Norv Practically Sainted by Media, Sapp, etc. Where can I puke?

wewantdallas · #1 11-21-2005, 09:12 AM

Apparently Sapp gave the game ball to Norv yesterday than offered a long monologue on how Norv was "mistreated" and "done wrong" by the evil Redskin empire. Norv almost cried and then once again defended his time in Washington as "great years," saying he took a bad team and made them "competitive." Yeah, whatever you say, Norval.

Here's the link.

This is just rubbing salt into an already gaping wound. I mean, I think Norv is a good guy, a nice guy, but those of us who lived through that nightmare know better about this attempt to revise history by Thomas Boswell.

I bet the media is salivating over getting another chance to write a similar story next week when old Marty comes back to town.

Does it get any worse than this???

PennSkinsFan · #2 11-21-2005, 09:17 AM

Norv deserved it. He cam, saw, and beat the Redskins the way everyone does, take advantaage of the weaknesses. Can't fault the guy. He has a less talented team, came into FESDEX and walked out victorius.

wewantdallas · #3 11-21-2005, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PennSkinsFan

Norv deserved it. He cam, saw, and beat the Redskins the way everyone does, take advantaage of the weaknesses. Can't fault the guy. He has a less talented team, came into FESDEX and walked out victorius.

He got the win, good for him. But I thought his team looked ALMOST equally inept yesterday, and his coaching was questionable as usual. But that wasn't my point anyway.

My point was that he and others are somehow trying to alter the past and make it look like Norv was somehow undercut at every turn and treated unfairly during his SEVEN YEARS here, FIVE of which were NOT under Dan Snyder. It makes me sick. I was there, I sat through every one of those seasons, and he DESERVED to be fired.

He is a mediocre, AT BEST, head coach, and I'd be very surprised if he's with the Raiders next year. Guess he can start blaming Al Davis at that point.

PennSkinsFan · #4 11-21-2005, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wewantdallas

He got the win, good for him. But I thought his team looked ALMOST equally inept yesterday, and his coaching was questionable as usual. But that wasn't my point anyway.

My point was that he and others are somehow trying to alter the past and make it look like Norv was somehow undercut at every turn and treated unfairly during his SEVEN YEARS here, FIVE of which were NOT under Dan Snyder. It makes me sick. I was there, I sat through every one of those seasons, and he DESERVED to be fired.

He is a mediocre, AT BEST, head coach, and I'd be very surprised if he's with the Raiders next year. Guess he can start blaming Al Davis at that point.

That doesn't say much for Joe Gibbs

wewantdallas · #5 11-21-2005, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PennSkinsFan

That doesn't say much for Joe Gibbs

And rightfully so, IMO. It was probably Gibbs' worst coaching performance of the season.

bwparker · #6 11-21-2005, 09:50 AM

It makes me angry that the Redskin's he took over were described as "bad" Weren't we just 2-3 years removed from a DOMINANT Superbowl win. I've seen that Skin's team been called the greatest team ever, better than the '85 Bears, by NATIONAL publications and in books on the greatest teams ever.

We may have lost a step or two since that, but come on, were we really bad? I'm too young to remember accurately. but bad? Seems to me that a "good" coach could have turned that club around in less than 5 years and could have done it with some consistancy.

greatest2 · #7 11-21-2005, 10:05 AM

remember this is Sapp talking. Norv is not going to say, no your wrong, i was treated great by the Skins.

It's whatever guys, Sapp talking is like a barking dog, pay no attention to it...

wewantdallas · #8 11-21-2005, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bwparker

We may have lost a step or two since that, but come on, were we really bad? I'm too young to remember accurately. but bad? Seems to me that a "good" coach could have turned that club around in less than 5 years and could have done it with some consistancy.

We were pretty bad. In '93, under Richie Petibon, we were 4-12 and looked terrible.

I was willing to give Norv time to get things right. His first season he was 3-13. Next, 6-10. Next, 9-7 (after starting 7-1). At this point, I was still with him, thinking we were poised for something good. We go 6-10. Then, the next year, we go 8-7-1 in a season filled with some of the sorriest football you could ever imagine. I wanted him gone at that point.

Finally, Snyder comes in, lets it be known that if Norv doesn't succeed in '99 he's gone, and the team goes 10-6 and gets into the playoffs. Great. Next season? Norv is canned after numerous straight, passionless losses when the team is 7-6 after starting 6-2.

You're right, he had PLENTY of time to turn the team around and he couldn't do it. It could very well be argued that the '99 season was the result more of Casserly's involvement and Snyder's "win now" demands rather than anything Norv really did.

bwparker · #9 11-21-2005, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wewantdallas

We were pretty bad. In '93, under Richie Petibon, we were 4-12 and looked terrible.

I was willing to give Norv time to get things right. His first season he was 3-13. Next, 6-10. Next, 9-7 (after starting 7-1). At this point, I was still with him, thinking we were poised for something good. We go 6-10. Then, the next year, we go 8-7-1 in a season filled with some of the sorriest football you could ever imagine. I wanted him gone at that point.

Finally, Snyder comes in, lets it be known that if Norv doesn't succeed in '99 he's gone, and the team goes 10-6 and gets into the playoffs. Great. Next season? Norv is canned after numerous straight, passionless losses when the team is 7-6 after starting 6-2.

You're right, he had PLENTY of time to turn the team around and he couldn't do it. It could very well be argued that the '99 season was the result more of Casserly's involvement and Snyder's "win now" demands rather than anything Norv really did.

Thanks for clarification. Funny, with all the reading I've done on the Redskins, I feel like I know the 90's Skins less than any other decade because I was too young to follow them closely and now that I'm old enough to care...there's no desire to go back and read about what a failure that decade was.

GibbsFan · #10 11-21-2005, 10:33 AM

when Norv took over the roster completely turned over. FA as we now know it, was just starting up and the team had gotten old and was either the highest payroll or 2nd to the 49ers, I don't remember. But I do remember having cap problems as soon as FA began. Slowly the team got better, but defense was always an issue for Norv's teams.

Norv got a pass because he beat the Cowboys a number of times during his early years. Dan should have let him finish the season but I understand why he did it. I probably would have done the same as Norv stayed about 4 years too long for me.

He will always be a great OC in my mind, but a mediocre HC because he lacked the necessary leadership skills for the head job. Thank God we have Joe back, and lets move on.

IowaSkinsFan · #11 11-21-2005, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wewantdallas

And rightfully so, IMO. It was probably Gibbs' worst coaching performance of the season.

Agreed. All the more shocking because it was on the heels of his best performance of the season.

Spence · #12 11-21-2005, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bwparker

It makes me angry that the Redskin's he took over were described as "bad" Weren't we just 2-3 years removed from a DOMINANT Superbowl win. I've seen that Skin's team been called the greatest team ever, better than the '85 Bears, by NATIONAL publications and in books on the greatest teams ever.

We may have lost a step or two since that, but come on, were we really bad? I'm too young to remember accurately. but bad? Seems to me that a "good" coach could have turned that club around in less than 5 years and could have done it with some consistancy.

The team Norv took over was awful. The team Richie Petitbone took over the year before wasn't good either. The 1991 Redskins were built for that one year. They were old on both the offensive and defensive lines and they didn't have a single wide receiver who wasn't past his prime. The tailback was on his way down, too. That was a great team, but an old one. And old teams go downhill very quickly. Worst of all, Rypien never played well again after that 1991 season. The team Norv took over was terrible.

BurgundyNGold · #13 11-21-2005, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PennSkinsFan

That doesn't say much for Joe Gibbs

If I'm not mistaken, Norval went 3-13 and 4-12 in his first two seasons as Redskins coach. Gibbs has gone 6-10 and, so far 5-5 with Spurrier's roster. I'd take Gibbs any day.

Spence · #14 11-21-2005, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BurgundyNGold

If I'm not mistaken, Norval went 3-13 and 4-12 in his first two seasons as Redskins coach.

3-13 and 6-10.

PennSkinsFan · #15 11-21-2005, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BurgundyNGold

If I'm not mistaken, Norval went 3-13 and 4-12 in his first two seasons as Redskins coach. Gibbs has gone 6-10 and, so far 5-5 with Spurrier's roster. I'd take Gibbs any day.

Not referring or comparing the records. The statement was in respons eto what WWD said in the prior post. I'd take Gibbs over anyone anyday, but as for yesterday, Gibbs did not do a good coaching job at all, plain and simple, nor did Gregg Williams.