T-P: Redskins trade for Jammal Brown

[cal_junior]

A source has told me the Redskins have agreed on a trade for Jammal Brown. Still trying to confirm compensation. (http://twitter.com/jeffduncantp/status/16566208030)

[akhhorus]

Haynesworth will be involved I bet.

[Shawnb555]

about time this only took what 3 months to pull off ......sweet deal if tubbs is gone or less than a third

[WinnpegSkinsFan]

Haynesworth will be involved I bet.
God I hope so. I sure we don't give up any draft picks.

[hockeygoalie29]

Haynesworth will be involved I bet.

That's the rumor I'm seeing. If so, I wonder if it involves him returning some of that $21 million.

[cal_junior]

Courtesy Adam Schefter (http://twitter.com/Adam_Schefter/status/16567118269):

"Washington is trying to finalize a trade for Saints OT Jammal Brown. The trade is not believed to involve disgruntled DT Albert Haynesworth."

[akhhorus]

That's the rumor I'm seeing. If so, I wonder if it involves him returning some of that $21 million.

If we're getting Jammal Brown, he can keep it frankly.

[Skinreds]

Adam_Schefter

Washington is trying to finalize a trade for Saints OT Jammal Brown. The trade is not believed to involve disgruntled DT Albert Haynesworth.

I hope this isnt true and that Haynesworth is part of the trade but this is Shefty reporting and he is usaully good.

[Skinreds]

Courtesy Adam Schefter (http://twitter.com/Adam_Schefter/status/16567118269):

"Washington is trying to finalize a trade for Saints OT Jammal Brown. The trade is not believed to involve disgruntled DT Albert Haynesworth."

beat me to it by 1 minute.:smash:

[Redskin006]

If Haynesworth isn't involved, i bet that Rogers or Mcintosh is involved. Especially when considering that they're both Greg Williams' draft picks. Mcintosh is my bet if Haynesworth isn't going.

[OCSkinzFan]

So will Brown be moving to RT. And Hicks will back up RT.

[cal_junior]

So will Brown be moving to RT. And Hicks will back up RT.

Perhaps Hicks to guard and Trent Williams does a season at RT?

[OCSkinzFan]

beat me to it by 1 minute.:smash:
I was just about to post that too:Peace:

[cal_junior]

Jay Glazer (http://twitter.com/Jay_Glazer/status/16567775011):

"I'm reporting saints are trading pro bowl tackle jamaal brown to redskins for conditional draft pick."

[Redskin006]

Perhaps Hicks to guard and Trent Williams does a season at RT?

Ya I agree. From left to right the O-line will probably be the following: Jammal Brown, Dockery, Rabach, Hicks, Trent Williams. That's a vastly improved O-line from last year.

[Fathead]

I don't mind this at all.

[Skinreds]

Perhaps Hicks to guard and Trent Williams does a season at RT?

Shefty says this,

Adam_Schefter

Landing Jammal Brown from N.O. would allow Washington to play him at left tackle with first-round pick Trent Williams at right tackle.

Makes sense, let Williams get accustomed a little better and he will also have less pressure to perform well.

[akhhorus]

Fine by me. Brown is an accomplished left tackle in the prime of his career.

[OCSkinzFan]

Perhaps Hicks to guard and Trent Williams does a season at RT?

I thought about that too, afterall when Brown was drafted he started at RT and moved to LT later.

But Williams is supposed to be "Special" and he's taken all the starting snaps thusfar at LT so... But you're right that Hicks can play guard.

O Line may end up as a strength this comming year.
Everybody say Amen!

[cal_junior]

Rick Maese (http://twitter.com/RickMaese/status/16568073957) says:

"Adding JBrown to OL, Skins either start TWilliams at RT or JBrown at RT. Artis Hicks seems to be most affected by trade. Mike Williams, too."

[LadyNRedskinsfan]

I reallllly wanna know what we gave up, but I like the addition.

[cal_junior]

Schefter again (http://twitter.com/Adam_Schefter/status/16568459271):

"No word on official compensation from Washington to New Orleans, but it's thought to be tied to Jammal Brown's performance in 2010."

[akhhorus]

Schefter again (http://twitter.com/Adam_Schefter/status/16568459271):

"No word on official compensation from Washington to New Orleans, but it's thought to be tied to Jammal Brown's performance in 2010."

So, no one vote for Brown to go to the pro bowl this upcoming season no matter if he picks up DeMarcus Ware during a play and breaks him over his knee.

[smoak]

Schefter again (http://twitter.com/Adam_Schefter/status/16568459271):

"No word on official compensation from Washington to New Orleans, but it's thought to be tied to Jammal Brown's performance in 2010."

Makes sense, but the upside should also be tied to our team success.

[cal_junior]

More details from PFT (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/06/19/jammal-brown-deal-done-if-he-signs-the-tender/):

". . . Brown can't be traded unless he signs his tender offer. Per the source, the Redskins currently are negotiating a long-term extension for Brown. If/when they work it out, he'll sign the tender, get traded, and sign the extension.

The move will reunite Brown with Redskins defensive coordinator Jim Haslett, who drafted Brown out of Oklahoma in 2005."

[InsomniaKiller]

This is such a good move. Our o-line could actually be very solid this year. Considering where the unit was at last year, that would be quite the accomplishment.

[ryflan47]

I had to come out of hibernation because I was so pleased with this. Even better that we don't have to involve AH, now we can improve elsewhere by moving him too. I'm really liking some of the moves by our improved FO. McNabb is going to have some important tools around him this year, it'll be interesting to see how everything comes together.

[Gravy]

Does this mean if he performs at Pro-bowl level, that the Saints get 1st rounder? They can have our 4th rounder in 2012!

[akhhorus]

http://twitter.com/Adam_Schefter/statuses/16568330164

OT Jammal Brown landed in Washington minutes ago. He is scheduled to undergo his physical today. If he passes, the trade will be complete.

[The Skinsinator]

Hard not to like the move just hope the compensation wasn't too much.

Why the hell would New Orleans make this deal? It just makes no sense at all to trade away a critical piece of an awesome offense.

[akhhorus]

Hard not to like the move just hope the compensation wasn't too much.

Why the hell would New Orleans make this deal? It just makes no sense at all to trade away a critical piece of an awesome offense.

Bushrod at LT, Charles Brown(their 2nd round pick this year) behind him, Strief and Stinchcomb at RT. Brown was surplus to need.

[Fathead]

Hard not to like the move just hope the compensation wasn't too much.

Why the hell would New Orleans make this deal? It just makes no sense at all to trade away a critical piece of an awesome offense.

He's an RFA that didn't play last year (injury). They won the Super Bowl with Bushrod at LT, so they didn't want to pay the $$$$ for Brown.

[The Skinsinator]

He's an RFA that didn't play last year (injury). They won the Super Bowl with Bushrod at LT, so they didn't want to pay the $$$$ for Brown.OK got it now. We need to start a poll over/under on a 2nd round pick. Or have an option as a 2nd rounder. I was having nightmares about starting Capers on the right side so I really dig this deal.

[justinskins]

This is the best offseason the team has had in many, many years.

[akhhorus]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/06/19/no-extension-yet-for-jammal-brown/

Meanwhile, word is that the Redskins did not have to give up much for Brown

[The Skinsinator]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/06/19/no-extension-yet-for-jammal-brown/Even better news. I wanna know what it is though. How many picks do we have for the 2011 draft already? Just gave up a 3rd as part of the McNabb package?

[DaveKShape]

This is so awesome. I'm really starting to think we can win big this year.

[akhhorus]

Even better news. I wanna know what it is though. How many picks do we have for the 2011 draft already? Just gave up a 3rd as part of the McNabb package?

3rd or a 4th. I bet the Saints get the pick we don't send to Philly.

[The Skinsinator]

3rd or a 4th. I bet the Saints get the pick we don't send to Philly.That'll work. I'm not going to be surprised if we use of one of those top picks on a new franchise receiver: Julio Jones, AJ Green, or possibly Michael Floyd. Jones and Green already have me salivating.

[Red Bear]

this is a good pickup for the redskins once its finalized, the biggest weakness on the team last year may now be one of the biggest strengths. i also think this could mark the end of stephon heyer...

[akhhorus]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5306133


After Saturday's trade for Brown, Washington will be without its third- and fourth-round picks in 2011, but it also will be getting back a later pick from New Orleans, according to a league source.

Washington owes the Eagles a third- or fourth-round pick in 2011 for McNabb, based on how the quarterback plays or the team performs. If the Redskins win nine games, or go to the playoffs, or McNabb gets selected to the Pro Bowl, then Philadelphia will receive Washington's third-round pick and New Orleans will get Washington's fourth. If none of those happen, then the Eagles will get the Redskins' fourth-round pick and the Saints will get the Redskins' third-round pick.

If Washington's third-round pick goes to Philadelphia, then the Redskins' fourth-round pick will go to New Orleans, with a sixth- or seventh-round pick coming back to Washington from the Saints. However, if Washington's fourth-round pick goes to Philadelphia, then the Redskins' third-round pick will go to New Orleans, with a fifth-round pick coming back to Washington from the Saints.

There is also a conditional 2012 sixth-round pick involved. Should he play 90 percent of the plays next season or get voted to the Pro Bowl, then Washington will send its 2012 sixth-round pick to New Orleans. After Saturday's trade, Washington has six picks left in the 2011 draft.

[The Skinsinator]

this is a good pickup for the redskins once its finalized, the biggest weakness on the team last year may now be one of the biggest strengths. i also think this could mark the end of stephon heyer...Very possible. Could never knock the guy for effort though. I'm still giddy with this move. People need to realize our offensive line was atrocious last year. We also had an average qb and Cooley/Portis out and someone who had no business as head coach calling the shots.

Now we have MAJOR upgrades everywhere and 2 masterminds calling the shots. Loving it guys.

[BurgundyNGold]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5306133


After Saturday's trade for Brown, Washington will be without its third- and fourth-round picks in 2011, but it also will be getting back a later pick from New Orleans, according to a league source.

Washington owes the Eagles a third- or fourth-round pick in 2011 for McNabb, based on how the quarterback plays or the team performs. If the Redskins win nine games, or go to the playoffs, or McNabb gets selected to the Pro Bowl, then Philadelphia will receive Washington's third-round pick and New Orleans will get Washington's fourth. If none of those happen, then the Eagles will get the Redskins' fourth-round pick and the Saints will get the Redskins' third-round pick.

If Washington's third-round pick goes to Philadelphia, then the Redskins' fourth-round pick will go to New Orleans, with a sixth- or seventh-round pick coming back to Washington from the Saints. However, if Washington's fourth-round pick goes to Philadelphia, then the Redskins' third-round pick will go to New Orleans, with a fifth-round pick coming back to Washington from the Saints.

There is also a conditional 2012 sixth-round pick involved. Should he play 90 percent of the plays next season or get voted to the Pro Bowl, then Washington will send its 2012 sixth-round pick to New Orleans. After Saturday's trade, Washington has six picks left in the 2011 draft.
We almost certainly wouldn't get a starting LT of Brown's caliber with either the 3rd or 4th round pick in 2011.

[CapitalDefense]

Very good trade, both Tackle spots are now secured and Hicks can move to RG.

[Keino]

We almost certainly wouldn't get a starting LT of Brown's caliber with either the 3rd or 4th round pick in 2011.

Indeed. On the phone with my father and we both love this. We have Book-end tackles and flexibility on the Oline we didn't have before.

[akhhorus]

We almost certainly wouldn't get a starting LT of Brown's caliber with either the 3rd or 4th round pick in 2011.

Based on the draft value chart, we basically got Brown for a high 3rd or a high 4th(depending on which pick we give the Saints).

Just amazing.

[The Skinsinator]

Indeed. On the phone with my father and we both love this. We have Book-end tackles and flexibility on the Oline we didn't have before.Exactly. New Orleans had the luxury of dealing him with their oline depth. They, and Shanny for that matter understand, how critical oline is. I'm still in disbelief over this deal. We need to use our fastest back (possibly Parker) on sweeps to Williams' side all day long. He will THRIVE in the zone blocking system. Brown is a mauler.

[Red Bear]

i like the deal, it really solidifies us at tackle. we have the young stud, the young probowl vet, the seasoned veteran, and the developmental tackle in stable with williams, brown, hicks, and capers. and maybe hicks will give mike williams more competition at right guard than chad rinehart is. its great that we get a pick back as well next year.

[VegasSkinsFan]

Based on the draft value chart, we basically got Brown for a high 3rd or a high 4th(depending on which pick we give the Saints).

Just amazing.

Wow..if both Brown and Carriker work out, Bruce Allen is my new hero. The guys on NFL Sirius are saying that with Brown, our oline is now the best in the NFC East. Wow. GO SKINS !!!!

[828791Redskins]

Is this what a real front office looks like? Unbelievable.

[The Skinsinator]

The guys on NFL Sirius are saying that with Brown, our oline is now the best in the NFC East. Wow. GO SKINS !!!!I don't know about that but it is a helluva upgrade for sure. And everyone quickly forgets that Donovan McNabb has never had a running game. Mike Shanahan will give him a formidable one this year. If we get mad production from our receivers look out.

[akhhorus]

I don't know about that but it is a helluva upgrade for sure. And everyone quickly forgets that Donovan McNabb has never had a running game. Mike Shanahan will give him a formidable one this year. If we get mad production from our receivers look out.

You must be happy that the skins have 2 starting OTs from Oklahoma now.

[cal_junior]

Dan Steinberg (http://twitter.com/dcsportsbog/status/16572777183) gets in a dig:

"You know what seems to be a great strategy for the Redskins? Trading away draft picks. That's always worked out pretty well."

[justinskins]

We have an Oline, something we didn't have before.

Fixed.

[BurgundyNGold]

Dan Steinberg (http://twitter.com/dcsportsbog/status/16572777183) gets in a dig:

"You know what seems to be a great strategy for the Redskins? Trading away draft picks. That's always worked out pretty well."
That's pretty easy to point out and it's usually correct. I guess he didn't like the McNabb trade for the same reasons.

[MONK_in_HOF]

What a pleasant surprise to click on HR.com and see this news. I absolutely love this trade.

[The Skinsinator]

You must be happy that the skins have 2 starting OTs from Oklahoma now.Yeah for sure. Jammal Brown was spectacular at OU. He was a big reason Peterson ran wild in the Big XII. Him and Williams is a very appealing bookend duo even with the coincidence.

[Gravy]

Indeed. On the phone with my father and we both love this. We have Book-end tackles and flexibility on the Oline we didn't have before.

:Fruit: :Pickle:

[Fathead]

There is zero reason to not love this trade, as a skins fan.

[SKINSATIONAL]

WOOOOOOO HOOOOOO!!! I was hoping for some late season moves concerning the O-Line. This is gr8 ! A mobile line that a defense will have to wonder about. With a solid running game, play action deep should be a beast this year. GO SKINS !!!

[Keino]

There is zero reason to not love this trade, as a skins fan.

The don't give up any draft picks ever because it is mortgaging the future contingent will be around to weigh in on this in 3....2.....1............

[Fathead]

The don't give up any draft picks ever because it is mortgaging the future contingent will be around to weigh in on this in 3....2.....1............

I'm sorry, this is a no brainer. A young LT? At that price?

[akhhorus]

The don't give up any draft picks ever because it is mortgaging the future contingent will be around to weigh in on this in 3....2.....1............

Yeah, its going to be draft pick madlibs...again.

[SKINSATIONAL]

Oh well, you can't please everyone. I love this move.

"I don't know the secret to success but the secret to failure is to try to please everyone." - Bill Cosby

[VegasSkinsFan]

So we went from Campbell/Levi Brown/Heyer to McNabb/Williams/Jamaal Brown. Also from Zorn to Shanahan and vinny to Allen...probably the best offseasoni can remember. Just imagine is AH wasnt such a moron. GO SKINS !!!!

[esmith1790]

me first, me first, me first LOL

They didnt trade for him without an extension on his contract?
Is this a 1 year rental and he walks?
He is too old to be signing to a huge contract.



Please add to the list if i missed some.

[akhhorus]

me first, me first, me first LOL

They didnt trade for him without an extension on his contract?
Is this a 1 year rental and he walks?
He is too old to be signing to a huge contract.



Please add to the list if i missed some.

You forgot:
"Why did Jeruh not sober up long enough to offer slightly more to keep from having Doug Free as your LT this upcoming season. "
or
"Wondering if Stephon Heyer will represent an upgrade from Free when the skins cut him in a couple days?"

He's 29, thats too old for a long term extension? This from a fan of a team who's gave Leonard Davis 50 million when he was 28 year old bust? Or 43 million to a 33 year old Flozell Adams(only to cut him 2 years into the deal). Insert easy comment about stones and glass houses.

[wide_awake]

me first, me first, me first LOL

They didnt trade for him without an extension on his contract?
Is this a 1 year rental and he walks?
He is too old to be signing to a huge contract.



Please add to the list if i missed some.

It's cool, I'd be jealous too if a division rival traded away a 3rd or 4th round pick for one of the better starting left tackles in the league. He just turned 29 a few months ago, definitely too old right?


One of my best friends is a Cowboys fan and I just called to let him know of this deal. He was shocked. There is no doubt we fleeced New Orleans.

[Biggie]

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

I love this deal. Allen and Shanahan have done more to improve this team in six months than Snyder/Vinny did in ten years. I'm really excited to see this offense in action.

[VegasSkinsFan]

Looking at the roster, we now have 16 Oline guys including the long snapper, with 11 of them age 27 or younger. They wont all pan out, but its a decent start. GO SKINS !!!!

[esmith1790]

It's cool, I'd be jealous too if a division rival traded away a 3rd or 4th round pick for one of the better starting left tackles in the league. He just turned 29 a few months ago, definitely too old right?


One of my best friends is a Cowboys fan and I just called to let him know of this deal. He was shocked. There is no doubt we fleeced New Orleans.

I think it is a good trade for the skins.

I was just playing along with everyone just like the McNabb trade thead.

As soon as some one brought up how people would complain about giving up draft picks, i was adding to the list of other poeples reasons for a terrible trade.

One reason some people hated the McNabb deal was the fact he didnt sign an extension.

I wasnt try to start a flame war or anything.

[tuckahoeskin]

We almost certainly wouldn't get a starting LT of Brown's caliber with either the 3rd or 4th round pick in 2011.

This deserved to be posted in all caps.

[wide_awake]

I think it is a good trade for the skins.

I was just playing along with everyone just like the McNabb trade thead.

As soon as some one brought up how people would complain about giving up draft picks, i was adding to the list of other poeples reasons for a terrible trade.

One reason some people hated the McNabb deal was the fact he didnt sign an extension.

I wasnt try to start a flame war or anything.

Sorry man, I misread your post. I was surprised because you are very non-confrontational.

[tuckahoeskin]

Indeed. On the phone with my father and we both love this. We have Book-end tackles and flexibility on the Oline we didn't have before.

Bookend tackles from Oklahoma. How rare is it that one NFL team has a pair of starting tackles from the same school. No big deal to me, just kind of interesting.

[akhhorus]

The Saints' fans weight in on this:

http://www.saintsreport.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=165551

(some highlights)


wash totality owned NO in this one ... sorry to say but thats the truth, any one who says JB sucks is an ******* ...

they got PRO BOWL LT for a 4round pick

congrats ... this one they won big ... congrats to their FO

Flame away, but the Jamal Brown compensation was flat out horrible.


It is sickening how ridiculously we got taken to the woodshed on this deal.


We got hosed on this deal. I know that he wanted to be traded, but the compensation was awful. A third or fourth round pick for a Pro-Bowl LT? The worst part about it is that we are sending a pick along with him.

It's not so much that we traded JB, BA, its that sick feeling that we got royally screwed by the Skins by getting far less in return

the worse thing about it that NOBODY here said is that

we are making a NFC team better with a chance of them getting a pro bowl LT for absolutely no compensation

what a STEAL and DUMB move

if you want to trade your LT pro bowl, at least do it to a team that doesnt have a chance to beat u in the NFC

http://www.saintsreport.com/forums/showthread.php?t=165542

my crystal ball tells me

J Brown for Haynesworth and RB Ladell Betts

(and the response)

You need a new crystal ball. They cut Betts.


We got taken to the woodshed. I'm really disappointed if those are the terms.

what espn is reporting sounds like we screwed up big time imo. AH > 4th rounder who wont make the team!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Then we just got robbed. I'm not too hot on this deal.


We definitely got robbed.

This is disappointing, for sure.. We might even have to give them a pick?? What the hell happened..

We GOT ROBBED! Horrible job... I would rather AH even though I didn't want him. WE could trade him (AH) after a year and get more than this. Highway robbery...

Looks like a 4th and a 6th. That is awful. No McIntosh or Andre Carter? Something, Loomis, SOMETHING!!!!

So we gave up Brown and either a 5th or 6th for either a 3rd or 4th?

Why did we do this?

We could of simply held onto him and gotten a compensatory pick (that would of either been a 3rd or 4th) in 2011 while getting to keep our 5th.

We just took it up the *******.

please tell me this is a joke.. a 3rd or 4th round pick for a pro bowl LT?


Hope he fails his physical now......

Unless there is more to this trade we got freakin Pwned

[X-Factor13]

YES! I'm so happy about this trade, and frankly the picks we gave up I don't really mind losing. Our team has been upgraded in a major way this offseason from GM on down, and I'm just grateful to be excited about smart moves rather than attention getting ones. Our line is much better with this piece in place, and though we may not have all the depth we fans would prefer, the picture is very clear as to what we have to focus on in the draft and next offseason. I have been trying to stay focused on the fact that this is really a rebuilding year, but my emotion has officially been stepped up a notch into full blown diehard mode once again. I can't wait for this season!!!

[cal_junior]

One more positive:

This guy might be one of the youngest (wear-and-tear wise) 29-year olds in the NFL. He's only played four seasons so far.

[Gravy]

akhhorus;1323906]The Saints' fans weight in on this:

http://www.saintsreport.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=165551

http://www.saintsreport.com/forums/showthread.php?t=165542
[/QUOTE]

It feels weird being on the other side for once...

[hail2skins]

You forgot:
"Why did Jeruh not sober up long enough to offer slightly more to keep from having Doug Free as your LT this upcoming season. "
or
"Wondering if Stephon Heyer will represent an upgrade from Free when the skins cut him in a couple days?"

He's 29, thats too old for a long term extension? This from a fan of a team who's gave Leonard Davis 50 million when he was 28 year old bust? Or 43 million to a 33 year old Flozell Adams(only to cut him 2 years into the deal). Insert easy comment about stones and glass houses.You owe esmith an apology. He was continuing the excuses thing you guys had going.

BTW, some of those posts from the Saints forums are hilarious. The one about crystal ball, Haynes and BETTS and the followup being you need a new crystal ball. LMAO.

[akhhorus]

You owe esmith an apology. He was continuing the excuses thing you guys had going.


You're right. Esmith, please consider this my apology. I thought you were trying to flame and I was wrong.

BTW, some of those posts from the Saints forums are hilarious. The one about crystal ball, Haynes and BETTS and the followup being you need a new crystal ball. LMAO.

The other funny thing is all the Saints fans talking about how Brown didn't recover from some knee injury and thats why it was a good deal. Brown missed last year because of a hernia/hip problem lol. I think that the Saints fans would have been happier if we gave them Haynesworth.

[Red Bear]

we're finally trading those 3rd and 4th rounders for probowl QBs and Tackles instead of 3rd string RBs and bust cancer WRs

[esmith1790]

You're right. Esmith, please consider this my apology. I thought you were trying to flame and I was wrong.



I think that the Saints fans would have been happier if we gave them Haynesworth.

No offense taken, after reviewing my post i could see how it was taken that way, espcially being a cowboys fan.

it stills seems to be seen where they plan on playing him LT or RT and if they plan on extending his contract.

It might be a locker room issue to give out a big contract to a new guy and have guys that have been here, McIntosh and Rogers still waiting new contracts.

It will be intersting to see if he asks for LT money if they make him the RT.

It seems that since they didnt give McNabb a new deal they cant give JB a new deal either.

[fent]

After this move it's getting REAL hard not to significantly raise my 8-8 expectations for this season...

[Gravy]

Brown missed last year because of a hernia/hip problem.

...Do we know where JB is on his recovery process from this?

[hail2skins]

The other funny thing is all the Saints fans talking about how Brown didn't recover from some knee injury and thats why it was a good deal. Brown missed last year because of a hernia/hip problem lol. I think that the Saints fans would have been happier if we gave them Haynesworth.It still would have been a good deal and we probably would have gotten us another pick out it. LOL

[tuckahoeskin]

After this move it's getting REAL hard not to significantly raise my 8-8 expectations for this season...

Too bad you'll miss it with your nose stuck in law books this season. :readme:

[akhhorus]

It seems that since they didnt give McNabb a new deal they cant give JB a new deal either.

Well, they couldn't give McNabb a new deal until recently because of NFL rules about redoing a deal within a year of your last redo. There's plenty of time to do new deals for both.



...Do we know where JB is on his recovery process from this?

If he fails the physical we'll know lol. I think he could have theoretically played in the playoffs last season, but they decided to IR him early since Bushrod was playing so well.

[fent]

Too bad you'll miss it with your nose stuck in law books this season. :readme:

Between that and the wee one showing up, you're probably right.

[hail2skins]

Too bad you'll miss it with your nose stuck in law books this season. :readme:Hey, leave our resident lawyer-to-be alone. You may need his services in the future:moon2:

[tuckahoeskin]

Between that and the wee one showing up, you're probably right.

One of my favorite photos of our first child is of him sitting on my lap while we were watching Dallas stick it to us in December 2004. Kids put things in perspective. :) Enjoy it all.

[hail2skins]

Between that and the wee one showing up, you're probably right.So, which player's jersey are you thinking about getting for the wee one?

[hail2skins]

One of my favorite photos of our first child is of him sitting on my lap while we were watching Dallas stick it to us in December 2004. Kids put things in perspective. :) Enjoy it all.Wearing a jersey of course correct?

[HoKiES34]

we now have..

13th pick 2005-Jamaal Brown
13th pick 2007-Adam Carrieker
13th pick 2009-Brian Orakpo

lucky 13 haha

[44 goes 50 gut]

The don't give up any draft picks ever because it is mortgaging the future contingent will be around to weigh in on this in 3....2.....1............

Right because those who believe in building through the draft for long term success in this sport, are likely to be against all trades that involve draft picks... Even trades where the other team got hosed (BEFORE they returned a later round draft pick)... :rolleyes:

[BSMKF]

WOW on paper this is becoming a STUDISH team.

[hail2skins]

Right because those who believe in building through the draft for long term success in this sport, are likely to be against all trades that involve draft picks... Even trades where the other team got hosed (BEFORE they returned a later round draft pick)... :rolleyes:
I take it this post should have sarcasm tags around it. LOL.

[ihatedallas]

Pretty flippin excited.


I wish Fat Al was too.

[BSMKF]

I think its time to start HYPING up the Skins and talking a little trash.

Skins are going to be good.......No doubt

[Keino]

Right because those who believe in building through the draft for long term success in this sport, are likely to be against all trades that involve draft picks... Even trades where the other team got hosed (BEFORE they returned a later round draft pick)... :rolleyes:

People have argued down good deals on the sole basis of giving up a draft pick. The public record on that point is actually rather clear. As evidence, please check out the Donovan McNabb trade thread.

Passing on good deals because they mean sacrificing a draft pick is not mortgaging the future and people who buy in to making deals aren't opposed to building through the draft.

[BSMKF]

Pretty flippin excited.


I wish Fat Al was too.

Me too and me too

[BSMKF]

People have argued down good deals on the sole basis of giving up a draft pick. The public record on that point is actually rather clear. As evidence, please check out the Donovan McNabb trade thread.

Passing on good deals because they mean sacrificing a draft pick is not mortgaging the future and people who buy in to making deals aren't opposed to building through the draft.

Good post....I want to build through the draft, but I don't think anybody can argue that the Skins made bad deals on any of the trades this year. IMO these trades made our future better and they were all STEALS.


Hail to the Skins baby!

[Keino]

Did anyone see this:

According to ESPN, an conditional 2012 pick is also involved in the Brown deal. If the tackle plays 90 percent of the plays this season or is selected to the Pro Bowl, then the Redskins must also send their sixth-round pick in 2012 to New Orleans.

Yea, throw in 2012 6th for pro bowl or 90% of snaps. Still a great deal.

[jaylen]

Okay now lets look big picture here.

we have a young left tackle, and pro bowl rt and a solid player in Hicks at guard.

we have a pro bowl caliber qb.

3 old and taken their lumps on the downside rb's.

2 potentially great te's.

1 good to solid wr who seems to be on the downside and 2 haven't proven a thing wr's.

and a wiz O coordinator.

=
a pretty damn good offseason upgrade .

[skin4ever]

Im stoked about this trade and the direction this team is heading. I love the price we gave up for him and the fact that we can allow Williams to develop at RT before taking Browns place. Its a win win for us. I havent been here long, but its been a long time that i have seen this board as excited about the team. (except for the vinny fired one) and nice to read fans excited about the team. I only hope it all works out and this hope builds upon the expectations it creates and we play well consistently. We as skins fans have been here before, only to be screwed later. Sorry guys and girls of the board, i have to temper my excitement, theres been too many lows.

However, we have undone 10 years of offensive line ignorance in one offseason(not by choice but I dont know that the previous regime would have done anyof this), and hopefully stopped the carousel we call the QB position as well. Its hard not to get excited. Rock meet hardplace.

On a side note, my name came up for gen admin season tickets and the sales rep has been calling me nonstop today to sign me up. I didnt know about this trade, but he called me literally 4 times throughout the day. Anyone know sect 431?

[smoak]

People have argued down good deals on the sole basis of giving up a draft pick. The public record on that point is actually rather clear. As evidence, please check out the Donovan McNabb trade thread.

Passing on good deals because they mean sacrificing a draft pick is not mortgaging the future and people who buy in to making deals aren't opposed to building through the draft.

As president of the club who thinks the Redskins are a poorly run franchise that significantly undervalue the draft as a way to build a team, I love this deal.

Mcnabb was a good trade, but I felt it was risky (at best) to get a veteran QB without shoring up the o line. This helps in that department!!!

[greatest2]

As president of the club who thinks the Redskins are a poorly run franchise that significantly undervalue the draft as a way to build a team, I love this deal.

Mcnabb was a good trade, but I felt it was risky (at best) to get a veteran QB without shoring up the o line. This helps in that department!!!

agreed. this trade makes the other trade make more sense, and become a better deal.

[redcayman]

WoW can a front office and organiztion be more different in one offseason. We went from a 4-12 team laughing stock in our division. To a team thats respected with legitimate shot at the division. A whole new offensive line,(some of which we drafted) QB and mindset. Competent coaching and a front office that makes trades in which we get the better end. Heck they even made the team a sympathetic figure when it comes to the AH fiasco. I so frickin impressed and excited.

[ClubSandwichGuy]

Fantastic move. This would never have happened a year ago. Well done Bruce Allen and Mike Shanahan.

[Fathead]

Anyone know sect 431?

Here's my wife and I sitting up in 431


http://i33.tinypic.com/317jzt1.jpg

[smoak]

Right because those who believe in building through the draft for long term success in this sport, are likely to be against all trades that involve draft picks... Even trades where the other team got hosed (BEFORE they returned a later round draft pick)... :rolleyes:

Standing ovation.

This trade makes mcnabb and the redskins better. Significantly better. Trading for mcnabb alone was questionable in my mind b/c the team around him wasn't good enough. Now they should be able to protect the qb.

[smoot]

Dear new front office:

http://www.furthereducationlessontrader.co.uk/me%20to%20you%20bears%20i%20love%20you%20this%20mu ch.jpg

[Fathead]

I'm so glad Vinny didn't quite push me to the point of shooting myself.

[MadDog97]

As one who has complained about the line for many years, I love this trade and I love the new front office. This team now has a strong offensive line and some depth. Bruce Allen and Shanny, you have my gratitude.

Now dump Albert. Let him keep the money, and try to recoup some draft picks.

:sun:

[WinnpegSkinsFan]

At most a 3rd for Brown is pretty reasonable. I just hope he's healthy and signs a long term contract.
Edit: Nice to see a FO that values a quality Oline.

[joethefan]

WOW after a day of fishing, now to come home and read this. I am elated about this move. Seems we're getting better and better. This move helps our line esp with depth. Brown is a proven guy.we may have just added another 2 wins with this move.

It's amazing how 1 offseason can change the entire look of our team.
I'm loving it.

[hogs86]

In one year the redskins have made the oline, not only a priority, but maybe the potential strength of the team!!

[oldskinfan]

This was on my team roadmap...
Really...

Well, OK...what I meant was I was gonna bring in TO and you watch, that kid..what's his name? Rhinehart. My pick. Yeah he's gonna be a stud. And you watch, Mike Williams was gonna return to his college form. And why get McNabb when we could have gotten the #1 pick Jamarcus Russell for NOTHING?

You guys miss me don't you?
C'mon...a litte bit?

Hang on...Deion is texting me...

Love,
Vinnie
:cool:

[shally]

As one who has complained about the line for many years, I love this trade and I love the new front office. This team now has a strong offensive line and some depth. Bruce Allen and Shanny, you have my gratitude.

Now dump Albert. Let him keep the money, and try to recoup some draft picks.

:sun:

totally agree. great trade. instant upgrade for the o line. makes us better because Hicks can slide to RT if Mike Williams isnt working out. also allows the luxury of starting trent williams at RT for a year or so..



we are a much better team this year

[skinsfan36]

absolutely love this trade. we have made two great trades and one good one(carriker) where we actually pretty much fleeced the other team. this new front office,and btw allen and shanny are smart to trade mid rounders next year as the draft will be pretty watered down(thats the major consensus).
having bookend tackles that are young is awesome and its about time. now if we can just get a free safety somehow,and get something for albert mesworth. i think we will field the best oline we have had since norv and mcnabb should be smiling.
now you have Williams/Dock/Rabach/Hicks/Brown then on the bench you have capers/lichtenser(sp?)/bmw/rinehart. pretty huge upgrade over last year

[justinskins]

After this move it's getting REAL hard not to significantly raise my 8-8 expectations for this season...

I still say 7-9. But it's a great move!

[Arkangiest]

This is huuuuuge!!!!!!!

[Emmanouel8]

I just got back from NYC and read the news. Man the disbelief from the moment I read the headlines to the end of the article just grew and grew. We just got a legit tackle for chump change?! If this was last years regime it would have taken Haynesworth, a 1st and 2nd rounder and a conditional reach around to make this happen.

As far as Haynesworth we are in the driver seat at this point. I'd keep him until some team gets desperate and forks over picks. There's also a small possibility he buys into the team and suits up but I'm not holding my breath.

The team is almost entirely remade.

[CapitalDefense]

I just got back from NYC and read the news. Man the disbelief from the moment I read the headlines to the end of the article just grew and grew. We just got a legit tackle for chump change?! If this was last years regime it would have taken Haynesworth, a 1st and 2nd rounder and a conditional reach around to make this happen.

As far as Haynesworth we are in the driver seat at this point. I'd keep him until some team gets desperate and forks over picks. There's also a small possibility he buys into the team and suits up but I'm not holding my breath.

The team is almost entirely remade.

Exactly, loving our new FO. A real NFL FO!

Haynesworth can report and if comes in to be a great team member and willing to play anywhere, you let him play. If not give him the Keyshawn treatment from a few years ago. Pay him but tell him to stay away from Redskins park. Only trade him somebody offers a couple of good picks a 2nd and 3rd or 4th.

[Patrick]

On the surface this looks good BUT I'm still taking a wait and see on this one ....... He got to pass his physical first. Then he's got to stay healthy. AND I guess the most important element of the OL will be who the backups are. Just as important to quality players there too.
AND I'd still love to see a upgrade to the Center.

[ChiefPowhatan17]

This is good, I feel much better about our O-line at least at Tackle this year. This is the last time we see Heyer on the field. Welcome Jammal Brown!

[lorimike]

I guess the offensive line is starting to look good on paper. I think they will play Brown at left tackle and Trent at right tackle. To start out with it would make more sense to play the rookie at right tackle versus lining him up against Demarcus Ware in his first NFL game. Again lots of draft picks flying around here for a 29 year old player. And neither McNabb or Brown are signed to long term deals. While I do think we will be much better than last year we are not a contender for much more than a playoff appearance. And if McNabb and Brown bolt next year we will have given up a 2nd( and a high 2nd at that) a 3rd and a 4 th round pick for players who might only play 1 year here. That's not building a foundation. That's deluding ourselves into thinking we are only a few players away.

[SkinsfaninNJ]

Very good move for the Skins. The age doesn't worry me. It is very common for top tackles to play 10 plus years, so it would not be out of the ordinary for Brown to play at a pro bowl level for at least another 5 years. That is most definitely worth a 3rd or 4th round pick.

I do worry about the injury last year. Let's put it this way, if he were on the team last year and returning from injury, we would all be saying hope he recovers and stays healthy in 2010.

I'm sure the team doctors will be thorough in the physical.

[akhhorus]

I guess the offensive line is starting to look good on paper. I think they will play Brown at left tackle and Trent at right tackle. To start out with it would make more sense to play the rookie at right tackle versus lining him up against Demarcus Ware in his first NFL game. Again lots of draft picks flying around here for a 29 year old player. And neither McNabb or Brown are signed to long term deals. While I do think we will be much better than last year we are not a contender for much more than a playoff appearance. And if McNabb and Brown bolt next year we will have given up a 2nd( and a high 2nd at that) a 3rd and a 4 th round pick for players who might only play 1 year here. That's not building a foundation. That's deluding ourselves into thinking we are only a few players away.

Predictable. So, if the skins sign McNabb and Brown to extensions(which they almost certainly will), what's your complaint then? That we could have gotten the next Tom Brady with those picks?

[Santheb]

I keep refusing to get my hopes set too high, no matter what we do, but it's getting harder to do so now with this move. I hope he passes his physical and can stay healthy.

[lorimike]

Predictable. So, if the skins sign McNabb and Brown to extensions(which they almost certainly will), what's your complaint then? That we could have gotten the next Tom Brady with those picks?

If the resign them and they play well for 4 or 5 years then I wouldn't have a complaint. But we are many months past the McNabb trade and I hear nary a word about a long term deal. So who is to say we didn't give up a high 2nd and a 3rd for a guy who is going to play one year here?

[Fathead]

If the resign them and they play well for 4 or 5 years then I wouldn't have a complaint. But we are many months past the McNabb trade and I hear nary a word about a long term deal. So who is to say we didn't give up a high 2nd and a 3rd for a guy who is going to play one year here?

Until they are actually gone, they are still part of this team. We have exclusive negotiation rights, and a deal may happen at any time. So sitting there all negative nancy about things that have actually improved this team is just ridiculous.

[akhhorus]

If the resign them and they play well for 4 or 5 years then I wouldn't have a complaint. But we are many months past the McNabb trade and I hear nary a word about a long term deal. So who is to say we didn't give up a high 2nd and a 3rd for a guy who is going to play one year here?

McNabb couldn't even negotiate or sign a new deal until June 15th due to NFL rules. As for not hearing a word about any new deals, we didn't know about this Jammal Brown deal until it was done.

And if you legitimately believe your "we traded draft picks for someone who might be here only 1 year" criticism(which I doubt), you should wait until after the upcoming season considering that the skins have over 200 days to get a new deal done.

As for Brown, we didn't really deal away any picks, we traded down in the draft for him but have the same number of picks after that trade(unless Brown makes the Pro bowl, and then we would have to give up a 2012 6th which I'm sure you're outraged about).

[fent]

So, which player's jersey are you thinking about getting for the wee one?

I like this one (shockingly, Carmen does too), but I need to find it in something smaller than 24 months so she can wear it the first Sunday of her life :)

http://shop.redskins.com/ProductDetail.aspx?ProductDetailIndexName=Category Detail_524&C1=504&CategoryID=524&Page=1,2&ProductID=40355

[esmith1790]

The skins got a good deal for JB. Everyone knew the saints werent going to keep everyone and thus his asking price went down.

I think that is the same thing is going to happen to AH. The skins asking price will go way down and he will be moved for a 3/4 with a conditional 5/6 in 2012.

Also, i am still curious about the angle of the FO (giving/will be giving) big deals to new guys and not taking care of current guys. I know people bash CR cause he cant hold onto the ball but when the FO signed Hall to that big deal as a FA. CR didnt take it that well.

However, i think only CR and RM are the ones with deals set to expire and they arent really in the plans of the teams future. Suprised LL hasnt been asking for a new deal yet either.

[akhhorus]

The skins got a good deal for JB. Everyone knew the saints werent going to keep everyone and thus his asking price went down.

I think that is the same thing is going to happen to AH. The skins asking price will go way down and he will be moved for a 3/4 with a conditional 5/6 in 2012.

Also, i am still curious about the angle of the FO (giving/will be giving) big deals to new guys and not taking care of current guys. I know people bash CR cause he cant hold onto the ball but when the FO signed Hall to that big deal as a FA. CR didnt take it that well.

However, i think only CR and RM are the ones with deals set to expire and they arent really in the plans of the teams future. Suprised LL hasnt been asking for a new deal yet either.

Landry won't get one I think(and I think he's not up for free agency until 2013 anyways), neither will McIntosh or Rogers. The only players coming up for unrestricted free agency in the next 2 years who they might try to keep are Portis and Fletcher in 2012(and they probably will let Fletcher go, Portis also if they have another quality RB). Barring some surprise, they'll give McNabb 3 more year and lock up Brown for longer.

[fent]

However, i think only CR and RM are the ones with deals set to expire and they arent really in the plans of the teams future. Suprised LL hasnt been asking for a new deal yet either.

You just hit it on the head. Carlos and Rocky don't appear to be in the mix for the skins too much longer. Carlos can play, but I think the team wants to try him out in the new system before committing long term. Just a hunch. Rocky isn't long for this team. I think he walks without even a contract discussion after this season. As for Landry, the man knows he's not in a spot to go asking for a contract right now. He's better off waiting until the offseason and hoping his play picks up.

[lorimike]

McNabb couldn't even negotiate or sign a new deal until June 15th due to NFL rules. As for not hearing a word about any new deals, we didn't know about this Jammal Brown deal until it was done.

And if you legitimately believe your "we traded draft picks for someone who might be here only 1 year" criticism(which I doubt), you should wait until after the upcoming season considering that the skins have over 200 days to get a new deal done.

As for Brown, we didn't really deal away any picks, we traded down in the draft for him but have the same number of picks after that trade(unless Brown makes the Pro bowl, and then we would have to give up a 2012 6th which I'm sure you're outraged about).

From what I read it is a contingent 4th, possibly more based on performance. And no I am not thrilled about just throwing away picks but it is only a 6th rounder and if Brown makes the pro bowl that's a fair trade. But if he's not re-signed then it's a bad deal. Keep in mind it was the Super bowl champion Saints who are trading this player. Based on our track record vs the Saints I will have to defer to the Saints as far more of a superior franchise. We keep seeing this movie year in and year out Ank and you keep arguing that these trades are good trades. How has it worked out? Take a look at our record the past 5 years. Until proven otherswise I remain a skeptic

[akhhorus]

From what I read it is a contingent 4th, possibly more based on performance. And no I am not thrilled about just throwing away picks but it is only a 6th rounder and if Brown makes the pro bowl that's a fair trade.

You read wrong. Whatever pick we don't give to the Eagles for McNabb(a 3rd or a 4th), we give to the Saints and the Saints give up a draft pick 2 rounds after the pick we give them. Thats it.

But if he's not re-signed then it's a bad deal. Keep in mind it was the Super bowl champion Saints who are trading this player.

Who are loaded with OTs. Bushrod did a great job filling in for Brown and they drafted Charles Brown in the 2nd.

Based on our track record vs the Saints I will have to defer to the Saints as far more of a superior franchise. We keep seeing this movie year in and year out Ank and you keep arguing that these trades are good trades. How has it worked out? Take a look at our record the past 5 years. Until proven otherswise I remain a skeptic

Please show me where we've gotten one of the best QBs in the history of the NFC east and a multiple pro bowl left tackle for a 2nd, a 3rd, a 4th while getting a later round pick back. Thats not significantly more than what the skins gave up for Jason Taylor, but of course you're pissy about it because one of your precious picks got dealt away there smeagol.

And no matter how much you want to put your blinders up whenever you and the draft pick cult are offended at what the skins do, every successful team does this, you just selectively neglect to get outraged when other teams do it. I really don't understand what you expect for the skins to do to improve their team. If you're expecting the skins to find stars with 60-70% of their draft picks year in and year out along with getting these players to stay with them for long term cheap deals, which appears to be what your expectations are, then you should find another sport to follow since you'll always be disappointed.

[Fathead]

Based on our track record vs the Saints I will have to defer to the Saints as far more of a superior franchise.



What? Superior on what basis? Our track record in what? Head to Head? 15-8 against the Saints. In playoff appearances? 22-7. In Championships? 5-1. In trades? I seem to remember fleecing the Saints with the Ricky Williams deal, along with this one.



They certainly had a better season last year. But the comparison overall is not close.

[lorimike]

Look at the Saints. Now there is a savvy franchise. Jermon Bushrod was a 4th round pick. Jahri Evans a 4th round pick. Colston was a 7th. Cashing out the aging and injured Jamaal Brown for a 4th. There's a team that really knows what they are doing.

[Fathead]

Look at the Saints. Now there is a savvy franchise. Jermon Bushrod was a 4th round pick. Jahri Evans a 4th round pick. Colston was a 7th. Cashing out the aging and injured Jamaal Brown for a 4th. There's a team that really knows what they are doing.


Then go cheer for them.

[akhhorus]

Look at the Saints. Now there is a savvy franchise. Jermon Bushrod was a 4th round pick. Jahri Evans a 4th round pick. Colston was a 7th. Cashing out the aging and injured Jamaal Brown for a 4th. There's a team that really knows what they are doing.

And they dealt a 2nd and a 5th for Jeremy Shockey, a conditional 2nd to the Jets for Jonathan Vilma, gave Brees 60 million coming off a major throwing arm injury...all of which you would be pissy about if the skins did it.

[lorimike]

You read wrong. Whatever pick we don't give to the Eagles for McNabb(a 3rd or a 4th), we give to the Saints and the Saints give up a draft pick 2 rounds after the pick we give them. Thats it.

3rd and 4th round picks are not throw away picks. Maybe this trade will work if Brown can regain his pro bowl form



Who are loaded with OTs. Bushrod did a great job filling in for Brown and they drafted Charles Brown in the 2nd.

Charles Brown- another great pick for the Saints. They sure know what they are doing down in NO.



Please show me where we've gotten one of the best QBs in the history of the NFC east and a multiple pro bowl left tackle for a 2nd, a 3rd, a 4th while getting a later round pick back. Thats not significantly more than what the skins gave up for Jason Taylor, but of course you're pissy about it because one of your precious picks got dealt away there smeagol.

And no matter how much you want to put your blinders up whenever you and the draft pick cult are offended at what the skins do, every successful team does this, you just selectively neglect to get outraged when other teams do it. I really don't understand what you expect for the skins to do to improve their team. If you're expecting the skins to find stars with 60-70% of their draft picks year in and year out along with getting these players to stay with them for long term cheap deals, which appears to be what your expectations are, then you should find another sport to follow since you'll always be disappointed.

Ank, Much like the stock market past performance is no guarantee of future performance. And the team who traded us those players have a much better track record with talent than we do. The Eagles are the masters of knowing when to cash out aging veterans for draft picks. That's why year in and year out they have been a contender. What I expect the Skins to do is be patient and build a team that can win for 5 to 7 years like the Saints. like the Colts, like the patriots. The definition of insansity is to keep doing the same thing and expect a different result. I understand we are under new management so maybe it will be different. I'll make the 4 "easy" payments again this year to DirectTv and I'll be there rootin for the Skins. Hopefully this year will be different. But I feel like I'm in the movie Groundhog day when it comes to the Skins.

[lorimike]

Then go cheer for them.

I tried switching teams when I was a little kid. Jack Pardee was the coach at the time. I couldn't do it. I will question their moves but I am as loyal as they come.

[akhhorus]

Ank, Much like the stock market past performance is no guarantee of future performance. And the team who traded us those players have a much better track record with talent than we do.

And draft picks have a higher rate of success? LMAO.

The Eagles are the masters of knowing when to cash out aging veterans for draft picks.

And trading a first rounder, a 3rd round and a 5th for Jason Peters(and gave him a massive extension). Among other big free agent moves/trades. All of which violate your rules for NFL franchises.

That's why year in and year out they have been a contender.

No, its McNabb that made them a contender.

What I expect the Skins to do is be patient and build a team that can win for 5 to 7 years like the Saints. like the Colts, like the patriots.

I can point out examples of those 3 teams making moves that would give you the vapors. In fact, I have in the past you ignore it or try to make up new standards for when its okay to make trades.

The definition of insansity is to keep doing the same thing and expect a different result. I understand we are under new management so maybe it will be different. I'll make the 4 "easy" payments again this year to DirectTv and I'll be there rootin for the Skins. Hopefully this year will be different. But I feel like I'm in the movie Groundhog day when it comes to the Skins.

Please show when in the past we're traded for 2 starting caliber players(one who's made multiple pro bowls) for the lines, under the age of 30 and all we've done is swap down in the draft(and not given up any picks).

[lorimike]

And they dealt a 2nd and a 5th for Jeremy Shockey, a conditional 2nd to the Jets for Jonathan Vilma, gave Brees 60 million coming off a major throwing arm injury...all of which you would be pissy about if the skins did it.

fair enough. It seems when we make the trade or the big signing it backfires on us. See any of the countless picks for players from past seasons. Haynesworth looks to the grand-daddy of them all when it comes to ridiculous signings.

[akhhorus]

fair enough. It seems when we make the trade or the big signing it backfires on us. See any of the countless picks for players from past seasons. Haynesworth looks to the grand-daddy of them all when it comes to ridiculous signings.

We've made 3 trades of significance this offseason(and we really didn't make any massive signings in free agency): McNabb, Carriker and Brown. 2 of them, we swapped down in the draft instead of giving up picks(Brown and Carriker). We gave up a high 2nd and a conditional 3rd or 4th for McNabb. I really don't understand what your complaint is, especially when compared to how the skins ran things before Shanny/Allen took over, on how they're running things. There's just no comparison between Vinny's impulsive trading up and down in the drafts, along with Gibbs' trading for players who don't fit the system, as compared to Shanny's getting established players who seem to be good fits for the system they want to run.

[lorimike]

Ank, This is year 3 of having this same debate. At what point will you be right and we'll win the NFC East and go deep in the playoffs. You cannot put yourself up on a pedestal as the smart and insightfull football analyst when the track record of wins and losses is abysmall. Year in and year out you come out in support of these trades and year in and year out we lose.

[akhhorus]

Ank, This is year 3 of having this same debate. At what point will you be right and we'll win the NFC East and go deep in the playoffs. You cannot put yourself up on a pedestal as the smart and insightfull football analyst when the track record of wins and losses is abysmall. Year in and year out you come out in support of these trades and year in and year out we lose.

I'll be right about these trades before you'll be consistent in criticizing teams like the Pats, Eagles, Giants, Dolphins etc for doing the exact same thing the skins are doing.

[lorimike]

We've made 3 trades of significance this offseason(and we really didn't make any massive signings in free agency): McNabb, Carriker and Brown. 2 of them, we swapped down in the draft instead of giving up picks(Brown and Carriker). We gave up a high 2nd and a conditional 3rd or 4th for McNabb. I really don't understand what your complaint is, especially when compared to how the skins ran things before Shanny/Allen took over, on how they're running things. There's just no comparison between Vinny's impulsive trading up and down in the drafts, along with Gibbs' trading for players who don't fit the system, as compared to Shanny's getting established players who seem to be good fits for the system they want to run.

OK, hopefully it will be different this year. I did say the offensive line looks much better on paper. Which Jamaal Brown are we getting. The pro bowl guy from 2008 or the washed up and injured version from 2009. The good side is that we won't have to watch Stephon " Oley " Heyer any more.

[akhhorus]

OK, hopefully it will be different this year. I did say the offensive line looks much better on paper. Which Jamaal Brown are we getting. The pro bowl guy from 2008 or the washed up and injured version from 2009. The good side is that we won't have to watch Stephon " Oley " Heyer any more.

Brown didn't play last year so saying he was "washed up" is pretty ridiculous. He had a sports hernia and a hip flexor, but supposedly he could have played in the playoffs if they needed. The Saints saw what they had in Bushrod, and IRed Brown to get the roster spot.

We also didn't give up much for Brown, so the risk is pretty low here. Just traded down 2 rounds in the draft.

[hogs86]

Looks like we signed another player.

Redskins reel in Ramzee Robinson via waivers

The Washington Redskins continue to demonstrate the kind of work ethic that requires the media to constantly be ready for the next move to come.

On Easter Sunday, they traded for quarterback Donovan McNabb. On a beautiful Saturday afternoon in June, they traded for tackle Jammal Brown.

Now, on Father's Day, the Redskins have announced the arrival of cornerback Ramzee Robinson, whom they acquired on waivers from the Browns.

The Redskins also announced the release of defensive lineman Greg Peterson and cornerback Melvin Stephenson.

Link http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/06/20/redskins-reel-in-ramzee-robinson-via-waivers/

[lorimike]

I'll be right about these trades before you'll be consistent in criticizing teams like the Pats, Eagles, Giants, Dolphins etc for doing the exact same thing the skins are doing.<<<

those teams will make a trade or two but when you look at their rosters the foundation was solid drafting.

[akhhorus]

<<<

those teams will make a trade or two but when you look at their rosters the foundation was solid drafting.

I've already been over the Pats, Saints and Colts. You can't defend the Dolphins dealing for Brandon Marshall without sounding like a hypocrite.

As for the Eagles, they gave up 2 first round picks, a 3rd and a 5th for Kevin Kolb(you forget that they gave Dallas a future first for him) and Jason Peters. A 4th rounder(and a young player) for Darryl Tapp(only to see them draft 2 small DEs high in the recent draft). And a 5th rounder for 10 games of Will Witherspoon. If the skins made those moves, you would have started 8 threads a week condemning them for it. Nevermind all the big deals for guys like Asante Samuel, Stacy Andrews(who was a major bust for 42 million), Kearse, etc etc etc.

But you think that this is a right way to run a franchise. And you're seriously whining about the skins' deals for McNabb and Brown? You're a hypocrite.

[lorimike]

I've already been over the Pats, Saints and Colts. You can't defend the Dolphins dealing for Brandon Marshall without sounding like a hypocrite.

As for the Eagles, they gave up 2 first round picks, a 3rd and a 5th for Kevin Kolb(you forget that they gave Dallas a future first for him) and Jason Peters. A 4th rounder(and a young player) for Darryl Tapp(only to see them draft 2 small DEs high in the recent draft). And a 5th rounder for 10 games of Will Witherspoon. If the skins made those moves, you would have started 8 threads a week condemning them for it. Nevermind all the big deals for guys like Asante Samuel, Stacy Andrews(who was a major bust for 42 million), Kearse, etc etc etc.

But you think that this is a right way to run a franchise. And you're seriously whining about the skins' deals for McNabb and Brown? You're a hypocrite.

Eagles had 12 picks in this past years draft. You'll have to show me that the Eagles traded that much to pick Kolb. My recolection is they traded down out of the first round to draft Kolb As for Peters they were stacked with picks that year. That had two firsts so giving up one 1st at the bottome of round 1 for Peters was a good move. Like I said before this the same argument we have each year. The track record for our trades is not so good which is why I find it amusing that you defend each one so vehemently.

[akhhorus]

Eagles had 12 picks in this past years draft. You'll have to show me that the Eagles traded that much to pick Kolb. My recolection is they traded down out of the first round to draft Kolb

No, you're right about that, they dealt down. My bad.

As for Peters they were stacked with picks that year. That had two firsts so giving up one 1st at the bottome of round 1 for Peters was a good move. Like I said before this the same argument we have each year. The track record for our trades is not so good which is why I find it amusing that you defend each one so vehemently.

So, if its okay to deal away picks for Vet players if you have a lot of picks(nevermind that this is more hypocrisy from you), you cannot possibly have any complaint with the Brown trade at all. Even if he's gone after 2010.

And the track record you condemn is Gibbs and Vinny/Snyder's track record. In case you missed the big news looking longingly at Eagles jerseys, I think we have a new decision maker in DC. As for my defending the skins moves, I didn't defend the Lloyd trade at all and if Blache decided that going after the Qb wasn't evil, Taylor would have been a good move(and he was far from the only defensive player who had problems with Blache on this). Nevermind that you're trying to make me the issue to avoid dealing with your hypocritical positions on how to build an NFL franchise.

[ihatedallas]

Is he going to be signed an extension? At the moment isnt he tendered for one more year?

[esmith1790]

<<<

those teams will make a trade or two but when you look at their rosters the foundation was solid drafting.

I guess u can take my non-biased opinion here as i am an outsider-AKA cowboys fan.

If you are comparing franchises the skins are one of the top 10 in the history of the NFL.

Now if you want to compare regimes and snippets from Front office cycle that is ok. But u cant mix and match. IE. The vinny led - Front office cycle against the SAINTS franchise.

The vinny led - FO cycle is over. Now the Allen led -FO is here starting. So it seems and you have to admit is going alot better.

The Saints have been a horrible franchise just like the Eagles over thier whole history of existence.

Now if you want to compare Front office cycles, yes the Andy Ried cycle with McNabb has produced long playoff runs and the Sean Payton cycle has won a Super bowl. Compared to the Vinny led - FO not even a comparision at all.

Now you have to throw out the Vinny led - FO and start looking at the Allen -led -FO and realize that in the past year or so. The deals made and the palyers the skins received have made them better and seems this FO cycle is starting out good.

[esmith1790]

Is he going to be signed an extension? At the moment isnt he tendered for one more year?

Yes currently he is on his 1 year tender.

[lorimike]

No, you're right about that, they dealt down. My bad.



So, if its okay to deal away picks for Vet players if you have a lot of picks(nevermind that this is more hypocrisy from you), you cannot possibly have any complaint with the Brown trade at all. Even if he's gone after 2010.

And the track record you condemn is Gibbs and Vinny/Snyder's track record. In case you missed the big news looking longingly at Eagles jerseys, I think we have a new decision maker in DC. As for my defending the skins moves, I didn't defend the Lloyd trade at all and if Blache decided that going after the Qb wasn't evil, Taylor would have been a good move(and he was far from the only defensive player who had problems with Blache on this). Nevermind that you're trying to make me the issue to avoid dealing with your hypocritical positions on how to build an NFL franchise.

Well yes we are under new management. My gosh how many years have been saying this since Danny bought the team. Who's to say this lasts more than a year? As for Taylor , I would say then don't trade a 2nd rounder for a guy that doesn't fit your system. It was one of the all time dumbest trades. a 2nd rounder for a guy who plays one year? dumb dumb dumb and double dumb- hence our losing record. I believe you build through the draft and accesorize with trades and free agency. This team has deluded itself into thinkin they are one player away. It's takes years of building and it does take patience.

[OCSkinzFan]

I havn't seen anyone post this, but it looks as though Brown will be playing right tackle.

So that means Trent Williams is left tackle and Hicks is probably at right guard.

Here's the link: LINK to WAPO (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/redskinsinsider/qa-with-jammal-brown.html)

[akhhorus]

Well yes we are under new management. My gosh how many years have been saying this since Danny bought the team. Who's to say this lasts more than a year? As for Taylor , I would say then don't trade a 2nd rounder for a guy that doesn't fit your system. It was one of the all time dumbest trades. a 2nd rounder for a guy who plays one year? dumb dumb dumb and double dumb- hence our losing record.

Taylor wasn't the cause of last year's nightmare season. Nor was any trade the skins made. The skins had made 16 draft picks in 2008 and 2009, which the most they've made in consecutive drafts since 01/02, and they barely got any production from those picks. So, your draft pick dogma clearly has a flaw.

I believe you build through the draft and accesorize with trades and free agency. This team has deluded itself into thinkin they are one player away. It's takes years of building and it does take patience.

So, again: what's your complaint with just swapping down 2 rounds in the draft for a multiple pro bowl left tackle under the age of 30? If you actually believe what you're typing, then you shouldn't be complaining.

[Fathead]

.

Here's the link: LINK to WAPO (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/redskinsinsider/qa-with-jammal-brown.html)



Brown says in there that the Redskins doctors evaluated him.

[shally]

I havn't seen anyone post this, but it looks as though Brown will be playing right tackle.

So that means Trent Williams is left tackle and Hicks is probably at right guard.

Here's the link: LINK to WAPO (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/redskinsinsider/qa-with-jammal-brown.html)

Hicks is cheap insurance against Mike Williams flaming out. if nothing else, we are looking like we have solid depth for the O line

[akhhorus]

Link (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/redskinsinsider/qa-with-jammal-brown.html?wprss=redskinsinsider)

Question: How bad were the injuries?
Brown: "Well, right before I had the surgery, I played the whole year with a torn labrum. That was the last year I played, when I made the Pro Bowl (2008). I had a torn labrum and a sports hernia.

He played an entire season, and made the pro bowl with a torn labrum and a sports hernia. Wow.

[BurgundyNGold]

Link (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/redskinsinsider/qa-with-jammal-brown.html?wprss=redskinsinsider)

He played an entire season, and made the pro bowl with a torn labrum and a sports hernia. Wow.
This injuries are the only concern to me. I have no confidence in what passes as a "physical" when trades are involved. If he's healthy, then this is a savage beating being handed out by the Redskins FO.

[fent]

This injuries are the only concern to me. I have no confidence in what passes as a "physical" when trades are involved. If he's healthy, then this is a savage beating being handed out by the Redskins FO.

If Andrews signed off on him like Brown claims, that's good enough for me.

[BurgundyNGold]

If Andrews signed off on him like Brown claims, that's good enough for me.
For the price of the trade, it's well worth the risk of a misdiagnosis. Dude made the pro bowl the year before last and in 2006, as well.

[akhhorus]

For the price of the trade, it's well worth the risk of a misdiagnosis. Dude made the pro bowl the year before last and in 2006, as well.

For what its worth, Brown says later in the interview that he was healthy enough to play in the playoffs if they wanted him to. I'd be more concerned if he was having degenerative injuries or he was missing time because a single area of his body kept getting hurt. But you're right, the risk is minimal here.

[OCSkinzFan]

Hicks is cheap insurance against Mike Williams flaming out. if nothing else, we are looking like we have solid depth for the O lineSo you think Mike Williams starts ahead of Hicks?

[fent]

The bonus to getting him cheap is we have just removed a significant need from our list come next April. Now, instead of realistically needing to look for an OT in the first 2 rounds, we have them both in house and can focus our premium picks on LB/NT/DB/RB, positions that will likely need significant work next spring.

[Fathead]

The bonus to getting him cheap is we have just removed a significant need from our list come next April. Now, instead of realistically needing to look for an OT in the first 2 rounds, we have them both in house and can focus our premium picks on LB/NT/DB/RB, positions that will likely need significant work next spring.


If history teaches us anything, MS is not going to waste a premium pick on RB.

[fent]

If history teaches us anything, MS is not going to waste a premium pick on RB.

I doubt it as well, but barring the discovery of the fountain of youth, that's going to be one of our top concerns at this point next year.

[OCSkinzFan]

My favorite quote of the interview was this (in bolds below):

I like the scheme of offense that he runs. The zones, things like that. I'm gonna come in; they want me to play right tackle.I still think I'm a left tackle, but I'm going to do what they want me to do. I know they got my college teammate Trent Williams on the left side. We'll see how that all plays out. But I'm going to play wherever they want me to play. I'm just excited to be here and to be a part of a first-class program."

He's no Haynesworth.
Can I get an Amen!:honor:

[Lacquer Head]

My favorite quote of the interview was this (in bolds below):

I like the scheme of offense that he runs. The zones, things like that. I'm gonna come in; they want me to play right tackle.I still think I'm a left tackle, but I'm going to do what they want me to do. I know they got my college teammate Trent Williams on the left side. We'll see how that all plays out. But I'm going to play wherever they want me to play. I'm just excited to be here and to be a part of a first-class program."

He's no Haynesworth.
Can I get an Amen!:honor:

That's a terrible example. Why? Haynesworth said the exact. same. thing.

That being said, I love this trade.

[lorimike]

Taylor wasn't the cause of last year's nightmare season. Nor was any trade the skins made. The skins had made 16 draft picks in 2008 and 2009, which the most they've made in consecutive drafts since 01/02, and they barely got any production from those picks. So, your draft pick dogma clearly has a flaw.

WELL WE WERE MISSING OUR 2ND ROUNDER IN THE SPRING OF 2009. SEEMS TO ME WE COULD HAVE USED THAT PICK ON A RIGHT TACKLE. PHIL LOADHOLT COMES TO MIND. MINNESOTA PICKED HIM IN THE 2ND ROUND AND HE WENT ON TO BE A STARTER. SO YES LOSING THAT PICK FOR TAYLOR COST US BIG TIME. FURTHERMORE ALL THE DRAFT PICKS WE TRADED AWAY WAS A BIG REASON WE DID NOT HAVE THE TALENT TO COMPETE.



So, again: what's your complaint with just swapping down 2 rounds in the draft for a multiple pro bowl left tackle under the age of 30? If you actually believe what you're typing, then you shouldn't be complaining.



GIVING UP A 3 RD ROUNDER OR A 4 ROUNDER DOES COST YOU. RATHER AMUSING THAT THE GUY REPLACING JAMAAL BROWN WAS A 4TH ROUND PICK. 3RDS AND 4THS ARE NOT THROW AWAY PICKS. FOR TEAMS WHO KNOW WHAT THEY ARE DOING MANY OF THOSE GUYS END UP AS STARTERS. HOPEFULLY THIS TRADE WILL WORK OUT FOR US BECAUSE MOST OF OUR TRADES DO NOT

[akhhorus]

Stop writing in all caps. If this upsets you so much, then just walk away.

WELL WE WERE MISSING OUR 2ND ROUNDER IN THE SPRING OF 2009. SEEMS TO ME WE COULD HAVE USED THAT PICK ON A RIGHT TACKLE. PHIL LOADHOLT COMES TO MIND. MINNESOTA PICKED HIM IN THE 2ND ROUND AND HE WENT ON TO BE A STARTER. SO YES LOSING THAT PICK FOR TAYLOR COST US BIG TIME. FURTHERMORE ALL THE DRAFT PICKS WE TRADED AWAY WAS A BIG REASON WE DID NOT HAVE THE TALENT TO COMPETE.

We had plenty of picks after that 2nd rounder and we didn't draft a RT. We drafted Hanson and Glenn over several OL prospects who could have helped also. So, no, you're totally wrong since you still don't understand that a draft pick is only as good as the person making it.


GIVING UP A 3 RD ROUNDER OR A 4 ROUNDER DOES COST YOU. RATHER AMUSING THAT THE GUY REPLACING JAMAAL BROWN WAS A 4TH ROUND PICK. 3RDS AND 4THS ARE NOT THROW AWAY PICKS. FOR TEAMS WHO KNOW WHAT THEY ARE DOING MANY OF THOSE GUYS END UP AS STARTERS. HOPEFULLY THIS TRADE WILL WORK OUT FOR US BECAUSE MOST OF OUR TRADES DO NOT

Again: we're not losing a draft pick here. We're trading down 2 rounds. I don't understand why you can't understand that concept unless you're so obsessed with draft picks that it blinds you to facts.

[tuckahoeskin]

I doubt it as well, but barring the discovery of the fountain of youth, that's going to be one of our top concerns at this point next year.

If we could nab Ingraham from Alabama I'd be dancin'.

[OCSkinzFan]

That's a terrible example. Why? Haynesworth said the exact. same. thing.

That being said, I love this trade.

I don't recall AH saying "But I'm going to play wherever they want me to play."

Care to provide a link to your assertion?

What I remember is that he said Washington does a lot of the same things as Tennessee so the transition won't be difficult.

[SkinsKY]

I like this one (shockingly, Carmen does too), but I need to find it in something smaller than 24 months so she can wear it the first Sunday of her life :)

http://shop.redskins.com/ProductDetail.aspx?ProductDetailIndexName=Category Detail_524&C1=504&CategoryID=524&Page=1,2&ProductID=40355You said no to this one?
http://shop.redskins.com/ProductDetail.aspx?ProductDetailIndexName=Category Detail_524&C1=504&CategoryID=524&Page=1,2&ProductID=40101

[lorimike]

Stop writing in all caps. If this upsets you so much, then just walk away.

I'm not upset at all. enjoying the debate quite frankly.



We had plenty of picks after that 2nd rounder and we didn't draft a RT. We drafted Hanson and Glenn over several OL prospects who could have helped also. So, no, you're totally wrong since you still don't understand that a draft pick is only as good as the person making it.

I doubt anyone had Glenn or Henson on the radar as draftable players before round 7. The answer is to get better at drafting. Duke Robinson comes to mind as someone we should have picked over Cody Glenn




Again: we're not losing a draft pick here. We're trading down 2 rounds. I don't understand why you can't understand that concept unless you're so obsessed with draft picks that it blinds you to facts.

Its either a 3 or a 4th depending on which pick we have based on McNab's performance. Moving from a 3rd to a 5th is a big dropoff in talent. Maybe this trade will be a good one. We do have more competent people making decisions. We shall see. But you lose credibility when you defend the Jason Taylor trade. It was truly one of the all time fleecings in NFL history.

[fent]

You said no to this one?
http://shop.redskins.com/ProductDetail.aspx?ProductDetailIndexName=Category Detail_524&C1=504&CategoryID=524&Page=1,2&ProductID=40101

As much as we're in penny pinching mode right now, I think I'll pass on the "stiffs no longer on the team" category :)

[Lacquer Head]

I don't recall AH saying "But I'm going to play wherever they want me to play."

Care to provide a link to your assertion?

What I remember is that he said Washington does a lot of the same things as Carolina so the transition won't be difficult.

After less than a minute of searching:

"I’m not going to be a distraction or anything so I’m just going to do what they ask me to do.”

This is just the latest example of him making this statement. I'm sorry it's not a verbatim quote, I'll try to avoid hyperbole in the future.

http://blogs.fredericksburg.com/redskinsjournal/2010/03/22/albert-haynesworth-speaks-about-the-3-4-offseason-workouts/

[akhhorus]

I'm not upset at all. enjoying the debate quite frankly.


No one writes in caps locks unless they're pissed off.

I doubt anyone had Glenn or Henson on the radar as draftable players before round 7. The answer is to get better at drafting. Duke Robinson comes to mind as someone we should have picked over Cody Glenn


This has nothing to do with what you said. You said that the Taylor trade hurt us since it kept us from getting a right tackle. We passed on OLine talent throughout that draft, so assuming that the skins would have taken any Offensive lineman even with the picks back from Jason Taylor isn't based on fact.

Its either a 3 or a 4th depending on which pick we have based on McNab's performance. Moving from a 3rd to a 5th is a big dropoff in talent. Maybe this trade will be a good one. We do have more competent people making decisions.

Based on your rhetoric, it shouldn't matter. You try to point out that any draft pick could yield a good starting level player(nevermind your consistent inability to mention that draft picks after the first round have about a 8-15% success rate), so a 5th-to you unless you want to go back on what you've been saying for years-shouldn't be much different than a 3th considering your rhetoric about draft picks.

We shall see. But you lose credibility when you defend the Jason Taylor trade. It was truly one of the all time fleecings in NFL history.

It really wasnt even one of the worst trades in the last few years and your constant bringing up of my opinion of that trade is just a straw man(and saying that we screwed up the deal by playing him in the wrong system isn't defending it, but you clearly don't read what's being written) so you can try to avoid a discussion of your constant hypocrisy regarding the Skins. We get it Lorimike: you're an eagles fan or have a pathological draft pick obsession. But you become a joke when you constantly whine about the skins giving up a draft pick when they didn't in this case, then instead of just walking away after you realize your mistake understanding the trade, you start lashing out desperately trying to change the subject.

[lorimike]

No one writes in caps locks unless they're pissed off.

I did that so my response was separted from yours


This has nothing to do with what you said. You said that the Taylor trade hurt us since it kept us from getting a right tackle. We passed on OLine talent throughout that draft, so assuming that the skins would have taken any Offensive lineman even with the picks back from Jason Taylor isn't based on fact.

We gave up a 2nd rounder for a player who played here one year. That absolutey hurts a team. Even if they didn't pick an offensive linemen the 2nd rounder could have been used at virtually any position.



Based on your rhetoric, it shouldn't matter. You try to point out that any draft pick could yield a good starting level player(nevermind your consistent inability to mention that draft picks after the first round have about a 8-15% success rate), so a 5th-to you unless you want to go back on what you've been saying for years-shouldn't be much different than a 3th considering your rhetoric about draft picks.


I said maybe this will be a good trade but lets not pretend we didn't give up anything for this player.
It really wasnt even one of the worst trades in the last few years and your constant bringing up of my opinion of that trade is just a straw man(and saying that we screwed up the deal by playing him in the wrong system isn't defending it, but you clearly don't read what's being written) so you can try to avoid a discussion of your constant hypocrisy regarding the Skins. We get it Lorimike: you're an eagles fan or have a pathological draft pick obsession. But you become a joke when you constantly whine about the skins giving up a draft pick when they didn't in this case, then instead of just walking away after you realize your mistake understanding the trade, you start lashing out desperately trying to change the subject.

Oh please. get over yourself. Have a little respect for someones opinion. We do this debate all the time. Every year we lose yet you keep defending these trades.

[OCSkinzFan]

After less than a minute of searching:

"I’m not going to be a distraction or anything so I’m just going to do what they ask me to do.”

This is just the latest example of him making this statement. I'm sorry it's not a verbatim quote, I'll try to avoid hyperbole in the future.

http://blogs.fredericksburg.com/redskinsjournal/2010/03/22/albert-haynesworth-speaks-about-the-3-4-offseason-workouts/

That's different than " I'm going to play wherever they want me to play."

Albert wasn't walking in being asked to play another position and saying I'm going to play wherever they want me to. What Haynesworth was saying was saying was "I’m not going to be a distraction or anything so I’m just going to do what they ask me to do" exactly because he HAD been a distraction in the past and had NOT done exactly what the coaches had told him to do in the past.

This situation is totally different.

Brown is being asked to play at a different position than the one that he went to two probowls at and he said, "But I'm going to play wherever they want me to play." Now he could be lying BUT He also has never stomped on an opponents head or been a distraction other than to ask to be traded when he was no longer a starter.

My point stands that he is very unhaynesworthic.

[akhhorus]

I did that so my response was separted from yours

You're lying here, but make up anything you want to so you can keep tap dancing.

We gave up a 2nd rounder for a player who played here one year. That absolutey hurts a team. Even if they didn't pick an offensive linemen the 2nd rounder could have been used at virtually any position.

This really has nothing to do with what you want to bring up(especially since the skins had 3 2nd rounders from the previous season who barely played in 2008). The issue was how the Taylor trade specifically hurt the Skins for the 2009 season, which is what you want to complain about. You wanted to bring up that it kept the skins from getting a right tackle(which is absurd on the face of it), I pointed out that we passed on right tackles throughout the draft. Now you're trying to claim that we could have gotten someone who could have helped the skins. Yet another straw man.

I said maybe this will be a good trade but lets not pretend we didn't give up anything for this player.


We gave up 2 rounds in the next draft. If its okay in your dogmatic universe for the Eagles to give up 2 high draft picks and a 5th for Jason Peters(who is about the same level as Brown), if you want to be consistent, you should have absolutely zero problem with the skins giving up 2 rounds(without losing a pick) for Brown.

That is if you want to be consistent, which you clearly never want to do.

Oh please. get over yourself. Have a little respect for someones opinion. We do this debate all the time. Every year we lose yet you keep defending these trades.

Yet another straw man so you can tap dance to avoid the issue. And Lorimike, I have no respect for someone who doesn't bother to read what's really going on or bother to see the context of a situation/event or to realize when they're being blatantly hypocritical just so that they can bitch and moan a little louder. If the Skins got Tom Brady for a conditional 7th round pick, you'd complain about losing that 7th round pick.

[lorimike]

Ank- Tom Brady for a 7th rounder?

I would be doing the irish jig if we got Brady for a 7th rounder. My opinions are not as un-flexible as you think. And I've said several times this might be a good trade but lets not think we didn't give up anything. I will admit that the oline just went from a question mark to being possibly a very good line. The other side of this is that if you trade for these guys you need to sign them to long term deals otherwise you've given up draft compensation for a one year player. I would feel a lot more compfortable if we had McNabb and Brown signed to long term deals. Hopefully that will happen.

[akhhorus]

Ank- Tom Brady for a 7th rounder?

I would be doing the irish jig if we got Brady for a 7th rounder. My opinions are not as un-flexible as you think.

Then show that you're willing to look at context. All your posting suggests that you're not flexible(except when the Eagles do it).

And I've said several times this might be a good trade but lets not think we didn't give up anything.

We gave up 2 rounds in the next draft. A 2012 6th if Brown makes the pro bowl. If you want to think that the Taylor trade was a royal screw job, knock yourself out, but again with context: we gave up a 2nd and a 6th(or a 5th) for Taylor. We've given up a 2nd, 3rd, 4th for McNabb, Jammal Brown and a 5th or 6th rounder. I don't think that even you can't say that this represents a massive shift in the quality of the front office(at least in their negotiating skills).

I will admit that the oline just went from a question mark to being possibly a very good line. The other side of this is that if you trade for these guys you need to sign them to long term deals otherwise you've given up draft compensation for a one year player. I would feel a lot more compfortable if we had McNabb and Brown signed to long term deals. Hopefully that will happen.

If they don't, they could get some more draft picks.

[Red Bear]

lorimike youre not looking at this trade the right way. picture the trade the way we made it with allen as gm, and then picture the trade we wouldve made with vinny cerrato in charge. if vinny was still in charge we wouldve given up packages similar to what the eagles gave up for peters, for a similar level tackle as brown, or a package like what the cowboys gave up for roy williams. and thats only if vinny decided to actually try and upgrade the oline for once. and i have to agree that youve been highly hypocritical during this debate ive read

[Goskins11]

So will Brown be moving to RT. And Hicks will back up RT.

i think brown will be LT and williams will be Rt. hicks will back up. The offensive line is looking better as the offseason continues. thank god that it was such a big area of focus this offseason. I'm really excited for the season. I am a little dissapointed that AH wasn't part of the deal but oh well. Also the conditional and draft scenarios are a little confusing, but looks like a steal for our fo. GO SKins!!!

[Hr fan]

Jamal Brown? For picking 64-80 players later (comp picks)? Yes, Virginia, there is a Santa Claus!

No arguing with this trade. But about rarely or never trading draft choices?

Since the Otto Graham era there have been two periods closely following each other of superior performance - George Allen and Bobby Beathard. Before either came, and after both were gone, there was only the 1991/Casserly using mostly Beathard's roster to feel good about. And there was a common theme for each man.

Allen made the over-the-hill gang by getting 7 (if memory serves) Rams and Billy Kilmer for virtually all the 'Skins draft choices. Led in the short term to our first SB appearance. Bobby always felt that getting a player this year for next year's choice was advantageous. He also felt the risk of 1st rounders was avoidable by trading down. Again a trade of a 1st led to Grimm (HOF), Speck, Manley, and Dean.

Excellence is very hard to sustain. It is achievable by the draft, trades, or more likely a combination. IMO the method has to be based on need versus availability, but the common thread seems to be who is doing the evaluations/commitments. Casserly/Ceratto = 20 down years. Allen/Beathard = nearly 20 years up.

I don't care to retain draft choices, garner them like a Belichek, off vets like a Reid, or any method, unless the individuals applying the method(s) produce results. We started 2010 with 5 choices, made 6, and got a pro bowl QB and potential starter at DE ion the 3-4 to boot. Now a pro bowl LOT for very, very little.

While we need to see results, and it may take more than 1 year (new systems on both sides of the ball), the start is impressive. For several years our biggest need has been OL, and we have 5 new ones, one pro bowler and one potential pro bowler among the 5, both at the position of maximum need (OT). By consensus we did not overspend in FA and our trades have brought a change at QB that most on this board considered essential to progress. Ceratto is gone, danny is muzzled, and past mistakes are being addressed. Thank you Allehan!!!

Yes, Virginia, there is a Santa Claus!

[ihatedallas]

I would really enjoy seeing A small extension. Its rare that someone who the Redskins want to keep walks though. Danny pays for quality, even if he is misdirected most of the time.

[LATrueRedskin]

I'm down with this move, especially after hearing that Dr. Andrews checked him out and he looks perfectly fine. He's a HUGE addition to our OLine, and can immediately step in and play left tackle if Williams is overwhelmed at first. Smart move by Shanahan.

[Hr fan]

I would really enjoy seeing A small extension. Its rare that someone who the Redskins want to keep walks though. Danny pays for quality, even if he is misdirected most of the time.

As I gather JB wouldn't sign the tender, thus blocking a trade, until a negotiated extension was in place. This is what lowered his price also, since he is coming off injury and wanted to be paid like a pro bowl LT. I am sure this turned off other teams, but at the price in terms of draft position this is a more than reasonable risk backed by Dr. Andrews. This is a proper use of danny's deep pockets. He fits AND addresses a position of critical need.

[greatest2]

As I gather JB wouldn't sign the tender, thus blocking a trade, until a negotiated extension was in place. This is what lowered his price also, since he is coming off injury and wanted to be paid like a pro bowl LT. I am sure this turned off other teams, but at the price in terms of draft position this is a more than reasonable risk backed by Dr. Andrews. This is a proper use of danny's deep pockets. He fits AND addresses a position of critical need.

im not sure thats why he didn't sign the tender. I believe he didn't sign the tender because he wanted to be with a team that had him in the long term plans. I.E. i will go to the redskins, try and get a deal, but if it doesn't happen will prove myself to get my contract. That is why there is no extension right now.

[Lacquer Head]

That's different than " I'm going to play wherever they want me to play."

Albert wasn't walking in being asked to play another position and saying I'm going to play wherever they want me to. What Haynesworth was saying was saying was "I’m not going to be a distraction or anything so I’m just going to do what they ask me to do" exactly because he HAD been a distraction in the past and had NOT done exactly what the coaches had told him to do in the past.

This situation is totally different.

Brown is being asked to play at a different position than the one that he went to two probowls at and he said, "But I'm going to play wherever they want me to play." Now he could be lying BUT He also has never stomped on an opponents head or been a distraction other than to ask to be traded when he was no longer a starter.

My point stands that he is very unhaynesworthic.

You're just mincing words.

Is the statement "I'm going to do what they ask me to do" not an all-encompassing statement? Surely you don't think he's talking about his willingness to do Shanny's laundry or wash Redskin One for Snyder? What other context could you take that statement in other than "In regards to my role on this football team, I will do whatever they ask me to do"? Sure he doesn't want to play in a 3-4, but that is indeed what they are asking him to do, is it not? I don't see the disconnect at all.

He sure wasn't talking about doing what they want in regards to offseason training...

Anyway, we both agree that Jamaal is a good pick-up, which is the meat of the issue, but I find the way you compared it to Haynesworth pretty amusing since we all had that vibe from Haynesworth from Day 1, that he was supposed to be a team player.

[FanFromArizona]

Did anyone see this:



Yea, throw in 2012 6th for pro bowl or 90% of snaps. Still a great deal.

Or basically send them the Oakland pick we got for JCampbell.

[joethefan]

Per PFT

Report: Cowboys tried to get Jammal Brown

Offensive tackle Jammal Brown ended up with the Redskins, but reportedly not before a division rival gave Dan Snyder's team competition for the oft-injured former Pro Bowler.


Per Jeff Duncan of the New Orleans Times-Picayune, the Cowboys "showed interest" in Brown prior to his Saturday trade to Washington. The extent of their interest was unclear, but Dallas' pursuit of Brown may hint at a few different things:


1. The Cowboys were not overly pleased with Doug Free during spring workouts. Free is entering his first full season as a starter. Though he flashed promise in spot starts last season, Free remains something of an unknown.


2. Jerry Jones' team is concerned with 31-year-old right tackle Marc Colombo's possibly imminent decline. Colombo broke his right fibula last November. Upon return in the playoffs, Colombo was embarrassed by Vikings defensive end Ray Edwards. In the scenario that Dallas' goal was to upgrade over Colombo, Free could kick over to his more natural right tackle position with Brown manning Tony Romo's blind side. Alex Barron would remain the "swing" tackle and Colombo would be released.


3. The Cowboys threw their hat into the Brown bidding just because they knew the Redskins wanted him. Dallas and Washington are division foes. Even if the Cowboys' roster looks to contain significantly more talent, the Redskins are a threat, and will be even more so if they keep new quarterback Donovan McNabb off the injured reserve list.


Ultimately, the Cowboys' interest in Jammal Brown may have been minimal. Duncan does not provide details of a trade proposal, and the Redskins were able to snag an Opening Day starting offensive tackle for the relatively bargain price of a conditional third-round pick. But it's a topic worth exploring, and indicates that Jerry Jones' franchise will be active on the waiver wire following training camp cuts


http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/06/20/report-cowboys-tried-to-get-jammal-brown/

[shally]

Love it.. absolutely, love it..

we get stronger and a rival has to be content with a guy like Free playing tackle

[Lacquer Head]

various good stuff

And that makes it all sweeter...

[Gravy]

Love it.. absolutely, love it..

we get stronger and a rival has to be content with a guy like Free playing tackle

They can have Heyer!

[smoak]

I just love this part (http://www.theredzone.org/BlogDescription/tabid/61/EntryId/7611/Cowboys-also-had-interest-in-Jammal-Brown/Default.aspx) of the whole scenario.

[44 goes 50 gut]

Per PFT

Report: Cowboys tried to get Jammal Brown

Offensive tackle Jammal Brown ended up with the Redskins, but reportedly not before a division rival gave Dan Snyder's team competition for the oft-injured former Pro Bowler.


Per Jeff Duncan of the New Orleans Times-Picayune, the Cowboys "showed interest" in Brown prior to his Saturday trade to Washington. The extent of their interest was unclear, but Dallas' pursuit of Brown may hint at a few different things:


1. The Cowboys were not overly pleased with Doug Free during spring workouts. Free is entering his first full season as a starter. Though he flashed promise in spot starts last season, Free remains something of an unknown.


2. Jerry Jones' team is concerned with 31-year-old right tackle Marc Colombo's possibly imminent decline. Colombo broke his right fibula last November. Upon return in the playoffs, Colombo was embarrassed by Vikings defensive end Ray Edwards. In the scenario that Dallas' goal was to upgrade over Colombo, Free could kick over to his more natural right tackle position with Brown manning Tony Romo's blind side. Alex Barron would remain the "swing" tackle and Colombo would be released.


3. The Cowboys threw their hat into the Brown bidding just because they knew the Redskins wanted him. Dallas and Washington are division foes. Even if the Cowboys' roster looks to contain significantly more talent, the Redskins are a threat, and will be even more so if they keep new quarterback Donovan McNabb off the injured reserve list.


Ultimately, the Cowboys' interest in Jammal Brown may have been minimal. Duncan does not provide details of a trade proposal, and the Redskins were able to snag an Opening Day starting offensive tackle for the relatively bargain price of a conditional third-round pick. But it's a topic worth exploring, and indicates that Jerry Jones' franchise will be active on the waiver wire following training camp cuts


http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/06/20/report-cowboys-tried-to-get-jammal-brown/

I don't know, my "Desperate - journalist - looking - for - a - story - mostly - speculating - based - on - anonymous - source - BS-o'-meter" is pegged, but whatever, glad to see them get one over on the 'boys if it's not just some news guys daydream or the blown up comment of some cowboys ticket sales rep who knows the author...

[Redskinmayhem]

Solid deal for us. Lets hope JB's injury woes are behind him.

[Hr fan]

im not sure thats why he didn't sign the tender. I believe he didn't sign the tender because he wanted to be with a team that had him in the long term plans. I.E. i will go to the redskins, try and get a deal, but if it doesn't happen will prove myself to get my contract. That is why there is no extension right now.

The tender for JB was a raise >10%, which by not signing during the tender period allowed NO to lower the offer to a 10% raise. In either case JB was tied to the Saints, and could hold out until game 10 with fines accruing. He needed to get in by game 10 to accrue the year so he would be a FA.

Instead, as JB acknowledged in his WAPO Insider interview, JB and agent decided to go for the big #s (I believe he used the term "big push") by doing what he could to force a trade. NO has 4 NFL level OTs without JB, and JB's replacement did very well and is much cheaper. He wanted out, and NO didn't need him and has cheaper players in hand. But a trade could not take place until JB signed his tender, which he had declined to do previously. IMO the structure of an extension is in place that satisfies Brown and agent.

His desire to be a Redskin, IMO, was less then his desire to do good "business" (the word he used).

[Skaggsrules]

Per PFT

Report: Cowboys tried to get Jammal Brown




3. The Cowboys threw their hat into the Brown bidding just because they knew the Redskins wanted him. Dallas and Washington are division foes. Even if the Cowboys' roster looks to contain significantly more talent, the Redskins are a threat, and will be even more so if they keep new quarterback Donovan McNabb off the injured reserve list.


http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/06/20/report-cowboys-tried-to-get-jammal-brown/

I know I'm very optimistic, but I don't see how the Cowboys are SIGNIFICANTLY more talented than we are. The only place I see them having way more talent than us is WR, and now NT since Fat Baby is having a tantrum

[OCSkinzFan]

You're just mincing words.

Is the statement "I'm going to do what they ask me to do" not an all-encompassing statement? Surely you don't think he's talking about his willingness to do Shanny's laundry or wash Redskin One for Snyder? What other context could you take that statement in other than "In regards to my role on this football team, I will do whatever they ask me to do"? Sure he doesn't want to play in a 3-4, but that is indeed what they are asking him to do, is it not? I don't see the disconnect at all.

He sure wasn't talking about doing what they want in regards to off season training...

Anyway, we both agree that Jamaal is a good pick-up, which is the meat of the issue, but I find the way you compared it to Haynesworth pretty amusing since we all had that vibe from Haynesworth from Day 1, that he was supposed to be a team player.

YOU are mincing words.
I was providing context.

In the same interview that you provided to point out that AH said I'll do what they tell me to he also says that he told Shanny that he would NOT do what he was told and go to off season workouts, and in the same interview he said that he did NOT want to play NT (a different position) in a 3/4.

Now PLEASE explain how that is "THE SAME THING" as Brown saying "I'll play wherever(a different position) they want me to play.

[skin-tastic]

Im glad it wasnt a conditional 3rd for bushrod.

Im glad we didnt make this move before or during the draft and used 2011 draft picks.

Im glad we seem to have adequate depth at the tackle spot with 2 starting caliber players. Last year, if and when samuels went down, it left us sliding our starting RT (levi jones) over and pluggin Heyer in at RT. Now Heyer is where he belongs, on the bench as a back up to a backup. I assume hicks would slide from RG to RT and heyer would come in if 2 of these 3 (williams, brown hicks) are injured.

In this day and age, IMO you need 3 starting caliber tackles. 1 is a probowl type LT. 1 is a RT who could play LT at a decent level. 1 is a player on the bench who could start at RT on half the teams in the league. Wishful thinking, but if this is your set up you can sustain winning with injuries.

The ravens had oher starting at RT with Gaither at LT. Gaither goes down, Oher slides over to LT and I forget who they then plugged in at RT but i believe started at RT for the ravens the year before Oher was drafted.

Saints - brown goes down, bushrod is a 4th rounder with 2 years of training and prep ready to step in.

My dream scenario with Brown is that he plays 8 games or so under his tender so we can see how healthy he is and how he fits in, then if we like what we see, sign him to a contract making him the somewhere around the 15th highest paid LT. I just dont want a b lyyod all over again where we get a new player who is under contract but we rip up the contract and sign him to a new long term deal without ever seeing what he looks like in the B&G. but Brown wants a new contract and not the tender money, so I guess in allen and shanny i trust.

i like the potential value of the pick. this offseason you can acquire real talent for 3rd to 5th rounders. quite astounishing how the tender restrictions this offseason cut down on FA activity but opened the door for minimal compensation trades (as long as you were willing to give the tendered player a new contract which his old team who has the best scouting report on him declined to do).

im surprised and thankful no one ponyed up a 3rd for los and that haslett values his play more than most prior.

[NamVet4]

I am neutral about this latest pickup. Jamal Brown started 58 games for the Saints in five seasons before the injuries sidelined him last year. While I concur with others that this is a step toward making the O-line better I am taking a wait and see as to whether or not Brown passes his physical and can be an every game starter.

[OCSkinzFan]

i think brown will be LT and williams will be Rt. hicks will back up. The offensive line is looking better as the offseason continues. thank god that it was such a big area of focus this offseason. I'm really excited for the season. I am a little dissapointed that AH wasn't part of the deal but oh well. Also the conditional and draft scenarios are a little confusing, but looks like a steal for our fo. GO SKins!!!You think Brown will play LT even though he said in an interview with the Washington Post that he will be playing RT? Link (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/redskinsinsider/qa-with-jammal-brown.html) So you and lackerhead both think he is a lier?

Most people think that Hicks will compete with Mike Williams for the RG spot, but if Mike wins, then Hicks will probably back up RT and RG.

[Keino]

You think Brown will play LT even though he said in an interview with the Washington Post that he will be playing RT? Link (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/redskinsinsider/qa-with-jammal-brown.html) So you and lackerhead both think he is a lier?

Most people think that Hicks will compete with Mike Williams for the RG spot, but if Mike wins, then Hicks will probably back up RT and RG.

I would think in that situation, no matter what, Hicks would be the first lineman off the bench given his ability to play T, G as well as Center.

Frankly, I think he beats out BMW for the RG spot in which case the first guy off the bench is Williams who would replace a G if one goes down and shifts Hicks to Tackle if one of the Tackles goes down or to C if Rabach goes down. Also, do not count out Selvish Capers getting a look if a T goes down, as Chris Samuels was giving this guy glowing praise.

What would be interesting to me if this acquisition suddenly opened up competition at the Center position.

[dj_stouty]

All in all...this is a great problem to have. We have better O-line depth now than we have had in years...

[Patrick]

You think Brown will play LT even though he said in an interview with the Washington Post that he will be playing RT? Link (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/redskinsinsider/qa-with-jammal-brown.html) So you and lackerhead both think he is a lier?

Most people think that Hicks will compete with Mike Williams for the RG spot, but if Mike wins, then Hicks will probably back up RT and RG. I have nothing to base this on other than a few brief words coming from local reports about Mike Williams in OTAs - but I think Williams will end up the starting RG and Hicks becomes a backup. I'm also thinking that Hicks, Montgomery, E. Williams, and Rinehart are the backups. Heard some good things about Capers so there is a chance he slips into that group over Rinehart but that will depend how good he performs in training camp. JMO though.

[OCSkinzFan]

I would think in that situation, no matter what, Hicks would be the first lineman off the bench given his ability to play T, G as well as Center.

Frankly, I think he beats out BMW for the RG spot in which case the first guy off the bench is Williams who would replace a G if one goes down and shifts Hicks to Tackle if one of the Tackles goes down or to C if Rabach goes down. Also, do not count out Selvish Capers getting a look if a T goes down, as Chris Samuels was giving this guy glowing praise.

What would be interesting to me if this acquisition suddenly opened up competition at the Center position.

I agree with everything you say here except that I think Rabach (healthy) is a lock at center. And as far a Capers goes, in a year or two, I bet he's our #3 Tackle. (But that may be a little optimistic- hard not to be with so much off season action on the o-line!)

[shally]

I am neutral about this latest pickup. Jamal Brown started 58 games for the Saints in five seasons before the injuries sidelined him last year. While I concur with others that this is a step toward making the O-line better I am taking a wait and see as to whether or not Brown passes his physical and can be an every game starter.

supposedly Doc Andrews checked Brown out and he is fine

[Red Bear]

I would think in that situation, no matter what, Hicks would be the first lineman off the bench given his ability to play T, G as well as Center.

Frankly, I think he beats out BMW for the RG spot in which case the first guy off the bench is Williams who would replace a G if one goes down and shifts Hicks to Tackle if one of the Tackles goes down or to C if Rabach goes down. Also, do not count out Selvish Capers getting a look if a T goes down, as Chris Samuels was giving this guy glowing praise.

What would be interesting to me if this acquisition suddenly opened up competition at the Center position.

the flaw with this is, center is the one position that Hicks does not play, he has played all other 4 positions along the line though

[skin-tastic]

I agree with everything you say here except that I think Rabach (healthy) is a lock at center. And as far a Capers goes, in a year or two, I bet he's our #3 Tackle. (But that may be a little optimistic- hard not to be with so much off season action on the o-line!)

I agree. I think rabach is a lock at center. The new regime resigned him. I may be wrong, but one of the things i liked about rabach was when he was responsible for calling out the blocks, blitzes, pressure, line protection audibles, etc.

when zorn came in, there were conflicting reports and qoutes that campbell took over line protection audibles, etc.

i think rabach, at his smallish size, wasnt meant to go 1 on 1 with defensive tackles like zorn and co had schemed for our offense. imo alot of our problems last year was zorn's reluctance to change philosophy of having and expecting our o lineman to go 1 on 1 and for each to win their battles. expecting levi jones to stand strong against a bull rushing end with no chip or slide protection help was just retarded. expecting heyer to stand strong against a DE 1 on 1 and expect him or whoever our back was to pick up a stunt rusher or blitzing linebacker was fatal.

my sense is that our o line guys arent going to have to win physical one on one battles anymore, but rely on their scheme and quickness.

our o line protection scheme last year; jones and heyer had to win their 1 on 1 battles for any play over 15 yards to have a chance. (that doesnt even include dockery, rabach, williams not containing the middle rush).

rabach is a smart center. right? years ago you could see it in his play, the last 2 years he has not been used properly imo.

[Keino]

the flaw with this is, center is the one position that Hicks does not play, he has played all other 4 positions along the line though

For some reason I thought that he had logged some time at C over the course of his career either in College or Pros, but I am not having any luck finding anything that supports that.

[shally]

For some reason I thought that he had logged some time at C over the course of his career either in College or Pros, but I am not having any luck finding anything that supports that.

i think you are correct..i just dont remember where i read it either..
maybe we can get Jansen back to fill that role...lol






jk

[Red Bear]

I agree. I think rabach is a lock at center. The new regime resigned him. I may be wrong, but one of the things i liked about rabach was when he was responsible for calling out the blocks, blitzes, pressure, line protection audibles, etc.

when zorn came in, there were conflicting reports and qoutes that campbell took over line protection audibles, etc.

i think rabach, at his smallish size, wasnt meant to go 1 on 1 with defensive tackles like zorn and co had schemed for our offense. imo alot of our problems last year was zorn's reluctance to change philosophy of having and expecting our o lineman to go 1 on 1 and for each to win their battles. expecting levi jones to stand strong against a bull rushing end with no chip or slide protection help was just retarded. expecting heyer to stand strong against a DE 1 on 1 and expect him or whoever our back was to pick up a stunt rusher or blitzing linebacker was fatal.

my sense is that our o line guys arent going to have to win physical one on one battles anymore, but rely on their scheme and quickness.

our o line protection scheme last year; jones and heyer had to win their 1 on 1 battles for any play over 15 yards to have a chance. (that doesnt even include dockery, rabach, williams not containing the middle rush).

rabach is a smart center. right? years ago you could see it in his play, the last 2 years he has not been used properly imo.

at the same time, you cant expect to block everyone with double teams either. theres a lot of times where guys will need to win the 1 on 1 matchups


For some reason I thought that he had logged some time at C over the course of his career either in College or Pros, but I am not having any luck finding anything that supports that.

i think you are correct..i just dont remember where i read it either..
maybe we can get Jansen back to fill that role...lol

jk

i dont recall ever reading such a thing about him playing center, in fact i recall hicks saying its the one position he has never played.

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/redskinsinsider/free-agency/in-artis-hicks-redskins-get-so.html

The former Minnesota Vikings guard-tackle, who signed a three-year contract with the Redskins on Saturday, entered the league as a left tackle. He only reluctantly learned to play left guard, and then right guard and right tackle in an attempt to improve and extend his career.

And after eight seasons in the NFL, Hicks believes he made a wise move.

"You can't win in this league if you don't have a good offensive line, and not only a good offensive line, you've got to have a good offensive line that has good depth," Hicks said in a phone interview Sunday. "You have to have guys who can step in and play a lot of different positions and the line won't miss a beat.

"And I think that was one of the things that attracted them [the Redskins] to me, is that I can play four out of the five spots. They know that I can step in and keep things rolling right ahead, as well as be a starter in this league. My versatility ... that's one of the things that's helped me play in this league for eight years now."

[firehawk157]

Got to love our depth at OL! Hicks has to be one of the best back-ups in the NFC East.

[CapitalDefense]

Got to love our depth at OL! Hicks has to be one of the best back-ups in the NFC East.
I am not sold that he will backup, given the opportunity Hicks would win the RG spot and Mike Williams would go to the bench. IMO

Training camp will be fun.

[VegasSkinsFan]

I am not sold that he will backup, given the opportunity Hicks would win the RG spot and Mike Williams would go to the bench. IMO

Training camp will be fun.

Either way i think its a win-win situation. We either start Hicks, who will do a good job at G, or we have Mike Willaims win the job showing his improvement, with Hicks coming off the bench. Its wierd thinking about using the words Oline and Depth concerning the 'Skins...but it sure is nice. GO SKINS !!!!!!

[Hr fan]

im not sure thats why he didn't sign the tender. I believe he didn't sign the tender because he wanted to be with a team that had him in the long term plans. I.E. i will go to the redskins, try and get a deal, but if it doesn't happen will prove myself to get my contract. That is why there is no extension right now.

+1. A deal is not in place for an extension but both sides want one. IMO JB used the tender to get to a team with a chance to display his abilities haven't eroded. He wants LT money, so there is a doubt in the Allen fiscal conservatism vein that another team won't outbid us. But the need is immediate, and he fits the bill.

The Saints had to choose, and Jhari Evans record contract, plus the investments in other OL members and having 4 serviceable OTs made JB the odd man out. We were lucky, but also Allehan had to be pursuing this for some time. Kudos to the FO.

[guess88]

The best part of the deal is how little we gave up. BA made a trade that Ceratto couldn't ever even comprehend or manage. We would've given our 1st, and 4th for sure.

[firehawk157]

The best part of the deal is how little we gave up. BA made a trade that Ceratto couldn't ever even comprehend or manage. We would've given our 1st, and 4th for sure.

No, Cerrato would have been like, "WTH is an offensive tackle? Isn't tackling something you do on defense? Why would I want an offensive tackle, that seems quite counter-productive to me!"

[tuckahoeskin]

No, Cerrato would have been like, "WTH is an offensive tackle? Isn't tackling something you do on defense? Why would I want an offensive tackle, that seems quite counter-productive to me!"

"Hey Coach Blache, got another safety for you."

[silverspring]

We got lucky on this one. Assuming brown is healthy this is a good pick up. I am not happy to be missing both our 3rd and 4th round picks but you can't complain about brown for a 4th. Although this is another one of those pick ups that perplexes me in terms of having no extension in place. If he doesn't sign an extension I would reverse my opinion and call this trade a waste of a draft pick.