Who would you trade?

[GloryHog]

Bruce Allen has stated that he thinks there will be a very active trading period at the end of preseason. It seems it may mostly be player for player.

Who would you be willing to trade and who would you like to trade for?

I think that K. Williams, Rocky Macintosh might be available. Ryan Torain and Chris Cooley might have been available, but injuries have pretty much ruled out getting anything for them.

If they could somehow trade someone to come up with OL or safety depth, I would be all for that.

[akhhorus]

Rocky, a WR and Torain would seem to be obvious candidates, but I wouldn't expect to net much for any of them.

[smoak]

I would love to get something for Rocky, Moore, Horton, Doughty, Scott, Stallworth, and/or Torrain... But I would only trade guys will will be cut or bring something significant in return. Maybe Cooley & Landry fall into that bucket, but I don't think so.

[smoak]

Rocky, a WR and Torain would seem to be obvious candidates, but I wouldn't expect to net much for any of them.

Yeah, thats why I would only trade guys you are planning to cut.

[GloryHog]

Rocky might be a good case study. There seems to be a number of interesting (and younger) linebackers in camp. If they really want to go younger, what will a starting caliber (cough, cough) linebacker bring in trade. Don't laugh many people thought (and some still do) that he would/will be our starting LB next to Fletcher.

If he's not really necessary, assuming the ascendancy of Riley, Fox, White, et al, would a team that could really use a 4-3 outside linbacker AND who happens to have a plethera of safeties or O lineman be interested in doing business?

I'm interested in what prompted Allen to even bring it up the trade thing if he didn't feel like there was a reasonable possibility of something happening.

[Skaggsrules]

Send Torain to Arizona for a pick

[Keino]

I would love to get something for Rocky, Moore, Horton, Doughty, Scott, Stallworth, and/or Torrain... But I would only trade guys will will be cut or bring something significant in return. Maybe Cooley & Landry fall into that bucket, but I don't think so.

LOL

:lol3:

[silverspring]

I hope Allen doesn't mean future picks, but we could use all the Oline help we could find.

I have noticed it in other threads as well, I really don't understand how everyone seems happy to part ways with Torain. Torain stepped up big time last year and ran like a beast and not in pre-season, in actual real games.
I know the knock on him is that he is injury prone, but I don't think a broken hand is the kind of thing you attribute to someone falling apart. It would be one thing if it was a knee or a pulled muscle or a sprain or something like that. A broken hand is just one of those random things. Additionally, it isn't like he is going to be laid up for a while, he will be ready by the giants game.

I think we would be prudent to keep Torain. If he immediately gets nicked up again, then fine we can officially call him injury prone, let him go and promote whoever ends up on the practice squad, but imo he earned a spot with his strong running last year. Now if someone offers us something big for him I might change my tune, but I would expect that his market value wouldn't be all that high.

[justinskins]

I hope Allen doesn't mean future picks, but we could use all the Oline help we could find.

I have noticed it in other threads as well, I really don't understand how everyone seems happy to part ways with Torain. Torain stepped up big time last year and ran like a beast and not in pre-season, in actual real games.
I know the knock on him is that he is injury prone, but I don't think a broken hand is the kind of thing you attribute to someone falling apart. It would be one thing if it was a knee or a pulled muscle or a sprain or something like that. A broken hand is just one of those random things. Additionally, it isn't like he is going to be laid up for a while, he will be ready by the giants game.

I think we would be prudent to keep Torain. If he immediately gets nicked up again, then fine we can officially call him injury prone, let him go and promote whoever ends up on the practice squad, but imo he earned a spot with his strong running last year. Now if someone offers us something big for him I might change my tune, but I would expect that his market value wouldn't be all that high.

I'm not as sold on Torain as you are. Quite apart from his injury problems (which I think are major and make me question whether it's worth using a roster spot on him), I don't think he has a lot of speed. I actually thought Portis looked quicker last year before he got out. My impression of Torain is that of a workmanlike back who can break tackles, but isn't a homerun hitter. Both Hightower and Helu have that potential. Maybe you keep Torain as insurance in case one of those two goes down, but we also need 3rd-down backs and special teams contributors among our backups.

[silverspring]

I'm not as sold on Torain as you are. Quite apart from his injury problems (which I think are major and make me question whether it's worth using a roster spot on him), I don't think he has a lot of speed. I actually thought Portis looked quicker last year before he got out. My impression of Torain is that of a workmanlike back who can break tackles, but isn't a homerun hitter. Both Hightower and Helu have that potential. Maybe you keep Torain as insurance in case one of those two goes down, but we also need 3rd-down backs and special teams contributors among our backups.

I am not anointing Torain as some all pro back or something, I am just saying I think he deserves a spot and a chance to show us if he can repeat his great running from last year.

[redskinz#1fan]

I personally like Torain...now of course I'm basing that on how hard he ran last year when given the opportunity. He's not a "homerun" back with break away speed, but he's a bruiser that runs north and south. I think he deserves a shot on this team to see if he can duplicate his efforts from last year.

Now with that said, Hightower and Helu are running like beast too, so they load would have to be shared among all three.

[shally]

Rocky, a WR and Torain would seem to be obvious candidates, but I wouldn't expect to net much for any of them.

agree.. but other than torain, i dont expect anyone to actually get traded

[BIGREDSKINSFAN1963]

i would'nt trade cooley! i don't really think there is anybody on our team worth trading away now!

[hail2skins]

LOL

:lol3:I thought the same thing when I saw that post. Smoak must be smoking. LOL.

[Monk4HOF]

I think we could package McIntosh and Torain for some O-line depth. We have three guys - Riley, Fox and Alexander - who can compete for the second ILB spot.

Torain is made of pretzel sticks... this is his second broken bone that I know of. I don't know many successful RBs who break bones while practicing in shells. Not to mention, I think he is behind Hightower and Helu talent-wise. I appreciate that he runs hard, but I would rather have some depth at C/G.

[The Iceman]

Guys I'd like to see traded that have value? IMO, trade McIntosh.. he's not terrible. Also, I'd like to see us get something for Landry... He's a beast when healthy, and it would be nice to sell him at a high price if we can get him into the last preseason game to showcase that he is healthy... otagwe and gomes/doughty/moore is fine w/ me... even if gomes and doughty aren't true SS. Also, imo, keep Cooley, and trade sleepyhead.. Ya, he's good, but he is in a contract year. He's gonna want big money next year. IMO, trade him now for a 2, or possibly a 1.

[KMDeMuth]

I wouldn't expect trades for stars or veteran starters. IF trades are made its likely for depth players or low draft picks.

Realistically possible trades:
Mike Sellers: Lost his job, still has something in the tank, another team might want to take a chance on him.
Donte' Stallworth: Showing he can still play well enough to be a 3rd WR for a team in need with less options.
Brandon Banks: HR threat on returns, low chance of sticking around with WR position changes here.
Malcolm Kelly: Has too much upside/size for teams not to take a chance on when/if the Skins finally give up on him being healthy.
Chris Horton: Has shown flashes when used as a SS in the box, the right team might take a chance on him for depth/competition if hurting at SS.
Keiland Williams: He showed last year he could be a 2nd/3rd RB for a team in need of a RB depth and no real options.

Low chance of being traded this year, but possibly next year:
Ryan Torain: If Hightower gets hurt, Shanny isn't going to put it all on rookies. If another team REALLY wants him, possibly, but doubtful. Injury prone and hasn't shown he is consistent; teams wont offer enough to outweigh his value here.
Chris Cooley: Value is too low this year to consider moving with injuries and chance to put up numbers to increase his value. If they want to move him at all.
Fred Davis: Has a chance to put up better numbers to increase value for next year, no reason to move him now unless a team makes a very good offer. If they want to move him at all.

Won't be traded, don't understand the talk of it:
Rocky McIntosh: Was on the open market for awhile, no-one wanted him, home-team-fans are over-valuing him. Has a chance to play this/next year with ILB being unsettled and Fletchers contract up after this year. Signed a 1 year deal hoping to show his value, likely a depth guy.
Kareem Moore: The only real FS on the team for depth, not a starter, not valued highly by other teams, can not play other DB positions. strictly depth @ FS.
Reed Doughty: Signed a 3 year deal, is the ST's captain. Other teams DO NOT WANT him. He is a 'decent' SS in the box, CAN NOT COVER and can not play other DB positions. He shouldn't realistically be higher then 3rd on the SS depth-chart. Horton should be above him, Gomes is likely to take over the 2nd spot in the future; Gomes also has the ability to play FS better then 'other back-ups' on the roster. But, Doughty is both under-valued and over-valued by people on this board. He isn't going anywhere, cheap and does what the coaches want. I do hope the coaches quit putting him in positions to fail though, like coverage situations. Regardless he has way too much discussion about him, he is what he is, coaches know that, leave the man alone already. Yell at the coaches if they use him outside of what he is.

[jaylen]

I would trade Douthy but I'd end up eating that bag of chips before I got back to redskins park.

[smoak]

I would trade Douthy but I'd end up eating that bag of chips before I got back to redskins park.

You eat stale chips??

[GloryHog]

Won't be traded, don't understand the talk of it:
Rocky McIntosh: Was on the open market for awhile, no-one wanted him, home-team-fans are over-valuing him. Has a chance to play this/next year with ILB being unsettled and Fletchers contract up after this year. Signed a 1 year deal hoping to show his value, likely a depth guy.


Obviously no one else was willing to pay him what he wanted. I do think there might be teams out there that could use a backup 4-3 LB, and who have excess talent at another position that might otherwise be cut, who could be interested. Maybe not...Could very well be wishful thinking.

[smoak]

Torrain and a first rounder for Chris Johnson. :D

[skinsfan36]

id do any of these
torain to the cards for a 4th rd pick
doughty for a bag of footballs
stallworth for a backup g/c on a contender
rocky to a 4/3 team for a 5th

[DannySnyder]

I would try to trade off Davis. Good tightend that is proven that we dont use at all. Maybe pick up another quality O line vet for depth or a draft pick. Think he could go for a 4th? A 3rd would be wishful thinking.

[HanburgerBum]

Torrain and a first rounder for Chris Johnson. :D


I don't know if you are suggesting this trade as a lark or what. But, I think the Titans would take that deal in a heartbeat. They would get rid of a headache. Plus, RBs just aren't worth what they used to be worth, because they simply don't have the same impact as before. Moreover, Johnson already has some mileage under him, and he plays a position where 28 can be considered old.

If I were the Skins GM, I would definitely NOT make that deal.

[guess88]

I don't know if you are suggesting this trade as a lark or what. But, I think the Titans would take that deal in a heartbeat. They would get rid of a headache. Plus, RBs just aren't worth what they used to be worth, because they simply don't have the same impact as before. Moreover, Johnson already has some mileage under him, and he plays a position where 28 can be considered old.

If I were the Skins GM, I would definitely NOT make that deal.

Headache? He IS their team. RB's in general aren't worth as much as they used to, but special players are always special. Do you really think there isn't much of a drop off losing Chris Johnson or Adrian Peterson?

[HanburgerBum]

The problem with the Skins making a trade or two in the next two weeks is that they don't have any players whom they are willing to part with that other teams would want.

Orakpo, T Williams, Kerrigan would attract a lot of suitors, but I presume Wash wouldn't want to trade any of them. Landry would be in demand, but with his health in question, the Skins would be trading him at low value. Young players like Barnes, Helu, Jenkins would undoubtedly attract interest, but why would the Skins want to deal them?

Chris Cooley should be traded if decent compensation can be obtained, because Fred Davis should be capable of taking up any slack. But, Cooley at his age and with his current health situation may not fetch much.

As for using future picks to acquire players, Wash needs to be very, very careful. The team is still in the rebuilding process--it is not just a player away. The McNabb trade with Philly should be a lesson the Skins never forget. Draft choices are the future lifeblood of teams.

Thus, any trade would likely involve low round choices (6th, 7th) or players each team is about to cut. So, Bruce Allen's prediction notwithstanding, I am expecting nothing of significance in the trading front.

[BIGREDSKINSFAN1963]

i would'nt rade cooley or davis,we need both of them.there is rumor that denver may cut tim tebow,now i would not put him in at qb,but if he would take a 1 year deal at a fair price,i would sign him and experiment on how to use him because he is too atheletic to not give a second chance at playing to!
he was one heck of a great athlete that could help any team if used right.

[guess88]

i would'nt rade cooley or davis,we need both of them.there is rumor that denver may cut tim tebow,now i would not put him in at qb,but if he would take a 1 year deal at a fair price,i would sign him and experiment on how to use him because he is too atheletic to not give a second chance at playing to!
he was one heck of a great athlete that could help any team if used right.

Is he really that great of an athlete in the NFL game? In college yes, but I don't see him being particularly fast. He has physical tools and is a very well rounded athlete, but I just don't see him standing out from a pure athletic standpoint in the pros. His biggest plus is his work ethic, but we already have a Reed Doughty.

I do kinda like the idea of Tebow converting to a TE, but not on the Skins. He'd be 4th on the depth chart, which we wouldn't even carry, plus it would impede any of his development. Skins are rebuilding, there are better projects out there (like Niles Paul), but he could be good for another team that has their affairs in order.

[HanburgerBum]

Headache? He IS their team. RB's in general aren't worth as much as they used to, but special players are always special. Do you really think there isn't much of a drop off losing Chris Johnson or Adrian Peterson?


Let's presume Johnson is Tenn's best player. So what? Will Johnson be able to elevate the Titans to a playoff team? I know of no one who thinks that.

Further, he has taken a lot of punishment already in his NFL career so far. Moreover, he is somewhat of a fumbler. It would be a horrible mistake for the Skins to give up the 2012 1st rounder for him--Johnson will not be that one player who turns things around here. In fact, it can be argued that by the time the Skins become a contender, Johnson's career may on the decline. Most RBs start to slide by the time they are 27. Portis is barely 30 and he looks like an old man as a runner.

[HanburgerBum]

i would'nt rade cooley or davis,we need both of them.there is rumor that denver may cut tim tebow,now i would not put him in at qb,but if he would take a 1 year deal at a fair price,i would sign him and experiment on how to use him because he is too atheletic to not give a second chance at playing to!
he was one heck of a great athlete that could help any team if used right.


The Skins should trade Cooley in a hearbeat if they could get good value in return. He is getting older and injuries are going to occur with more frequency. Davis is younger and should be kept. There is no need for two outstanding receiving TEs.

As for Tebow, Denver was beyond stupid to trade up into the 1st round for him. He is the Broncos' problem. No need to bail them out. I can't think of one position Tebow can play in the NFL.

[smoak]

I don't know if you are suggesting this trade as a lark or what. But, I think the Titans would take that deal in a heartbeat. They would get rid of a headache. Plus, RBs just aren't worth what they used to be worth, because they simply don't have the same impact as before. Moreover, Johnson already has some mileage under him, and he plays a position where 28 can be considered old.

If I were the Skins GM, I would definitely NOT make that deal.

The Skins shouldn't give away draft picks... But I would consider this. Make it a second and I would JUMP. I just think we need that first in the event we go QB.

Johnson's deal isn't going to get done any time soon. He may sit out half to all of 2011.. Players shouldn't take this approach and owners definitely shouldn't cave.

Imagine if we gave up two firsts for Ochocinco

[guess88]

Let's presume Johnson is Tenn's best player. So what? Will Johnson be able to elevate the Titans to a playoff team? I know of no one who thinks that.

Further, he has taken a lot of punishment already in his NFL career so far. Moreover, he is somewhat of a fumbler. It would be a horrible mistake for the Skins to give up the 2012 1st rounder for him--Johnson will not be that one player who turns things around here. In fact, it can be argued that by the time the Skins become a contender, Johnson's career may on the decline. Most RBs start to slide by the time they are 27. Portis is barely 30 and he looks like an old man as a runner.

I never said anything about the Skins making the trade, I think that would be a horrible idea unless we could get him for a 3rd + McIntosh. We're still rebuilding, no point trading that high of a pick when the team's still figuring out what it can do.

Johnson won't elevate the Titans to a playoff team, because he's already on the team. They need to add players around him to change the equation. However, without him they have a new veteran QB with injury issues and a possibly fluke WR with court issues. Bironas has a solid leg, but you still need to get in FG range.

[HanburgerBum]

The Skins shouldn't give away draft picks... But I would consider this. Make it a second and I would JUMP. I just think we need that first in the event we go QB.

Johnson's deal isn't going to get done any time soon. He may sit out half to all of 2011.. Players shouldn't take this approach and owners definitely shouldn't cave.

Imagine if we gave up two firsts for Ochocinco



So, your original post of Torain plus a first rounder for Chris Johnson was a lark.

As for giving a 2nd rounder for CJ, I wouldn't even do that. RBs go downhill very quickly, especially one who has taken as much punishment as Johnson has already in the NFL.

Further, the NFL today is a pass-first league. RBs are having less and less impact. Nobody hardly drafts one in the 1st round any more.

If the Skins trade for Johnson, they would undoubtedly have to satisfy his exorbitant salary demands. He would become another one of those big-name, expensive acquisitions that turn out to be crap.

[HanburgerBum]

I never said anything about the Skins making the trade, I think that would be a horrible idea unless we could get him for a 3rd + McIntosh. We're still rebuilding, no point trading that high of a pick when the team's still figuring out what it can do.

Johnson won't elevate the Titans to a playoff team, because he's already on the team. They need to add players around him to change the equation. However, without him they have a new veteran QB with injury issues and a possibly fluke WR with court issues. Bironas has a solid leg, but you still need to get in FG range.


My bad. When I posted against Smoak's original post setting forth the issue of trading Torain plus a 1st rounder for Chris Johnson, you seemed to take his side. I mistakenly assumed that you were in favor of Smoak's proposed trade.

As for your proposal of McIntosh plus a 3rd rounder for CJ, I wouldn't even do that. Johnson has all the signs of being another one of those big-name, expensive acquisitions who doesn't amount to a hill of beans. In any event, the question would appear to be moot, because Tenn undoubtedly thinks Johnson is worth more than McIntosh + a 3rd. That's fine by me. The Titans can keep him--they will have no shot at the playoffs with or without him. After wasting another 20 million dollars on him, Tenn will release Johnson in two years. The Skins can pick him up cheap then if he still has anything left in the tank.

The top tier RBs like Adrian Peterson and Chris Johnson are pretty much in denial these days. AP was recently quoted as saying he is the most valuable player in the NFL. Let's temporarily forget his fumbling and assume he is the best RB in football. There are at least 10 QBs and 5 WRs in the NFL more valuable than Peterson because it is clearly a pass-first league now.

Johnson is no slouch as a fumbler either. But, even disregarding that, he is not the kind of a player who can turn a team around like a Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Drew Brees, Aaron Rogers, Philip Rivers, etc can.

[guess88]

The top tier RBs like Adrian Peterson and Chris Johnson are pretty much in denial these days. AP was recently quoted as saying he is the most valuable player in the NFL. Let's temporarily forget his fumbling and assume he is the best RB in football. There are at least 10 QBs and 5 WRs in the NFL more valuable than Peterson because it is clearly a pass-first league now.

Johnson is no slouch as a fumbler either. But, even disregarding that, he is not the kind of a player who can turn a team around like a Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Drew Brees, Aaron Rogers, Philip Rivers, etc can.

All of whom play behind pretty solid line, save for Rodgers. You could make a relative argument that an average QB behind a solid O-line would post up solid numbers the same way an average RB behind a good line would. No player can do it himself. AP had a solid line, an above average WR, a HOF QB on his last legs and almost made a good run to the SB. He won't do much this year because everything else around him got worse besides the QB position. CJ might have a season, but only if Hassellback makes defenses respect the pass. A big reason his numbers fell last year was because he was the obvious #1 target without anyone to take off the heat besides Britt (who only showed up a few games). I don't think he's in as much decline as you, but only time will tell who's right on that end.

Let's not forget Steven Jackson as well. Before Bradford, he WAS the Rams. Put him on the Colts, Patriots, Saints, Chargers and he'd set records every season. On the Rams, he just kept them at the bare minimum NFL level. Without him, they'd have absolutely no one (before Bradford).

[ChiefPowhatan17]

Mike Sellers for a pick, if they are going to cut him anyways, go ahead and test the market. Sorry, Mike, you were great, but the youth are coming.

[HanburgerBum]

All of whom play behind pretty solid line, save for Rodgers. You could make a relative argument that an average QB behind a solid O-line would post up solid numbers the same way an average RB behind a good line would. No player can do it himself. AP had a solid line, an above average WR, a HOF QB on his last legs and almost made a good run to the SB. He won't do much this year because everything else around him got worse besides the QB position. CJ might have a season, but only if Hassellback makes defenses respect the pass. A big reason his numbers fell last year was because he was the obvious #1 target without anyone to take off the heat besides Britt (who only showed up a few games). I don't think he's in as much decline as you, but only time will tell who's right on that end.

Let's not forget Steven Jackson as well. Before Bradford, he WAS the Rams. Put him on the Colts, Patriots, Saints, Chargers and he'd set records every season. On the Rams, he just kept them at the bare minimum NFL level. Without him, they'd have absolutely no one (before Bradford).



No argument that football is a TEAM sport--no one player can do it alone. But, it is also clear that some players are more important, more valuable than others.

When comparing players, we have to assume all other conditions are the same. That is, they would each have equivalent support from teammates. It may be that a 2nd tier QB can have more success on a great team, while a 1st tier QB may not do that well with a bad team. But, that would not be a fair comparison.

Top tier RBs today simply don't have the impact they once did. It is not their fault, it is just that the NFL has thru 30 years of rule changes that favor the passing game made the league a pass-first league. You would be hard pressed to find a recent SB winner with a dominating running game and a lesser passing attack.

Recent SB winners GB and NO had very mediocre running games. Indy had almost no running game. The Patriots were defined by Tom Brady and their great passing attack. Does anyone even remember who ran for NE in their SB years?

For elite RBs like Adrian Peterson and Chris Johnson to think that they are the most valuable commodity in the NFL is just being delusional. Momma, don't let your boy grow up to be a RB--it is no longer that glamorous a position and it has the shortest shelf life of all the players.