A lot of depth and answers have to be found in free agency and if those options dwindle to the likes of guys like the ones we just cut then we've done nothing but cut off our nose to spite our face.

Long term maybe this overly frugal approach reins in the free spending culture but I want a competetive team, even if we finish 6-10 this year. One that isnt sticking guys that have no business starting in positions they're ill suited for just to say hey look at us we're no ones meal tickets. The Browns, Bills, Bucs and Lions already have that market cornered and that's not company I want to keep just to restore Danny's image.

Again I just want a happy medium, not too far one direction or the other. Sign guys that fit and are affordable not the left overs in late summer just to show we can be fiscally responsible, that's almost as bad as a Vinny move. It's like saying the OL is fine with the addition of Hicks who can play 4 positions but isnt a starter at any lol... I thought the object was to win games, and improve the talent level of our team not win PR contests. Yipee look at us we now have the 4th lowest payroll in the NFL... at this rate we'll also have a top 4 pick again next year, if there is a next year.

[akhhorus]

I agree. I think they are making much more sane offers to players. I think some players are going to try and get more than they are worth, and then come back our way. I still think we will be willing to overpay modestly, and offer higher than normal incentives if player produces--but nothing like old days.

Right now I think we have very quietly made very reasonable offers to a number of FAs, or expressed interest at sane numbers. I think players are still holding out, hoping for more.

Traditionally under Snyder, the skins have had NO nuts in negotiations, and get so afraid of losing players they overpay. It is good to see us letting some guys walk, so agents know we can't be juked and jived into overpaying on EVERY free agent deal.

But I agree. The plan can't be to cut 10 guys, have 10 more that shouldn't be on any NFL roster, have 5 draft picks, and somehow fill the roster.

Like or hate my views, this is what I have ALWAYS said we should be doing, and I am pumped. Even Daniel Snyder can learn, it seems, it is just a slow, grueling, glacial process.

It is? Peter King reported today that the skins probably wanted Peppers, but not at the price quoted, so it just sounds like the new braintrust just won't overpay, not that they won't bring in older vet players at relatively big deals.

And the skins don't have enough draft picks to fill even just the holes in the starting lineup currently, so there's moves coming with this team for vets.

[shally]

It is? Peter King reported today that the skins probably wanted Peppers, but not at the price quoted, so it just sounds like the new braintrust just won't overpay, not that they won't bring in older vet players at relatively big deals.

And the skins don't have enough draft picks to fill even just the holes in the starting lineup currently, so there's moves coming with this team for vets.

you might be right about trades.. we might see a few people like Rocky, Rogers and Campbell dealt for draft picks. if we sign Foote, Rocky is as good as gone. Rogers is playing himself off the team and Campbell is going to go for draft picks, i think

[silverspring]

The change of pace has been refreshing, but i don't think you can make any real judgment until after the draft. Also in terms of being frugal, while I am an advocate of using our resources smarter, I am not so sure being stingy is the smartest thing to do in a rare uncapped year.

[bigcmr]

Its night and day compaired to vinny. I like this new FO a lot.

[NCskinsfanatic]

you might be right about trades.. we might see a few people like Rocky, Rogers and Campbell dealt for draft picks. if we sign Foote, Rocky is as good as gone. Rogers is playing himself off the team and Campbell is going to go for draft picks, i think

Maybe so shally, but they're starters who would likely bring back low 2nd rounders to low 4th rounders. People know we're not high on them so unless we trade them for equally disgruntled players what would we do for starters at QB( I think Bradford will be gone at 4), LB and CB? Unless we trade them for starters trading them would just ensure we'd field a less talented starting unit than last year and I thought the premise was to improve this offseason not play more guys with no business starting in the NFL.

Also just an fyi but I just read where the Steelers are interested in re-acquiring Foote, if he leaves town today imo he wont be playing for us.

[wave6ten]

I think the Saints have to lose a tackle...theres no way to keep all 4 which are all serviceable...we should target Bushrod.

[BurgundyNGold]

Grossman is a serviceable back-up who knows the Shanny system. As a starter, horrific signing. As a back-up, good signing.
If you cannot put the guy in the game because a horrific outcome is all but guaranteed, it is physically impossible for it to be a good signing. He'd be a good signing as a position coach, perhaps, but a waste of money and a roster spot as a player.

[The Skinsinator]

It almost sounds like Foote/Parker are a package deal (know they really aren't.) I think both would be solid pickups. I like Parker's ypc alot and not a tremendous amount of tread on his tires. Just needs to stay healthy. Foote sounds like a solid backer who isn't terribly old that is knowledgeable with the 3-4. Neither should break the bank that for whatever reason seems to be an important consideration this free agency period. :D

[Nomad]

I cant argue with that logic at all Nomad, but after cutting 10 players and increasing the amount of holes we had we better get busy filling them. My complaint is the 2nd tier guys you mentioned arent expensive and in all actuality are the top of this years limited UFA market. The drop off gets considerable especially at OT after the likes of Clifton, Pashos, etc. If we're just gonna replace Heyer and Mike Williams with players of the same ilk(career backups that wouldnt be able to start on any OL except ours) then are we really improving?

THIS ISN'T A 1 YEAR PROPOSITION. SIMPLY CREATING AN ATMOSPHERE IN WHICH EVERY POSITION IS TRULY OPEN TO COMPETITION AND EVERYONE HAS TO PLAY BY SAME RULES (NO FAT AL RUNNING TO SNYDER, CLINTON SHOWS UP IN SHAPE, ETC.) WOULD BE A BIG DEAL. AGREE THIS YEARS FA MARKET IS VERY LIMITED--BUT THERE ARE ALWAYS SOME QUALITY GUYS. I THINK THE MOST IMPORTANT THING IS GUYS WHO FIT YOUR SYSTEM. PORTIS NEVER FIT THE SYSTEM WE RAN--UNTIL NOW. CAMPBELL NEVER FIT THE SYSTEM WE RAN UNDER ZORN. JASON TAYLOR DIDN'T ONLY NOT FIT THE SYSTEM, HE WAS MOVED TO A POSITION HE COULDN'T BE EXPECTED TO PLAY WELL, ETC. COLTS, STEELER,S, ETC. FLOURISH WITH NO NAME PLAYERS REGULARLY BECAUSE THEY BRING IN HARD WORKING CHARACTER GUYS WHO FIT THEIR SYSTEM, STICK WITH THAT SYSTEM, AND HAVE PLAYERS LEARN IT FOR YEARS SO THAT IT BECOMES INSTINCTUAL. IT IS POSSIBLE TO IMPROVE DRASTICALLY WITH SECOND TIER PLAYERS THAT GIVE THEIR ALL. BUT YOU STILL NEED TALENT, AND UPGRADING TALENT SIGNIFICANTLY IS A LONG TERM PROPOSITION.

Again if the FA market was loaded with guys that would be even minimal upgrades and we had more than 5 draft picks then by all means be frugal, take your time, let a few of the top guys sign elsewhere...no worries. But in an uncapped year, with 2/3rds of the FA's back ups or worse then you cant keep passing on guys that can improve your roster at a reasonable price.

YES, YOU CAN, AND THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT YOU NEED TO DO. THE ENTIRE PANIC MENTALITY YOU ESPOUSE TYPIFIES THE VINNY ERA. THIS MESS ISN'T BEING OVERHAULED IN ONE SEASON, AND THERE IS NO HAVE TO HAVE FA. GOOD GM'S KEEP A SENSE OF LONG TERM PERSPECTIVE. IN PARTICULAR, THERE COULD VERY WELL BE A LOCKOUT NEXT YEAR, AND LOWER TIER PLAYERS NEED A PAYCHECK THIS YEAR. WE HAVE SOME LEVERAGE--WITH LOWER TIER PLAYERS. WE ALSO NEED TO CHANGE THE PERCEPTION OF THIS FRANCHISE WITH AGENTS. YOU NEED TO START PAYING MARKET PRICE FOR PLAYERS, NOT WELL ABOVE IT. AND THAT CAN ONLY HAPPEN BY SAYING NO A FEW TIMES, BEING PATIENT, SO THAT YOUR WORD IN NEGOTIATIONS CARRIES WEIGHT.

I dont buy that Pashos would only sign here for ridiculous money, if that were the case I dont think we would have landed Hicks. We were likely a mil or so off from what Cleveland offered with some incentive based language. And if Forester wasnt high on Pashos why bother to attend the wine and dine session with Shanny?/

I NEVER MENTIONED PASHOS. I MENTIONED DANSBY. THIS FRANCHISE IS KNOWN TO BE A BLACKHOLE OF SELFISHNESS AND DYSFUNCTION WHERE YOU COME TO GET PAID BIG BUT FLOUNDER. IF YOU THINK OTHERWISE, DREAM ON. THIS CAN AND WILL CHANGE, BUT WE ARE/WERE NOT A DESIRABLE PLACE COMPARED TO STABLE, WINNING FRANCHISES. YOU EVER HEAR THE BS LIKE HAYNESWORTH, LAVAR, ETC. AT THE STEELERS OR COLTS? YOU ATTEND THE WINE AND DINE BECAUSE SNYDER WAS KNOWN TO THROW OBSCENE MONEY AT ALMOST ANYONE--UNTIL WE DIDN'T THIS YEAR. ONLY AN ABSOLUTE MORON WOULDN'T MAKE AN EXPLORATORY VISIT TO DADDY WARBUCKS TO BEGIN FREE AGENCY.

Rumor is we were willing to pay Clifton but he didnt want to leave GB. So I think we just have to be a little more aggressive, just not to the ridiculous extent of the past. Foote is a definate need, is cheaper than Dansby and provides veteran leadership in a system he's familar with... if we lowball him watch him sign a modest deal in AZ and then we're probably left trying to force round pegs like Rocky into square holes.

NONE OF US KNOW WHAT WE WERE WILLING TO PAY CLIFTON, BUT "WORD IS" HE TOOK LESS TO STAY IN GREEN BAY. IT IS NOT A ONE YEAR PROPOSITION. THERE IS NO WAY WE COMPETE FOR A SB NEXT TWO, MAYBE EVEN THREE YEARS. WE NEED TO AMASS PICKS, AND DRAFT AND DEVELOP A FOOTE, NOT SIGN ONE. AND I STILL SAY, IN GENERAL, PLAYERS WILL WANT MORE TO SIGN HERE.

With 5 picks and lukewarm interest in our disgrunteled, underwhelming RFA's I dont see what other options we really have but to try to nab guys closer to the top in UFA rather than the bottom. A lot of depth and answers have to be found in free agency and if those options dwindle to the likes of guys like the ones we just cut then we've done nothing but cut off our nose to spite our face.

ACCEPT WE ARE A .500 TEAM THIS YEAR--OPTIMISTICALLY. A REAL GM--AND THANK GOD WE FINALLY HAVE ONE--IS REALISTICALLY LOOKING AT THE TEAM HE WILL HAVE IN THREE YEARS, AND MAKING DECISIONS TO HAVE A GOOD, YOUNG ROSTER BY THEN. YOU BRING IN AS MANY STOPGAPS AS YOU CAN, SOME PROVEN VETS NEAR THE END OF CAREER, SOME LOWER TIER YOUNG ERPLAYERS THAT SHOW SOME SPARK OCCASIONALLY ON FILM AND WHOM YOU THINK YOU CAN DEVELOP, LET THEM COMPETE, AND HOPEFULLY SOME THUMPERS EMERGE. YOU VALUE DRAFT PICKS, TRADING THEM ONLY TO ACQUIRE FRANCHISE QB. YOU DRAFT SMART TWO YEARS.

Long term maybe this overly frugal approach reins in the free spending culture but I want a competetive team, even if we finish 6-10 this year. One that isnt sticking guys that have no business starting in positions they're ill suited for just to say hey look at us we're no ones meal tickets. The Browns, Bills, Bucs and Lions already have that market cornered and that's not company I want to keep just to restore Danny's image.

THAT SUPERFAN THIS YEAR AT ALL COSTS MENTALITY IS THE WAY SNYDERATTO RAN THINGS. THIS TEAM HAS BEEN RUN INTO THE GROUND FOR A DECADE. TIME TO PAY THE PIPER, AND THAT MEANS YOU REBUILD THE RIGHT WAY--THROUGH THE DRAFT, AND WITH REASONABLY PRICED FAs. YOU WOULD BE AMAZED AT THE MASSIVE DIFFERENCE SIMPLE CONSISTENCY OF SCHEME, SIMPLIFICATION OF SCHEME, ROSTER-WIDE COMPETITION, AND DOING A FEW THINGS WELL CONSISTENTLY CAN MAKE. BUT IT WILL TAKE YEARS.

Again I just want a happy medium, not too far one direction or the other. Sign guys that fit and are affordable not the left overs in late summer just to show we can be fiscally responsible, that's almost as bad as a Vinny move. It's like saying the OL is fine with the addition of Hicks who can play 4 positions but isnt a starter at any lol... I thought the object was to win games, and improve the talent level of our team not win PR contests. Yipee look at us we now have the 4th lowest payroll in the NFL... at this rate we'll also have a top 4 pick again next year, if there is a next year.

IT IS NOT EVEN THE SAME BALLPARK AS VINNY MOVE. WE ARE FINALLY BEING RUN LIKE A REAL FRANCHISE. YOU CAN'T PERPETUALLY MORTGAGE THE FUTURE FOR THE PRESENT. THE WAY TO WIN IS DRAFT AND DEVELOP PLAYERS--THIS SHOULD BE THE CORE OF YOUR TEAM. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH PR. YET AGAIN, YOUR MENTALITY IS SHORT-TERM, REACTIVE SUPERFAN RATHER THAN GM LOOKING TO BUILD A CONTENDER. CLIFTON WASN'T WORTH WHAT GREENBAY PAID HIM. I'M GLAD WE DIDN'T SIGN HIM. I'D RATHER DRAFT AND DEVELOP A T. WE WILL SIGN SEVERAL FAs, BUT AT MUCH MORE REASONABLE PRICES--WHICH WILL MATTER AFTER THIS YEAR, AND THIS IS WHAT A REAL GM DOES, ESPECIALLY IN A FA CROP THIS THIN. THE TRUTH IS THAT NONE OF OLs AVAILABLE WAS A LONG TERM SOLUTION--UNLESS YOU FIND A GEM AMONG LOWER TIER FAs AND DEVELOP HIM MORE. THE ONLY LONG TERM SOLUTIONS OL ARE TRADES OR DRAFT--AND WE SHOULD DRAFT. A TOP 4 PICK NEXT YEAR WOULD BE AWESOME--CAUSE WE AREN'T WINNING THE SB NEXT YEAR EITHER. I'D RATHER HAVE THE INFUSION OF TALENT AND HAVE A REAL SHOT AT BEING A CONTENDER YEAR 3 ONWARD.

[Nomad]

It is? Peter King reported today that the skins probably wanted Peppers, but not at the price quoted, so it just sounds like the new braintrust just won't overpay, not that they won't bring in older vet players at relatively big deals.

WITHOUT KNOWING THE SPECIFIC NUMBERS, AND MORE IMPORTANTLY STRUCTURE OF CONTRACT, WHO CAN SAY. WHAT WE CAN SAY WITH CERTAINTY IS THAT SO FAR THEY HAVE MADE NO BIG SIGNINGS, WHICH IS GREAT.

And the skins don't have enough draft picks to fill even just the holes in the starting lineup currently, so there's moves coming with this team for vets.

AGREED. AND WE SHOULD HOLD THE LINE AND GET THOSE LOWER TIER VETS AT REASONABLE PRICES. HOW MANY UFAs WILL WE HAVE IN CAMP AFTER THE DRAFT DO YOU THINK, IN THOUSANDS?

[Nomad]

The change of pace has been refreshing, but i don't think you can make any real judgment until after the draft. Also in terms of being frugal, while I am an advocate of using our resources smarter, I am not so sure being stingy is the smartest thing to do in a rare uncapped year.

THEY HAVE NOT BEEN STINGY YET. IT IS A FEW DAYS INTO A LENGTHY FREE AGENCY. SO FAR, THIS FO HAS RESISTED OVERPAYING, NOT BEEN STINGY. BIG FAs WANTED MULTI-YEAR DEALS, AND THIS WILL EFFECT A CAP. WHEN YOU NEED 30+ NEW PLAYERS, THE TWO BIG NAMES ARE IMMATERIAL.

[Patrick]

Nomad take your cap lock off.

I going to hold judgment on this FO. Let's wait and see how this all works out.

[akhhorus]

Stop writing in all caps.


WITHOUT KNOWING THE SPECIFIC NUMBERS, AND MORE IMPORTANTLY STRUCTURE OF CONTRACT, WHO CAN SAY. WHAT WE CAN SAY WITH CERTAINTY IS THAT SO FAR THEY HAVE MADE NO BIG SIGNINGS, WHICH IS GREAT.

Thats not really the point, the point was that the skins aren't doing what you want them to and aren't trying for any big signings when they were interested(to a point) in a player that would violate your beliefs.

AGREED. AND WE SHOULD HOLD THE LINE AND GET THOSE LOWER TIER VETS AT REASONABLE PRICES. HOW MANY UFAs WILL WE HAVE IN CAMP AFTER THE DRAFT DO YOU THINK, IN THOUSANDS?

We're not going to wait that long, nor will we be signing a bunch of lower tier guys. We need starters and depth, not just depth.

[Keino]

It almost sounds like Foote/Parker are a package deal (know they really aren't.) I think both would be solid pickups. I like Parker's ypc alot and not a tremendous amount of tread on his tires. Just needs to stay healthy. Foote sounds like a solid backer who isn't terribly old that is knowledgeable with the 3-4. Neither should break the bank that for whatever reason seems to be an important consideration this free agency period. :D

Foote would be a starter for sure.

Personally, I am going to withhold proclamations of my love for this front office. I think making any affirmative declarations either way with free agency being 4 days old is slightly premature.

I'll have a better handle on the whole front office dealio in August.

[LATrueRedskin]

Foote would be a starter for sure.

Personally, I am going to withhold proclamations of my love for this front office. I think making any affirmative declarations either way with free agency being 4 days old is slightly premature.

I'll have a better handle on the whole front office dealio in August.

Agreed. Way too early to tell either way.

[Taylor21TheUndertaker]

yeah, moves will be made before draft day i presume

[skinsfan36]

hoping to see rogers traded atleast. he is an idiot who ahs became an average corner. any news on foote. jason reid is an awful beat writer or this new regime is very quiet with what they do even with visits

[lorimike]

hoping to see rogers traded atleast. he is an idiot who ahs became an average corner. any news on foote. jason reid is an awful beat writer or this new regime is very quiet with what they do even with visits

You can't trade trash for treasure. All the reasons why you want Carlos Rogers gone, is exactly why no one's going to give you much

[Red Bear]

Restricted FAs like Jeremy Trueblood, Bushrod, Strief, Atogwe, etc.

and i believe with Atogwe's tender he can be had without having to give up any draft pick compensation, but the Rams will have the right to match an offer made to him

[NCskinsfanatic]

IT IS NOT EVEN THE SAME BALLPARK AS VINNY MOVE. WE ARE FINALLY BEING RUN LIKE A REAL FRANCHISE. YOU CAN'T PERPETUALLY MORTGAGE THE FUTURE FOR THE PRESENT. THE WAY TO WIN IS DRAFT AND DEVELOP PLAYERS--THIS SHOULD BE THE CORE OF YOUR TEAM. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH PR. YET AGAIN, YOUR MENTALITY IS SHORT-TERM, REACTIVE SUPERFAN RATHER THAN GM LOOKING TO BUILD A CONTENDER. CLIFTON WASN'T WORTH WHAT GREENBAY PAID HIM. I'M GLAD WE DIDN'T SIGN HIM. I'D RATHER DRAFT AND DEVELOP A T. WE WILL SIGN SEVERAL FAs, BUT AT MUCH MORE REASONABLE PRICES--WHICH WILL MATTER AFTER THIS YEAR, AND THIS IS WHAT A REAL GM DOES, ESPECIALLY IN A FA CROP THIS THIN. THE TRUTH IS THAT NONE OF OLs AVAILABLE WAS A LONG TERM SOLUTION--UNLESS YOU FIND A GEM AMONG LOWER TIER FAs AND DEVELOP HIM MORE. THE ONLY LONG TERM SOLUTIONS OL ARE TRADES OR DRAFT--AND WE SHOULD DRAFT. A TOP 4 PICK NEXT YEAR WOULD BE AWESOME--CAUSE WE AREN'T WINNING THE SB NEXT YEAR EITHER. I'D RATHER HAVE THE INFUSION OF TALENT AND HAVE A REAL SHOT AT BEING A CONTENDER YEAR 3 ONWARD.

Lol, are you yelling or did you hit cap lock. I dont think it's a short term menatality to sign reasonable players like Foote, Pashos, etc. I'd much rather do that than sign Peppers and Dansby or on the flip side end up having to sign the likes of John Tait or Damion McIntosh because we waited too long and couldnt pony up a mil more for a better OT. I want to sign the best players at reasonable prices that can help bridge the gap for a draft or two not guys that cant push BMW and Heyer down the depth chart.

So I guess you're saying there's no in between for you...we have to wait until the best guys are off the board and we're sorting through the left overs to be a competent , fiscally responsible, long term thinking franchise. I mean it's not like I'm suggesting we sign guys to ridiculous deals nor do I think we should have to choose from guys that no one else wants either...whats so irresponsible about that?

[Redskinmayhem]

hoping to see rogers traded atleast. he is an idiot who ahs became an average corner. any news on foote. jason reid is an awful beat writer or this new regime is very quiet with what they do even with visits

wondering the same about Foote.

[greatest2]

loading up to have cap space for 2011, when there will be a slew of players on the market??????

sorry to burst you bubble but that may be the plan. Its going to take more then one offseason to convince me but i am hopeful...

[BurgundyNGold]

Lol, are you yelling or did you hit cap lock. I dont think it's a short term menatality to sign reasonable players like Foote, Pashos, etc. I'd much rather do that than sign Peppers and Dansby or on the flip side end up having to sign the likes of John Tait or Damion McIntosh because we waited too long and couldnt pony up a mil more for a better OT. I want to sign the best players at reasonable prices that can help bridge the gap for a draft or two not guys that cant push BMW and Heyer down the depth chart.

So I guess you're saying there's no in between for you...we have to wait until the best guys are off the board and we're sorting through the left overs to be a competent , fiscally responsible, long term thinking franchise. I mean it's not like I'm suggesting we sign guys to ridiculous deals nor do I think we should have to choose from guys that no one else wants either...whats so irresponsible about that?
Exactly. If anything, I'm subconsciously disappointed because our franchise does everything to extremes.

[CNYSkinFan]

Exactly. If anything, I'm subconsciously disappointed because our franchise does everything to extremes.
this is not unlike the second gibbs year 2005 where we added Patten and Rabach but pretty much stayed pat when we had a high (#10) draft pick. I am not sure this is a sea change yet. (of course then we over reached in the draft for JC trading too early and too much)

Danny can be subdued for one season. But like many I am waiting and seeing. I would love us to trade down, pick up picks, address the line, go 8-8 and then add pieces to build a perennial powerhouse beyond 2011

[Hr fan]

We hear about "it's a process"' but when we are in one it can be frustrating. While only the FO knows what motivates it's actions and they aren't sharing this knowledge with us, some speculations can be made:

Clifton - best UFA LT, but 31 and beginning to have injury lost games. GB lowballs at $5M, we go $7M at 2 years with guarantees consistent, GB ups it marginally with higher guarantee and 3rd year. Not worth it to us, especially 3rd year, and Clifton naturally would not want to relocate his family if GB matches.

Pashos - probably best at RT, and we need one. Available since Cle no more attractive than us, especially coming from SF. At best a mid-level talent with declining production. May have felt they can do better, for instance a 5th rounder as suggested by Akh (Marinelli, etc.).

Hicks - body young since he entered NFL at @24 I believe. Good experience snd versatility (background reminds me of Ray Brown). Depth with as needed starting in a pinch potential, not a regular. Certainly better than ANY player we had as depth last year.

Dansby got record $ (and I don't believe he is the best LB in the NFL by any means), Peppers inconsistent and looking for a position shift (good luck on his being worth his money in those conditions for at least 18 months), etc.

FO is looking to shore up our weakest areas but not to commit to players that won't be regulars 3 years from now. Sort of hamstrung by lack of draft choices. For instance can't directly go for Kirk Morrison since we have no 3rd.

The situation needs to develop before we can become players. Above all draft choices are gold - this is how your core is built. Players that could be moved like JC may await draft day. For instance the SN today shows Bradford going #1 but Clausen not in the 1st round. Ditto players like Moss who may have value but at this moment can not command a fair price.

Two things are evident - we need patience while the situation develops, and in the mean time not to lower the standards that the staff has set for each position until we have to.

[Nomad]

Stop writing in all caps.



Thats not really the point, the point was that the skins aren't doing what you want them to and aren't trying for any big signings when they were interested(to a point) in a player that would violate your beliefs.

MORE AKH ARGUING, NOT EVEN GOING TO WASTE THE TIME.



We're not going to wait that long, nor will we be signing a bunch of lower tier guys. We need starters and depth, not just depth.

BUT THE FACT REMAINS WE DIDN'T SIGN ANY OF THE BIG NAME FAs--WHICH IS GOOD. ALL THAT IS LEFT IS OLDER OR LOWER TIER GUYS.

[Nomad]

We hear about "it's a process"' but when we are in one it can be frustrating. While only the FO knows what motivates it's actions and they aren't sharing this knowledge with us, some speculations can be made:

Clifton - best UFA LT, but 31 and beginning to have injury lost games. GB lowballs at $5M, we go $7M at 2 years with guarantees consistent, GB ups it marginally with higher guarantee and 3rd year. Not worth it to us, especially 3rd year, and Clifton naturally would not want to relocate his family if GB matches.

Pashos - probably best at RT, and we need one. Available since Cle no more attractive than us, especially coming from SF. At best a mid-level talent with declining production. May have felt they can do better, for instance a 5th rounder as suggested by Akh (Marinelli, etc.).

Hicks - body young since he entered NFL at @24 I believe. Good experience snd versatility (background reminds me of Ray Brown). Depth with as needed starting in a pinch potential, not a regular. Certainly better than ANY player we had as depth last year.

Dansby got record $ (and I don't believe he is the best LB in the NFL by any means), Peppers inconsistent and looking for a position shift (good luck on his being worth his money in those conditions for at least 18 months), etc.

FO is looking to shore up our weakest areas but not to commit to players that won't be regulars 3 years from now. Sort of hamstrung by lack of draft choices. For instance can't directly go for Kirk Morrison since we have no 3rd.

The situation needs to develop before we can become players. Above all draft choices are gold - this is how your core is built. Players that could be moved like JC may await draft day. For instance the SN today shows Bradford going #1 but Clausen not in the 1st round. Ditto players like Moss who may have value but at this moment can not command a fair price.

Two things are evident - we need patience while the situation develops, and in the mean time not to lower the standards that the staff has set for each position until we have to.

EXACTLY.

[dj_stouty]

EXACTLY.

Chill out with all the CAPS...

You have already been warned twice by Mods. This is the final warning...

[RedskinsDave]

He was warned already. I deleted his last post that was more than one sentence. Please delete any more posts where he uses all caps too.

[CarMike]

Nomad, you need to listen to Mods when they say stop using all caps. Once is forgivable. Mistakes happen. But if you continue to ignore the warnings, we will be forced to take action.

Now, back to the thread topic. I have never been one to get upset when we tried to make our teams better by adding FAs. So I'll hold off on congratulating the FO so far. If there was a guy out there that made us better, and the FO thought we needed that player, I would have supported the FO in a signing. Not that it matters in the long run. lol

[akhhorus]

MORE AKH ARGUING, NOT EVEN GOING TO WASTE THE TIME.

Its not arguing, its pointing out a fact. You want to claim that not signing big name players is exactly what you wanted them to do as a franchise, except that they're trying to. So, I don't know what you're celebrating.

BUT THE FACT REMAINS WE DIDN'T SIGN ANY OF THE BIG NAME FAs--WHICH IS GOOD. ALL THAT IS LEFT IS OLDER OR LOWER TIER GUYS.

Except that they were interested, which means the skins' FO isn't doing what you want them to.

[flaskinsfan8]

I think the new front office COULD be a great change that our beloved franchise has needed for quite some time now. And note I say "could". The only way that it is going to benefit it is if somehow Snyder manages to stay out the roster decisions that should be left up to Allen and Shanahan. My buddy runs a really good Skins blog that discussed this exact topic earlier this week.

Let's all hope that these two are allowed to utilize their knowledge.

[BurgundyNGold]

I think the new front office COULD be a great change that our beloved franchise has needed for quite some time now. And note I say "could". The only way that it is going to benefit it is if somehow Snyder manages to stay out the roster decisions that should be left up to Allen and Shanahan. My buddy runs a really good Skins blog that discussed this exact topic earlier this week.

Let's all hope that these two are allowed to utilize their knowledge.
Again with this link? Just put the link in your sig and post like a mormal person before you get banned for spamming.

[OCSkinzFan]

BUT THE FACT REMAINS WE DIDN'T SIGN ANY OF THE BIG NAME FAs--WHICH IS GOOD. ALL THAT IS LEFT IS OLDER OR LOWER TIER GUYS.

When you type in all caps it LOOKS LIKE YOU'RE YELLING OR SOMETHING.

See what I mean?

[Irish Redskin]

I do agree Pashos was signed at a decent price for a starting tackle, and I can't imagine he would've preferred to go to Cleveland over DC?

Anywho, I'm going to adopt a wait and see approach before praising or slamming the FO.

[ChiefPowhatan17]

All Free Agent prices are down, since the SKINS aren't chasing anyone.

[BurgundyNGold]

All Free Agent prices are down, since the SKINS aren't chasing anyone.
Not enough, apparently.

[NCskinsfanatic]

Not enough, apparently.

I think they're down enough we just decided we'd model our spending after the Browns, Bengals and Cards...or atleast how those franchises use to spend lol. That and evidentally we're fine filling out the roster with guys with talent equal to Heyer, BMW and Daniels after the 1st and 2nd tier UFA's have all signed reasonable deals.