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  #91  
Old 04-15-2012, 03:21 PM
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I know you need facts so here is some...

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540...19260#46919260
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  #92  
Old 04-15-2012, 03:52 PM
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I did not make things up if he has called the police 46 times on African American males in his neighborhood. That is fact. And no I will not riot but perhaps, if Zimmerman is acquitted, I would feel like many white folk did when OJ was acquitted....
It is not a fact. He called 911 that many times but not regarding black males. That's a lie. You would feel like white folk did when OJ got off? You mean people who knew he was guilty or just white people who knew he was guilty. Again, I didn't look at race in that case. You did.

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Zimmerman tells the police after he shot the kid the kid lays on his back and says "you got me". C'mon dude, now you just get shot and say you got me??? That alone was enough for me to know he was lying. I guess as I say true police work doesn't take place down there. So I guess stand your ground only applies to the people in pursuit. A witness went on camera to say she saw ZIMMERMAN on top of the kid after the gun went off..hmm
Again, you're believing what you want and don't really care about the truth.

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Now if ZIMMERMAN was brought in and kept, then maybe all these so called stories you say IM making up would not have happened. I guess the fact that it took so long to bring him in is why the public and media was able to have access to so much information whether it be false as you would call it or not.
They brought him in that night. That is the famous video where you can see an injury on the back of his head where the race baiters say there is no injury on the back of his head.

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And no Dave I don't ever consider myself luckyin those situations, I call it UNMERITED FAVOR.
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  #93  
Old 04-15-2012, 03:54 PM
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I know you need facts so here is some...

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540...19260#46919260
Kudos for getting at least one facet correct. You're on your way to the truth. Nice picture MSNBC used of a 12 year old Martin. No bias there at all. Of course they are an affiliate of the NBC who edited the tapes to make a better story as they knew people like you would lap it up and ignore the truth.
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  #94  
Old 04-16-2012, 06:44 AM
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You're assumption that he knew or took Martin's race into account.
Since he describes Martin's race in the 911 call, the same call he placed to indicate the kid looked suspicious, is not too far of a leap that his race played a role in how he was viewed. That's not making anything up, that's drawing a reasonable conclusion based upon the facts.
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  #95  
Old 04-16-2012, 07:00 AM
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Since he describes Martin's race in the 911 call, the same call he placed to indicate the kid looked suspicious, is not too far of a leap that his race played a role in how he was viewed. That's not making anything up, that's drawing a reasonable conclusion based upon the facts.
So if I see a suspicious person walking around my neighborhood and I decide to call the police (something that would probably never happen) and I describe the person as black, anything that happens after that point means I am acting differently than if he were white? No, you don't know that. None of us do.
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  #96  
Old 04-16-2012, 07:19 AM
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So if I see a suspicious person walking around my neighborhood and I decide to call the police (something that would probably never happen) and I describe the person as black, anything that happens after that point means I am acting differently than if he were white? No, you don't know that. None of us do.
I would ask you why you thought that person looked suspicious. What made this kid specifically look suspicious? I know why the police thought it reasonable, and I refer you back to the unanswered "#1 male" question I asked earlier in the thread. I contend that if the racial tables were turned, we wouldn't even be having this discussion, because the black assailant would be locked up, not released on bond due to being a flight risk etc. under the exact same set of facts.

If you then approached that individual with a weapon after being specifically told by the dispatcher not to, I would question your motivations for such an action. If you weren't arrested on the spot after initiating the conflict that resulted in a dead "suspicious looking" 17 year old kid armed with Skittles and Iced Tea I would then question not only your actions but those running the investigation.
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  #97  
Old 04-16-2012, 07:51 AM
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I don't think that Zimmerman saying he was black was based on race, the 911 operator asked Zimmerman to describe him. Now when he says: "These assholes always get away with this"....thats open for interpretation racially speaking.

Odd thing I noticed reading the 911 call transcript: Zimmerman says that Martin has something in his hand and is coming towards him(after staring at Zimmerman), then he says Martin's running away from him. Why did anyone buy his self defense claim?
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  #98  
Old 04-16-2012, 08:39 AM
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I don't think that Zimmerman saying he was black was based on race, the 911 operator asked Zimmerman to describe him. Now when he says: "These assholes always get away with this"....thats open for interpretation racially speaking.

Odd thing I noticed reading the 911 call transcript: Zimmerman says that Martin has something in his hand and is coming towards him(after staring at Zimmerman), then he says Martin's running away from him. Why did anyone buy his self defense claim?
There is also the inaudible word that sounds awfully close to being "coon".

I agree that "black" on the 911 call was descriptive, since he was asked specifically what the person he was following looked like. What I am getting at is what made this guy think Martin looked suspicious? Taken together with his words on the 911 call and subsequent actions, it's hard to draw any other conclusion than the reason that Martin looked "suspicious" in Zimmerman's eyes was the mere fact that he was black and had a hoodie on. It's also clear, that given the number of holes in his story that the reason for his non-arrest has everything to do with Police sharing the same attitudes about who is "suspicious" looking.
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  #99  
Old 04-16-2012, 09:08 AM
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If there was a kid of any race who I didn't know walking through a gated community with a hoodie on, it would look suspicious. I know, I know, hoodies are never used to hide ones face and are merely there to protect you from the cold.

Listen, I think Zimmerman is a turd and he had no reason to have a gun. I also think he should at least be convicted of manslaughter because he took an unreasonable action that resulted in a death. Everything else is speculation, supposition and downright b.s.

The same people who want to paint Zimmerman in the worst light possible and question all of his actions also want to ignore that maybe Martin wanted to look menacing. Maybe he was a punk thug wannabe. Maybe he was a trouble maker who had been suspended from school, had tats and gold teeth. Maybe he dealt weed. I don't know these things but can come to these conclusions based on things I've read. I can conclude these things as easily as someone who heard the word "coon" (which has been debunked already). Of course if I draw these conclusions, that's racist.
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  #100  
Old 04-16-2012, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by RedskinsDave View Post
If there was a kid of any race who I didn't know walking through a gated community with a hoodie on, it would look suspicious. I know, I know, hoodies are never used to hide ones face and are merely there to protect you from the cold.

Listen, I think Zimmerman is a turd and he had no reason to have a gun. I also think he should at least be convicted of manslaughter because he took an unreasonable action that resulted in a death. Everything else is speculation, supposition and downright b.s.

The same people who want to paint Zimmerman in the worst light possible and question all of his actions also want to ignore that maybe Martin wanted to look menacing. Maybe he was a punk thug wannabe. Maybe he was a trouble maker who had been suspended from school, had tats and gold teeth. Maybe he dealt weed. I don't know these things but can come to these conclusions based on things I've read. I can conclude these things as easily as someone who heard the word "coon" (which has been debunked already). Of course if I draw these conclusions, that's racist.

A 63 degree, rainy day in FL is cause to wear a hoodie. Nothing suspicious about that at all. I am pretty sure I wore one myself on February 26 when I took my dog for a walk that day.

As to all of the rest, yea maybe. But none of that has anything to do with automatically assuming someone looks suspicious based on merely walking down the street and wearing a weather appropriate article of clothing. None of those potential defects in character make a damn bit of difference. People are entitled to walk down a public street without being accosted. That's why a walk is commonly called a "constitutional". A gated community doesn't change the public nature of the street, as it is a right of way maintained by the state.

As to whether the inaudible portion of the 911 call has been debunked, has that happened officially? All I am seeing is that various folks opine what is really said with one person saying that what Zimmeran says is "It's effing cold" (which supports why someone would have a hoodie on).

If you want to believe that race doesn't play a role here at all, you are welcome to that belief, but I think there are plenty of facts out there that suggest that race was partially why Martin "looked suspicious" and why Police bought his craptacular story and why the local prosecutor declined to bring charges when the lead investigator wanted to bring charges. It also explains why various police officers were coaching up witness accounts and why the victim's body sat on a slab for 3 days. You can believe in the honorable intentions of these folks if you want. Those of us who aren't quick to buy these things that do not add up have a historical context with which we can view these things.

A black assailant would've been behind bars on the day of the incident.
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  #101  
Old 04-16-2012, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Keino View Post
There is also the inaudible word that sounds awfully close to being "coon".
The special pros. says that it was "punks."

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Originally Posted by Keino View Post
I agree that "black" on the 911 call was descriptive, since he was asked specifically what the person he was following looked like. What I am getting at is what made this guy think Martin looked suspicious? Taken together with his words on the 911 call and subsequent actions, it's hard to draw any other conclusion than the reason that Martin looked "suspicious" in Zimmerman's eyes was the mere fact that he was black and had a hoodie on. It's also clear, that given the number of holes in his story that the reason for his non-arrest has everything to do with Police sharing the same attitudes about who is "suspicious" looking.
Yes, all taken together its a very fair question of what was Zim's motives racially speaking.
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  #102  
Old 04-16-2012, 11:34 AM
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I would ask you why you thought that person looked suspicious. What made this kid specifically look suspicious? I know why the police thought it reasonable, and I refer you back to the unanswered "#1 male" question I asked earlier in the thread. I contend that if the racial tables were turned, we wouldn't even be having this discussion, because the black assailant would be locked up, not released on bond due to being a flight risk etc. under the exact same set of facts.

If you then approached that individual with a weapon after being specifically told by the dispatcher not to, I would question your motivations for such an action. If you weren't arrested on the spot after initiating the conflict that resulted in a dead "suspicious looking" 17 year old kid armed with Skittles and Iced Tea I would then question not only your actions but those running the investigation.
Thank you and that is why I qouted the father, who reported what was told to him by the police. So in other words the Police detective used Zimmermans story as gold as opposed to doing any real police work IMO,which is why the father questioned the entire thing. If Trayvon had went after Zimmerman, he would have been on a cot in KANSAS by now. That whole case would have taken 5 days at the most. If Zimmerman was carrying a cell phone. Someone would have dug a little deeper to at least find his family as opposed to locating them 3 days later.
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  #103  
Old 04-16-2012, 11:44 AM
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I don't think that Zimmerman saying he was black was based on race
??
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  #104  
Old 04-16-2012, 11:49 AM
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Yes, we all know that if the tables were turned Martin would have already been convicted as evidenced by the Sean Taylor incident. I have no idea what a "cot in Kansas" means.
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  #105  
Old 04-16-2012, 11:54 AM
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If you want to believe that race doesn't play a role here at all, you are welcome to that belief, but I think there are plenty of facts out there that suggest that race was partially why Martin "looked suspicious" and why Police bought his craptacular story and why the local prosecutor declined to bring charges when the lead investigator wanted to bring charges. It also explains why various police officers were coaching up witness accounts and why the victim's body sat on a slab for 3 days. You can believe in the honorable intentions of these folks if you want. Those of us who aren't quick to buy these things that do not add up have a historical context with which we can view these things.

A black assailant would've been behind bars on the day of the incident.
This.
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