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  #46  
Old 03-01-2012, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by NCskinsfanatic View Post
You guys scoot over, I'm climbing in too lol...
Our boat is a helluva lot more fun. We have kool-aid, hope and a franchise QB!
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  #47  
Old 03-01-2012, 03:09 PM
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Originally Posted by wide_awake View Post
Our boat is a helluva lot more fun. We have kool-aid, hope and a franchise QB!
Like smoak said I really, really like Rg3 and I wont be upset if we decide to go all in for him. But I believe Flynn, and to a much lesser degree Orton, would be an upgrade to our QB situation and would allow us to take a QB(like Tannenhill) that has the tools to be a franchise guy while still addressing our numerous needs on both sides of the ball. I also like Cousins and think he could be an above average starter in a year or two.

With an average to above average QB I think we're a .500 team as is. Now if that's the case and you can add talent through free agency and another full draft maybe we can win 9-10 games and atleast compete for a wild card spot. If we mortgage the future on RG3, we would likely be set for a decade but I dont think our record changes much next year, while RG3 is obviously much better than Rex, he's still a rookie and we arent going to be able to put much young talent around him with all the picks we'll give up this year and next. You just cant do it all in free agency, we of all fan bases should know this by now...not to mention ask the Eagles how that worked out for them last year.
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"After three or four, in the huddle I said to Russ, 'Play along with me,' " Bostic said. "I got to the line, and I said to Randy White, 'Our coaching staff loves you. We're going to run it over you again.' Then on the next play Russ told him. Randy wasn't very happy, but after three or four times, he didn't say a word."
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  #48  
Old 03-01-2012, 03:30 PM
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Originally Posted by NCskinsfanatic View Post
Like smoak said I really, really like Rg3 and I wont be upset if we decide to go all in for him. But I believe Flynn, and to a much lesser degree Orton, would be an upgrade to our QB situation and would allow us to take a QB(like Tannenhill) that has the tools to be a franchise guy while still addressing our numerous needs on both sides of the ball. I also like Cousins and think he could be an above average starter in a year or two.

With an average to above average QB I think we're a .500 team as is. Now if that's the case and you can add talent through free agency and another full draft maybe we can win 9-10 games and atleast compete for a wild card spot. If we mortgage the future on RG3, we would likely be set for a decade but I dont think our record changes much next year, while RG3 is obviously much better than Rex, he's still a rookie and we arent going to be able to put much young talent around him with all the picks we'll give up this year and next. You just cant do it all in free agency, we of all fan bases should know this by now...not to mention ask the Eagles how that worked out for them last year.
The difference is Tannehill has a lower chance of EVER being the guy. You get Tannehill and you are undoubtedly getting a guy who COULD develop in a couple of years but you are still getting a guy with multiple holes in his resume and may never be the guy. The chance exists with Griffin but to a smaller degree.
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  #49  
Old 03-01-2012, 03:37 PM
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Originally Posted by firehawk157 View Post
The difference is Tannehill has a lower chance of EVER being the guy. You get Tannehill and you are undoubtedly getting a guy who COULD develop in a couple of years but you are still getting a guy with multiple holes in his resume and may never be the guy. The chance exists with Griffin but to a smaller degree.
I dont prefer Tannehill to to RG3, I just prefer the cost of Tannenhill to RG3. And while RG3 seems more like the sure thing, many scouts speak very glowingly of Tannenhill and his skill set. He just doesnt have the necessary starts under his belt for me to say his ceiling cant be that of a franchise QB. Cutler wasnt thought to be the best QB the year Shanny traded up for him, nor was he seen as a lock as a franchise QB but he has proved that he is a franchise QB, despite flaws in his game, that you can build around.

Also I'm still not convinced we can obtain the Rams pick, I think if Cleveland loses Flynn to Seattle or Miami you can all but kiss RG3 good bye. And if that happens we better have a damn good plan B to address the QB situation for now and the future.
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... on running the 50-gut 9 straight times against the Cowboys

"After three or four, in the huddle I said to Russ, 'Play along with me,' " Bostic said. "I got to the line, and I said to Randy White, 'Our coaching staff loves you. We're going to run it over you again.' Then on the next play Russ told him. Randy wasn't very happy, but after three or four times, he didn't say a word."
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  #50  
Old 03-01-2012, 04:08 PM
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Originally Posted by NCskinsfanatic View Post
I dont prefer Tannehill to to RG3, I just prefer the cost of Tannenhill to RG3. And while RG3 seems more like the sure thing, many scouts speak very glowingly of Tannenhill and his skill set. He just doesnt have the necessary starts under his belt for me to say his ceiling cant be that of a franchise QB. Cutler wasnt thought to be the best QB the year Shanny traded up for him, nor was he seen as a lock as a franchise QB but he has proved that he is a franchise QB, despite flaws in his game, that you can build around.

Also I'm still not convinced we can obtain the Rams pick, I think if Cleveland loses Flynn to Seattle or Miami you can all but kiss RG3 good bye. And if that happens we better have a damn good plan B to address the QB situation for now and the future.
Cutler had more experience than Tannehill, for sure

i dont think that Holmgren will draft RGIII on any parameter other than whether he feels he is the best QB option available, anywhere.. he has NEVER drafted a QB in the first round, and has gone after other team's backups.. why should he change what has worked well for him ? the only reason i can think of is that he believes that RGIII is head and shoulders above Flynn.. if that is true, he wont even bother being in the mix of Flynn, but will be "all in" for RGIII from square 1.

i think we definitely have a plan B beyond RGIII...and i think we will see in a couple of weeks that it is a QB in this draft.. i also think if it is RGIII, we will have that settled before free agency because we will deal with the Rams, and the maximum leverage the Rams will have will be before free agency starts when there is maximum uncertainty

if there is no trade, and no free agency qb by mid March, we better be prepared to see Tannehill or Weedon next year.. i think Shanahan will waste little time starting either one
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  #51  
Old 03-01-2012, 04:13 PM
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Originally Posted by paulskinsfan View Post
[

I should say the same for you! Clearly, if you support giving up all these draft picks then, in your opinion, RG3 is a sure thing franchise quarterback. The draft is a total crap shoot. I would rather spend some money on a FA QB, and use the draft picks we have to continue and build this team. Giving up the future for a QB with 1 great year who will pull it down and run first, thats CRAZY !!!
This statement drives me absolutely insane. The draft is not an exact science but you could not be more wrong about it being a crapshoot. The media hypes up 40 times and such, and you see a lot of recycled collegiate highlights for the top prospects, but you have no idea how much attention to detail and how much effort really goes into evaluating talent. There are so many small intricasies that go into an overall evaluation, so many different formulas, so much time spent pouring over hours and hours of film looking at so many different aspects of a the propects' game. Teams don't just look at a kid and say he looks good in a uniform, what the hell let's draft him. Football talent evaluation is more of a science than some casual observers think, especially at this level where there is access to every player, every play at every angle you can think of.

If the draft is a crapshoot, explain to me why the succesfull teams do it well, and the bad teams do not.
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  #52  
Old 03-01-2012, 04:27 PM
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If the draft is a crapshoot, explain to me why the succesfull teams do it well, and the bad teams do not.
And while your at it explain why there's a higher percentage of hits at the top of the draft and lower percentage at the bottom.
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  #53  
Old 03-01-2012, 05:02 PM
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Originally Posted by shally View Post
Cutler had more experience than Tannehill, for sure

i dont think that Holmgren will draft RGIII on any parameter other than whether he feels he is the best QB option available, anywhere.. he has NEVER drafted a QB in the first round, and has gone after other team's backups.. why should he change what has worked well for him ? the only reason i can think of is that he believes that RGIII is head and shoulders above Flynn.. if that is true, he wont even bother being in the mix of Flynn, but will be "all in" for RGIII from square 1.

i think we definitely have a plan B beyond RGIII...and i think we will see in a couple of weeks that it is a QB in this draft.. i also think if it is RGIII, we will have that settled before free agency because we will deal with the Rams, and the maximum leverage the Rams will have will be before free agency starts when there is maximum uncertainty

if there is no trade, and no free agency qb by mid March, we better be prepared to see Tannehill or Weedon next year.. i think Shanahan will waste little time starting either one
I get what you're saying but how well has it really worked for him lately? He didnt have to worry about it in SF or GB and had Hasselbeck in Seattle. I think as the league evolves it's hard to use what someone has never done in the draft before as a measuring stick. Cleveland sucks, and like us will continue to until they get a franchise QB. It's not like that rule of thumb only applies to us.
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... on running the 50-gut 9 straight times against the Cowboys

"After three or four, in the huddle I said to Russ, 'Play along with me,' " Bostic said. "I got to the line, and I said to Randy White, 'Our coaching staff loves you. We're going to run it over you again.' Then on the next play Russ told him. Randy wasn't very happy, but after three or four times, he didn't say a word."
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  #54  
Old 03-01-2012, 05:22 PM
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Funny thing about everyone worrying about all the picks we might give up for RGIII (an extra 1st, and probably 2nd and 4th).

I can understand that if we were the New England Patriots, Steelers or Giants and had a good history with our picks. But we simply don't.

In the last 10 years our first rounders have been:
- Sean Taylor
- Carlos Rogers
- Laron Landry
- Jason Campbell
- Trent Williams
- Brian Orakpo
- Ryan Kerrigan

Out of all these there are some solid players, but I only count Sean Taylor as a talent who could have the same impact as a franchise QB, and that is ST. If you look past the first round, we have several solid players, but no impact players there either.

We're also $47m under the cap, so we can build with hungry 26-28 year old FA. It's time to roll the dice on RGIII.
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  #55  
Old 03-01-2012, 05:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Emmanouel8 View Post
And while your at it explain why there's a higher percentage of hits at the top of the draft and lower percentage at the bottom.
To say it's not a crapshoot isn't saying all 250 plus propects will go on to be good players. Do I really have to explain why there are better odds at the top of the talent pool than the bottom?
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  #56  
Old 03-01-2012, 05:36 PM
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I Think the media has pushed this thing into such a frenzy,The Fans in dc are'nt gonna accept anything but rg3! Snyder knows he can make money off him no matter how much it cost the team,2 or 3 1st rounders don't mean anything to him.THERE IS NO WAY THEY PASS HIM UP NOW!!!!!!!
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  #57  
Old 03-01-2012, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by paulskinsfan View Post
Im not going to get into an insult exchange over an opinion about how a future draft pick will perform, so if you want to start this debate with insults it will be a short lived one. I will say that yes, I watched the kid play. I watched him last year and the year before when he was fairly pedestrian. RG III is a SMALL quarterback, and with that speed, his first instinct will be to tuck and run in the NFL. If you have God given speed like that, you are going to use it, and in the NFL those chicken like legs are gonna get injured. We're not talking Cam Newton, we're talking a rather small QB by NFL standards with freakish quickness who is going to get hit, and he's going to go down. RG III will be out injured by week 9 if he starts every week in the NFL, that's just my opinion. I hope Im wrong, and I hope the kid is the next great QB, but I don't think the Skins should mortgage the future for this kid with so many needs on this team.
Brees, Rodgers, Stafford and Romo on the phone for you, all SMALL by your definition. His size is a red herring argument in light of the fact he is the same size as the guys listed above and we now have official measurements.

I hear the durability argument all the time and Griffin indeed tore his ACL in 09. Yet he came back to lead Baylor to back to back bowl games. Whatsmore he played in an Offense where he had to run the ball 150 times a year as he did in 2010 and 2011. He obviously had the durability to withstand getting hit on a regular basis so why is this fact ignored now.

If you really did watch him the past two years then you cannot come to the conclusion he is a headless chicken, you simply don't complete 69% of passes if you are. Using your legs to stop from getting sacked needs to be regarded as a positive not a negative. Watch any tape and you cannot come to any other conclusion other than he is a pass first, run second QB. There are countless plays on tape that he gets a pass of before taking a hit. There is also evidence on tape that he can make all the throws.

I will admit I want RG3 to be this teams QB, but I base this on watching all the available tape on him and reading every scouting report I can find. I am confident enough to believe that if we can get RG3 that is one position that we do not need to worry about in the coming seasons.
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  #58  
Old 03-01-2012, 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted by NCskinsfanatic View Post
I get what you're saying but how well has it really worked for him lately? He didnt have to worry about it in SF or GB and had Hasselbeck in Seattle. I think as the league evolves it's hard to use what someone has never done in the draft before as a measuring stick. Cleveland sucks, and like us will continue to until they get a franchise QB. It's not like that rule of thumb only applies to us.
Everyone is completely discounting Colt McCoy. There are a lot of Browns fans that still want him to have a shot and for the FO to build around him. It'll be his second year in this offense and IMO he's a better prospect than Flynn ever was/is/will be.

Cleveland giving up on Colt this quickly is a mistake. He's getting the same raw deal JC did here and Colt has a lot more talent.
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  #59  
Old 03-01-2012, 06:57 PM
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I see three teams in desperate need of a franchise QB: Cleveland, Washington, and Miami. There are three exciting QB options this off-season other than Andrew Luck: RG III, Peyton Manning, and Matt Flynn.

Cleveland has the most to offer the Rams for the right to draft RG III with the second draft pick.

Miami makes the most sense to pursue Matt Flynn.

That leaves the Redskins in pursuit of Peyton Manning and possibly one of his receivers from the Colts.

I think the Skins will either overpay for RG III, or pursue a package of Peyton Manning and Colts receivers. Either way, hope will be renewed, jerseys will be sold, and luxury boxes will be filled.
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  #60  
Old 03-01-2012, 07:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Chief Redskin View Post
I see three teams in desperate need of a franchise QB: Cleveland, Washington, and Miami. There are three exciting QB options this off-season other than Andrew Luck: RG III, Peyton Manning, and Matt Flynn.

Cleveland has the most to offer the Rams for the right to draft RG III with the second draft pick.

Miami makes the most sense to pursue Matt Flynn.

That leaves the Redskins in pursuit of Peyton Manning and possibly one of his receivers from the Colts.

I think the Skins will either overpay for RG III, or pursue a package of Peyton Manning and Colts receivers. Either way, hope will be renewed, jerseys will be sold, and luxury boxes will be filled.
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"After three or four, in the huddle I said to Russ, 'Play along with me,' " Bostic said. "I got to the line, and I said to Randy White, 'Our coaching staff loves you. We're going to run it over you again.' Then on the next play Russ told him. Randy wasn't very happy, but after three or four times, he didn't say a word."
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