a View on Rush

[Spence]

Originally posted by Sil
I registered so I could respond to the smear piece on Limbaugh. This is obviously a divergent opinion and I am sure that many will disagree but there is nothing like starting off with you first message going against the grain. Here goes:

I am appalled at a column that is currently posted on the Hail Redskins website. In your “Around the NFL” the author grossly distorts facts, uses an ultra-left activist website as a reliable source, and libels the character of Rush Limbaugh. Granted this is an opinion piece and the author is entitled to his opinion, but he misquotes Limbaugh, he cites FAIR as a source, and starts his column with the “intelligent” assertion that “Limbaugh is an idiot.” The author then goes on to say that when Limbaugh uses the word media he actually means “evil liberals who want Negroes and lesbians to take over the world.” Threkeld admits that he does not “know the man's mind” later in his piece but apparently he knows it well enough to tell the reader what Limbaugh REALLY means. I suppose if one cannot find anything inflammatory you just have to “translate” for the ignorant.

Secondly it is apparent that the author did not hear Limbaugh’s comments concerning black coaches. What Limbaugh argued against was a system that required teams to interview black coaches even if management was committed to a white candidate. Limbaugh felt that this system would marginalize black coaches and make them into pawns in a shell game. Many liberal newspapers including the New York Times praised Limbaugh’s argument. Threlkeld is the first person I have heard that suggests that Limbaugh’s position is racist.

Thirdly, the author goes on to state that McNabb’s status was the result of his peer’s respect for him and not the creation of some “fictional ‘liberal media.’" Limbaugh never used the term “liberal media” during his ESPN piece. Again this is putting words in the mouth of the commentator to make him look bad.

The author uses the website of FAIR as a source for several racist comments that Limbaugh has supposedly made in the past. First I must point out that FAIR is a liberal advocacy organization that even describes itself as “a progressive group.” Secondly the way FAIR collects its quotes is through submissions by volunteer activists, I have looked throughout its web pages for citations for their Limbaugh quotes and there are none. I challenge the veracity of all of the quotes the author uses. It stands to reason that if these statements were indeed true Limbaugh would have been taken to task by much more prominent sources than FAIR.

Finally the author begins his piece with the assertion that Limbaugh is an “analyst” on ESPN. This is simply not the case; Limbaugh’s job is to represent the fan’s perspective. Even he admits that fans are often wrong.

I suppose that libel is appropriate when it is directed at someone who you do not like. If it is not than the slam piece on Hail Redskins is certainly poorly researched, poorly supported, and poorly executed. That being the case I would suggest it is not appropriate for a high quality sports page. That is my opinion and unlike Threkeld I will not become petty and use pejoratives to make my case.

Thanks for reading the piece, Sil. Let me address your objections.

I based my views on Mr Limbaugh's portrayal of the media based on the totality of his work on radio and television. If you are seriously suggesting that Mr Limbaugh does not use the terms "media" and "liberal media" interchangeably then it is pretty clear you are not a serious person.

Secondly, I did not suggest Mr Limbaugh's comments about black head coaches were racist. The case Mr Limbaugh made on that subject is fair and has been made better by better men than he.

Thirdly, again your assertion that I placed words in Mr Limbaugh's mouth is absurd. When Mr Limbaugh uses the word "media" in that context, it is clear he is referring to a fictional creature called "the liberal media"--something he refers to often. Are you suggesting that Mr Limbaugh believes Donovan McNabb was unfairly elevated by the conservative media?

Fourthly, Mr Limbaugh has been taken to task by groups other than FAIR for his racist comments. You assert those comments were never made. And as evidence for this assertion you cite...nothing. In other words, we're supposed to take your word for it that those quotes were invented just as we're supposed to take Mr Limbaugh's word that Donovan McNabb gets more respect than he deserves because he's black. No evidence cited by either of you, of couse, just a blanket assertion, unsubstantiated by facts. You simply dismiss the evidence supplied by FAIR because FAIR is a liberal organization. In other words, FAIR is liberal so nothing it does can be believed. As I noted in my column, that sort of "argument" works just fine on Mr Limbaugh's show for dittoheads, but the rest of the planet usually requires something a bit more substantive. If you've got it, let's see it. Otherwise...well, you know.

Finally, when describing Mr Limbaugh's role on the ESPN program I put the word analyst in quotation marks, a pretty clear sign that I was being facetious. Your attempt to trip me up by taking my words in an overly-literal fashion is pretty weak, Sil. Mr Limbaugh obviously is not an analyst. Nor is he the voice of the fan. At least, not all fans.

[Raven Rick]

Rush told the truth. It's kinda refreshing.

[Spence]

And as evidence that "the media" hyped up Donovan McNabb because he's a black quarterback you cite...?

[rskinsfan10]

Why didn't Rush take Alstott to task and say that the media over-hypes him because he is white?

[Sil]

Originally posted by Spence Fourthly, Mr Limbaugh has been taken to task by groups other than FAIR for his racist comments. You assert those comments were never made. And as evidence for this assertion you cite...nothing.

It is a basic premise of intelligent debate that one cannot prove a negative. Therefore it is not my job to prove that Limbaugh did NOT make those comments but your job to prove he did. Try a reliable liberal source like the Washington Post or the New York Times and you might gain some credibility.

I see that pejoritives are your tour de force, because if I do not agree with you I am obviously not "serious." Trust me I am dead serious. Your piece is libelous and unsubstantiated, bottom line.

[Spence]

Originally posted by rskinsfan10
Why didn't Rush take Alstott to task and say that the media over-hypes him because he is white?

A fair question, Kenny. Let's consider. Alstott is a guy who has never run for 1000 yards in a season. He's never run for more than 10 TDs in a season. He's never averaged better than 4.1 yards per carry in a season. He's never had a run of 50 yards. He blocks about as well as I do. And he fumbles constantly.

Kenny, I suspect the answer to your question about why Rush didn't bring up Mike Alstott is pretty obvious. You know the answer. I know the answer. Everyone knows the answer. It's just that some of us are willing to admit it.

It's good news for Al Franken, they're bring back his book - Rush Limbaugh is a Big Fat Idiot.

MCNABB WENT TO BACK-TO-BACK PROBOWLS STARTING IN HIS 2nd SEASON?? Doesn't leave a whole lot of wiggle room for "opinion". And he's only played 5 years, still not as good as he's going to get. (not to mention taking the 3rd worst team in the NFL to the NFC championship in that 5 years). That's on the field, not a "media buzz" or perception??

Rush is just so sickly arrogant & out of touch with reality he'll say anything.

[Raven Rick]

Jason Seahorn. Don't try to tell me you haven't heard him refered to in the context of a white man playing a black man's position.
There's an amazing double standard at work here Spence.
Look at McNabb's #'s. He's an above average QB. That's it.

[Spence]

Originally posted by Sil
It is a basic premise of intelligent debate that one cannot prove a negative. Therefore it is not my job to prove that Limbaugh did NOT make those comments but your job to prove he did. Try a reliable liberal source like the Washington Post or the New York Times and you might gain some credibility.

I see that pejoritives are your tour de force, because if I do not agree with you I am obviously not "serious." Trust me I am dead serious. Your piece is libelous and unsubstantiated, bottom line.

You're not making sense, Sil. I'm not insisting that you prove a negative, merely that you cite some credible source calling FAIR's report into question. You have not done that. In all likelihood, you have not even tried. Probably because you're afraid of what you might find.

Secondly, you're wrong. [And I'm dead serious about that.] My piece is not libelous. I know the definition of libel. I learned it first as a journalism major in college. I learned it again at George Washington University Law School. I know the law of libel. You obviously do not. Scuttle off and do some research on libel law and then come back and admit your error. This is not a debatable subject: My article is not libelous. Not even close. The fact that you are claiming to know something you clearly do not will not inspire confidence in your writing here.

[Spence]

Originally posted by Raven Rick
Jason Seahorn. Don't try to tell me you haven't heard him refered to in the context of a white man playing a black man's position.
There's an amazing double standard at work here Spence.
Look at McNabb's #'s. He's an above average QB. That's it.

Of course Jason Sehorn got a lot of attention as a white cornerback. What's wrong with that? I never heard of Jason Sehorn objecting to it. The only amazing thing about Jason Sehorn is that he got so much attention. After all, the guy was never a great cornerback. Last I saw him playing the position, he was getting burned so badly by the Niners in the playoffs last year that the Giants had to cut him shortly thereafter.

You're mixing apples with oranges, Rick. When did Jason Sehorn get abused for being an average cornerback who received so much positive attention because he is white? I never heard Tom Jackson make that case on ESPN. Did you?

[rskinsfan10]

Originally posted by Raven Rick
Jason Seahorn. Don't try to tell me you haven't heard him refered to in the context of a white man playing a black man's position.
There's an amazing double standard at work here Spence.
Look at McNabb's #'s. He's an above average QB. That's it.

I will not forget about Alsott. Answer the question at hand.

As far as Sehorn goes, who made that assertion about him playing a "black man's" position? And if it bothered you, why didn't you for one take whoever did it to task?

[Spence]

Let's be clear about the issue here. Rush Limbaugh said Donovan McNabb has been hyped by the media because he's black and that he's not nearly as good as "the media" would have us believe.

Nobody ever did that to Jason Sehorn. When did Tom Jackson or Michael Wilbon or Jason Whitlock or Stuart Scott say that Jason Sehorn got more credit than he deserved because he is white? I never saw that happen. We all know Sehorn got extra attention because a white CB is so rare, but that's not the same thing as saying he was entirely a media creation. Sehorn is not a good example. If anything, it helps to prove the point Kenny and I are making.

[Raven Rick]

...it doesn't bother me. Not a bit. In fact, I readily admit, I think it's a correct assessment. If I own an NFL team, no slow white guy is going to be my CB.
...and as far as Alstott goes... sheeeeet! The Buc's are reigning SB Champions... they're just plain over hyped because of their curent status in the league. It's what the media does. What, ...? The Buc's have played 4 games... 2 MNF(?), one 8:30 National Game... the whole team is a media darling.

[Spence]

Uh, I think most would agree that the media's fascination with Mike Alstott precedes the previous Super Bowl. This is something that has gone on for some time now, despite the man's comparatively modest personal accomplishments as an NFL player.

[rskinsfan10]

Originally posted by Spence
Let's be clear about the issue here. Rush Limbaugh said Donovan McNabb has been hyped by the media because he's black and that he's not nearly as good as "the media" would have us believe.

Nobody ever did that to Jason Sehorn. When did Tom Jackson or Michael Wilbon or Jason Whitlock or Stuart Scott say that Jason Sehorn got more credit than he deserved because he is white? I never saw that happen. We all know Sehorn got extra attention because a white CB is so rare, but that's not the same thing as saying he was entirely a media creation. Sehorn is not a good example. If anything, it helps to prove the point Kenny and I are making.

Exactly.

If Dumbaugh had simply said that he felt that McNabb was over-hyped by the media and/or NFL then he wouldn't have lit the firestorm that is raging across America over this. To interject that this action was taken because he is black is asking for it, and I'm sure that he is sitting back loving life right now because of it.