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View Full Version : Free agent speculation from JLC via PFT


smittyskin
07-13-2011, 08:35 AM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/13/report-santonio-holmes-primary-objective-on-long-redskins-wish-list/

I guess I would be okay with these guys. I think we need another solid corner though. Any thoughts on A. Franklin versus Kris Jenkins?

BIGREDSKINSFAN1963
07-13-2011, 09:34 AM
i'd take holmes before i woul braylon edwards! marshall yanda is got to be number 1 on the ravens resigning list is'nt he?:giantsuk:

Santheb
07-13-2011, 09:47 AM
Seems like a lot of high priced people to squeeze under the cap. I'm all for Yanda, but placing him next to Rabach instantly deteriorates his value to this team. Casey Rabach is pretty much a black hole of suck, compromising everybody in his immediate vicinity, dragging them down to his level.

Are there any decent FA center's this year?

shally
07-13-2011, 09:57 AM
Seems like a lot of high priced people to squeeze under the cap. I'm all for Yanda, but placing him next to Rabach instantly deteriorates his value to this team. Casey Rabach is pretty much a black hole of suck, compromising everybody in his immediate vicinity, dragging them down to his level.

Are there any decent FA center's this year?

Montgomery, actually..Would be an instant upgrade without big time expense

otherwise, Baas or Sendlein would be fine

and adding the Jenkins Brothers would be a huge upgrade for the D line.. the only questions about Kris are his ability to stay healthy now.. if he can, he would be a cheaper alternative to Franklin, who will cost a mint to sign

Moe
07-13-2011, 10:11 AM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/13/report-santonio-holmes-primary-objective-on-long-redskins-wish-list/

I guess I would be okay with these guys. I think we need another solid corner though. Any thoughts on A. Franklin versus Kris Jenkins?

Sounds like so much excrement being tossed at the wall to see what sticks.
-Holmes is a talent, but he's also 1 strike away from a suspension of some length, not to mention the realities that this team just drafted a ton of WR's and don't exactly have the most encouraging QB situation to lure a lot of WR's in.

- Yanda would fill a need nicely but I think the Ravens will find a way to retain him. They're a contender and losing him would hurt.

-Cullen Jenkins makes some sense and also fills a need so this one could bear fruit.

-Kris Jenkins is so banged up that at this point he's a spot player who should only be signed to an incentive contract. I don't buy him being a target due to his age, injury history, career list of always feeling underpaid and the fact that he's publicy stated that he doesn't like the Skins.

-Cofield will be available but he's a 4-3 DT, so I'm not sure where he fits for the price he'll be able to command. It wouldn't shock me to see him in the fold but he'll get some run from a lot of teams that better fit his style.

-Gaither...meh. He's can play but he's a headcase with a potentially gimpy back and as a backup would be great but not too many headcases thrive as backups.

-Chester is interesting because he's one of the few Centers that will be out there. However, he's never been able to take that spot for the Ravens, which probably says a lot. Maybe he needs to a fresh start or maybe he's Rabach v2.0

The list of guys they want to retain is logical and wouldn't surprise me. Buchannon doesn't excite me and i think they'll look at one of the free agent CB's that'll be available, but the rest seem likely. One position that wasn't mentioned is LB, whichI think will get some attention.

Gravy
07-13-2011, 10:36 AM
Montgomery, actually..Would be an instant upgrade without big time expense

otherwise, Baas or Sendlein would be fine

and adding the Jenkins Brothers would be a huge upgrade for the D line.. the only questions about Kris are his ability to stay healthy now.. if he can, he would be a cheaper alternative to Franklin, who will cost a mint to sign

Did Shanny NOT see the Titans game to see that Montgomery made our line instantly better? Cut Rabach and add Baas would be good

nicefellow31
07-13-2011, 11:03 AM
This is what caught my eye

Shanahan has been unwavering in his support of Beck, to the dismay of some in the organization who haven't seen anything to suggest the former Raven and Miami Dolphin can be a competitive starting quarterback. With the 2010 season lost, Shanahan chose to play Grossman over Beck, and some at Redskins Park wonder why Beck, if he was indeed the future, didn't receive the call in those meaningless games. "He is set on Beck," said a source familiar with Shanahan's thinking. "That's his guy. He isn't just saying it for the media or to blow smoke. He's serious as hell about it."


I wonder where that "dismay" is coming from? Danny? Allen? Who?

LadyNRedskinsfan
07-13-2011, 11:05 AM
Here's a more detailed article on the free agent speculation by Jason LaCanfora.

Link (http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d820be464/article/redskins-prepared-to-make-run-on-big-free-agents-after-lockout)

akhhorus
07-13-2011, 11:20 AM
This is what caught my eye



I wonder where that "dismay" is coming from? Danny? Allen? Who?

The rest of the offense?

As for the names Holmes and Gaither are plausible, but Cullen Jenkins et al with all the Dline pieces we have already? Signing Moss AND Holmes? Does not compute. Resigning Brown and going after Gaither? Also does not compute.

That being said, I fully expect the skins to try all this so that people will forget that they are pushing John Beck out there at Qb lol.

shally
07-13-2011, 11:53 AM
The rest of the offense?

As for the names Holmes and Gaither are plausible, but Cullen Jenkins et al with all the Dline pieces we have already? Signing Moss AND Holmes? Does not compute. Resigning Brown and going after Gaither? Also does not compute.

That being said, I fully expect the skins to try all this so that people will forget that they are pushing John Beck out there at Qb lol.

implausible we dont sign at least 1 QB-- either UDFA like Devlin, or perhaps a young reserve.

second, why we wouldnt just go after Harris to play the RT is beyond me. he was drafted by Shanahan and is 4 years younger than Brown with less injury history. plus, he actually wants to play the Right tackle position, unlike Brown, who sees himself as a LEFT tackle first.

i think the Ravens will go hard after Yanda, so plan B should be to go after the right side of the Falcons line

corner is a big concern until we decide who takes Rogers spot

akhhorus
07-13-2011, 12:16 PM
implausible we dont sign at least 1 QB-- either UDFA like Devlin, or perhaps a young reserve.

second, why we wouldnt just go after Harris to play the RT is beyond me. he was drafted by Shanahan and is 4 years younger than Brown with less injury history. plus, he actually wants to play the Right tackle position, unlike Brown, who sees himself as a LEFT tackle first.

i think the Ravens will go hard after Yanda, so plan B should be to go after the right side of the Falcons line

corner is a big concern until we decide who takes Rogers spot

Shally, stop trying to apply reason and logic lol.

Patrick
07-13-2011, 12:39 PM
How about ???? ...... ANY of these articles that are written are nothing more that speculation. And besides if you add enough big names to any teams list (as one of these so-call expert nfl insiders do) you're going to come up with one or two correct ones. ............. NO ONE knows what Shanahan/Allen (I'm not sure they even know) are going to do, or any other coach/GMs. Bottomline is if Shanny/Allen go after young quality OG, OC, RT, NT, CB, and WR, then I'd say they are trying to be competitive this season. IF they go after mostly UDFA and one or two position players proven vets (stop-gaps) then it's pretty evident that they are building for the future (based on another strong draft in 2012).

akhhorus
07-13-2011, 01:17 PM
How about ???? ...... ANY of these articles that are written are nothing more that speculation. And besides if you add enough big names to any teams list (as one of these so-call expert nfl insiders do) you're going to come up with one or two correct ones. ............. NO ONE knows what Shanahan/Allen (I'm not sure they even know) are going to do, or any other coach/GMs. Bottomline is if Shanny/Allen go after young quality OG, OC, RT, NT, CB, and WR, then I'd say they are trying to be competitive this season. IF they go after mostly UDFA and one or two position players proven vets (stop-gaps) then it's pretty evident that they are building for the future (based on another strong draft in 2012).

If they don't have a real QB, they aren't trying to be competitive no matter who they sign imo.

shally
07-13-2011, 01:20 PM
Shally, stop trying to apply reason and logic lol.

sheesh... you would hope that things are better without the hand of Cerrato on the steering wheel...

Skins7ny
07-13-2011, 01:21 PM
If PFT is right, we will be able to field the NFL's first all-Jenkins defensive line:

RDE Cullen Jenkins
NT Kris Jenkins
LDE Jarvis Jenkins

Maybe this is the new strategy. Stress cohesiveness of play by having each unit manned by people who share the last name. Brilliant!

I don't think that Kris Jenkins has much left in the tank. Cullen Jenkins is a good player, but I would rather go younger at the position. Marshall Yanda is probably going to command a top offer, and overpaying guards is not usually the secret to salary cap success, but he would be a huge upgrade over what we have now. I agree with Shally about Ryan Harris over Jamal Brown, esp. since Harris should be cheaper and is a proven fit for Shanahan's offense. I would stay away from both Holmes and Gaither-we have had enough head cases on this team, and enough drama. Let's stop picking up other teams' baggage.
This is what caught my eye
I wonder where that "dismay" is coming from? Danny? Allen? Who? David Donovan.

shally
07-13-2011, 01:23 PM
How about ???? ...... ANY of these articles that are written are nothing more that speculation. And besides if you add enough big names to any teams list (as one of these so-call expert nfl insiders do) you're going to come up with one or two correct ones. ............. NO ONE knows what Shanahan/Allen (I'm not sure they even know) are going to do, or any other coach/GMs. Bottomline is if Shanny/Allen go after young quality OG, OC, RT, NT, CB, and WR, then I'd say they are trying to be competitive this season. IF they go after mostly UDFA and one or two position players proven vets (stop-gaps) then it's pretty evident that they are building for the future (based on another strong draft in 2012).

if the estimates of how much money the Redskins will have to spend just to reach the cap floor are even close to being true, there is no reason why the Redskins cannot be competitive this year.

that is not saying we should be a playoff contender, but we should be able to be competitive against all but the elite teams we face this year

shally
07-13-2011, 01:28 PM
If PFT is right, we will be able to field the NFL's first all-Jenkins defensive line:

RDE Cullen Jenkins
NT Kris Jenkins
LDE Jarvis Jenkins

Maybe this is the new strategy. Stress cohesiveness of play by having each unit manned by people who share the last name. Brilliant!

I don't think that Kris Jenkins has much left in the tank. Cullen Jenkins is a good player, but I would rather go younger at the position. Marshall Yanda is probably going to command a top offer, and overpaying guards is not usually the secret to salary cap success, but he would be a huge upgrade over what we have now. I agree with Shally about Ryan Harris over Jamal Brown, esp. since Harris should be cheaper and is a proven fit for Shanahan's offense. I would stay away from both Holmes and Gaither-we have had enough head cases on this team, and enough drama. Let's stop picking up other teams' baggage.
David Donovan.

Larry Allen proved that if you have a top guard who can also play tackle at a superior level, you give your line tremendous flexibility. Having a guy like Yanda who can move from Guard to Tackle would allow coaches to tinker with the line without falloff. injuries occur, so why not have the means to deal with it ?

a parlay of Yanda, Harris/Clabo/Brown and moving Montgomery to Center would provide an instant fix and keep Beck or Grossman upright a much greater percentage

akhhorus
07-13-2011, 02:12 PM
sheesh... you would hope that things are better without the hand of Cerrato on the steering wheel...

All starts at the top. Shanny is making these decisions, but Snyder isn't enabling, to quote Lincoln, the better angels of his nature lol.

Keino
07-13-2011, 02:28 PM
Well whoever is expressing this "dismay" is expressing the same exact concerns that some of us stupid fans expressed, based on the handling of the QB situation. If Beck was the guy of the future (now), why in the blue hell would you play Rex Grossman? Who evaluates back-ups outside of pre-season and practice? This is beyond moronic.

CNYSkinFan
07-13-2011, 03:41 PM
seriously...if I see one more time we are looking at a 4-3 guy to play our 304 I am going to kill the first person I come across named Mike, Kyle, Jim Haslett, or shanahan

Patrick
07-13-2011, 06:51 PM
If they don't have a real QB, they aren't trying to be competitive no matter who they sign imo. QB comes next year ....;) .......gives the OL time to jell

akhhorus
07-13-2011, 06:56 PM
QB comes next year ....;) .......gives the OL time to jell

You build around the QB, not create a donut to hopefully fill in. And if Shanny is convinced that Beck is the future now, unless he has a total meltdown of a season, why would he considering drafting a QB high next year?

nicefellow31
07-13-2011, 07:10 PM
If PFT is right, we will be able to field the NFL's first all-Jenkins defensive line:

RDE Cullen Jenkins
NT Kris Jenkins
LDE Jarvis Jenkins

Maybe this is the new strategy. Stress cohesiveness of play by having each unit manned by people who share the last name. Brilliant!

I don't think that Kris Jenkins has much left in the tank. Cullen Jenkins is a good player, but I would rather go younger at the position. Marshall Yanda is probably going to command a top offer, and overpaying guards is not usually the secret to salary cap success, but he would be a huge upgrade over what we have now. I agree with Shally about Ryan Harris over Jamal Brown, esp. since Harris should be cheaper and is a proven fit for Shanahan's offense. I would stay away from both Holmes and Gaither-we have had enough head cases on this team, and enough drama. Let's stop picking up other teams' baggage.
David Donovan.

That's them Jenkins boys from Vulcan. Any Boomerang fans?

jaylen
07-13-2011, 10:31 PM
gee wiz Holmes. Really have we put that much emphasis on Santonio Holmes hopefuly JLC is just blowing smoke about that with better options out there Holmes a drug issue guy with possible serious headcase issues. Come on.

and I'm done fishing for Ravens rejects Ozzie knows what he's doing if he doesn't want gaither I don't him either.

Cullen okay Fat jack Khris no thanks,

Very few of those names make sense and I didn't see cb on there anywhere.

Yanda okay. I'll buy that.

and the idea they are questioning Rabach is the best news in the whole article by JLC.

skinsfan36
07-13-2011, 11:29 PM
both jenkins would give us alot of depth. id prefer franklin to kris jenkins but he will cost more. i like the idea of signing chris chester and replacing rabach(well with anyone).resigning buchanon and letting barnes ease into starting seems like a good idea. i hope we sign 3 olinemen(at least two) a dlinemen,a ILB. now holmes is a good player but will be expensive and still has those character issues but is a huge upgrade over moss. this should be interesting

BigCountry
07-13-2011, 11:30 PM
gee wiz Holmes. Really have we put that much emphasis on Santonio Holmes hopefuly JLC is just blowing smoke about that with better options out there Holmes a drug issue guy with possible serious headcase issues. Come on.

and I'm done fishing for Ravens rejects Ozzie knows what he's doing if he doesn't want gaither I don't him either.

Cullen okay Fat jack Khris no thanks,

Very few of those names make sense and I didn't see cb on there anywhere.

Yanda okay. I'll buy that.

and the idea they are questioning Rabach is the best news in the whole article by JLC.

A good 20 teams send their scouts to Ravens pre-season games to watch these "rejects"

Patrick
07-14-2011, 07:23 AM
You build around the QB, not create a donut to hopefully fill in. And if Shanny is convinced that Beck is the future now, unless he has a total meltdown of a season, why would he considering drafting a QB high next year? and Shanny has never been wrong about a QB????
But anyway - he'll consider it when Beck turns out to be just an OK QB and realizes that he's not what he is looking for in terms of a starting QB. AND that is IF this isn't a smoke screen right now but we'll know alot more come FA period. ................ AND to be honest - I do HOPE the Beck turns out to be the second coming of a Curt Warner type guy, AND I hope the Skins DO pickup "quality" young FAs at the same time. I'm getting tired of sub.500 seasons while becoming the laughing stock of the NFL. ........... I just have little faith in Shanahan's ability of "Built" a contenting team.

akhhorus
07-14-2011, 11:28 AM
and Shanny has never been wrong about a QB????

?

But anyway - he'll consider it when Beck turns out to be just an OK QB and realizes that he's not what he is looking for in terms of a starting QB. AND that is IF this isn't a smoke screen right now but we'll know alot more come FA period. ................ AND to be honest - I do HOPE the Beck turns out to be the second coming of a Curt Warner type guy, AND I hope the Skins DO pickup "quality" young FAs at the same time. I'm getting tired of sub.500 seasons while becoming the laughing stock of the NFL. ........... I just have little faith in Shanahan's ability of "Built" a contenting team.

Considering the track record so far in DC, I can't assume that Shanny is capable of admitting a mistake, especially when it comes to Qbs.

SkinsGuru77
07-14-2011, 12:02 PM
First I respectfully disagree with the notion that you always have to build around a QB and canít build your offensive line and skill positions first before draft a QB. In my opinion I think that if you give your rookie QB a solid line first and WRís he can depend on first it only increases his likelihood to succeed his first year and makes the transition to the NFL easier.
With that said Shanahan locked and loaded on Beck isnít necessarily a bad thing. If I look at this dispassionately and not with my Redskins Goggles on I would think that taking a look this season at Beck and having Grossman as our back up is not necessarily a horrible plan. It works on many levels:

1. We see what we have in Beck: Option 1 he is great and problem is solved, Option 2 he is average and we know he falls in the ďgood but not greatĒ category and we draft a QB. Option 3 he is just horrible with a capital ďHĒ and we are in great position to draft a QB.

2. This strategy buys Shanahan Time while expectations are still low. None of us really believes the Redskins are a playoff contender little lone a Super bowl contender. We have time to coach the young players drafted, Build our D and if it doesnít work out at the QB position or we learn we need additional players next year Shanahan can still claim he is Re-Building.

As far a not drafting QB and not signing one, I believe Shanahan looked at the landscape this offseason and didnít see anything he liked and if he is going to succeed he canít afford to try and fit a square peg in a round hole at the QB position like he did with McNabb. Itís better to see what he has in Beck and if all else fail give Grossman another shot with and improved line (Contingent on the FA) and make your move next year. Next year Draft class is expected to be much better at the QB Position and a lot of prospects in my Opinion, Luck & Barkley fit Shanahan (Father & Son) system better than anyone that was available in this draft.

These are just my opinions and are not to offend. I am a Lifelong Redskins fan and no matter what Danny, Shanahan etc.. Ever do with effect that. Peace to All and HAIL TO THE REDSKINS!!!:Peace:

jaylen
07-14-2011, 12:09 PM
A good 20 teams send their scouts to Ravens pre-season games to watch these "rejects"

the same 20 scouts show up at Skins games as well its their job.

akhhorus
07-14-2011, 12:17 PM
First I respectfully disagree with the notion that you always have to build around a QB and can’t build your offensive line and skill positions first before draft a QB. In my opinion I think that if you give your rookie QB a solid line first and WR’s he can depend on first it only increases his likelihood to succeed his first year and makes the transition to the NFL easier.

In theory, you're right. You can go the donut route, but thats a much longer path to potential success. If you draft(or acquire) a QB first, then you can properly build the team around their tools/skills(not getting a tall Oline if he's a shorter Qb, getting a great RT if they're left handed, WRs that they can jive with better, etc etc).

With that said Shanahan locked and loaded on Beck isn’t necessarily a bad thing. If I look at this dispassionately and not with my Redskins Goggles on I would think that taking a look this season at Beck and having Grossman as our back up is not necessarily a horrible plan. It works on many levels:

1. We see what we have in Beck: Option 1 he is great and problem is solved, Option 2 he is average and we know he falls in the “good but not great” category and we draft a QB. Option 3 he is just horrible with a capital “H” and we are in great position to draft a QB.


That presumes that Shanny will make a change if Beck is so bad that the season is a disaster. Realistically, if Beck is a disaster, they'll bring in Grossman-who imo will be an improvement on Beck(even if its incremental)-but not good enough to win consistently. And then they can talk themselves into "well, maybe Beck just needs another year."

2. This strategy buys Shanahan Time while expectations are still low. None of us really believes the Redskins are a playoff contender little lone a Super bowl contender. We have time to coach the young players drafted, Build our D and if it doesn’t work out at the QB position or we learn we need additional players next year Shanahan can still claim he is Re-Building.

Agreed, but what appears to be a big spending splurge from the Skins belies this theory. And if they were going that route, wouldn't it make more sense not to go nuts in free agency and announce that "well, Rome wasn't build in a day and fixing this team will force us to shoot for 2013 as the make/break season"? I understand not wanting to go into a season with very low expectations, but it doesn't appear that the plan is to compete with Beck.

As far a not drafting QB and not signing one, I believe Shanahan looked at the landscape this offseason and didn’t see anything he liked and if he is going to succeed he can’t afford to try and fit a square peg in a round hole at the QB position like he did with McNabb. It’s better to see what he has in Beck and if all else fail give Grossman another shot with and improved line (Contingent on the FA) and make your move next year. Next year Draft class is expected to be much better at the QB Position and a lot of prospects in my Opinion, Luck & Barkley fit Shanahan (Father & Son) system better than anyone that was available in this draft.


Okay, but there were a lot of reports that Shanny did like some of the QBs in this draft and reportedly was after Kaepernick(the 49ers traded up to snag him because they believed that the Skins were going to take him). I don't buy the "Shanny didn't like any of the rookie/vet Qbs available and really believe Beck could be the answer" theory. We saw Beck last preseason and he couldn't do well against grocery baggers/walmart greeters. If Shanny legitimately believes that Beck has starting potential, then he needs to start taking his meds lol.

shally
07-14-2011, 12:59 PM
In theory, you're right. You can go the donut route, but thats a much longer path to potential success. If you draft(or acquire) a QB first, then you can properly build the team around their tools/skills(not getting a tall Oline if he's a shorter Qb, getting a great RT if they're left handed, WRs that they can jive with better, etc etc).



That presumes that Shanny will make a change if Beck is so bad that the season is a disaster. Realistically, if Beck is a disaster, they'll bring in Grossman-who imo will be an improvement on Beck(even if its incremental)-but not good enough to win consistently. And then they can talk themselves into "well, maybe Beck just needs another year."



Agreed, but what appears to be a big spending splurge from the Skins belies this theory. And if they were going that route, wouldn't it make more sense not to go nuts in free agency and announce that "well, Rome wasn't build in a day and fixing this team will force us to shoot for 2013 as the make/break season"? I understand not wanting to go into a season with very low expectations, but it doesn't appear that the plan is to compete with Beck.



Okay, but there were a lot of reports that Shanny did like some of the QBs in this draft and reportedly was after Kaepernick(the 49ers traded up to snag him because they believed that the Skins were going to take him). I don't buy the "Shanny didn't like any of the rookie/vet Qbs available and really believe Beck could be the answer" theory. We saw Beck last preseason and he couldn't do well against grocery baggers/walmart greeters. If Shanny legitimately believes that Beck has starting potential, then he needs to start taking his meds lol.

i think that the leash that Beck will be on will be much shorter than the one
McNabb was on for a number of reasons:

The rest of the offense, especially the O line will be improved compared to 2010 (assuming a reasonable course in free agency)

McNabb had a proven track record of success to fall back on, despite his spotty performance

Beck has had a full year in the offense, so he is expected to know it, and failings will be because of him

Beck is 30 and has been on NFL rosters long enough to understand the speed of the pro game, even if he hasnt actually played much at all

It wont take very long to actually see if Beck can get it done as starter. Even fans like us should be able to see the handwriting on the wall and the need for another season for Beck, if he fails miserably this year, will be very very hard to justify. Beck either locks in, or we move on

Skins7ny
07-14-2011, 01:27 PM
That's them Jenkins boys from Vulcan. Any Boomerang fans?
I am sorry, I don't get the quote. Boomerang, the movie with Eddie Murphy and Robin Givens? (Old Fart Alert!)
both jenkins would give us alot of depth. id prefer franklin to kris jenkins but he will cost more. i like the idea of signing chris chester and replacing rabach(well with anyone).resigning buchanon and letting barnes ease into starting seems like a good idea. i hope we sign 3 olinemen(at least two) a dlinemen,a ILB. now holmes is a good player but will be expensive and still has those character issues but is a huge upgrade over moss. this should be interesting
I'd prefer re-signing Moss to signing Holmes. Holmes is a head case with inconsistent performance and a history of suspension. He cannot be counted on. And Moss outperformed him last year, even factoring in Holmes' suspension.

We should re-sign Buchanon as our nickel back, not as a starter. He had an excellent year as a nickel DB last year, but when we asked him to start he got torched. If they think Barnes can handle nickel, let him handle nickel. If they are covincvefd that Barnes can start, then re-sign Buchanon as the nickel. Based on last year, I don't want Buchanon starting even one game for us next year.

lorimike
07-14-2011, 05:23 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/13/report-santonio-holmes-primary-objective-on-long-redskins-wish-list/

I guess I would be okay with these guys. I think we need another solid corner though. Any thoughts on A. Franklin versus Kris Jenkins?

Ah geez. I hope this isn't true. Resigning Grossmand and Moss makes some sense at the right price. But other than Santonio Holmes the rest make little sense.

SkinsGuru77
07-14-2011, 05:25 PM
akhhorus - Thanks for the feedback. I guess its just a waiting game to see what they do once they get the year started and free agency begins. :Peace:

firehawk157
07-14-2011, 05:30 PM
akhhorus - Thanks for the feedback. I guess its just a waiting game to see what they do once they get the year started and free agency begins. :Peace:

There just isn't a great option on the free agent market and whoever we pick up will essentially have two weeks to pick up the offense. Like it or not, Beck/Grossman will be our QB going into 2011. Ending 2011 though, that's the question.

akhhorus
07-14-2011, 06:26 PM
akhhorus - Thanks for the feedback. I guess its just a waiting game to see what they do once they get the year started and free agency begins. :Peace:

Couldn't put it better myself.

There just isn't a great option on the free agent market and whoever we pick up will essentially have two weeks to pick up the offense. Like it or not, Beck/Grossman will be our QB going into 2011. Ending 2011 though, that's the question.

Kyle Orton?

Arkangiest
07-14-2011, 07:30 PM
This is a debbie downer post, I believe I've drank enough coolaid over the years. I've had that horrible feeling you get after drinking so much liquor you can't stop puking, I'm at a dry heave and it won't turn around until we start winning again.

This free agency isn't going to be very productive if we dont trade away McNabb and Haynesworth and cut Casey Rabach. I doubt Yanda will leave Baltimore, so that's unlikely. Santonio Holmes is a jackass. Cullen Jenkins will be OK but won't be worth his likely big contract. Kris Jenkins is finished. John Beck is.... A big gamble that probably won't pan out. Grossman is trash. Were looking at quite possibly the most underwhelming starting offensive lineups I can think of.

Perhaps wearing some $hit colored goggles is the secret to Redskins glory as the rose colored ones have only enlargedthe size of my liver over the years.

justinskins
07-14-2011, 11:01 PM
Kyle Orton?

Not a free agent.

joethefan
07-14-2011, 11:18 PM
First of all I know i'm late to the party but I question anything coming from Jason. As tight lipped as this org has been in the past year, what makes anyone think they are gonna make a run at any of these guys....

If Vinnie were in the building then yes, but Allen and Shanny no. Shanny wouldn't tell a little kid what they were gonna do with Don, so why are we putting any weight into this report. And ask yourself the question: Why now? This seems more agent related....I would be shocked if we went after and landed 3 of these guys. Too many big names just downs add up to what they are trying to build IMO. Although some names may seem to be ok, I question the love for Holmes.

First of all, why would he come here? We are no longer in the business of paying anyone alot of money, so that just doesn't make any sense.
On top of that why would he come here having won 1 superbowl and coming a play or two from going to another?
Furthermore, we dont even know what QB will be here!.

Receivers look and weigh all of these things beofre making a decision to go to a team.


This report reads SMOKESCREEN.

wave6ten
07-15-2011, 12:42 AM
I don't know if it's been said but....I would personally sign Matt Leinart...we have no options other than Grossman/Beck. I kind of think that there is something there with Leinart. I know he is cocky and has always had a sense of entitlement since he's been in the NFL...but he's also hit rock bottom. So he has to know it's now or never for himself. I would have to think that he wouldn't be that expensive. Worst case scenario he's a QB3 and you cut him next year...but the flip side is he fulfills his potential and you have a franchise QB...that's the type of move that can really turn a franchise around. Now I'm not saying he's Drew Brees but the Saints took a chance when Brees was coming off shoulder surgery and it turned that franchise around big time. Brees was also a more proven commodity. To me it's worth a shot...who knows we might not have to draft a QB in the first round if it were to pan out.

RedskinsDave
07-15-2011, 06:19 AM
I don't know if it's been said but....I would personally sign Matt Leinart...we have no options other than Grossman/Beck. I kind of think that there is something there with Leinart. I know he is cocky and has always had a sense of entitlement since he's been in the NFL...but he's also hit rock bottom. So he has to know it's now or never for himself. I would have to think that he wouldn't be that expensive. Worst case scenario he's a QB3 and you cut him next year...but the flip side is he fulfills his potential and you have a franchise QB...that's the type of move that can really turn a franchise around. Now I'm not saying he's Drew Brees but the Saints took a chance when Brees was coming off shoulder surgery and it turned that franchise around big time. Brees was also a more proven commodity. To me it's worth a shot...who knows we might not have to draft a QB in the first round if it were to pan out.

Um, no. He is proven, proven he isn't an NFL QB. The guys we have are better.

BigCountry
07-15-2011, 08:54 AM
the same 20 scouts show up at Skins games as well its their job.

Other Ravens rejects include Jason Brown, Dwan Edwards and James Harrison. All of whom would start for the Redskins, plus Rabach was a good player for a number of years. It was really only by about mid 2008 that his play fell off.

BTW
I heard a couple of opposing team's commentators during pre-season games against the Ravens say that they draw scouts from the most amount of teams, particularly to watch their backups on the offensive line and the front seven.

akhhorus
07-15-2011, 08:59 AM
Not a free agent.

No, but he'll be available.

GibbsFan
07-15-2011, 10:17 AM
Not a free agent.

I'd love to see Orton as we have no QB right now IMHO except for Donovan. Maybe a 3 way with Denver/Minny is possible. I'm not sure why Shanny is blowing the Beck smokescreen, but I'm highly doubting he gets the call against the Giants.

Rex is a loser. Think about the Bears team that he let down. That team was good enough to win a SB. Rex cost them one. Hell even Dilfer got the job done. All Rex had to do was not blow it.

Orton is nothing special, but he's not the turnover machine that Rex is. He would be a competent stand in guy who gives us a chance to compete.

Moe
07-15-2011, 10:35 AM
I don't know if it's been said but....I would personally sign Matt Leinart...we have no options other than Grossman/Beck. I kind of think that there is something there with Leinart. I know he is cocky and has always had a sense of entitlement since he's been in the NFL...but he's also hit rock bottom. So he has to know it's now or never for himself. I would have to think that he wouldn't be that expensive. Worst case scenario he's a QB3 and you cut him next year...but the flip side is he fulfills his potential and you have a franchise QB...that's the type of move that can really turn a franchise around. Now I'm not saying he's Drew Brees but the Saints took a chance when Brees was coming off shoulder surgery and it turned that franchise around big time. Brees was also a more proven commodity. To me it's worth a shot...who knows we might not have to draft a QB in the first round if it were to pan out.

Leinart doesn't check any of the boxes that Shanny typically employs at QB. He's not very strong armed, he's immobile and he plays cautiously.

Moe
07-15-2011, 10:37 AM
I'd love to see Orton as we have no QB right now IMHO except for Donovan. Maybe a 3 way with Denver/Minny is possible. I'm not sure why Shanny is blowing the Beck smokescreen, but I'm highly doubting he gets the call against the Giants.

The Broncos need DT's in a bad way, shoot them Haynesworth and something else (why not Kemo too, Fox knows him from Carolina) in a deal for Orton.

RedskinsDave
07-15-2011, 12:50 PM
Other Ravens rejects include Jason Brown, Dwan Edwards and James Harrison. All of whom would start for the Redskins, plus Rabach was a good player for a number of years. It was really only by about mid 2008 that his play fell off.

BTW
I heard a couple of opposing team's commentators during pre-season games against the Ravens say that they draw scouts from the most amount of teams, particularly to watch their backups on the offensive line and the front seven.

As someone who hates the Ravens thanks to their fans, I laugh at all the accolades given to their front office who from their Super Bowl win to 2007 had fewer playoffs wins than the Redskins. I guess Ozzie buys the best food but can't find anyone to cook it.

justinskins
07-15-2011, 01:46 PM
I'd love to see Orton as we have no QB right now IMHO except for Donovan. Maybe a 3 way with Denver/Minny is possible. I'm not sure why Shanny is blowing the Beck smokescreen, but I'm highly doubting he gets the call against the Giants.

Rex is a loser. Think about the Bears team that he let down. That team was good enough to win a SB. Rex cost them one. Hell even Dilfer got the job done. All Rex had to do was not blow it.

Orton is nothing special, but he's not the turnover machine that Rex is. He would be a competent stand in guy who gives us a chance to compete.

I agree, Orton would be a big overgrade over what we have now. However, I think the Broncos are going to want too much for him.

akhhorus
07-15-2011, 02:25 PM
I agree, Orton would be a big overgrade over what we have now. However, I think the Broncos are going to want too much for him.

Jmo, but I think that the Skins *could* pull it off using Haynesworth(and maybe something like a conditional pick or another asset) if they were willing to take someone like Moreno off the Broncos' hands(Fox apparently doesn't like him at all).

BigCountry
07-15-2011, 02:47 PM
As someone who hates the Ravens thanks to their fans, I laugh at all the accolades given to their front office who from their Super Bowl win to 2007 had fewer playoffs wins than the Redskins. I guess Ozzie buys the best food but can't find anyone to cook it.

That and he only really knows a couple of departments.

Skins7ny
07-15-2011, 03:55 PM
I agree, Orton would be a big overgrade over what we have now. However, I think the Broncos are going to want too much for him.
The Broncos have almost literally nobody starting at DT in their 4-3, and John Fox is the kind of experienced, defensive-minded coach who is likely to figure he can get the best out of Haynesworth. From Haynesworth's perspective, there are a lot worse places to end up than Denver, and a lot worse coaches he could play for than Fox, who has a rep as a player's coach. Both men quit on their team last year, so they have a lot in common.

jaylen
07-15-2011, 04:42 PM
Jmo, but I think that the Skins *could* pull it off using Haynesworth(and maybe something like a conditional pick or another asset) if they were willing to take someone like Moreno off the Broncos' hands(Fox apparently doesn't like him at all).

us giving up picks for another vet player. uh sounds like our typical formula for disaster. and quite frankly with how jr Shany does things not sure he wouldn't find a way to mess things up with orton.

akhhorus
07-15-2011, 04:43 PM
us giving up picks for another vet player. uh sounds like our typical formula for disaster. and quite frankly with how jr Shany does things not sure he wouldn't find a way to mess things up with orton.

The only things that Denver could want imo would be Fred Davis or a lb like Alexander.

CapitalDefense
07-15-2011, 08:17 PM
I love my Redskins, the last thing I want them to do is go on another spending spree and mortgage the future only to go 6-10 to 8-8. We need to get younger at a bunch of positions and enter the Andrew Luck sweepstakes. I say sweepstakes because he could choose to stay again next year only being a junior this year coming up. We go young, take our lumps this year and build for the future.

A top QB for thew next 10+ years, that is what we need.

colkurtz
07-16-2011, 04:11 AM
This doesn't` surprise me. Many of us have been calling for a BIG FA off-season show. There are just way too many holes and our draft just wasn't big enough to come anywhere near to filling them. We have no playmakers - not at QB, not a RB, not a #1 WR. Although I see us going for a big-ticket #1 WR, I just ahve this feeling we'll sit faurly tight at QB and RB and wee how our group plays out with an improved OL.

I get the dismay with Beck, but this is going to be a re-building season. Last year was an evaluation season to see what we really had. Obviously they over-estimated what McKnabb could do - especially with a horrible OL and a weak WR and RB group.

I just can't understand why even with this draft AND a huge FA period, they're still not talking about replacing Rabach. Maybe it's such an obvious black hole that they don't want to get into a bidding war over the few FA Centers out there.

guess88
07-16-2011, 10:44 AM
Orton is nothing special, but he's not the turnover machine that Rex is. He would be a competent stand in guy who gives us a chance to compete.

At this point, serviceable would be an upgrade.

Emmanouel8
07-16-2011, 10:47 AM
I'd be shocked if more than 1 of those FA signings occur here. It doesn't make any sense and smells of the offseason splash Snyderrato era, which means its all smoke.

This team needs a QB before it invests heavily in FA.

guess88
07-16-2011, 10:54 AM
We need to get younger at a bunch of positions and enter the Andrew Luck sweepstakes. I say sweepstakes because he could choose to stay again next year only being a junior this year coming up. We go young, take our lumps this year and build for the future.

A top QB for thew next 10+ years, that is what we need.

I'm tired of this Luck Sweestakes talk. Yes he looks solid, and could very well be the next coming of greatness in the NFL. But he could also flounder and not live up to his college play. Or he hits a wall and his skills only translate to him becoming a slightly better than average NFL QB. Or he could get injured in the 2nd half of the season and become a college Carson Palmer (heaven forbid). Or he could stay for his senior year.

Not that I don't think he'll be a good NFL player, but people need to take a step back from their desperation goggles. Way too many things can happen in a year, and no college player is ever a 100% sure thing. I'd love to see a team actually try to squander an entire season just to be in a position to draft him, then have him say he's staying for one more year. Wouldn't be completely out of line for the Raiders...

guess88
07-16-2011, 10:57 AM
I'd be shocked if more than 1 of those FA signings occur here. It doesn't make any sense and smells of the offseason splash Snyderrato era, which means its all smoke.

This team needs a QB before it invests heavily in FA.

The shameful thing is that if we didn't completely mishandle McNabb, we'd actually be in a decent position if he stayed and we focus on rebuilding the line to give him good protection.

BRAVEONAWARPATH
07-16-2011, 01:05 PM
Rich_Tandler Rich Tandler
Full free agency starting a week from Monday, July 25, again per ESPN.
1 hour ago

Rich_Tandler Rich Tandler
That makes sense. The GM's have the terms of the agreement in their hands now, they have a week to get up to speed.
1 hour ago

Rich_Tandler Rich Tandler
Interesting. RT @TurfShowTimes: Just learned that ESPN staf has been told to be ready by 1 in anticipation that the lockout could end today
52 minutes ago

http://twitter.com/#!/Rich_Tandler

JoeJacksonTaylor28
07-16-2011, 02:42 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/Rich_Tandler

Wooooowwww.... Today??? Really? I don't think all the details have been managed so quickly... hope, though.

Edit: Could the lockout be lifted pending some of the so-called "details"? And therefore, free-agency?

flave1969
07-16-2011, 03:11 PM
Wooooowwww.... Today??? Really? I don't think all the details have been managed so quickly... hope, though.

Edit: Could the lockout be lifted pending some of the so-called "details"? And therefore, free-agency?

I think this was false and retracted soon after.

Wasn't me, I was just the punking middleman! RT @JenXperience: @Rich_Tandler punked me today! #NFLLockout

JoeJacksonTaylor28
07-16-2011, 05:03 PM
I think this was false and retracted soon after.

Wasn't me, I was just the punking middleman! RT @JenXperience: @Rich_Tandler punked me today! #NFLLockout
Too good to be true. Thanks flave

BRAVEONAWARPATH
07-16-2011, 06:46 PM
AlbertBreer Albert Breer
by Rich_Tandler
NFL general counsel Jeff Pash just spoke to us, we'll have it on NFLN. Said it's in the lawyers' hands now, principles have done their job.

http://twitter.com/#!/Rich_Tandler

HanburgerBum
07-17-2011, 03:48 PM
As someone who hates the Ravens thanks to their fans, I laugh at all the accolades given to their front office who from their Super Bowl win to 2007 had fewer playoffs wins than the Redskins. I guess Ozzie buys the best food but can't find anyone to cook it.



It is probably true that Balt fans have always felt a special resentment for Wash sports--maybe it is due to their inferiority complex of being the poor neighbor of the big, rich capitol city.

But, the truth is that at least in football for the last 2 decades or so the Ravens have consistently out perform the Skins. I would say it is actually not even that close. The Ravens have a terrific front office and have been a consistent winner. As for the Redskins, well you know what has transpired here. It is not a stretch to say that we are currently the laughing stock of the NFL. More alarmingly, the WashPost has just confirmed that the Skins are having great difficulty selling out season tickets and that the long waiting list is actually a figment of Dan Snyder's imagination. The big, rich neighbor doesn't look that big and rich any more.

BRAVEONAWARPATH
07-18-2011, 11:23 AM
mortreport Chris Mortensen
Some teams still mad Redskins dumped Haynesworth money into uncapped year ...but, heck, those were the rules

http://twitter.com/#!/mortreport

shally
07-18-2011, 12:07 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/mortreport

sucks to be them.. redskins just worked within system

RedskinsDave
07-18-2011, 12:09 PM
It is probably true that Balt fans have always felt a special resentment for Wash sports--maybe it is due to their inferiority complex of being the poor neighbor of the big, rich capitol city.

But, the truth is that at least in football for the last 2 decades or so the Ravens have consistently out perform the Skins. I would say it is actually not even that close. The Ravens have a terrific front office and have been a consistent winner. As for the Redskins, well you know what has transpired here. It is not a stretch to say that we are currently the laughing stock of the NFL. More alarmingly, the WashPost has just confirmed that the Skins are having great difficulty selling out season tickets and that the long waiting list is actually a figment of Dan Snyder's imagination. The big, rich neighbor doesn't look that big and rich any more.

None of this counters what I wrote. They have a great front office and little to show for it. Typical Baltimore.

CNYSkinFan
07-18-2011, 02:15 PM
Until we go with the proven NFL model, strong GM and HC who uses the talents given to him, and owner who does nothing but write checks and bang the cheerleaders (ok I admit that is my fantasy if I become an nfl owner), then we won't be succesful. A strong GM can tell a HC no and a good HC can adapt their system to the talents of those around them. We have neither of those in Allehan

shally
07-18-2011, 03:42 PM
Until we go with the proven NFL model, strong GM and HC who uses the talents given to him, and owner who does nothing but write checks and bang the cheerleaders (ok I admit that is my fantasy if I become an nfl owner), then we won't be succesful. A strong GM can tell a HC no and a good HC can adapt their system to the talents of those around them. We have neither of those in Allehan

We are not even into year 2 of their regime..Let's see what kind of team they put on the field this year .. We have a great opportunity to quickly re make the team because of the projected Cap situation..if they blow it this year, you will have me on your side..until then, i remain in the "show me" mode

CNYSkinFan
07-18-2011, 03:52 PM
We are not even into year 2 of their regime..Let's see what kind of team they put on the field this year .. We have a great opportunity to quickly re make the team because of the projected Cap situation..if they blow it this year, you will have me on your side..until then, i remain in the "show me" mode
my point is ...and has beeen always even under Gibbs II, that a HC is not also a good GM. The Redskins keep trying the same model with bad people. Weak gm, strong HC making bad decisions.....its doomed to failure

BIGREDSKINSFAN1963
07-18-2011, 04:04 PM
i heard it won't be over until the owners meeting thursday,and players can go into their team's park and start working out friday.

silverspring
07-18-2011, 04:26 PM
Until we go with the proven NFL model, strong GM and HC who uses the talents given to him, and owner who does nothing but write checks and bang the cheerleaders (ok I admit that is my fantasy if I become an nfl owner), then we won't be succesful. A strong GM can tell a HC no and a good HC can adapt their system to the talents of those around them. We have neither of those in Allehan

+1

If I see another free agent spree I am going to be very disappointed, I will be particularly annoyed if we pick up some high priced players when we just drafted the same position, ie didn't we just draft 3 WRs, why are we going after more?

Rickskins76
07-18-2011, 04:49 PM
I agree, offensive line, NT, and CB should be our targets in free agency...and no overpriced old players just looking for their last payday...develop the youth.

BIGREDSKINSFAN1963
07-18-2011, 05:14 PM
We are not even into year 2 of their regime..Let's see what kind of team they put on the field this year

i agree with you 100% wise one! gonna take more than 2 years to do anything with the way vinny screwed it all up!

Keino
07-18-2011, 05:21 PM
We are not even into year 2 of their regime..Let's see what kind of team they put on the field this year .. We have a great opportunity to quickly re make the team because of the projected Cap situation..if they blow it this year, you will have me on your side..until then, i remain in the "show me" mode

It sounds like you are advocating a Big Free Agent Spending model, which to me is the same thing we have been doing since 2000. If they (the team) are actually re-building, then this year shouldn't be the barometer at all.

RedskinsDave
07-18-2011, 05:24 PM
I have no problems with the team spending on free agents so long as it isn't to the detriment of draft picks and grooming young guys.

akhhorus
07-18-2011, 05:34 PM
I have no problems with the team spending on free agents so long as it isn't to the detriment of draft picks and grooming young guys.

I agree with this. We don't need DLmen or WRs. We need Olinemen and a f*cking Qb. But shocker: we're after WRs and DLinemen reportedly. Why did we draft Hankerson and Jenkins again? So that they can be on the Malcolm Kelly/Devin Thomas career path?

redskin_rich
07-18-2011, 05:35 PM
We have to spend some money on the lines, no other way about it. I'd prefer not to spend much on the skill positions, since we have a lot of youth to compete amongst one another now and skill position free agents should be considered as final pieces and we are years away from that.

shally
07-18-2011, 05:36 PM
I have no problems with the team spending on free agents so long as it isn't to the detriment of draft picks and grooming young guys.

+1 Not all the draft picks will be roster worthy, but overall i agree

It sounds like you are advocating a Big Free Agent Spending model, which to me is the same thing we have been doing since 2000. If they (the team) are actually re-building, then this year shouldn't be the barometer at all.

if the projected figures for the cap floor are true, then we may actually HAVE to sign free agents.. or re sign our own at inflated figures just to comply

i advocate signing young guys the way we did when we signed Moss, Griffin and Randy Thomas.. Guys who are young enough to be entering their prime years-- not guys looking for a last payday. A guy like Atogwe is a perfect example of who we should be signing

firehawk157
07-18-2011, 05:48 PM
+1 Not all the draft picks will be roster worthy, but overall i agree



if the projected figures for the cap floor are true, then we may actually HAVE to sign free agents.. or re sign our own at inflated figures just to comply

i advocate signing young guys the way we did when we signed Moss, Griffin and Randy Thomas.. Guys who are young enough to be entering their prime years-- not guys looking for a last payday. A guy like Atogwe is a perfect example of who we should be signing

We will sign free agents, the real question is if we're smart (young linemen) or more of the Snyder status quo (skill positions)

BigCountry
07-18-2011, 07:14 PM
I agree with this. We don't need DLmen or WRs. We need Olinemen and a f*cking Qb. But shocker: we're after WRs and DLinemen reportedly. Why did we draft Hankerson and Jenkins again? So that they can be on the Malcolm Kelly/Devin Thomas career path?

The title of this thread may as well be "Free agent speculation from Daffy Duck via PFT". I'm not putting any stock into what JLC puts out there besides the Jenkins bros. which everyone knew before JLC wrote his little article. My money is on one of the Jenkinses, Harvey Dahl, Josh Wilson and Ryan Harris if Brown doesn't resign.

Keino
07-18-2011, 07:16 PM
+1 Not all the draft picks will be roster worthy, but overall i agree



if the projected figures for the cap floor are true, then we may actually HAVE to sign free agents.. or re sign our own at inflated figures just to comply

i advocate signing young guys the way we did when we signed Moss, Griffin and Randy Thomas.. Guys who are young enough to be entering their prime years-- not guys looking for a last payday. A guy like Atogwe is a perfect example of who we should be signing

The problem is signing vets almost always leads to retarding the development of some younger player. I am all for making smart signings and I certainly don't want to see the team in the position of getting a top 3 pick, but the way we go about the business of talent evaluation and acquisition has to change, and I don't see much in the way of change from one regime to the next.

Of course this coaching regime has not had the benefit of a regular NFL off-season yet, but no move they have made has been indicative of a team that recognizes the need to rebuild itself. Having a big free agent spending spree on the players being speculated upon would reinforce that flawed method of team building and show the only thing changing are the clowns running the circus.

shally
07-18-2011, 07:19 PM
The problem is signing vets almost always leads to retarding the development of some younger player. I am all for making smart signings and I certainly don't want to see the team in the position of getting a top 3 pick, but the way we go about the business of talent evaluation and acquisition has to change, and I don't see much in the way of change from one regime to the next.

Of course this coaching regime has not had the benefit of a regular NFL off-season yet, but no move they have made has been indicative of a team that recognizes the need to rebuild itself. Having a big free agent spending spree on the players being speculated upon would reinforce that flawed method of team building and show the only thing changing are the clowns running the circus.

right now it is ALL speculation.. let's see what they do when the bell rings and the league-wide craziness begins

Keino
07-18-2011, 07:29 PM
right now it is ALL speculation.. let's see what they do when the bell rings and the league-wide craziness begins

All reports are that the Bell will ring on Monday after 72 hours re-sign your own. I am interested to see who we try and re-sign of our own. I would be willing to bet a paycheck that Rex is one of the first to re-up with the team.....

akhhorus
07-18-2011, 07:48 PM
The title of this thread may as well be "Free agent speculation from Daffy Duck via PFT". I'm not putting any stock into what JLC puts out there besides the Jenkins bros. which everyone knew before JLC wrote his little article. My money is on one of the Jenkinses, Harvey Dahl, Josh Wilson and Ryan Harris if Brown doesn't resign.

See, shelling out for the Jenkins bros would be pointless(and expensive). And a lot of other sources are saying that the Skins will be after Moss and/or Holmes.

RedSkinBrit
07-18-2011, 07:50 PM
I hope it is in the lines but not sure who is available as FA in this department.

BigCountry
07-18-2011, 07:51 PM
See, shelling out for the Jenkins bros would be pointless(and expensive). And a lot of other sources are saying that the Skins will be after Moss and/or Holmes.

I think they'll try to resign Santana Moss very quickly, but I doubt Santonio Holmes will be a Redskin. If they're willing to give younger players at ILB and CB a chance to step up, why not other areas? Also I think Kris Jenkins is worth a gamble for a low price. Ted Washington played at a high level into his 30's and NT's for the most part can potentially have a longer shelf life. The other Jenkins just depends on where we want to play young Jenkins, but Carriker is a free agent next year.

akhhorus
07-18-2011, 08:05 PM
I think they'll try to resign Santana Moss very quickly, but I doubt Santonio Holmes will be a Redskin. If they're willing to give younger players at ILB and CB a chance to step up, why not other areas?

Then why did we draft Hankerson and 2 other WRs? Now you have Hankerson, Armstrong, Moss and Kelly competing for 2 jobs. So, either Kelly and Hankerson were wastes of picks or they blew cash bringing back the HGH Hamstring Hamburglar lol.

This is what's so frustrating about the Shanahan era: there's no plan whatsover apparently. And, this isn't about my feelings about Moss: I feel the same way even if we sign Holmes or another X WR. Makes no flipping sense. Plaxico Burress or another Y? That makes sense. As for the Jenkins bros: why? Why did we draft Jarvis Jenkins at 41 if they wanted Cullen Jenkins at 40-50 million?

I really hope they let the Bears overpay Moss and just focus on the Oline/QB spots.

The other Jenkins just depends on where we want to play young Jenkins, but Carriker is a free agent next year.

So, Jarmon is doing nothing for the skins then. Like I said: no plan.

Keino
07-18-2011, 08:09 PM
See, shelling out for the Jenkins bros would be pointless(and expensive). And a lot of other sources are saying that the Skins will be after Moss and/or Holmes.

I can see how Cullen Jenkins will make some sense, and though I really want to part ways with him, I think we almost have to re-sign Moss at this stage of the game, don't we? The guy was highly productive last year (of course he had a QB for most of the year).

The NFL dragging the CBA did us no favors this year. Both in terms of seeking trade partners for two highly publicized players and for the sake of adding talent to the roster.

BigCountry
07-18-2011, 08:19 PM
Then why did we draft Hankerson and 2 other WRs? Now you have Hankerson, Armstrong, Moss and Kelly competing for 2 jobs. So, either Kelly and Hankerson were wastes of picks or they blew cash bringing back the HGH Hamstring Hamburglar lol.

This is what's so frustrating about the Shanahan era: there's no plan whatsover apparently. And, this isn't about my feelings about Moss: I feel the same way even if we sign Holmes or another X WR. Makes no flipping sense. Plaxico Burress or another Y? That makes sense. As for the Jenkins bros: why? Why did we draft Jarvis Jenkins at 41 if they wanted Cullen Jenkins at 40-50 million?

I really hope they let the Bears overpay Moss and just focus on the Oline/QB spots.



So, Jarmon is doing nothing for the skins then. Like I said: no plan.

Good WR corps run about 4 deep now a days. If we go with Moss, Armstrong, Kelly, Hankerson and whoever wins the battle for the 5th receiver, we could finally have some depth at the position instead of having one guy the opposing defense can double team while they look to other side of the field and laugh. Not sure what the plan is for the defensive line but I wouldn't be completely opposed to bringing Cullen Jenkins in, letting Jarvis be third in the rotation for year and letting Carriker walk next year.

shally
07-18-2011, 09:03 PM
All reports are that the Bell will ring on Monday after 72 hours re-sign your own. I am interested to see who we try and re-sign of our own. I would be willing to bet a paycheck that Rex is one of the first to re-up with the team.....

agree. Rex would be a fool to go anywhere else.. No one is going to blow him away with a starter offer.. he has got to feel he can beat out Beck

i think if we have an exclusive 72 hours that Moss gets signed quickly as well

akhhorus
07-18-2011, 09:09 PM
I can see how Cullen Jenkins will make some sense, and though I really want to part ways with him, I think we almost have to re-sign Moss at this stage of the game, don't we? The guy was highly productive last year (of course he had a QB for most of the year).

The NFL dragging the CBA did us no favors this year. Both in terms of seeking trade partners for two highly publicized players and for the sake of adding talent to the roster.

We could use a vet 5 tech, but not a big ticket one. As for Moss: no, we don't lol. We need a real flanker to team with Armstrong and Hankerson(and no I'm not expecting Kelly to do much).

Good WR corps run about 4 deep now a days. If we go with Moss, Armstrong, Kelly, Hankerson and whoever wins the battle for the 5th receiver, we could finally have some depth at the position instead of having one guy the opposing defense can double team while they look to other side of the field and laugh.

There's depth and then there's confusion. Having 3 Xs(4 if you count Paul) with a Y who can't stay healthy+2 Z slot guys in Austin and Robinson is a recipe for confusion. Let Moss go. Don't bring in Holmes or any other X WR in. Let Hankerson and Armstrong fight it out for the X spot. Find a Vet Y to go with them.

This "lets just throw a lot of fast poop against the wall" strategy has plagued the Skins' WR corps and red zone offense for years.

Not sure what the plan is for the defensive line but I wouldn't be completely opposed to bringing Cullen Jenkins in, letting Jarvis be third in the rotation for year and letting Carriker walk next year.

If they wanted Cullen Jenkins all along, pick #41 could have been used on something infinitely more useful imo. You can find a rotational 5 tech late in a draft.

shally
07-18-2011, 09:09 PM
Then why did we draft Hankerson and 2 other WRs? Now you have Hankerson, Armstrong, Moss and Kelly competing for 2 jobs. So, either Kelly and Hankerson were wastes of picks or they blew cash bringing back the HGH Hamstring Hamburglar lol.

This is what's so frustrating about the Shanahan era: there's no plan whatsover apparently. And, this isn't about my feelings about Moss: I feel the same way even if we sign Holmes or another X WR. Makes no flipping sense. Plaxico Burress or another Y? That makes sense. As for the Jenkins bros: why? Why did we draft Jarvis Jenkins at 41 if they wanted Cullen Jenkins at 40-50 million?

I really hope they let the Bears overpay Moss and just focus on the Oline/QB spots.



So, Jarmon is doing nothing for the skins then. Like I said: no plan.

Jarmon goes to the prior regime.. he has to prove he actually has a spot in the 3/4 or else he goes somewhere else to try for a 4/3 DE position

Kelly ? right now he was given a 1 year mulligan by Shanahan. they have nothing to lose. if he does well he is a gift.. if he cant stay healthy, he also goes on Vinnie's ledger

I dont think Moss will get to see an offer form the Bears. I bet we re sign him in the exclusive 72 hr window (if there is one)

Cullen Jenkins had as many sacks as our whole DL last year. The other Jenkins will be a rotational player for a year..It is Kris Jenkins that i think would be a waste of money..

We cant count on Austin doing anything. Armstrong might regress or flame out. Hankerson will need time to learn the pro game. Paul and the other draft pick are only late round picks, you cant count on them

We need O linemen for sure

shally
07-18-2011, 09:11 PM
We could use a vet 5 tech, but not a big ticket one. As for Moss: no, we don't lol. We need a real flanker to team with Armstrong and Hankerson(and no I'm not expecting Kelly to do much).



There's depth and then there's confusion. Having 3 Xs(4 if you count Paul) with a Y who can't stay healthy+2 Z slot guys in Austin and Robinson is a recipe for confusion. Let Moss go. Don't bring in Holmes or any other X WR in. Let Hankerson and Armstrong fight it out for the X spot. Find a Vet Y to go with them.

This "lets just throw a lot of fast poop against the wall" strategy has plagued the Skins' WR corps and red zone offense for years.



If they wanted Cullen Jenkins all along, pick #41 could have been used on something infinitely more useful imo. You can find a rotational 5 tech late in a draft.

pick #41 or the natural one should have been used on a damn QB...dont get me started..lol

akhhorus
07-18-2011, 09:17 PM
Jarmon goes to the prior regime.. he has to prove he actually has a spot in the 3/4 or else he goes somewhere else to try for a 4/3 DE position

He looked very effective last year in the 5 tech.

Kelly ? right now he was given a 1 year mulligan by Shanahan. they have nothing to lose. if he does well he is a gift.. if he cant stay healthy, he also goes on Vinnie's ledger


Still, he's nominally healthy and while I'm not expecting anything from him.

I dont think Moss will get to see an offer form the Bears. I bet we re sign him in the exclusive 72 hr window (if there is one)

I keep hearing that the skins are working on a deal with him, but that Moss will test the market. Possibly because they aren't offering him what he wants.

Cullen Jenkins had as many sacks as our whole DL last year. The other Jenkins will be a rotational player for a year..It is Kris Jenkins that i think would be a waste of money..

I'd be very careful signing him. Green Bay isn't even lifting a finger to resign him(pre-lockout) or to tag him.

We cant count on Austin doing anything. Armstrong might regress or flame out. Hankerson will need time to learn the pro game. Paul and the other draft pick are only late round picks, you cant count on them

Okay, but you aren't going to develop them on the bench playing 10 snaps a game.

pick #41 or the natural one should have been used on a damn QB...dont get me started..lol

Passed on Wisniewski, Rodney Hudson and Ijalana for him. And they're effectively going to relegate him to 10-12 snaps a game for the season if they sign Cullen Jenkins.

BigCountry
07-18-2011, 09:30 PM
We could use a vet 5 tech, but not a big ticket one. As for Moss: no, we don't lol. We need a real flanker to team with Armstrong and Hankerson(and no I'm not expecting Kelly to do much).



There's depth and then there's confusion. Having 3 Xs(4 if you count Paul) with a Y who can't stay healthy+2 Z slot guys in Austin and Robinson is a recipe for confusion. Let Moss go. Don't bring in Holmes or any other X WR in. Let Hankerson and Armstrong fight it out for the X spot. Find a Vet Y to go with them.

This "lets just throw a lot of fast poop against the wall" strategy has plagued the Skins' WR corps and red zone offense for years.



If they wanted Cullen Jenkins all along, pick #41 could have been used on something infinitely more useful imo. You can find a rotational 5 tech late in a draft.

That I agree, and I had players rated accordingly too but perhaps their draft board didn't. We'll have to agree to disagre on the wide receivers though. There is some diversity in the group they've put together and hopefully the best 5 will rise to the top.

shally
07-18-2011, 09:53 PM
He looked very effective last year in the 5 tech.



Still, he's nominally healthy and while I'm not expecting anything from him.



I keep hearing that the skins are working on a deal with him, but that Moss will test the market. Possibly because they aren't offering him what he wants.



I'd be very careful signing him. Green Bay isn't even lifting a finger to resign him(pre-lockout) or to tag him.



Okay, but you aren't going to develop them on the bench playing 10 snaps a game.



Passed on Wisniewski, Rodney Hudson and Ijalana for him. And they're effectively going to relegate him to 10-12 snaps a game for the season if they sign Cullen Jenkins.

they screwed with Jarmon's head and development last year.. You cant cut weight, get over an injury, and then put on weight all in 1 year.. last year was a lost cause and was mismanagment of whatever natural talent Jarmon has.

i think you have to have depth for the D line- no matter what scheme you anticipate playing. those guys all get beat up over the year.. it is a war of attrition that way

the real key is not going to be who plays DE, but rather what they do about the NT position.. if the guy we have playing there is getting shoved back into Fletcher's face all year, nothing else will matter..Kemo is useless, Bryant is a career reserve, Haynesworth is, well, Haynesworth, Neild is 1 pick from Mr Irrelevant.. we better have Franklin lined up or a valid plan B..just saying...

as for Moss, the only way i dont see us signing him quickly is if they have decided they are going after Holmes and will spend their bucks in pursuit of him.. i do agree that if we dont sign Moss in the 72 hr window, we arent going to sign him at all

redskin_rich
07-18-2011, 10:21 PM
We could use a vet 5 tech, but not a big ticket one. As for Moss: no, we don't lol. We need a real flanker to team with Armstrong and Hankerson(and no I'm not expecting Kelly to do much).



There's depth and then there's confusion. Having 3 Xs(4 if you count Paul) with a Y who can't stay healthy+2 Z slot guys in Austin and Robinson is a recipe for confusion. Let Moss go. Don't bring in Holmes or any other X WR in. Let Hankerson and Armstrong fight it out for the X spot. Find a Vet Y to go with them.

This "lets just throw a lot of fast poop against the wall" strategy has plagued the Skins' WR corps and red zone offense for years.


In the majority of our sets, running a variation of the Walsh WCO, Cooley is the Y and with Fred Davis behind him, I wouldn't expect any change if Cooley were to get hurt.

So whoever proves to be our best (speed and size) WR gets the X or Split End position and the best hands, short route specialist plays the Z or Flanker and the rest fall in order. The slot or Y reciever in 3 WR sets can be any of the Z Receivers, since there is nothing different in the role of Z and Y other than where they line up.

That said, I really don't see a role for Moss on this team anymore, other than return duty and I totally agree that having him here only impedes the development of our younger players. Same goes for signing Holmes or Plax or any other veteran WR's at this point. This is a down year, time to develop and find out what we got in all these youngsters.

Arkangiest
07-19-2011, 11:36 AM
Are there any quality O-linemen available? That's the only position that really matters right now. John Beck is being given a final chance for glory, I'm not sure what he can show. If there isn't an revamped line the only thing Beck will be showing are unclean underwear and a broken pride.

I agree with most on the board about not needing moss back or any extra wide receivers. So no to Nnamdi, 30 years old is too old for top dollar.

akhhorus
07-19-2011, 11:44 AM
This is a down year, time to develop and find out what we got in all these youngsters.

This is all that need to be said about the skins. They have a ton of young player-talented and not. BUt they need to see the field. Simple as that.

Are there any quality O-linemen available? That's the only position that really matters right now. John Beck is being given a final chance for glory, I'm not sure what he can show. If there isn't an revamped line the only thing Beck will be showing are unclean underwear and a broken pride.

I agree with most on the board about not needing moss back or any extra wide receivers. So no to Nnamdi, 30 years old is too old for top dollar.

Checking my FA list:

OT/OG Justin Blalock Atlanta Falcons
OT Ryan Harris Denver Broncos
OG Login Mankins New England Patriots: Tagged
OT Matt Light New England Patriots
OT Nick Kaczur OT New England Patriots
OG Josh Beekman Chicago Bears
OG Kevin Boothe New York Giants
OG Leroy Harris Tennessee Titans
OG Davin Joseph Tampa Bay Buccaneers
OG Uche Nwaneri Jacksonville Jaguars

I wouldn't mind any of these guys.

Patrick
07-19-2011, 11:53 AM
This is all that need to be said about the skins. They have a ton of young player-talented and not. BUt they need to see the field. Simple as that.



Checking my FA list:

OT/OG Justin Blalock Atlanta Falcons
OT Ryan Harris Denver BroncosOG Login Mankins New England Patriots: Tagged
OT Matt Light New England Patriots
OT Nick Kaczur OT New England Patriots
OG Josh Beekman Chicago Bears
OG Kevin Boothe New York Giants
OG Leroy Harris Tennessee Titans
OG Davin Joseph Tampa Bay BuccaneersOG Uche Nwaneri Jacksonville Jaguars

I wouldn't mind any of these guys. Joseph and Harris have reports out there that speculate Redskins interest .... specially Joseph.

esmith1790
07-19-2011, 01:04 PM
Wasnt Holmes just suspended the 1st 4 games last year?

SO you sign him to a big time contract only to get busted again and be out 1 whole year?

That is the luck the skins would have.

akhhorus
07-19-2011, 01:13 PM
Wasnt Holmes just suspended the 1st 4 games last year?

SO you sign him to a big time contract only to get busted again and be out 1 whole year?

That is the luck the skins would have.

Dez Bryant on line 2 for you lol.

shally
07-19-2011, 02:11 PM
Odds are that Fat Albert is heading down the same path

BIGREDSKINSFAN1963
07-19-2011, 03:16 PM
got this number from another website,does anybody know how accurate it is? 52 million buys a lot of players does'nt it?
Early indications are that the 'Skins have to spend about $52 million in new salaries and bonuses to meet new salary cap rules. That is the opposite of Washington's normal position when they are scrambling to find a few million in cap room to sign somone.

shally
07-19-2011, 03:36 PM
got this number from another website,does anybody know how accurate it is? 52 million buys a lot of players does'nt it?

Betcha Rogers is going to be ballistic because he aint getting some of that...lol

DaveKShape
07-19-2011, 04:58 PM
Betcha Rogers is going to be ballistic because he aint getting some of that...lol

"now carlos, we'll give you the money you want... but with one condition: you need to catch this stack of $10,000."

(2 min later, carlos rogers' vehicle leaves redskins park)

shally
07-19-2011, 05:21 PM
"now carlos, we'll give you the money you want... but with one condition: you need to catch this stack of $10,000."

(2 min later, carlos rogers' vehicle leaves redskins park)

even worse, Dallas is in no position to bid up the process..Good Luck, 'Los !!

BIGREDSKINSFAN1963
07-19-2011, 05:51 PM
Betcha Rogers is going to be ballistic because he aint getting some of that...lol


I agree with you doc,he's gonna be pissed!
would'nt it be poetic if wherever he ends up,they give him an eye exam and figure out that was his problem? you have been saying that the last few years!

wide_awake
07-19-2011, 07:01 PM
got this number from another website,does anybody know how accurate it is? 52 million buys a lot of players does'nt it?

It should for a team like this. Or it could buy one flashy toy, exactly what should not happen.

justinskins
07-19-2011, 07:27 PM
got this number from another website,does anybody know how accurate it is? 52 million buys a lot of players does'nt it?

If that's true, potential free agents around the league should be on notice. So should our front office. A lot of players will be looking for an easy payday on Snyder's dime.

BRAVEONAWARPATH
07-19-2011, 08:44 PM
Joseph and Harris have reports out there that speculate Redskins interest .... specially Joseph.

Joseph is expected to re-sign with Tampa during the 72hr window.

Death_Venom
07-19-2011, 09:19 PM
Um, no. He is proven, proven he isn't an NFL QB. The guys we have are better.

Beck? Are we talking about the same BECK here??? Seriously-JOHN BECK is "better" than Leinart?

Wow......I will agree Grossman has proven more than Leinart has-either way it is going to be a long season with either one at the helm.

shally
07-19-2011, 09:26 PM
I agree with you doc,he's gonna be pissed!
would'nt it be poetic if wherever he ends up,they give him an eye exam and figure out that was his problem? you have been saying that the last few years!

NO ONE who is as good an athlete as he is can possibly have that bad a set of hands.. it just doesnt add up..

sinskin
07-20-2011, 11:04 AM
Passed on Wisniewski, Rodney Hudson and Ijalana for him. And they're effectively going to relegate him to 10-12 snaps a game for the season if they sign Cullen Jenkins.

Maybe (young) Jenkins will be Carrikers replacement next year after a year of learning. Just a thought.


I still say spend the 52 million on a scouting dept. ......then go from there!

Keino
07-20-2011, 11:18 AM
NO ONE who is as good an athlete as he is can possibly have that bad a set of hands.. it just doesnt add up..

Fred Smoot summed it up best: "I have played across the field from many great Corners. Hall of Famer Darrell Green, Champ Bailey, Antoine Winfield.....you're just Carlos Rogers, son."

Catching the ball is a concentration and confidence issue. Something tells me that at one point in Los' playing career he was an offensive player who was moved to defense because his hands were a liability and he had his confidence shaken on the point early in his football life.

I cannot imagine that he hasn't had his eyes checked.

Moe
07-20-2011, 12:04 PM
Fred Smoot summed it up best: "I have played across the field from many great Corners. Hall of Famer Darrell Green, Champ Bailey, Antoine Winfield.....you're just Carlos Rogers, son."

Catching the ball is a concentration and confidence issue. Something tells me that at one point in Los' playing career he was an offensive player who was moved to defense because his hands were a liability and he had his confidence shaken on the point early in his football life.

I cannot imagine that he hasn't had his eyes checked.

A few months ago the Junkies interviewed Carlos and he was asked directly about his problems holding on to the ball. His reply was basically that he's never been a big interception guy and that his game is more about tight coverage and being physical. He claimed to work on that a lot in practice and that he didn't know why he didn't hang on to more them but that he felt that his ability to cover and support the run was his strength.

IMO the use of interceptions as a means to measure a CB is grossly over-valued because there are so many factors that play into that and it tends to carry more weight than the other aspects of the position (cough DeAngelo cough), but he has nobody to blame but himself for not capitalizing much more than he did. The plays he left on the field have cost him a lot of money and while I think he's a more valuable player than many, I cannot abide his sense of entitlement nor his bitterness for the Skins not opening the vault for him.

BIGREDSKINSFAN1963
07-20-2011, 12:38 PM
NO ONE who is as good an athlete as he is can possibly have that bad a set of hands.. it just doesnt add up..

you being a doctor yourself,how could anybody ever get through the levels of tests given by the NFL to these guys and have a problem that is not detected? could he have the beginning stages of lou gehrig's disease or something?

BigCountry
07-20-2011, 01:23 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/AdamSchefter/status/93738324593872897

No hope of an all Jenkins defensive line then.

shally
07-20-2011, 01:34 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/AdamSchefter/status/93738324593872897

No hope of an all Jenkins defensive line then.

Thank God !! We dont need another Kemo.

Franklin needs to be the major target for the DL right out of the box

VegasSkinsFan
07-20-2011, 01:34 PM
you being a doctor yourself,how could anybody ever get through the levels of tests given by the NFL to these guys and have a problem that is not detected? could he have the beginning stages of lou gehrig's disease or something?

More likely instead of the condition called "dropfoot"...he has " dropfootballs " aka dropballs :)

shally
07-20-2011, 03:08 PM
you being a doctor yourself,how could anybody ever get through the levels of tests given by the NFL to these guys and have a problem that is not detected? could he have the beginning stages of lou gehrig's disease or something?

some things do slide through because agents dont want any test that could de value a players worth. certainly possible that some kind of rare neurologic condition could go undetected for some time but i dont think that is the case with Rogers. i just dont know because NOBODY should be that bad

WinnpegSkinsFan
07-20-2011, 03:10 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/AdamSchefter/status/93738324593872897

No hope of an all Jenkins defensive line then.

How about Fat Al for Orton straight up? Denver's interior D-Line is miserable and dumping Orton's salary (& competition to Tebow) helps the Donkey's out.
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/20/ortons-salary-makes-him-tough-for-broncos-to-keep/

HanburgerBum
07-20-2011, 03:23 PM
Beck? Are we talking about the same BECK here??? Seriously-JOHN BECK is "better" than Leinart?

Wow......I will agree Grossman has proven more than Leinart has-either way it is going to be a long season with either one at the helm.



Who is not better than Matt Leinart?

John Beck may not prove to be any better than Leinart, but at least there is some doubt. With Leinart, the case is already closed. He simply can't play at this level. He was obviously the beneficiary of a lot of great players around him in college.

HanburgerBum
07-20-2011, 03:30 PM
This is a debbie downer post, I believe I've drank enough coolaid over the years. I've had that horrible feeling you get after drinking so much liquor you can't stop puking, I'm at a dry heave and it won't turn around until we start winning again.

This free agency isn't going to be very productive if we dont trade away McNabb and Haynesworth and cut Casey Rabach. I doubt Yanda will leave Baltimore, so that's unlikely. Santonio Holmes is a jackass. Cullen Jenkins will be OK but won't be worth his likely big contract. Kris Jenkins is finished. John Beck is.... A big gamble that probably won't pan out. Grossman is trash. Were looking at quite possibly the most underwhelming starting offensive lineups I can think of.

Perhaps wearing some $hit colored goggles is the secret to Redskins glory as the rose colored ones have only enlargedthe size of my liver over the years.


Don't despair. Your plan of Rabach + Grossman = Andrew Luck is a masterful one. Shanahan may even be improving your plan by replacing Grossman with Beck. Things will start to look better down the road.

Keino
07-20-2011, 03:33 PM
A few months ago the Junkies interviewed Carlos and he was asked directly about his problems holding on to the ball. His reply was basically that he's never been a big interception guy and that his game is more about tight coverage and being physical. He claimed to work on that a lot in practice and that he didn't know why he didn't hang on to more them but that he felt that his ability to cover and support the run was his strength.

IMO the use of interceptions as a means to measure a CB is grossly over-valued because there are so many factors that play into that and it tends to carry more weight than the other aspects of the position (cough DeAngelo cough), but he has nobody to blame but himself for not capitalizing much more than he did. The plays he left on the field have cost him a lot of money and while I think he's a more valuable player than many, I cannot abide his sense of entitlement nor his bitterness for the Skins not opening the vault for him.

I don't think INTs should be the sole measure, but I will not go so far as to say that it is over-emphasized or over-valued. It's no secret that winning the turnover battle in the NFL provides about a 90% success rate in terms of wins and losses. Leaving turnovers, game changing and field position altering turnovers on the field is unacceptable to any CB looking for big money or viewing himself in the upper tier of the position. Los can't say he does everything well but make INTs in one breath and then get pissy because the team won't throw big money at him in the next breath and be taken seriously at all. He even named CBs who he thinks he compares to and all of them have way more INTs and coverage ability as good, if not better.

Some corners simply do not get thrown at because they will make QBs and offenses pay if you test them too often. Los, had he not left those plays on the field could be that type of corner, but the fact is, nobody fears throwing at him, no matter how good his coverage is because he fails to make plays. Los has an inflated view of himself and gives huge cushions. Sure he is excellent in run support, but I would say that as a CB that is the only part of his game in which he excels. He has better than average cover skills, but piss poor ball and playmaking skills.

I am happy that all indications are that he won't be back. I'd rather see Kevin Barnes get a shot.

Moe
07-20-2011, 03:49 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/AdamSchefter/status/93738324593872897

No hope of an all Jenkins defensive line then.

Not surprised. He's been banged up too many years in a row and this is the third significant knee injury he's had. Add on his propensity for off-season laziness and it's not shocking that he'd call it a career.

NCskinsfanatic
07-20-2011, 03:51 PM
How about Fat Al for Orton straight up? Denver's interior D-Line is miserable and dumping Orton's salary (& competition to Tebow) helps the Donkey's out.
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/20/ortons-salary-makes-him-tough-for-broncos-to-keep/

I support this scenario, not that I think Orton is a savior at the QB position...i just loathe AH and would love to be able to get anything of value for him in return.

shally
07-20-2011, 04:00 PM
Who is not better than Matt Leinart?

John Beck may not prove to be any better than Leinart, but at least there is some doubt. With Leinart, the case is already closed. He simply can't play at this level. He was obviously the beneficiary of a lot of great players around him in college.

Not just that, Leinart has maturity/character issues.. Not so with Beck

colkurtz
07-20-2011, 05:58 PM
The Redskins failed strategy in the Snyder era has been to try to build a team through FA. Snyderratto's method was to award monster contracts for "big name", older players who are on their last contract and/or more than a few years past their prime. Call it "FLASH FOR CASH". This created team with old players (oldest in NFL), with lots of injuries [older players get hurt more], no depth, spending up to the cap limit and players giving just enough to last another year on the Snyder retirement plan. Another related problem also has been the team's continuing issue of keeping older players well onto the downsides of their careers and not developing new draft talent to replace it. It's been inexplicable to me when you go into the last couple of meaningless games of the season and DON'T SEE rookies or backups getting some play time.

The number of FA we hire this year doesn't matter as much as going for the right type of players and into the correct positions. First issue is to hire younger FA - especially in ANY position where the starter is over 30. Any FA brought in over 30 should only be done so under special circumstances.

The OL needs the most help NOW and getting at least 2-3 potential starters will make a world of difference for the offense. I can't see why our first or second FA shouldn't be at C or OG - not flashy but absolutely necessary. Same thing at NT. We had nothing last year there and we've just got to pay to get the best talent in that position for the 3/4. That and getting a CB - I think a guy like Asomugha will help shore up the DB. It would be nice to have a CB who can catch the ball for INT - helping our turnover numbers.

Finally hire a QB - either old guy who can run it if Beck flops or take another developmental guy and hope that this 'hail mary' works out. Unless Beck surprises us, next draft will be for a QB. BL - I think we will have a very active FA with 4-6 players.

VegasSkinsFan
07-20-2011, 07:26 PM
I think with the flurry of free agency that some udfa's might slip through the cracks. There are a couple of guys in the udfa pool i would like to see signed and given a good look.

Skins7ny
07-20-2011, 08:15 PM
Thank God !! We dont need another Kemo.Franklin needs to be the major target for the DL right out of the box

♪♪We just need to sign Aub--ray-yo-o-o♪♪

justinskins
07-20-2011, 08:55 PM
I don't think INTs should be the sole measure, but I will not go so far as to say that it is over-emphasized or over-valued. It's no secret that winning the turnover battle in the NFL provides about a 90% success rate in terms of wins and losses. Leaving turnovers, game changing and field position altering turnovers on the field is unacceptable to any CB looking for big money or viewing himself in the upper tier of the position. Los can't say he does everything well but make INTs in one breath and then get pissy because the team won't throw big money at him in the next breath and be taken seriously at all. He even named CBs who he thinks he compares to and all of them have way more INTs and coverage ability as good, if not better.

Some corners simply do not get thrown at because they will make QBs and offenses pay if you test them too often. Los, had he not left those plays on the field could be that type of corner, but the fact is, nobody fears throwing at him, no matter how good his coverage is because he fails to make plays. Los has an inflated view of himself and gives huge cushions. Sure he is excellent in run support, but I would say that as a CB that is the only part of his game in which he excels. He has better than average cover skills, but piss poor ball and playmaking skills.

I am happy that all indications are that he won't be back. I'd rather see Kevin Barnes get a shot.

I agree with the bolded part. At best, Carlos is a run-of-the-mill NFL corner. If he wants to get paid like a top corner, he can look elsewhere.

That being said, losing him could make us worse. The guys behind him will really have to step up.

Moe
07-21-2011, 08:50 AM
I agree with the bolded part. At best, Carlos is a run-of-the-mill NFL corner. If he wants to get paid like a top corner, he can look elsewhere.

That being said, losing him could make us worse. The guys behind him will really have to step up.

Haslett is running a Pittsburgh style 3-4 which puts more of a premium on pressure and creating turnovers and Los doesn't fit that mold. Barnes showed a little bit of a nose for the ball and a FA like Joseph from Cincy would fall into that category as well. Otogwe will be a big help as he also is known for being a playmaker. Now they need to figure out the front seven to get that pressure. This year the offense is going to need as much help as the defense can provide, so here's hoping.

Keino
07-21-2011, 09:09 AM
Haslett is running a Pittsburgh style 3-4 which puts more of a premium on pressure and creating turnovers and Los doesn't fit that mold. Barnes showed a little bit of a nose for the ball and a FA like Joseph from Cincy would fall into that category as well. Otogwe will be a big help as he also is known for being a playmaker. Now they need to figure out the front seven to get that pressure. This year the offense is going to need as much help as the defense can provide, so here's hoping.

Absolutely correct. A Strong Front 7 can make a mediocre CB look like an all-pro.

I am far more concerned about the Front 7 than the back 4.

RedskinsDave
07-21-2011, 10:03 AM
Absolutely correct. A Strong Front 7 can make a mediocre CB look like an all-pro.

I am far more concerned about the Front 7 than the back 4.

+1. A good pass rush makes the backs look better a lot more often than the backs can create a coverage sack.

Arkangiest
07-21-2011, 01:25 PM
Don't despair. Your plan of Rabach + Grossman = Andrew Luck is a masterful one. Shanahan may even be improving your plan by replacing Grossman with Beck. Things will start to look better down the road.

I desire Redskins super bowl glory more than anything in the world, but man it seems so futile after so many frustrating seasons. This team needs top shelf talent, yes scrappy teams can have success but I'm dying for a future powerhouse (for example look at the Washington Nationals with Espinosa, Strasburg, Harper, and Rendon).

I'm on the get Andrew Luck/Matt Barkley bandwagon in 2012, then the 3 years of consecutive gamecocks bandwagon of Alshon Jeffrey in 2013, Marcus Lattimore in 2014, and Jadveon Clowney in 2015. granted we will need the #1 pick net year, a top 5 pick in 2013, probably another top 5 pick in 2014, and probably the #1 pick in 2015... I can't deal with that much losing so Allen will have to fleece some team and trade for their first rounder and hope they suck terribly.

BigCountry
07-21-2011, 01:41 PM
Possible Defensive Cuts (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/21/16-defenders-who-could-be-cut-before-the-season/)

From that list I wouldn't mind signing Gerald Hayes. Heady, doesn't miss tackles and tough as nails.

BIGREDSKINSFAN1963
07-21-2011, 02:47 PM
barnett is pretty good too.i just hope like hell we still away from joey porter!

shally
07-21-2011, 02:56 PM
Absolutely correct. A Strong Front 7 can make a mediocre CB look like an all-pro.

I am far more concerned about the Front 7 than the back 4.

+1

and we already look to have a pair of very good safeties

esmith1790
07-21-2011, 02:56 PM
Dez Bryant on line 2 for you lol.

lol, yes but he is the #2. Miles Austin is our #1 and DEZ is on a rookie contract. Now he is a knucklehead for sure, but i dont see a 1 year suspension in his future.

Holmes is in the drug program for a reason and would be signed to a huge contract and paid to be the #1 guy.

akhhorus
07-21-2011, 02:58 PM
lol, yes but he is the #2. Miles Austin is our #1 and DEZ is on a rookie contract. Now he is a knucklehead for sure, but i dont see a 1 year suspension in his future.

Not yet. Based on his rookie year, I'd say that its only a matter of time that he is or Dallas dumps him for 20 cents on the dollar since he's such a douche.

shally
07-21-2011, 02:59 PM
lol, yes but he is the #2. Miles Austin is our #1 and DEZ is on a rookie contract. Now he is a knucklehead for sure, but i dont see a 1 year suspension in his future.

Holmes is in the drug program for a reason and would be signed to a huge contract and paid to be the #1 guy.
not if i am the GM...pass.. far prefer Rice, if i am going after a #1 guy

shally
07-21-2011, 03:06 PM
Not yet. Based on his rookie year, I'd say that its only a matter of time that he is or Dallas dumps him for 20 cents on the dollar since he's such a douche.

Dallas has a long and proud history of nurturing and putting up with douchebaggery

akhhorus
07-21-2011, 03:22 PM
Dallas has a long and proud history of nurturing and putting up with douchebaggery

As long as the player put in the effort for his game. Dez couldn't give a crap about that apparently.

hockeygoalie29
07-22-2011, 12:32 PM
+1. A good pass rush makes the backs look better a lot more often than the backs can create a coverage sack.

I disagree.

Signed,
Gregg Williams

akhhorus
07-22-2011, 12:34 PM
I disagree.

Signed,
Gregg Williams

Agreed. Pass rushers can die in a fire and created herpes.

Signed,
Greg Blache

CNYSkinFan
07-22-2011, 12:51 PM
i will fix this...All 11 players on defense will play out of position, it will blow their mind.

Jim Haslett

HanburgerBum
07-22-2011, 02:21 PM
I desire Redskins super bowl glory more than anything in the world, but man it seems so futile after so many frustrating seasons. This team needs top shelf talent, yes scrappy teams can have success but I'm dying for a future powerhouse (for example look at the Washington Nationals with Espinosa, Strasburg, Harper, and Rendon).

I'm on the get Andrew Luck/Matt Barkley bandwagon in 2012, then the 3 years of consecutive gamecocks bandwagon of Alshon Jeffrey in 2013, Marcus Lattimore in 2014, and Jadveon Clowney in 2015. granted we will need the #1 pick net year, a top 5 pick in 2013, probably another top 5 pick in 2014, and probably the #1 pick in 2015... I can't deal with that much losing so Allen will have to fleece some team and trade for their first rounder and hope they suck terribly.


While I am not a big baseball fan (can't stand its economic system of teams with 50 million dollar payrolls competing against teams with 200 million dollar payrolls), I think you are right about the Nats. If not 2012, then surely in 2013 the Nats will be a team to recon with.

As for Jeffrey, Lattimore and Clowney, I am not familiar with these players. I don't think it will be necessary for the Skins to have top 5 picks three-four years in a row to turn things around. There are plenty of really good players later in round 1 as well as rounds 2-4. The front office just has to stick with the plan to rebuild mainly thru the draft and refrain from making moronic trades of top draft picks for aging big-name players and make smart choices in free agent signings. I know Allanhan have not inspired a lot of confidence with their moves in year 1, but hey the law of averages is on their side.

IH Brave
07-22-2011, 02:22 PM
Agreed. Pass rushers can die in a fire and created herpes.

Signed,
Greg Blache

What are pass rushers? Oh wait, they're linebackers.

Moe
07-25-2011, 08:59 AM
http://twitter.com/#!/AdamSchefter/status/93738324593872897

No hope of an all Jenkins defensive line then.

Kris Jenkins was on Charlotte radio this morning and put on a really good interview. Some highlights:
-his retirement was largely based upon an ongoing custody case he's been fighting for his nine year old son. Essentially, he's finally received the opportunity for full custody but had he gone back to play then he would have lost it. He said he could still play but he knew he was towards the end anyway and this made his decision easy.

-he ripped Fox and Hurney for being company men who consistently lied to the players. He also laid into several players, Mike Rucker and Mike Minter most notably, for being in their shorts and running to them whenever things got difficult. He called Rucker a "hand puppet" for Fox and Hurney.

-he said that the trainer in NY who was fired after the sideline tripping incident last year was a moron who's inexperience led to several players getting hurt last year and probably affected their season.

-the host asked about the chances of his brother Cullen coming to the Panthers in light of Kris's experience here and Kris said quite clearly, "he's got his ring, now he's looking to get paid."

It was a really honest interview, not something you typically get from players but I guess now that he has nothing to lose he opened up. I could see him easily landing a media job in the near term.

BIGREDSKINSFAN1963
07-25-2011, 09:30 AM
glazer says free agency can start at 1201 am tonight.
No matter how much every other media outlet tries to ignore it and/or claim it for their own, Jay Glazer of FOX was the first to report that a deal in principle has been reached between the NFL and the NFLPA*.

And so Glazer gets extra special consideration when he reports on the events for the coming week.

Glazer reports that, starting Tuesday, teams can make trades and start signing rookies (presumably, both draft picks and undrafted).

Though free agents from other teams canít be signed until 6:00 p.m. ET Friday, teams will be permitted to talk with them (and, presumably, line up deals in principle) beginning Tuesday.

When on Tuesday? We reached Glazer by phone. He said that thereís no specific time on which the doors will open.

Itís safe to say that, when the clock strikes 12:01 a.m. ET on Tuesday, the process will begin.

shally
07-25-2011, 10:23 AM
glazer says free agency can start at 1201 am tonight.

You snooze, you lose...

dj_stouty
07-25-2011, 10:38 AM
glazer says free agency can start at 1201 am tonight.

My guess is that Redskins One has already been gassed up and is ready for flight. I assume people are stalking the plane via the internet again this year? It will be interesting to see where it lands first...

LadyNRedskinsfan
07-25-2011, 10:58 AM
-the host asked about the chances of his brother Cullen coming to the Panthers in light of Kris's experience here and Kris said quite clearly, "he's got his ring, now he's looking to get paid."

Translation: Welcome to Washington, Cullen....Lol

BIGREDSKINSFAN1963
07-25-2011, 11:37 AM
You snooze, you lose...

since snyder bought the team,the only thing they have done is waste money on free agents.i have to believe their were a lot of trades agreed on,just not made official yet!

Redskinmayhem
07-25-2011, 11:37 AM
Translation: Welcome to Washington, Cullen....Lol

lol...my thoughts exactly.

BIGREDSKINSFAN1963
07-25-2011, 11:38 AM
My guess is that Redskins One has already been gassed up and is ready for flight. I assume people are stalking the plane via the internet again this year? It will be interesting to see where it lands first...

snyder probably had it fueled and ready to go with the pilot,co-pilot and flight attendant on call!

Skaggsrules
07-25-2011, 01:09 PM
snyder probably had it fueled and ready to go with the pilot,co-pilot and flight attendant on call!

Where's that web site that tracks were Redskins One is at all times?

Patrick
07-25-2011, 01:34 PM
Where's that web site that tracks were Redskins One is at all times? I'm not sure but I believe it was removed in 2010. (It was a Snyder thing)

RedskinsDave
07-25-2011, 02:47 PM
It was an independent thing but Snyder had his flight records hidden after all the secrets got out.

hockeygoalie29
07-25-2011, 04:55 PM
Translation: Welcome to Washington, Cullen....Lol

I had the same thought. Hopefully after hearing that Shanny stays as far away as possible.